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Post by lordb on Apr 20, 2017 16:53:24 GMT
Swansea weren't in non-league. We played them several times in the early 90s. They were in a worse place than us around the time, what im saying is the "little old stoke" attitude doesn't wash anymore, we're richer now than some of the biggest clubs across Europe, just so many fans look back and not forward. But we are not richer than the clubs we compete with.
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Post by lordb on Apr 20, 2017 16:58:29 GMT
The defeat to Wolves is the biggest factor this season. It was pretty shit. We could draw Chelsea away and lose 1.0 The end result is the same,out you go, however psychologically losing to a poor Championship side at home is much worse.
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Post by okeydokeystokie2 on Apr 20, 2017 16:58:38 GMT
well said Babyeuan. Who would have believed, that in the middle years of the last decade, watching binary football with Gifton Noel Williams finishing as the top scorer, observing a young Kenwyne Jones lollop and saunter his way to a SCFC debut -that this laid back player who would one day keep Michael Owen out of a Stoke City side? How many of those stoke fans watching and scrutinising Two Metre Peter's incredible goalscoring England record from afar, in golden national seasons such as 2006, would imagine that his feats would multiply, like amoeba under a microscope, in the red and white of Stoke, a club where he would make more appearances and score more goals than for any other, and yes, transcend to new headed heights of goaldscoring record-book prowess? Few mortal men indeed I used to cringe when he scored for England because that meant he would be selected for another good few caps. You're right I never thought or hoped he'd sign for Stoke and since he has my feelings haven't changed one bit. I don't know how you can't like, rate or respect Crouchie. Absolutely top pro, still under rated. His goal against Manchester City is right up there as one of the best goals ever scored by a Stoke player.
You're a hard man to please, Al, and sometimes a hard man to understand.
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Post by Davef on Apr 20, 2017 17:41:34 GMT
The defeat to Wolves is the biggest factor this season. It was pretty shit. We could draw Chelsea away and lose 1.0 The end result is the same,out you go, however psychologically losing to a poor Championship side at home is much worse. That would be the Wolves who also knocked Liverpool out on their own ground. I don't see why some of our fans think we should be immune from embarrassing defeats and Cup shocks. It's been happening our entire history and isn't going to change.
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Post by alster on Apr 20, 2017 19:32:53 GMT
I used to cringe when he scored for England because that meant he would be selected for another good few caps. You're right I never thought or hoped he'd sign for Stoke and since he has my feelings haven't changed one bit. I don't know how you can't like, rate or respect Crouchie. Absolutely top pro, still under rated. His goal against Manchester City is right up there as one of the best goals ever scored by a Stoke player.
You're a hard man to please, Al, and sometimes a hard man to understand.
I've got a fairly fixed idea of what makes a good forward and it usually involves pace and power. Everything I associate with being a good forward Crouch lacks. You've got his height but I don't think he uses it well, He's 6'7 but he rarely gets both feet off the ground. His touch is probably his best asset but I think his weaknesses in pace and mobility prevents it to being used to best effect. I'd prefer a Diouf who I acknowledge is a woeful footballer but I think if given equal opportunities as a central striker as Crouch would almost always outscore him, as demonstrated by his only consistent season for us as a central striker. I honestly believe that people have a more positive opinion of Crouch because he's a very likeable guy, I'm afraid that means nothing to me.
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Post by kustokie on Apr 20, 2017 19:41:46 GMT
i personally feel the same, i would like Mark Hughes given another season to prove himself, this season overall has been poor, but get the right players in during the summer, and hopefully he can give us a good season People said that last Summer and the Summer before that. Overall, Hughes's pre-season preparation and signings have been poor. This is the triumph of hope over experience.
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Post by kustokie on Apr 20, 2017 19:48:49 GMT
I don't know how you can't like, rate or respect Crouchie. Absolutely top pro, still under rated. His goal against Manchester City is right up there as one of the best goals ever scored by a Stoke player.
You're a hard man to please, Al, and sometimes a hard man to understand.
