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Post by bathstoke on Mar 4, 2017 19:52:59 GMT
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Post by felonious on Mar 5, 2017 6:58:07 GMT
Time to take the NHS away from the politicians and make it a non party problem. Throwing money at it does not work. Like education the political system (all parties) is set up to make pronouncements on a daily basis that the system is not working and this in turn must lead to despondency for anyone working in the professions. Same as it ever was. |
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Post by Deleted on Mar 5, 2017 7:27:56 GMT
I remember Blair talking the talk and it went down hill under labour too
Think all their money went into making more managers didn't it?
That worked well
Felonious' post above is the direction it needs to follow and quick
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Post by bathstoke on Mar 5, 2017 7:32:01 GMT
I remember Blair talking the talk and it went down hill under labour too Think all their money went into making more managers didn't it? That worked well Felonious' post above is the direction it needs to follow and quick B%!!%#&$. The NHS is being systematically undermined now |
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Post by Deleted on Mar 5, 2017 7:35:18 GMT
I remember Blair talking the talk and it went down hill under labour too Think all their money went into making more managers didn't it? That worked well Felonious' post above is the direction it needs to follow and quick B%!!%#&$. The NHS is being systematically undermined now And it hasn't been before with other governments? |
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Post by Deleted on Mar 5, 2017 7:39:51 GMT
Mr Hammond is expected to pour as much as an extra £1 billion into social care – although the funding shortfall is still predicted to rise to £2.6 billion by 2020.  |
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Post by felonious on Mar 5, 2017 17:09:35 GMT
B%!!%#&$. The NHS is being systematically undermined now And it hasn't been before with other governments? Wonder what the wife of Bath thinks?  |
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Post by Old School Stokie on Mar 5, 2017 18:12:26 GMT
Useless management really. if less than 10% actually pay for prescriptions how can that work? The NHS was originally intended for the sick but now its supporting too many non essential illnesses that could be dealt with by pharmacies and a bit of common sense. And thats not including the millions we pay for foreign treatment
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Post by mtrstudent on Mar 5, 2017 18:25:34 GMT
The NHS does an amazing job with the £2k it gets per Brit. The American system sucks up £7.5k per person and millions aren't even insured. My American healthcare insurance is about £5k/year for a healthy low-risk guy and I have to pay more to see a doctor or get treatment. The NHS is magnificent. Fat people and old people cost a lot more to treat. We now have a lot more of both so it seems obvious that we need to spend more if we want to keep care that's just as good as it was before. The last 40-odd years of governments basically decided to kick the problem onto today's workers.  |
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Post by felonious on Mar 5, 2017 18:35:28 GMT
The NHS does an amazing job with the £2k it gets per Brit. The American system sucks up £7.5k per person and millions aren't even insured. My American healthcare insurance is about £5k/year for a healthy low-risk guy and I have to pay more to see a doctor or get treatment. The NHS is magnificent. Fat people and old people cost a lot more to treat. We now have a lot more of both so it seems obvious that we need to spend more if we want to keep care that's just as good as it was before. The last 40-odd years of governments basically decided to kick the problem onto today's workers.Same as the state pension but the Conservative party are now starting to pass pension funding on to employers and employees. |
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Post by The Drunken Communist on Mar 5, 2017 18:39:26 GMT
The NHS should be for 'proper' things... People suffering with cancer or other such terrible things, people who've been in car crashes or other horrible accidents... I shouldn't need to draw up a list, you all know the kind of things I mean.
What the NHS should NOT be for is people wanting a nose job or some shit to help them look like some fucking celebrity, people who've been fucking idiots & done stupid things, example off the top of my head someone who is pissed up & been dicking about on top of something, fell off & broke their leg... By all means treat them, but they should be charged for it afterwards. (The latter example I mean - The dickhead wanting a nose job for vanity reasons can pay upfront)
NO NHS treatment for foreigners untill they have lived AND worked here for ten years.
