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Post by Staffsoatcake on Aug 12, 2017 23:27:42 GMT
I have an idea,play Berahino with a strike partner for a few games and see how we get on,if he still does not cut the mustard,then drop him.
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Berahino
Aug 12, 2017 23:31:35 GMT
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Post by GreaterGlasgowstokie on Aug 12, 2017 23:31:35 GMT
The reason we can't score is because the centre forward is shite. I'd either play 4-2-3-1 with Shaq as No.10 or on the right.. or the 3-4-2-1 we lined up with today. Stick Crouch or Joselu as the main striker and we'll score. No, he isn't shite. He's got no support. He's up top as a lone striker and we're not doing anything to help him. You want to build the team around a player by playing to his strengths. Is it not worth trying the same with Berahino? I've been saying this Constantly. However, watching him today, it was clear he just doesn't have it in him anymore. No pace, can't shoot. Another dud Hughes signing, sadly
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Berahino
Aug 12, 2017 23:34:35 GMT
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Post by PB1863 on Aug 12, 2017 23:34:35 GMT
It's not easy being a striker as you are often only as good as the service you get. Most strikers drop back and go looking for the ball . You look at Mane's goal for Liverpool yesterday. He dropped back, held of the defender, played a one /two to get himself into a scoring position and boom. He created that goal from nothing. I'm sure Saido is quality and once he gets one they will flow for him. I remember when Crouch went to Liverpool he took ages to get going.
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Post by thegrassyknoll on Aug 12, 2017 23:45:12 GMT
He has already been down the loan route at WBA, with mixed results. Twice he was sent back to the Albion for unspecified attitude problems. I cannot readily think of any newly purchased £12m player being loaned out (from a club of SCFC's size and resources) for experience/confidence. All the questions in this thread about what SB's strengths are mirrors the comments from WBA fans during his decline at the Hawthorns. And no, I don't know what these elusive talents would be either. I remain incredulous that a manager with Hughes' experience has saddled himself with such a high cost, high maintenance player of such dubious abilities. Could this be MH's final bad purchase? What was he doing right when he first burst into the team? And can you put your finger on when the decline actually started? Was it directly related to the Spurs thing? Am I right in thinking he was physically a lot leaner, much more like the young Michael Owen than the bulkier player he developed into? He just looks so bereft at the moment - just offering zilch He arrived by default, in as much as the thin WBA squad gave him an opening. The mobility and enthusiasm that a much leaner SB displayed enabled him to score, and his confidence was on a much higher level. He never had outstanding pace, unlike Owen. Even in his short 'golden period', he did not contribute in build up play, and his tracking and defending was poor. His performances had begun to tail off prior to the first Spurs bids, but the whole circus seems to have finished him off imo. As I posted on here on an earlier thread, I made money by betting on him staying through the two transfer windows when Spurs were serious suitors. My belief , confirmed by what happened, was that the chairman, Poisonous Peace would not take the personal content of SB's comments lightly or well. His refusal to sell went far beyond commercial or football sense. Peace was imo was out to damage SB and make him an example. Ironically, Peace's vindictive stance was still rewarded by his theft of £12m off Coates. For once, Our Tone was not the villain of the piece. In fact, one curious facet of the farce was Tone's reluctance to publicly criticise SB and his repeated attempts to reintegrate him into the team. Hughes must have been stark staring mad to want to take on such a flickering talent, given that his contacts in the game must have known of SB's frailties.
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Post by numpty40 on Aug 13, 2017 0:25:49 GMT
Oh indeed. But he'd have to play a back four to do that though and he seems fully intended on going with a back three. I mentioned it earlier in the thread mate, he's painted himself into a corner with his recruitment ... again. Shaq played centrally all match and created nothing. For me it was ridiculous that we finished the game as a 4-4-2 with diouf wide and Shaq in behind crouch. We never get to the by line and pull balls back. Even when Arnie was here we had him and Shaq continually trying to cut inside. Everton's goal was a classic example of the benefit of getting to the by line. We have decent wide players who are more than capable of getting behind defenders but we never seem to want to. I find it baffling.
