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Post by Lakeland Potter on Aug 8, 2015 9:19:19 GMT
If he did sign for Everton big if on Loan I'd love to see the defence of our approach to the whole Shaq transfer on here and even better the guardian article explaining it straight from the horses mouth as I think to most reasoned observers it would game set and match to Mr Biscut.As it would pose the question what the fock have been trying to do all Sumer and how have we been trying to do it . Any chance of an English translation, Benjie?
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Post by benjaminbiscuit on Aug 8, 2015 9:20:12 GMT
Ramblers and Clarke
Let's not start the vale stuff you lot all only go Mardy and hurt when the flak starts coming back so give it a rest before you all get all upset again. And start a who loves stoke most contest .
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Post by VolvicStokie on Aug 8, 2015 9:22:11 GMT
Let him go on loan to Everton, no mither
Then when we take 6 points off them again, he'll see what a monumental fuck up he made.
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Post by harryburrows on Aug 8, 2015 10:29:02 GMT
Is this word now firmly on the school curriculum Linx ?
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Post by darksideofthemoon on Aug 8, 2015 11:25:31 GMT
If he did sign for Everton big if on Loan I'd love to see the defence of our approach to the whole Shaq transfer on here and even better the guardian article explaining it straight from the horses mouth as I think to most reasoned observers it would game set and match to Mr Biscut.As it would pose the question what the fock have been trying to do all Sumer and how have we been trying to do it . WOT !!!???
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Post by Deleted on Aug 8, 2015 11:32:06 GMT
I remember their keeper running over to the ambulance corner to get the medics on sharpish. They didn't look particularly keen to get involved
[/b] about as keen as Sol Campbell one murky Saturday a few years ago [/quote] I can't understand how Arsenal fans couldn't work out the turn for the worse in the atmosphere was completely down to the oldest player on the pitch 's tantrum (and it was a literal tantrum, jumping up and down) getting our player sent off and nothing to do with 'booing someone because he has a broken leg' I can only think they imagine us sat in front of the paralympics heckling every competitor.
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Post by baystokie on Aug 8, 2015 11:58:34 GMT
If he did sign for Everton big if on Loan I'd love to see the defence of our approach to the whole Shaq transfer on here and even better the guardian article explaining it straight from the horses mouth as I think to most reasoned observers it would game set and match to Mr Biscut.As it would pose the question what the fock have been trying to do all Sumer and how have we been trying to do it . Any chance of an English translation, Benjie? Lakeland's request apart - does the player not have a say in where he wants to go? if he prefers Everton for whatever reason, that's his prerogative - all our money, charm negotiating skill counts little in such cases. I guess that that many Prem clubs have many rejections, early and late, along the way between July and Sept - that's the nature of the beast.
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Post by themistocles on Aug 8, 2015 12:07:52 GMT
Any chance of an English translation, Benjie? Lakeland's request apart - does the player not have a say in where he wants to go? if he prefers Everton for whatever reason, that's his prerogative - all our money, charm negotiating skill counts little in such cases. I guess that that many Prem clubs have many rejections, early and late, along the way between July and Sept - that's the nature of the beast. Do you not think a crucial part of negotiating a transfer is making the player want to join your club over another I.e sell your club properly not a last resort... You don't just give up on a transfer because a player prefers another club, you sell your club right so they want to join you ... Do you not think the likes of payet, lens, ayew, mitrovic and the other castle lad had other teams they would of prefers to sign for ( instead of lower Prem clubs) the clubs sold themselves right for those kind of next level players to want to join...
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Post by stokeramblers on Aug 8, 2015 12:18:47 GMT
Lakeland's request apart - does the player not have a say in where he wants to go? if he prefers Everton for whatever reason, that's his prerogative - all our money, charm negotiating skill counts little in such cases. I guess that that many Prem clubs have many rejections, early and late, along the way between July and Sept - that's the nature of the beast. Do you not think a crucial part of negotiating a transfer is making the player want to join your club over another I.e sell your club properly not a last resort... You don't just give up on a transfer because a player prefers another club, you sell your club right so they want to join you ... Do you not think the likes of payet, lens, ayew, mitrovic and the other castle lad had other teams they would of prefers to sign for ( instead of lower Prem clubs) the clubs sold themselves right for those kind of next level players to want to join... I guess you have a point we will have to do as we did with the likes of Bojan, Muniesa, Affelay, Diouf, Arnautovic etc..