I've got a fairly fixed idea of what makes a good forward and it usually involves pace and power. Everything I associate with being a good forward Crouch lacks. You've got his height but I don't think he uses it well, He's 6'7 but he rarely gets both feet off the ground. His touch is probably his best asset but I think his weaknesses in pace and mobility prevents it to being used to best effect. I'd prefer a Diouf who I acknowledge is a woeful footballer but I think if given equal opportunities as a central striker as Crouch would almost always outscore him, as demonstrated by his only consistent season for us as a central striker. I honestly believe that people have a more positive opinion of Crouch because he's a very likeable guy, I'm afraid that means nothing to me. This would be the same Peter Crouch who holds the PL record for headed goals (more than Alan Shearer) and scores about 50% of his goals with his head. He doesn't really need to jump that high because he's already up there anyway. Unless, you think he should put it in the net with his nose. Edit: he's also scored more goals for Stoke than any other club.
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Post by philm87 on Apr 20, 2017 20:00:06 GMT
I think our overall points tally and league position is arguably less important right now then the performances we turn in between now and the end of the season. More of what we saw against Middlesborough and away at Citeh between now and the end of the season would be good.
Either way I don't think sacking Hughes is a sensible idea.
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Post by philm87 on Apr 20, 2017 20:03:50 GMT
I don't know how you can't like, rate or respect Crouchie. Absolutely top pro, still under rated. His goal against Manchester City is right up there as one of the best goals ever scored by a Stoke player.
You're a hard man to please, Al, and sometimes a hard man to understand.
I've got a fairly fixed idea of what makes a good forward and it usually involves pace and power. Everything I associate with being a good forward Crouch lacks. You've got his height but I don't think he uses it well, He's 6'7 but he rarely gets both feet off the ground. His touch is probably his best asset but I think his weaknesses in pace and mobility prevents it to being used to best effect. I'd prefer a Diouf who I acknowledge is a woeful footballer but I think if given equal opportunities as a central striker as Crouch would almost always outscore him, as demonstrated by his only consistent season for us as a central striker. I honestly believe that people have a more positive opinion of Crouch because he's a very likeable guy, I'm afraid that means nothing to me. I used to have such a low opinion of Crouch that someone bought me a biography of him as a wind up. I thought we paid massively over the odds for him and that he wouldn't suit a Pulis system. As far as I am concerned he has completely proven me wrong. He scored 14 goals in his first season in a team that often had Ryan Shotton playing on the wing. He has consistently produced when it matters, just like he did this weekend. He is a credit to his profession given how many players waste their talent. It is easy to hate footballers in this day and age, but hard not to love Crouchy. You really are a very hard man to please.
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Post by alster on Apr 20, 2017 20:31:34 GMT
I've got a fairly fixed idea of what makes a good forward and it usually involves pace and power. Everything I associate with being a good forward Crouch lacks. You've got his height but I don't think he uses it well, He's 6'7 but he rarely gets both feet off the ground. His touch is probably his best asset but I think his weaknesses in pace and mobility prevents it to being used to best effect. I'd prefer a Diouf who I acknowledge is a woeful footballer but I think if given equal opportunities as a central striker as Crouch would almost always outscore him, as demonstrated by his only consistent season for us as a central striker. I honestly believe that people have a more positive opinion of Crouch because he's a very likeable guy, I'm afraid that means nothing to me. This would be the same Peter Crouch who holds the PL record for headed goals (more than Alan Shearer) and scores about 50% of his goals with his head. He doesn't really need to jump that high because he's already up there anyway. Unless, you think he should put it in the net with his nose. Edit: he's also scored more goals for Stoke than any other club. So he doesn't really need to jump that high because he's the record holder for headed goals and he's scored more headed goals than Alan Shearer despite scoring a fraction of the number of goals he scored despite both men spending the vast majority of their careers at the top level. Perhaps if he'd jumped he'd have been a bit closer. Players could have slung crosses in a few inches higher and defenders would have been less able to beat him to the ball but he's a nice bloke he smiles a lot and acts the dick so he's a good egg and that means he's brilliant and still a force to be reckoned with at 36.
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Post by StokieNath on Apr 20, 2017 21:13:21 GMT
I'd sack him either way at the end of the season. Lets review why, - So far, 6 4-0 or 4-1 defeats notably Palace! - No wins against a top 6 side as of yet. - Previous manager potentially finishing above his Successor. - Wasting nearly 50 million pounds. - Not breaking our previous point barrier. - No clear gameplan. - Early cup exits to Hull and Wolves AT HOME, supposedly our fortress He has to go in the summer!