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Post by stayingupforbigbazza on Aug 13, 2017 1:39:28 GMT
thought many times that hughes signing and continuing playing him in this "role" will cost hughes his job --hughes is sounding like dead man walking to me.The only game when berahino looked vaguely any good was behind/with Crouchy last season for about 20 mins in one home game-forgot which one
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Post by Deleted on Aug 13, 2017 5:25:33 GMT
The fickled finger of fate says he will score 2, not next game, but the game after, at....YUP....WBA...Boing Boing Berra Berra Boing Boing
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Post by mickmacc on Aug 13, 2017 7:07:05 GMT
Time to stop making excuses for him. He got service yesterday. A great cross from Pieters. He didn't have the anticipation to get to it.He can't be found with a through ball because he hides. He's slow and doesn't make the bended runs you need to get behind defences . He's poor. Very poor. And if Hughes plays him it will cost him his job
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Post by trickydicky73 on Aug 13, 2017 7:13:31 GMT
thought many times that hughes signing and continuing playing him in this "role" will cost hughes his job --hughes is sounding like dead man walking to me.The only game when berahino looked vaguely any good was behind/with Crouchy last season for about 20 mins in one home game-forgot which one Hull?
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Berahino
Aug 13, 2017 7:16:15 GMT
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Post by trickydicky73 on Aug 13, 2017 7:16:15 GMT
Time to stop making excuses for him. He got service yesterday. A great cross from Pieters. He didn't have the anticipation to get to it.He can't be found with a through ball because he hides. He's slow and doesn't make the bended runs you need to get behind defences . He's poor. Very poor. And if Hughes plays him it will cost him his job I'd start with Diouf or Joselu up front over him. Or even play them as a pair.
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Post by Trouserdog on Aug 13, 2017 7:19:35 GMT
The reason we can't score is because the centre forward is shite. I'd either play 4-2-3-1 with Shaq as No.10 or on the right.. or the 3-4-2-1 we lined up with today. Stick Crouch or Joselu as the main striker and we'll score. No, he isn't shite. He's got no support. He's up top as a lone striker and we're not doing anything to help him. You want to build the team around a player by playing to his strengths. Is it not worth trying the same with Berahino? Surely you build the team around the best player- to make the most of their matchwinning talents and get them firing 100% as they're the one who makes things happen. It's not possible to do this for every player in the side, and if we're compromising other players' effectiveness to try and suit the game of one man who's done absolutely nothing to suggest he's even got the required level of ability, then we'll be in big trouble. The thing is, we've already tried 4-4-2....Berahino was hopeless. West Brom fans were telling us he was a waste of space before he signed, and while it's always good to take these sort of comments with a pinch of salt, what we're seeing now mirrors everything that they told us about.
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Post by davejohnno1 on Aug 13, 2017 7:20:10 GMT
With our current options it has to be diouf up front. He is the only one that offers the pace and movement that will allow Shaq, bojan and choupo to show their creative abilities.
Hughes signings suggest 4-2-3-1 is a thing of the past though so seeing them as a front 4 seems particularly unlikely.
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Berahino
Aug 13, 2017 7:27:24 GMT
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Post by trickydicky73 on Aug 13, 2017 7:27:24 GMT
No, he isn't shite. He's got no support. He's up top as a lone striker and we're not doing anything to help him. You want to build the team around a player by playing to his strengths. Is it not worth trying the same with Berahino? Surely you build the team around the best player- to make the most of their matchwinning talents and get them firing 100%, as they're the one who makes things happen. It's not possible to do this for every player in the side, and if we're compromising other players' effectiveness to try and suit the game of one man who's done absolutely nothing to suggest he's even got the required level of ability, then we'll be in big trouble. The thing is, we've already tried 4-4-2....Berahino was hopeless. West Brom fans were telling us he was a waste of space before he signed, and while it's always good to take these sort of comments with a pinch of salt, what we're seeing now mirrors everything that they told us about. Hughes has completely abandoned players for a lot less. Were Imbula, Diouf or Joselu worse than Berahino when he dropped them?
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Post by Trouserdog on Aug 13, 2017 7:34:47 GMT
Surely you build the team around the best player- to make the most of their matchwinning talents and get them firing 100%, as they're the one who makes things happen. It's not possible to do this for every player in the side, and if we're compromising other players' effectiveness to try and suit the game of one man who's done absolutely nothing to suggest he's even got the required level of ability, then we'll be in big trouble. The thing is, we've already tried 4-4-2....Berahino was hopeless. West Brom fans were telling us he was a waste of space before he signed, and while it's always good to take these sort of comments with a pinch of salt, what we're seeing now mirrors everything that they told us about. Hughes has completely abandoned players for a lot less. Were Imbula, Diouf or Joselu worse than Berahino when he dropped them? Diouf and Joselu have both been harshly treated. I think Diouf exasperated MH with his wastefulness in front of goal, but the fact he missed so many chances shows we do create them- it's just that the forward has to make the odd intelligent run or show a bit of anticipation now and again, which Berahino seems incapable of doing. Joselu has his faults too, but MH always seemed to drop him after one bad game. I'd get him back in and around the team and give him another chance.