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Post by butlerstbob on Aug 8, 2015 12:23:02 GMT
Ramblers and Clarke Let's not start the vale stuff you lot all only go Mardy and hurt when the flak starts coming back so give it a rest before you all get all upset again. And start a who loves stoke most contest . Maybe just maybe the day you string a coherent sentence together people might just understand you!
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Post by themistocles on Aug 8, 2015 12:25:30 GMT
Do you not think a crucial part of negotiating a transfer is making the player want to join your club over another I.e sell your club properly not a last resort... You don't just give up on a transfer because a player prefers another club, you sell your club right so they want to join you ... Do you not think the likes of payet, lens, ayew, mitrovic and the other castle lad had other teams they would of prefers to sign for ( instead of lower Prem clubs) the clubs sold themselves right for those kind of next level players to want to join... I guess you have a point we will have to do as we did with the likes of Bojan, Muniesa, Affelay, Diouf, Arnautovic etc.. Next level players at peak of career or dogs home ? The test is persuading the next level big money players to join, so far unsuccessful.
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Post by Pirate on Aug 8, 2015 12:26:48 GMT
Lakeland's request apart - does the player not have a say in where he wants to go? if he prefers Everton for whatever reason, that's his prerogative - all our money, charm negotiating skill counts little in such cases. I guess that that many Prem clubs have many rejections, early and late, along the way between July and Sept - that's the nature of the beast. Do you not think a crucial part of negotiating a transfer is making the player want to join your club over another I.e sell your club properly not a last resort... You don't just give up on a transfer because a player prefers another club, you sell your club right so they want to join you ... Do you not think the likes of payet, lens, ayew, mitrovic and the other castle lad had other teams they would of prefers to sign for ( instead of lower Prem clubs) the clubs sold themselves right for those kind of next level players to want to join... How would any of the above named players provide anymore guarantees than anyone we have signed over the last two seasons?? How are they next level signings anymore than any player we have signed this summer????? Your basically saying any player we are in for we should sign or we have failed?? Whats it like on your planet?
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Post by themistocles on Aug 8, 2015 12:36:06 GMT
Do you not think a crucial part of negotiating a transfer is making the player want to join your club over another I.e sell your club properly not a last resort... You don't just give up on a transfer because a player prefers another club, you sell your club right so they want to join you ... Do you not think the likes of payet, lens, ayew, mitrovic and the other castle lad had other teams they would of prefers to sign for ( instead of lower Prem clubs) the clubs sold themselves right for those kind of next level players to want to join... How would any of the above named players provide anymore guarantees than anyone we have signed over the last two seasons?? How are they next level signings anymore than any player we have signed this summer????? Your basically saying any player we are in for we should sign or we have failed?? Whats it like on your planet? Its quiet easy to compare the names above to Ireland sidwell, Beardsley, Johnson. They are next level signings because they have proved themselves at higher levels than the freebies we've signed. I don't get some idiots on here who jump on the defensive as soon as the word money is spouted. Name one poster who is complaining about the signings of Bojangles, duoif, arni ect ? But for every one of them you get the likes of sidwell, Ireland ect, and you talk about guarantees.... According to your logic we shouldn't sign any big money player as they don't give the guarantees the freebies do ? How's it like on your planet then ?
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Post by chiswickpotter on Aug 8, 2015 12:41:17 GMT
Lakeland's request apart - does the player not have a say in where he wants to go? if he prefers Everton for whatever reason, that's his prerogative - all our money, charm negotiating skill counts little in such cases. I guess that that many Prem clubs have many rejections, early and late, along the way between July and Sept - that's the nature of the beast. Do you not think a crucial part of negotiating a transfer is making the player want to join your club over another I.e sell your club properly not a last resort... You don't just give up on a transfer because a player prefers another club, you sell your club right so they want to join you ... Do you not think the likes of payet, lens, ayew, mitrovic and the other castle lad had other teams they would of prefers to sign for ( instead of lower Prem clubs) the clubs sold themselves right for those kind of next level players to want to join... Let's see how many of those players are "next level" but in any case the fact is we are a club in a small unfashionable city with a highest PL finish of 9th and a crowd of around 28 thousand. A loan to a club with a bigger name and larger crowd may well appeal to the player as he repositions his career. Not sure how we can infer anyone has not done their job just the reality of the challenge we face moving forward
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Post by mistergumby on Aug 8, 2015 12:44:17 GMT
Here's a yardstick of sorts for your consideration. Discussed this matter at length with a group of mates who originate from all over the world two weeks ago. All big footy fans and some are followers of Prem clubs. Most were only vaguely aware of Stoke City and few could name more than 2 players (Crouch and ermm, Walters being the most popular). The general consensus from their distant perspective was that Stoke as a club are perceived abroad as being on a par with... Norwich. Yep. Norwich. Similar sized support, one major trophy won, yo-yo'd up and down the leagues, provincial city, etc, etc. We have to face facts. Clubs like Newcastle, Villa, Everton, Sunderland etc may have finished below us on a regular basis just lately but are still WAY bigger than Stoke and will always be, unless we can somehow enhance our reputation as a club, which is usually initially achieved by sustained success and results on the pitch and actually winning things, difficult though that might be. I honestly think the board consider we may just be at the very start of that journey, but in trying to get to the much mentioned 'next level' and trying to sign players to achieve that, the club may have hit it's glass ceiling - at least for the present.