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Post by Deleted on Apr 20, 2017 21:21:22 GMT
I watched the Football League highlights programme on CH5 the other night. As each game's highlight were shown I found myself thinking back to a few years ago. Southend........ a Tuesday night game away, in January, ringing the ground on the way down there to make sure the game was still on. Gillingham.........knocked us out of the play-offs and one of the worst reffing performances I've ever seen. Walsall..........knocked us out of the play-offs. Oxford........watching us get stuffed 4-0 at the old Manor Ground. Swindon..........leaving the County Ground as their fans celebrated getting into the play-offs. Or the time we got beat 6-0. Wigan............Springfield Park, the grass bank, losing 4-0, Ball getting sacked. Bury...........away on a Tuesday,being pleased with a 1-1 draw (the night Robert Maxwell fell off his boat ) Exeter......... Alan Ball being escorted back to the dressing rooms as Stoke fans bayed for his blood. Stockport .......knocked us out of the play-offs. Vale...........pissing themselves laughing the day we went down to League One and they stayed up. I could go on but the memories are still too painful. Fast forward to last Saturday. 3-1 win at home in the Prem. 3 absolutely top draw goals from three top notch players. In 50+ years of watching Stoke I'm witnessing something I've never seen before, 3 consecutive top ten finishes in the top division, with a 4th a definite possibility. We're Stoke, we get gates of only 27,000, we've had a fairly uninspiring history and if you want success year on year, league titles, cup finals, mixing with Europe's big boys I'd suggest you join the glory hunters and look elsewhere. Me? I'll stick with the team I love, I'll stick with the manager and chairman who have delivered what I could only dare to dream of just a few years ago. I'm confident that my club is going in the right direction, slowly but surely. The progress we're undoubtedly making in all aspects of the club may not be quick enough, or as straight forward, for the more impatient among us but I prefer to take the long view. If it ain't broke why fix it? Fantastic post. Throw into that Luton where we lost 6. Oxford 5. Forest 6. Stockport defeats playing Macclesfield tranmere plymouth notts county etc etc. Some people think stoke have only been in the premiership
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Post by chesterfieldstokie on Apr 20, 2017 21:23:53 GMT
This would be the same Peter Crouch who holds the PL record for headed goals (more than Alan Shearer) and scores about 50% of his goals with his head. He doesn't really need to jump that high because he's already up there anyway. Unless, you think he should put it in the net with his nose. Edit: he's also scored more goals for Stoke than any other club. So he doesn't really need to jump that high because he's the record holder for headed goals and he's scored more headed goals than Alan Shearer despite scoring a fraction of the number of goals he scored despite both men spending the vast majority of their careers at the top level. Perhaps if he'd jumped he'd have been a bit closer. Players could have slung crosses in a few inches higher and defenders would have been less able to beat him to the ball but he's a nice bloke he smiles a lot and acts the dick so he's a good egg and that means he's brilliant and still a force to be reckoned with at 36. His record goals per game for England is better than Shearers.
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Post by alster on Apr 20, 2017 21:29:56 GMT
So he doesn't really need to jump that high because he's the record holder for headed goals and he's scored more headed goals than Alan Shearer despite scoring a fraction of the number of goals he scored despite both men spending the vast majority of their careers at the top level. Perhaps if he'd jumped he'd have been a bit closer. Players could have slung crosses in a few inches higher and defenders would have been less able to beat him to the ball but he's a nice bloke he smiles a lot and acts the dick so he's a good egg and that means he's brilliant and still a force to be reckoned with at 36. His record goals per game for England is better than Shearers. His Premier League goals tally is a fraction of Shearer's. As a striker he doesn't belong in the same sentence. Delude yourself all you want, there is good reason why he's had so many big clubs and been moved along everytime.
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Post by chesterfieldstokie on Apr 20, 2017 21:33:19 GMT
His record goals per game for England is better than Shearers. His Premier League goals tally is a fraction of Shearer's. As a striker he doesn't belong in the same sentence. Delude yourself all you want, there is good reason why he's had so many big clubs and been moved along everytime. is there anything about Stoke, the football team the city or the players that you actually like? Strikers come in all different shapes and sizes, John Ritchie wasnt fast but he was the best striker I have seen.
