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Post by StokeAz on Jun 24, 2015 15:14:05 GMT
I feel our players don't get the credit they deserve and that other teams don't take us seriously... sevilla offer 3m for zonz! How are they ever gonna get him for that? They seem to think he can push a deal but he can't move without the 2 clubs agreeing a fee... then villa seem to be linked with both zonz and bego and think they stand a chance of getting them! Some stories created are laughable - when Sevilla offered 3m for zonz they were saying we wanted 6m! 6m! I don't understand why we are valued so lowly... Then today apparently leicester have bid 7m for zonz but he has rejected it himself straight away, which doesn't surprise me because he wants champions league. all articles are saying that it would be a sidewards move! Sidewards move to leicester? It a downwards move! They will be in the relegation scrap again next season while we'll be safe from the start! We want more than 7m surely! He's on his last year in his contract but surely he's still worth around 10m+. The only way out players would move is if it is an upward move, but for some reason crappy clubs think they stand a chance of competing for them... Finally it's funny because soton, only 2 places above us, have schneiderlin, worth 10m max and there are others that I don't care to name... They sold some players last season that have proved a complete flop, lovren and lallana come to mind straight away with a combined total of 45m+ for the 2 of them! It's a joke and gets me annoyed thinking about it!  |
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Post by StokeAz on Jun 24, 2015 15:19:35 GMT
Here's an example: www.leicester.vitalfootball.co.uk/article.asp?a=403547"The press speculate that he won't be interested in doing a deal, but if we have put an offer in it stands to reason that there will be some interest and it would probably hinge on the wage discussions." It won't hinge on wages! We can offer more than them and so can top teams! thoughts anyone? What do u think of other teams taking the mick? |
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Post by mrcoke on Jun 24, 2015 16:20:12 GMT
You make a valid point but there are two sides to the issue.
1. I have lived outside North Staff since the 60s and the area does suffer from forgottenness. Most Southerners don't know where it is (North or Midlands) and couldn't tell you which county or where Stoke is. Consequently they don't want to be drawn into discussion about the place because they know very little. For example Cardiff city once came to Stoke for a FA Cup match in the 60s and I brought a university friend from Cardiff to the match. He was very surprised to see there were coal mines! and he though the place stank, literally, there was a very strong sulphurous smell in the air from smoke inversion when we got out of my car. Where ever I have lived around the country there has been a general ignorance about Stoke. When I lived in the North East in the 90s a colleague had to be "forced" to go to work at Shelton or it was clear his career in the steel industry would not progress.
Consequently the area suffers from the ignorance of people outside the area.
On the other side of the coin the area has done little to "put itself on the map". Stoke have only one one major trophy, the League Cup, 40+ years ago, so there is a credibility issue about Stoke ever achieving anything.
2. There is the 1st division of "big clubs" the top 6 who's income is very much higher than everyone else's. (ManU/ManC/Chelsea/Arsenal/Liverpool/Spurs) They have huge records of League, Cup, CL, doubles, etc. Then there are the traditional "big clubs" who have large followings, much greater than Stoke's local and worldwide, and have been regular winners of major trophies and can attract huge crowds. (Everton/Newcastle/Sunderland/Leeds (RIP)/Aston Villa/West Ham ("won the world cup") This places Stoke in the 3rd division of major English clubs, when comparing their record, drawing power, popularity, etc. Consequently agents will consider Stoke an also ran despite having had recent success (of an FA Cup final and 2 9th places); many consider this is just a transient phase and normal service will soon be resumed. (There have been a few on Oatcake of a similar disposition.) The expectation by outsiders is that Stoke will always be in the mix with clubs like Leicester/West Brom/Middlebrough/Notts Forest/Southampton/Norwich/Ipswich/Derby/various London clubs/etc. etc. occasionally joined by clubs that have enjoyed major benefactors like Blackburn and Wigan.
The only way to achieve sustainable success is for the club produce their own "home grown" players for playing or selling, supplemented by shrewd purchases which are unlikely to be in direct competition with the "big clubs".viz. Southampton.
It follows that the likes of Leicester and Newcastle "outbidding" Stoke is considered perfectly normal by a very large part (majority?) of the population.
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Post by Staffsoatcake on Jun 24, 2015 16:25:56 GMT
Nzonzi is a better player now than when he joined us, so how anyone can think he is worth less than what we paid for him, must be living in cloud cookoo land.