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Post by Paul Spencer on Aug 8, 2015 12:46:00 GMT
Here's a yardstick of sorts for your consideration. Discussed this matter at length with a group of mates who originate from all over the world two weeks ago. All big footy fans and some are followers of Prem clubs. Most were only vaguely aware of Stoke City and few could name more than 2 players (Crouch and ermm, Walters being the most popular). The general consensus from their distant perspective was that Stoke as a club are perceived abroad as being on a par with... Norwich. Yep. Norwich. Similar sized support, one major trophy won, yo-yo'd up and down the leagues, provincial city, etc, etc. We have to face facts. Clubs like Newcastle, Villa, Everton, Sunderland etc may have finished below us on a regular basis just lately but are still WAY bigger than Stoke and will always be, unless we can somehow enhance our reputation as a club, which is usually initially achieved by sustained success and results on the pitch and actually winning things, difficult though that might be. I honestly think the board consider we may just be at the very start of that journey, but in trying to get to the much mentioned 'next level' and trying to sign players to achieve that, the club may have hit it's glass ceiling - at least for the present. Any idea how they would view Southampton?
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Post by Pirate on Aug 8, 2015 12:51:25 GMT
How would any of the above named players provide anymore guarantees than anyone we have signed over the last two seasons?? How are they next level signings anymore than any player we have signed this summer????? Your basically saying any player we are in for we should sign or we have failed?? Whats it like on your planet? Its quiet easy to compare the names above to Ireland sidwell, Beardsley, Johnson. They are next level signings because they have proved themselves at higher levels than the freebies we've signed. I don't get some idiots on here who jump on the defensive as soon as the word money is spouted. Name one poster who is complaining about the signings of Bojangles, duoif, arni ect ? But for every one of them you get the likes of sidwell, Ireland ect, and you talk about guarantees.... According to your logic we shouldn't sign any big money player as they don't give the guarantees the freebies do ? How's it like on your planet then ? I am not the one offering guarantees though, you are holding up players like Mitrovic & Ayew as nailed on next level signings & using them as barometers with which to do down our own signings?? Please tell me wear i have said any player offers a certainty, that was the point, they don't even if they are more expensive & none of the above alluded to Newcastle of Swansea players offer any more or less certainty than our summer signings!!! I do not mind the money being spent in the least, if it represents value, to say that because we have only forked out £5ill in the transfer market must mean we have bought in shit substandard players though is ridiculous is it not?
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Post by themistocles on Aug 8, 2015 12:57:47 GMT
Its quiet easy to compare the names above to Ireland sidwell, Beardsley, Johnson. They are next level signings because they have proved themselves at higher levels than the freebies we've signed. I don't get some idiots on here who jump on the defensive as soon as the word money is spouted. Name one poster who is complaining about the signings of Bojangles, duoif, arni ect ? But for every one of them you get the likes of sidwell, Ireland ect, and you talk about guarantees.... According to your logic we shouldn't sign any big money player as they don't give the guarantees the freebies do ? How's it like on your planet then ? I am not the one offering guarantees though, you are holding up players like Mitrovic & Ayew as nailed on next level signings & using them as barometers with which to do down our own signings?? Please tell me wear i have said any player offers a certainty, that was the point, they don't even if they are more expensive & none of the above alluded to Newcastle of Swansea players offer any more or less certainty than our summer signings!!! I do not mind the money being spent in the least, if it represents value, to say that because we have only forked out £5ill in the transfer market must mean we have bought in shit substandard players though is ridiculous is it not? Good value van be achieved by spending money , wanyamma, clasie, bony ect. Other teams around us have significantly strengthened, I don't see what's wrong with supporters asking why can't we be closing the deals on signings like these. The biggest disappointment is all last season TS was preaching that money would be available and that we are keeping our powder dry for next season, he has also said himself that we are looking at next level signings, for what evidence is money available, if it's not don't get supporters hopes and expectations up..