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Post by alster on Apr 20, 2017 21:48:30 GMT
His Premier League goals tally is a fraction of Shearer's. As a striker he doesn't belong in the same sentence. Delude yourself all you want, there is good reason why he's had so many big clubs and been moved along everytime. is there anything about Stoke, the football team the city or the players that you actually like? Strikers come in all different shapes and sizes, John Ritchie wasnt fast but he was the best striker I have seen. I don't like Crouch as a player nothing you can say will ever change my mind. I will be chuffed when he leaves or retires, quite clear, feel free to disagree but don't waste your breath trying to change my mind. I've thought exactly the same his whole career since seeing him as an England U21 at our place right through his career upto and including Stoke.
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Post by coupe on Apr 20, 2017 22:14:43 GMT
is there anything about Stoke, the football team the city or the players that you actually like? Strikers come in all different shapes and sizes, John Ritchie wasnt fast but he was the best striker I have seen. I don't like Crouch as a player nothing you can say will ever change my mind. I will be chuffed when he leaves or retires, quite clear, feel free to disagree but don't waste your breath trying to change my mind. I've thought exactly the same his whole career since seeing him as an England U21 at our place right through his career upto and including Stoke. As a matter of interest nobody wants to change your mind, the question is there anything Stoke you do like because not for the first time you avoid answering a direct question and it seems odd that a person who is so anti Hughes but have stated in previous posts you desire for Martinez whose track record cop ares very unfavourable against Hughes in the Premier.
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Post by boskampsflaps on Apr 20, 2017 23:22:47 GMT
Top 10 and keep, but tell him no more over 30s/old boys or 'flair' players - we need more youth, midfielders who can run a game and defensive cover in the ranks. He's already signing the over 30s up
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Post by johnnysoul60 on Apr 20, 2017 23:36:39 GMT
I wish people would take the focus off Hughes , its the club does it want to be forward thinking or stand still and take the risk of decline , there is a lot more to it than just him . I'm 50-50 on him but its a lot more than a middle of the road manager , like TP he will keep us up but each year will feel worse than the the last one unless the people at the club are braver .
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Post by thegift on Apr 20, 2017 23:39:45 GMT
No conundrum, Hughes out where ever we finish
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Post by JoeinOz on Apr 21, 2017 0:14:52 GMT
So hypothetically, if we had a chance of finish 7th some wouldn't want us to do so because they want Hughes out despite him being a good manager who had got us to 7th.
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Post by thegift on Apr 21, 2017 0:17:56 GMT
So hypothetically, if we had a chance of finish 7th some wouldn't want us to do so because they want Hughes out despite him being a good manager who had got us to 7th. We can't finish 7th.. even if we finished 9th it doesn't mean he's a good manager. The performances and bad signings have been a total fucking digrace.
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Post by JoeinOz on Apr 21, 2017 0:19:39 GMT
So hypothetically, if we had a chance of finish 7th some wouldn't want us to do so because they want Hughes out despite him being a good manager who had got us to 7th. We can't finish 7th.. even if we finished 9th it doesn't mean he's a good manager. The performances and bad signings have been a total fucking digrace. I know we can't, hence the word hypothetically.
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Post by cheeesfreeex on Apr 21, 2017 0:27:01 GMT
So hypothetically, if we had a chance of finish 7th some wouldn't want us to do so because they want Hughes out despite him being a good manager who had got us to 7th. We can't finish 7th.. even if we finished 9th it doesn't mean he's a good manager. The performances and bad signings have been a total fucking digrace. Please be a bit more specific regarding the disgrace Hughes has rained down on us mucka. Interested and fancy something to chew over and maybe chuckle about.
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Post by duckling on Apr 21, 2017 1:33:31 GMT
If Stoke fans are so negative in a golden era like the last ten years, what was it like during the 23 years in the lower leagues? That's not a rhetorical question. I'm genuinely curious about how fans coped when their team was far worse than it is today. Did people stop attending games and stop supporting the club?