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Post by scfc5 on Aug 13, 2017 7:43:15 GMT
Surely you build the team around the best player- to make the most of their matchwinning talents and get them firing 100%, as they're the one who makes things happen. It's not possible to do this for every player in the side, and if we're compromising other players' effectiveness to try and suit the game of one man who's done absolutely nothing to suggest he's even got the required level of ability, then we'll be in big trouble. The thing is, we've already tried 4-4-2....Berahino was hopeless. West Brom fans were telling us he was a waste of space before he signed, and while it's always good to take these sort of comments with a pinch of salt, what we're seeing now mirrors everything that they told us about. Hughes has completely abandoned players for a lot less. Were Imbula, Diouf or Joselu worse than Berahino when he dropped them? But Berahino was clearly a gamble before he signed - a pet project for Hughes to stake his reputation on. The others were not. Admitting failure on Berahino makes Hughes' position rather weak, which is why he won't for a good while yet.
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Post by robwahlmann on Aug 13, 2017 7:45:31 GMT
Berahino doesn't fit in with the system we try to play, I'm not sure any system would by the way, but Hughes can obviously not see this. If he soon doesn't it will be his own downfall! A bit strange as an old striker that he is better at finding players for most of the other positions! When you look at yesterday's game it must be obvious that we with another striker than Bera would have had a real chance for all the 3 points! He has been given more chances to show what he can do than any of the other strikers on our books, but still he is preferred up front! A bit strange that the worst out of our four strikers seem to get the nod to play every game no matter how often he fire blanks!?
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Berahino
Aug 13, 2017 7:46:08 GMT
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Post by GreaterGlasgowstokie on Aug 13, 2017 7:46:08 GMT
The pieters ball across the box yesterday was the worst thing.
Any striker of note would have been on the end of that. It had goal written on it in big fucking capital letters.
He was just hiding behind a defender.
He is not there mentally and physically.
Awful.
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Post by Staffsoatcake on Aug 13, 2017 7:53:42 GMT
The pieters ball across the box yesterday was the worst thing. Any striker of note would have been on the end of that. It had goal written on it in big fucking capital letters. He was just hiding behind a defender. He is not there mentally and physically. Awful. Walters might have been in a better position to get the ball, but most likely have missed it anyway. If Berahino ever gets to play the same amount of games that Walters did, I would expect him to score more goals than Walters did.
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Post by cheekymatt71 on Aug 13, 2017 7:58:01 GMT
Pieters was absolutely mad there was no-one on the end of that cross. Berahino couldnt get to the ball because he made no movement and the defender blocked him out all too easily.
We had plenty of possession yesterday and with a decent striker up front I think we would have at least got a draw.
Bring back Joselu but ideally get a new striker in pronto
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Berahino
Aug 13, 2017 8:10:37 GMT
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Post by GreaterGlasgowstokie on Aug 13, 2017 8:10:37 GMT
The pieters ball across the box yesterday was the worst thing. Any striker of note would have been on the end of that. It had goal written on it in big fucking capital letters. He was just hiding behind a defender. He is not there mentally and physically. Awful. Walters might have been in a better position to get the ball, but most likely have missed it anyway. If Berahino ever gets to play the same amount of games that Walters did, I would expect him to score more goals than Walters did. Given the options we have we need to try to work out how to get the best out of berahino. There has to be a player in there. When he had that spell at west brom he came alive around the box, was always getting shots off. The problem is a psychological one to me, he is not switched on.
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Post by WhyDelilah on Aug 13, 2017 8:43:01 GMT
Berahino is another waste of a lot of money.
I can understand why the club aren't giving him money to spend.
May as well invest it in the Nigerian lottery.
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Post by roylandstoke on Aug 13, 2017 9:03:48 GMT
It is one thing to miss chances, it is another, much more worrying thing to never have a chance.
Mignolet´s wonder save aside, i can´t think of chance that Berahino has missed.