There are so many simple things we can do to make the NHS great again, and to make it something that looks after the poorest & most needy British citizens... But like with anything else nowadays we have to shit all over the British people in most need so that we can help 'politically correct' causes instead.
"Oh we know that a 70 year old who has paid into the system all their lives needs a new hip, but they'll just have to wait 'cos this 25 year old man who thinks he's a woman needs some bullshit treatment first. Stop being so Transphobic".
"Oh we know that your child can't get into their local school but all these foreign children help us reach our quota. Stop being so xenophobic".
"Oh we know that British citizen who has worked all his life & landed on hard times needs a council house, but this 38-year old 'child' refugee is far more deserving of it. You're such a racist".
The country needs a right good shake up from the top to the fucking bottom. We've got complete & utter fucking idiots in all the important positions who can actually do something about the state of the country.
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Post by auntiegeorge on Mar 5, 2017 19:04:05 GMT
I'm sick of the NHS being used as a political football instead of having a long overdue grown-up debate. I was never a huge fan of Ann Widdecombe but this is outstanding. Just watch the first 2 minutes.
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Post by mtrstudent on Mar 5, 2017 20:38:30 GMT
Same as the state pension but the Conservative party are now starting to pass pension funding on to employers and employees. Governments could have raised the pension age, put aside tax money or not increased the state pension as much. They're finally doing stuff but the past 40 years has been a big "screw the future" binge with the idea that today's workers just pick up the tab. |
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Post by mtrstudent on Mar 5, 2017 20:42:57 GMT
I shouldn't need to draw up a list, you all know the kind of things I mean. That "you know what I mean" with no details is a trick that politicians always use to avoid making grown up decisions though. What the NHS should NOT be for is people wanting a nose job or some shit to help them look like some fucking celebrity, I totally agree, but do you think the NHS should include cosmetic surgery as part of removing a breast cancer, or when fixing someone's breathing after they smashed their face in a car crash? Those are the sorts of details I think it's fair to argue about. How much cash do you think the NHS spends on cosmetics and trans treatment? |
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Post by lawrieleslie on Mar 5, 2017 21:33:34 GMT
Same as the state pension but the Conservative party are now starting to pass pension funding on to employers and employees. Governments could have raised the pension age, put aside tax money or not increased the state pension as much. They're finally doing stuff but the past 40 years has been a big "screw the future" binge with the idea that today's workers just pick up the tab. From the inception of the old age pension in 1908 and then the retirement pension in 1948 there was never a fund set aside to pay for it. It was always paid for from NI/taxation paid by the current workforce. As the retired population got bigger, due mainly to increased life expectancy, the state pension was never going to be sustainable in its original form of paying it to 60 year old women and 65 year old men. Successive governments have tackled it by equalising and increasing the pension age gradually. They have also introduced the new flat rate pension to prevent having to fund second state pensions or earnings related pension which could more than double many people's state pension for small increase in NI contributions. Finally the government have put the onus on employees and employers to provide for their own pensions through the private sectors the smaller state pension paid to Ever aging pensioners. |
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Post by partickpotter on Mar 6, 2017 7:08:09 GMT
I'm sick of the NHS being used as a political football instead of having a long overdue grown-up debate. I was never a huge fan of Ann Widdecombe but this is outstanding. Just watch the first 2 minutes. She really makes some basic points - but what makes her contribution (literally) outstanding is she is the only person to dwell on the essentials of the problems behind the NHS. Demonstrated by the next speaker, the populist sound byte machine: Billy Bragg, who immediately falls into the trap of both politicising and trivialising the subject pretending that a few minutes googling local hospital bed closure statistics (to suck up to the local audience) makes him an authority on NHS administration. |
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Post by felonious on Mar 6, 2017 7:30:55 GMT
I'm sick of the NHS being used as a political football instead of having a long overdue grown-up debate. I was never a huge fan of Ann Widdecombe but this is outstanding. Just watch the first 2 minutes. She really makes some basic points - but what makes her contribution (literally) outstanding is she is the only person to dwell on the essentials of the problems behind the NHS. Demonstrated by the next speaker, the populist sound byte machine: Billy Bragg, who immediately falls into the trap of both polticising and trivialising the subject pretending that a few minutes googling local hospital bed closure statistics (to suck up to the local audience) makes him an authority on NHS administration. I always thought she'd have made a good PM. |
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Post by Deleted on Mar 6, 2017 17:57:47 GMT
It obviously needs more workers and less shiny arses!