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Post by stokesaint1 on Jun 24, 2015 17:05:31 GMT
Nzonzi is a better player now than when he joined us, so how anyone can think he is worth less than what we paid for him, must be living in cloud cookoo land. While we all know he is worth megabucks to us, the fact his contract runs out in twelve months, puts all the cards in the buying clubs hands. |
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Post by Deleted on Jun 24, 2015 17:11:53 GMT
I feel our players don't get the credit they deserve and that other teams don't take us seriously... sevilla offer 3m for zonz! How are they ever gonna get him for that? They seem to think he can push a deal but he can't move without the 2 clubs agreeing a fee... then villa seem to be linked with both zonz and bego and think they stand a chance of getting them! Some stories created are laughable - when Sevilla offered 3m for zonz they were saying we wanted 6m! 6m! I don't understand why we are valued so lowly... Then today apparently leicester have bid 7m for zonz but he has rejected it himself straight away, which doesn't surprise me because he wants champions league. all articles are saying that it would be a sidewards move! Sidewards move to leicester? It a downwards move! They will be in the relegation scrap again next season while we'll be safe from the start! We want more than 7m surely! He's on his last year in his contract but surely he's still worth around 10m+. The only way out players would move is if it is an upward move, but for some reason crappy clubs think they stand a chance of competing for them... Finally it's funny because soton, only 2 places above us, have schneiderlin, worth 10m max and there are others that I don't care to name... They sold some players last season that have proved a complete flop, lovren and lallana come to mind straight away with a combined total of 45m+ for the 2 of them! It's a joke and gets me annoyed thinking about it! I viewed it as a positive statement of intent that we turned down £7m. Wouldn't be surprised if the bid was part of the Huth deal and was intended to show the market where our valuation of Nzonzi is. |
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Post by Skankmonkey on Jun 24, 2015 17:23:11 GMT
You make a valid point but there are two sides to the issue. "and he though the place stank, literally, there was a very strong sulphurous smell in the air from smoke inversion when we got out of the car" Even as late as the '70s, when I got off the train, after working away for the summer, there was still a distinctive aroma to SOT I can recall on walking out of Stoke station. A chemical type irritation that caught at the back of my throat. |
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Post by slpmarc on Jun 24, 2015 17:39:59 GMT
Here's an example: www.leicester.vitalfootball.co.uk/article.asp?a=403547"The press speculate that he won't be interested in doing a deal, but if we have put an offer in it stands to reason that there will be some interest and it would probably hinge on the wage discussions." It won't hinge on wages! We can offer more than them and so can top teams! thoughts anyone? What do u think of other teams taking the mick? The Leicester offer was instigated by Stoke. They want to let clubs know we won't exept low offers for Nzonzi. |
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Post by Binndy on Jun 24, 2015 18:01:21 GMT
We have a mixed personality and hopefully we can keep up the unknown factors. Stokealona. Dogshome. Long ball.liverpool 1 stoke 6.The top teams lose to us. The bottom teams win. Complex and rarely on the tv.
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Post by hammered on Jun 24, 2015 18:35:45 GMT
Every club suffers from the same smokescreen of agents whipping up interest and supposed offers derisory or otherwise. It isn't a lack of respect for Stoke or its players.
Clubs are looking all the time and the deals that go through quickest and with the least issue, have normally been sorted months previously, or the insane money on the table divied out amongst agents and hangers on makes it a default to happen. Only the uber financed/successful can get what they want, most of the time. Even Newton Heath can't hang on to their goalkeeper despite being the biggest club in the world if the player wants to go.
When you're not one of top 6 - unless youve scouted the bloke for months you're in the melee with everyone else. In the manager market it's going on as well. Emery and Beilsa both flashed their knickers recently and got better deals from the clubs they're at. We ended up with a slightly uglier bird who we knew we could get anyway and probably try harder in the sack.
Seville low-balling Nzonzi followed by Leicester's is a reflection of the current interest in the player and his contract situation. There may be a bunch of other non-public bids/offers that are in the background but as of today that's where it's at. I do think it will help flush out if there any serious takers - But why would any club go in high when Nzonzi has done half the persuading job by going public about wanting a move and no competition for him anywhere else currently exists?. If he doesn't get the move he's looking for, it'll still be the £££ wages offer from somewhere else that will determine where he's at next season. And if Stoke want to keep him they'll probablly have to match it.
West Ham are currently low- balling Barcelona for Song. Having agreed terms with the player apparently - we're trying to get him for free!! Do West Ham pay the £5m and get the job done or do they tough it out till Sept when Barcelona probably give in?
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Post by ayem on Jun 24, 2015 21:02:00 GMT
I feel the Leicester bid was a good gesture bid. They can go out there and up the price of the player thereby erasing the 3m bid from Sevilla. It doesn't hurt them as nothing is concrete, and gives Stoke an honest low ball price for anyone looking
Why? First the Huth loan, then his signing which was good for both clubs. I have no hate for Leicester today.
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