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Post by mistergumby on Aug 8, 2015 13:48:40 GMT
Here's a yardstick of sorts for your consideration. Discussed this matter at length with a group of mates who originate from all over the world two weeks ago. All big footy fans and some are followers of Prem clubs. Most were only vaguely aware of Stoke City and few could name more than 2 players (Crouch and ermm, Walters being the most popular). The general consensus from their distant perspective was that Stoke as a club are perceived abroad as being on a par with... Norwich. Yep. Norwich. Similar sized support, one major trophy won, yo-yo'd up and down the leagues, provincial city, etc, etc. We have to face facts. Clubs like Newcastle, Villa, Everton, Sunderland etc may have finished below us on a regular basis just lately but are still WAY bigger than Stoke and will always be, unless we can somehow enhance our reputation as a club, which is usually initially achieved by sustained success and results on the pitch and actually winning things, difficult though that might be. I honestly think the board consider we may just be at the very start of that journey, but in trying to get to the much mentioned 'next level' and trying to sign players to achieve that, the club may have hit it's glass ceiling - at least for the present. Any idea how they would view Southampton? Paul, they seem to see Southampton as a marginally bigger draw for players and a marginally bigger club. It was the first name I mentioned and thought to myself that would be the obvious comparison. Or maybe even West Brom. The appointment of Koeman seems to have carried a lot of weight amongst those of my mates of continental European origin. But that is only a small and very recent part of a much wider debate, of course. The issue of how 'big' a club is mostly about perceptions and reputations, which is, of course, blindingly obvious, so it was interesting to try and get another view from folks who, for the most part, see the game from both a geographical distance and a quite different perspective. And, yeah, Norwich LOL!
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Post by Pirate on Aug 8, 2015 14:06:21 GMT
I am not the one offering guarantees though, you are holding up players like Mitrovic & Ayew as nailed on next level signings & using them as barometers with which to do down our own signings?? Please tell me wear i have said any player offers a certainty, that was the point, they don't even if they are more expensive & none of the above alluded to Newcastle of Swansea players offer any more or less certainty than our summer signings!!! I do not mind the money being spent in the least, if it represents value, to say that because we have only forked out £5ill in the transfer market must mean we have bought in shit substandard players though is ridiculous is it not? Good value van be achieved by spending money , wanyamma, clasie, bony ect. Other teams around us have significantly strengthened, I don't see what's wrong with supporters asking why can't we be closing the deals on signings like these. The biggest disappointment is all last season TS was preaching that money would be available and that we are keeping our powder dry for next season, he has also said himself that we are looking at next level signings, for what evidence is money available, if it's not don't get supporters hopes and expectations up.. Good value can be achieved by spending money agreed, as it can by not spending also. The problem i have is you seem to think everyone else has signed better players than we have, when none of them are proven or dis-proven at this level any more or less than our 8 signings? Why is Ayew better than Affelay, or Mitrovic better than Joselu??
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Post by themistocles on Aug 8, 2015 14:18:52 GMT
Good value van be achieved by spending money , wanyamma, clasie, bony ect. Other teams around us have significantly strengthened, I don't see what's wrong with supporters asking why can't we be closing the deals on signings like these. The biggest disappointment is all last season TS was preaching that money would be available and that we are keeping our powder dry for next season, he has also said himself that we are looking at next level signings, for what evidence is money available, if it's not don't get supporters hopes and expectations up.. Good value can be achieved by spending money agreed, as it can by not spending also. The problem i have is you seem to think everyone else has signed better players than we have, when none of them are proven or dis-proven at this level any more or less than our 8 signings? Why is Ayew better than Affelay, or Mitrovic better than Joselu?? Mitrovic has scored goals in champions league, ayew is at his peak whereas affely has only played a handful of games in 5 seasons... You can talk rubbish all you like you're obviously on the defensive as a poster has said we need to invest... The likes of payer, ayew, lens are better then the players we have brought in, all have proved it on international level and have played for better quality teams than stoke. Unproven at prem level... You can say that about every player on the content , does that mean they aren't as good as the players we have brought in because of it...