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Post by RipRoaringPotter on Mar 6, 2017 18:47:37 GMT
The NHS should be for 'proper' things... People suffering with cancer or other such terrible things, people who've been in car crashes or other horrible accidents... I shouldn't need to draw up a list, you all know the kind of things I mean. What the NHS should NOT be for is people wanting a nose job or some shit to help them look like some fucking celebrity, people who've been fucking idiots & done stupid things, example off the top of my head someone who is pissed up & been dicking about on top of something, fell off & broke their leg... By all means treat them, but they should be charged for it afterwards. (The latter example I mean - The dickhead wanting a nose job for vanity reasons can pay upfront) NO NHS treatment for foreigners untill they have lived AND worked here for ten years. There are so many simple things we can do to make the NHS great again, and to make it something that looks after the poorest & most needy British citizens... But like with anything else nowadays we have to shit all over the British people in most need so that we can help 'politically correct' causes instead. "Oh we know that a 70 year old who has paid into the system all their lives needs a new hip, but they'll just have to wait 'cos this 25 year old man who thinks he's a woman needs some bullshit treatment first. Stop being so Transphobic". "Oh we know that your child can't get into their local school but all these foreign children help us reach our quota. Stop being so xenophobic". "Oh we know that British citizen who has worked all his life & landed on hard times needs a council house, but this 38-year old 'child' refugee is far more deserving of it. You're such a racist". The country needs a right good shake up from the top to the fucking bottom. We've got complete & utter fucking idiots in all the important positions who can actually do something about the state of the country. Cosmetic surgery is only available on the NHS if it is the solution to "physcological or other health reasons" according to the NHS www.nhs.uk/Conditions/cosmetic-treatments-guide/Pages/is-cosmetic-surgery-available-on-the-NHS.aspxThe rest of your post seems to be you getting angry at completely fictional situations. |
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Post by Billy the kid on Mar 6, 2017 21:42:03 GMT
The NHS should be for 'proper' things... People suffering with cancer or other such terrible things, people who've been in car crashes or other horrible accidents... I shouldn't need to draw up a list, you all know the kind of things I mean. What the NHS should NOT be for is people wanting a nose job or some shit to help them look like some fucking celebrity, people who've been fucking idiots & done stupid things, example off the top of my head someone who is pissed up & been dicking about on top of something, fell off & broke their leg... By all means treat them, but they should be charged for it afterwards. (The latter example I mean - The dickhead wanting a nose job for vanity reasons can pay upfront) NO NHS treatment for foreigners untill they have lived AND worked here for ten years. There are so many simple things we can do to make the NHS great again, and to make it something that looks after the poorest & most needy British citizens... But like with anything else nowadays we have to shit all over the British people in most need so that we can help 'politically correct' causes instead. "Oh we know that a 70 year old who has paid into the system all their lives needs a new hip, but they'll just have to wait 'cos this 25 year old man who thinks he's a woman needs some bullshit treatment first. Stop being so Transphobic". "Oh we know that your child can't get into their local school but all these foreign children help us reach our quota. Stop being so xenophobic". "Oh we know that British citizen who has worked all his life & landed on hard times needs a council house, but this 38-year old 'child' refugee is far more deserving of it. You're such a racist". The country needs a right good shake up from the top to the fucking bottom. We've got complete & utter fucking idiots in all the important positions who can actually do something about the state of the country. So forigners that have paid in to the system for only 8 years can't get help but uncle Jason who never worked a day in his life and sits at home on his arse since his mum kicked him out 20 years a go is ok to get work done after another dla claim? Just so we are clear |