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Post by hanibal7 on Apr 21, 2017 2:23:19 GMT
I watched the Football League highlights programme on CH5 the other night. As each game's highlight were shown I found myself thinking back to a few years ago. Southend........ a Tuesday night game away, in January, ringing the ground on the way down there to make sure the game was still on. Gillingham.........knocked us out of the play-offs and one of the worst reffing performances I've ever seen. Walsall..........knocked us out of the play-offs. Oxford........watching us get stuffed 4-0 at the old Manor Ground. Swindon..........leaving the County Ground as their fans celebrated getting into the play-offs. Or the time we got beat 6-0. Wigan............Springfield Park, the grass bank, losing 4-0, Ball getting sacked. Bury...........away on a Tuesday,being pleased with a 1-1 draw (the night Robert Maxwell fell off his boat ) Exeter......... Alan Ball being escorted back to the dressing rooms as Stoke fans bayed for his blood. Stockport .......knocked us out of the play-offs. Vale...........pissing themselves laughing the day we went down to League One and they stayed up. I could go on but the memories are still too painful. Fast forward to last Saturday. 3-1 win at home in the Prem. 3 absolutely top draw goals from three top notch players. In 50+ years of watching Stoke I'm witnessing something I've never seen before, 3 consecutive top ten finishes in the top division, with a 4th a definite possibility. We're Stoke, we get gates of only 27,000, we've had a fairly uninspiring history and if you want success year on year, league titles, cup finals, mixing with Europe's big boys I'd suggest you join the glory hunters and look elsewhere. Me? I'll stick with the team I love, I'll stick with the manager and chairman who have delivered what I could only dare to dream of just a few years ago. I'm confident that my club is going in the right direction, slowly but surely. The progress we're undoubtedly making in all aspects of the club may not be quick enough, or as straight forward, for the more impatient among us but I prefer to take the long view. If it ain't broke why fix it? Not very often I see someone on here that is realistic
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Post by elystokie on Apr 21, 2017 3:21:41 GMT
So hypothetically, if we had a chance of finish 7th some wouldn't want us to do so because they want Hughes out despite him being a good manager who had got us to 7th. We can't finish 7th.. even if we finished 9th it doesn't mean he's a good manager. The performances and bad signings have been a total fucking digrace. "even if we finished 9th it doesn't mean he's a good manager" So your hero Toxic won't be a good manager if he manages it for the first time in his narcissistic life this season? Yeh right
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Post by JoeinOz on Apr 21, 2017 3:24:05 GMT
If Stoke fans are so negative in a golden era like the last ten years, what was it like during the 23 years in the lower leagues? That's not a rhetorical question. I'm genuinely curious about how fans coped when their team was far worse than it is today. Did people stop attending games and stop supporting the club? It wasn't coping. it was just doing what you do... supporting your team. The relegations to the third tier were seriously painful though. As glorious as Lou's first spell was I doubt many of us would ever really want to go to that level again even if it meant winning every week.
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Post by mrcoke on Apr 21, 2017 7:53:00 GMT
If Stoke fans are so negative in a golden era like the last ten years, what was it like during the 23 years in the lower leagues? That's not a rhetorical question. I'm genuinely curious about how fans coped when their team was far worse than it is today. Did people stop attending games and stop supporting the club? It wasn't coping. it was just doing what you do... supporting your team. The relegations to the third tier were seriously painful though. As glorious as Lou's first spell was I doubt many of us would ever really want to go to that level again even if it meant winning every week. Funnily, I know a Boro fan who believes many of their fans would prefer to be a winning team in the Championship rather than a losing team in the Prem. it takes all sorts.
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Post by foxysgloves on Apr 21, 2017 8:37:15 GMT
I don't know how you can't like, rate or respect Crouchie. Absolutely top pro, still under rated. His goal against Manchester City is right up there as one of the best goals ever scored by a Stoke player.
You're a hard man to please, Al, and sometimes a hard man to understand.
I've got a fairly fixed idea of what makes a good forward and it usually involves pace and power. Everything I associate with being a good forward Crouch lacks. You've got his height but I don't think he uses it well, He's 6'7 but he rarely gets both feet off the ground. His touch is probably his best asset but I think his weaknesses in pace and mobility prevents it to being used to best effect. I'd prefer a Diouf who I acknowledge is a woeful footballer but I think if given equal opportunities as a central striker as Crouch would almost always outscore him, as demonstrated by his only consistent season for us as a central striker. I honestly believe that people have a more positive opinion of Crouch because he's a very likeable guy, I'm afraid that means nothing to me. Peter Crouch doesn't use his height well??!??? He's made an incredibly successful career out of doing exactly that!! His goal at the weekend is further proof of that fact.
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