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Post by scfc5 on Aug 8, 2015 14:58:55 GMT
Good value can be achieved by spending money agreed, as it can by not spending also. The problem i have is you seem to think everyone else has signed better players than we have, when none of them are proven or dis-proven at this level any more or less than our 8 signings? Why is Ayew better than Affelay, or Mitrovic better than Joselu?? Mitrovic has scored goals in champions league, ayew is at his peak whereas affely has only played a handful of games in 5 seasons... You can talk rubbish all you like you're obviously on the defensive as a poster has said we need to invest... The likes of payer, ayew, lens are better then the players we have brought in, all have proved it on international level and have played for better quality teams than stoke. Unproven at prem level... You can say that about every player on the content , does that mean they aren't as good as the players we have brought in because of it... Harsh on Afellay - signed by Barcelona, 50 caps for Netherlands. Had a cruciate ligament injury just like Bojan. Anyone can get one of those. Then Pep's replacement didn't fancy him.
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Post by Pirate on Aug 8, 2015 15:03:09 GMT
Good value can be achieved by spending money agreed, as it can by not spending also. The problem i have is you seem to think everyone else has signed better players than we have, when none of them are proven or dis-proven at this level any more or less than our 8 signings? Why is Ayew better than Affelay, or Mitrovic better than Joselu?? Mitrovic has scored goals in champions league, ayew is at his peak whereas affely has only played a handful of games in 5 seasons... You can talk rubbish all you like you're obviously on the defensive as a poster has said we need to invest... The likes of payer, ayew, lens are better then the players we have brought in, all have proved it on international level and have played for better quality teams than stoke. Unproven at prem level... You can say that about every player on the content , does that mean they aren't as good as the players we have brought in because of it... Yes continental players with no experience in England are unproven, doesn't mean the players we have bought in are not as good as other clubs signings either & i have never claimed so, you use the very reasons to dam our players that you use to big up other clubs signings, me, i have said they are all unproven. So Affelay doesn't have 50 caps for Holland & hasn't played for bigger clubs than Stoke? It in no way displays that he will or will not be a hit though anyway? Of course we need to invest, i have never said otherwise, we do invest on many levels other than direct transfer fee's but i am convinced if the right deals for the right players are there we will take them, not just buy any old shit with a lofty price tag. It is clear we are in for Yarmolenko for a price of anywhere between £13mill & £15mil, a player that i think would be a good educated risk at that sort of money, a player with pedigree.( 49 caps 19 gls ) How can you be convinced that the 4 players you have mentioned above will prove to be better than Affelay, Van Ginkel or Joselu, i would say every one of them, there's & ours have a fairly equal chance of success or failure. Why is this Payet with 14 caps for A France team in serious decline in the last 10 yrs who until recently plied his trade for bang average French sides suddenly a proven international?? I bet he hasn't played more than half a dozen times in the champions league proper? He could be a fine player, just because somebody else has bought him for big money & not us doesn't make him a guaranteed hit anymore than any player we have signed? Mitrovic has made 25 European ( not champs league exclusive ) appearances in his career scoring in no way prolific 6 goals,13 caps with a solitary goal to show for it make him proven international quality does it, Dave Nugent must be delighted yes he is a young player & looks a prospect but a couple of nice seasons in Belgium does not a player make. Hope that isn't to much rubbish for you.
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Post by Linx on Aug 8, 2015 15:25:15 GMT
Is this word now firmly on the school curriculum Linx ? Every kid who uses it appropriately in one of their essays will get an A* from me, harry. I'm not sure what it means but it's such a brill word it just has to be in there.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 8, 2015 18:27:19 GMT
Watford readying a bid. This could get fun.
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Post by bayernoatcake on Aug 8, 2015 18:32:20 GMT
On loan I think he'd go there over us for two main reasons.
1) Their manager is well respected in Europe 2) Living the London life
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Post by chuckrocky on Aug 8, 2015 18:48:25 GMT
On loan I think he'd go there over us for two main reasons. 1) Their manager is well respected in Europe 2) Living the London life I thought it was pretty well documented they're only interested in selling him permanently? If they're willing to loan him out there'll be much better options for him than ourselves and Watford.
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Post by bayernoatcake on Aug 8, 2015 18:53:37 GMT
On loan I think he'd go there over us for two main reasons. 1) Their manager is well respected in Europe 2) Living the London life I thought it was pretty well documented they're only interested in selling him permanently? If they're willing to loan him out there'll be much better options for him than ourselves and Watford. I don't think they'll get the offers. And I agree.
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Post by RAF on Aug 8, 2015 18:57:28 GMT
Ramblers and Clarke Let's not start the vale stuff you lot all only go Mardy and hurt when the flak starts coming back so give it a rest before you all get all upset again. And start a who loves stoke most contest . You are cancerous vermin sunshine! H
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Post by jeycov on Aug 8, 2015 19:45:50 GMT
Linked with Everton again on SSN and Argentina defender Miro.
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