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Post by TrentValePotter96 on Mar 7, 2017 9:28:28 GMT
The NHS should be for 'proper' things... People suffering with cancer or other such terrible things, people who've been in car crashes or other horrible accidents... I shouldn't need to draw up a list, you all know the kind of things I mean. What the NHS should NOT be for is people wanting a nose job or some shit to help them look like some fucking celebrity, people who've been fucking idiots & done stupid things, example off the top of my head someone who is pissed up & been dicking about on top of something, fell off & broke their leg... By all means treat them, but they should be charged for it afterwards. (The latter example I mean - The dickhead wanting a nose job for vanity reasons can pay upfront) NO NHS treatment for foreigners untill they have lived AND worked here for ten years. There are so many simple things we can do to make the NHS great again, and to make it something that looks after the poorest & most needy British citizens... But like with anything else nowadays we have to shit all over the British people in most need so that we can help 'politically correct' causes instead. "Oh we know that a 70 year old who has paid into the system all their lives needs a new hip, but they'll just have to wait 'cos this 25 year old man who thinks he's a woman needs some bullshit treatment first. Stop being so Transphobic". "Oh we know that your child can't get into their local school but all these foreign children help us reach our quota. Stop being so xenophobic". "Oh we know that British citizen who has worked all his life & landed on hard times needs a council house, but this 38-year old 'child' refugee is far more deserving of it. You're such a racist". The country needs a right good shake up from the top to the fucking bottom. We've got complete & utter fucking idiots in all the important positions who can actually do something about the state of the country. judging by this post i'd argue political correctness as you put it is vital. |
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Post by wizzardofdribble on Mar 7, 2017 23:04:11 GMT
Fat Bastards, smokers, alcoholics & druggies should pay for their own treatment.
They'd then have an incentive to change their behaviour & save us all a fortune.
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Post by bathstoke on Mar 8, 2017 0:41:47 GMT
Fat Bastards, smokers, alcoholics & druggies should pay for their own treatment. They'd then have an incentive to change their behaviour & save us all a fortune. How about those with sporting injuries. Skiers, runners, rugby, tennis... |
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Post by mtrstudent on Mar 8, 2017 2:09:35 GMT
Fat Bastards, smokers, alcoholics & druggies should pay for their own treatment. They'd then have an incentive to change their behaviour & save us all a fortune. Something like putting a special tax just on drink and fags like? |
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Post by Rednwhitenblue on Mar 8, 2017 16:24:51 GMT
We could always pay for a better NHS by, say, general taxation, like they do in, oh, Europe, where their health services are generally better than ours.
Just saying like. I know when it comes to voting time everyone is daft enough to believe they can have great services at no personal cost to themselves!
Does anyone really think the NHS paid for solely through NI contributions and entirely free at point of delivery will be with us still in 20 years time?
Average NI contributions based on average earnings of £26,500 pa in this country = £2212 pa
In the states average (silver) health care package = £3088pa
Good luck with affording that everyone!