We need more upfront.
I would play Diouf, Crouch, Joselu or even Bojan in the striker role ahead of Berahino next week.
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Berahino
Aug 13, 2017 9:07:05 GMT
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Post by Rick Grimes on Aug 13, 2017 9:07:05 GMT
I actually thought he worked hard yesterday and didn't play too badly.
I'd have expected him to be somewhere near that Erik Peters cross but other than that we didn't really create anything for him. I'm not prepared to write him off yet but I certainly hope that we're looking at a target man striker who is more mobile than Crouchy.
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Post by crapslinger on Aug 13, 2017 9:26:28 GMT
I actually thought he worked hard yesterday and didn't play too badly. I'd have expected him to be somewhere near that Erik Peters cross but other than that we didn't really create anything for him. I'm not prepared to write him off yet but I certainly hope that we're looking at a target man striker who is more mobile than Crouchy. 14 games no goals ???? for a striker is that acceptable for £15 million ????????
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Berahino
Aug 13, 2017 9:35:35 GMT
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Post by milky on Aug 13, 2017 9:35:35 GMT
Berahino is another waste of a lot of money. I can understand why the club aren't giving him money to spend. May as well invest it in the Nigerian lottery. If this is true and they don't trust him to spend money then they need to get rid pronto..otherwise there is only one way this is heading.
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Post by sheikhmomo on Aug 13, 2017 10:13:05 GMT
Just watching 5 minutes of highlights on Goals on Sunday compare £12M Jay Rodriguez with £12M Saido Berahino and it's enough to make you weep.
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Post by realstokebloke on Aug 13, 2017 11:05:57 GMT
Just watching 5 minutes of highlights on Goals on Sunday compare £12M Jay Rodriguez with £12M Saido Berahino and it's enough to make you weep. Thought much the same.
VT's had our pants down methinks.
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Berahino
Aug 13, 2017 11:54:25 GMT
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Post by Rick Grimes on Aug 13, 2017 11:54:25 GMT
I actually thought he worked hard yesterday and didn't play too badly. I'd have expected him to be somewhere near that Erik Peters cross but other than that we didn't really create anything for him. I'm not prepared to write him off yet but I certainly hope that we're looking at a target man striker who is more mobile than Crouchy. 14 games no goals ???? for a striker is that acceptable for £15 million ???????? He was poor last season but he also clearly unfit. He should be fit now after a full pre-season and I think it's daft to write him off after 1 game against a decent Everton side.
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Post by sportsman on Aug 13, 2017 11:56:12 GMT
14 games no goals ???? for a striker is that acceptable for £15 million ???????? He was poor last season but he also clearly unfit. He should be fit now after a full pre-season and I think it's daft to write him off after 1 game against a decent Everton side. And also no played for nearly two years properly
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Post by stantheman on Aug 13, 2017 12:00:35 GMT
What was he doing right when he first burst into the team? And can you put your finger on when the decline actually started? Was it directly related to the Spurs thing? Am I right in thinking he was physically a lot leaner, much more like the young Michael Owen than the bulkier player he developed into? He just looks so bereft at the moment - just offering zilch He arrived by default, in as much as the thin WBA squad gave him an opening. The mobility and enthusiasm that a much leaner SB displayed enabled him to score, and his confidence was on a much higher level. He never had outstanding pace, unlike Owen. Even in his short 'golden period', he did not contribute in build up play, and his tracking and defending was poor. His performances had begun to tail off prior to the first Spurs bids, but the whole circus seems to have finished him off imo. As I posted on here on an earlier thread, I made money by betting on him staying through the two transfer windows when Spurs were serious suitors. My belief , confirmed by what happened, was that the chairman, Poisonous Peace would not take the personal content of SB's comments lightly or well. His refusal to sell went far beyond commercial or football sense. Peace was imo was out to damage SB and make him an example. Ironically, Peace's vindictive stance was still rewarded by his theft of £12m off Coates. For once, Our Tone was not the villain of the piece. In fact, one curious facet of the farce was Tone's reluctance to publicly criticise SB and his repeated attempts to reintegrate him into the team. Hughes must have been stark staring mad to want to take on such a flickering talent, given that his contacts in the game must have known of SB's frailties. You talk a lot of sense my friend and unfortunately it all sounds true. We had our pants well and truly pulled down, and every time he starts and fails to score, we take another expensive spanking.
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