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Post by mtrstudent on Mar 8, 2017 18:04:16 GMT
Average NI contributions based on average earnings of £26,500 pa in this country = £2212 pa In the states average (silver) health care package = £3088pa Good luck with affording that everyone! With a silver package you have to pay to see the doctor and if you get sick you're on the hook for up to £5k in fees. The NHS is much more efficient though. We don't have to pay extra money to drugs companies to fund their $90 bn advertising habit. And the NHS has people working out which treatments actually work then negotiating good prices for them. It's just much more efficient so it doesn't need anywhere near as much cash as the American system. EDIT: also, when I had a concussion I spent more time with staff working out payment, signing waivers for fees etc than I did with the doctor. They had almost as many staff processing paperwork and payments as they did doctors. Not sure that's really using the money to look after health. |
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Post by felonious on Mar 8, 2017 18:47:45 GMT
We could always pay for a better NHS by, say, general taxation, like they do in, oh, Europe, where their health services are generally better than ours. Just saying like. I know when it comes to voting time everyone is daft enough to believe they can have great services at no personal cost to themselves! Does anyone really think the NHS paid for solely through NI contributions and entirely free at point of delivery will be with us still in 20 years time? Average NI contributions based on average earnings of £26,500 pa in this country = £2212 paIn the states average (silver) health care package = £3088pa Good luck with affording that everyone! Well that covers Employees NI but in addition the employer pays an additional £2,537 on top. |
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Post by rogerjonesisgod on Mar 8, 2017 21:18:13 GMT
We could always pay for a better NHS by, say, general taxation, like they do in, oh, Europe, where their health services are generally better than ours. Just saying like. I know when it comes to voting time everyone is daft enough to believe they can have great services at no personal cost to themselves! Does anyone really think the NHS paid for solely through NI contributions and entirely free at point of delivery will be with us still in 20 years time? Average NI contributions based on average earnings of £26,500 pa in this country = £2212 pa In the states average (silver) health care package = £3088pa Good luck with affording that everyone! In Europe 20 - 30% of health costs are covered by individuals health insurance. And you pay to see a GP. |
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Post by rogerjonesisgod on Mar 8, 2017 21:35:57 GMT
The NHS should be for 'proper' things... People suffering with cancer or other such terrible things, people who've been in car crashes or other horrible accidents... I shouldn't need to draw up a list, you all know the kind of things I mean. What the NHS should NOT be for is people wanting a nose job or some shit to help them look like some fucking celebrity, people who've been fucking idiots & done stupid things, example off the top of my head someone who is pissed up & been dicking about on top of something, fell off & broke their leg... By all means treat them, but they should be charged for it afterwards. (The latter example I mean - The dickhead wanting a nose job for vanity reasons can pay upfront) NO NHS treatment for foreigners untill they have lived AND worked here for ten years. There are so many simple things we can do to make the NHS great again, and to make it something that looks after the poorest & most needy British citizens... But like with anything else nowadays we have to shit all over the British people in most need so that we can help 'politically correct' causes instead. "Oh we know that a 70 year old who has paid into the system all their lives needs a new hip, but they'll just have to wait 'cos this 25 year old man who thinks he's a woman needs some bullshit treatment first. Stop being so Transphobic". "Oh we know that your child can't get into their local school but all these foreign children help us reach our quota. Stop being so xenophobic". "Oh we know that British citizen who has worked all his life & landed on hard times needs a council house, but this 38-year old 'child' refugee is far more deserving of it. You're such a racist". The country needs a right good shake up from the top to the fucking bottom. We've got complete & utter fucking idiots in all the important positions who can actually do something about the state of the country. So forigners that have paid in to the system for only 8 years can't get help but uncle Jason who never worked a day in his life and sits at home on his arse since his mum kicked him out 20 years a go is ok to get work done after another dla claim? Just so we are clear There's nothing we can do about work shy Brits apart from squeeze their benefits. In your example Mr Foreigner only has 2 more years of health insurance to pay before he qualifies for the UK National Health scheme. |
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Post by bathstoke on Mar 9, 2017 7:38:10 GMT
So forigners that have paid in to the system for only 8 years can't get help but uncle Jason who never worked a day in his life and sits at home on his arse since his mum kicked him out 20 years a go is ok to get work done after another dla claim? Just so we are clear There's nothing we can do about work shy Brits apart from squeeze their benefits. In your example Mr Foreigner only has 2 more years of health insurance to pay before he qualifies for the UK National Health scheme. Clunk, Squib, Plop |
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