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Post by partickpotter on Mar 27, 2015 11:18:59 GMT
Takes about 15 seconds to find the admission from the police that they were responsible for the death of Blair Peach. Blair Peach: After 31 years Met police say 'sorry' for their role in his killingSeeing as you seem more than proficient in trawling the web to find negative stories about Islam to support your promotion of islamophobia, Interesting that you're content to sit in ingnorance on the circumstances and the culpability of the police in the murder of a civilian. I guess if it had been a Muslim who'd killed Blair Peach you'd be all over that like a rash. BTW - your inference that as football supporters we're all well versed in riots is curious. Been going to football for over 40 years and I've never been in a riot (great song by the Mekons that!). I have seen some OTT heavy handed policing though - particularly from our friends in the West Midland Force. The police really struggled for a long time in the 70s and 80s in very difficult circumstances. And they messed up big time; individually on occassion (as in this case) and structurally (SPGs). That was then, this is now. No question lessons have been learned - although mistakes still happen. Some, sadly, still structural. I don't know guess the only people who do know one is dead and the other wont talk so its all hear say. Undeniably the evidence points at the police. But lets not kid are self's that Blair was of for a Sunday picnic down the park. Doesn't make it any less of a crime just saying when we went Bradford we all knew there was a very strong likely hood we take a kicking or worse goes with the territory. As for football ok maybe not full scale riots but you know what I am saying. I seen it with Vale Vs Wolves 2 season ago. Major police fuck up yet it gets portrayed as football hooligans ?? I have heard stories as well of Stoke games down the Brit think it was Cardiff when the Police were just charging up Stanley Matthews Way on horse back swinging batons at anyone unlucky enough get in the way. Have to say I'm struggling to understand what you're saying. For Blair Peach there are plenty of folk still alive who saw what happened. The police, as an organisation, have admitted responsibility, but have decided not to pursue individual culpability. Shades of Hillsbrough. As regards hooliganism - the police's job is to control and manage situations. Which is a frequently a tough and thankless task. But it's what they are trained for and paid to do. What they shouldn't do is exacerbate a situation - which, of course, has happened. The culture of police protecting their own is a cancer - I'm sure it's less malignant today than previously, but it is still there.
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Post by kinetic on Mar 27, 2015 11:53:17 GMT
I don't know guess the only people who do know one is dead and the other wont talk so its all hear say. Undeniably the evidence points at the police. But lets not kid are self's that Blair was of for a Sunday picnic down the park. Doesn't make it any less of a crime just saying when we went Bradford we all knew there was a very strong likely hood we take a kicking or worse goes with the territory. As for football ok maybe not full scale riots but you know what I am saying. I seen it with Vale Vs Wolves 2 season ago. Major police fuck up yet it gets portrayed as football hooligans ?? I have heard stories as well of Stoke games down the Brit think it was Cardiff when the Police were just charging up Stanley Matthews Way on horse back swinging batons at anyone unlucky enough get in the way. Have to say I'm struggling to understand what you're saying. For Blair Peach there are plenty of folk still alive who saw what happened. The police, as an organisation, have admitted responsibility, but have decided not to pursue individual culpability. Shades of Hillsbrough. As regards hooliganism - the police's job is to control and manage situations. Which is a frequently a tough and thankless task. But it's what they are trained for and paid to do. What they shouldn't do is exacerbate a situation - which, of course, has happened. The culture of police protecting their own is a cancer - I'm sure it's less malignant today than previously, but it is still there. Just saying if you go looking for agro it will find you no doubt. Does he deserve to be dead no he doesn't. Is he a martyr for the cause yes he is. Did the NF have a right to hold a election rally under are democracy yes they did in bad taste but they had the right and as you say. More than that I conna say wasn't there I was one yr old. Off topic a bit this what makes me laugh about the so called anti-fascist movement they still think it the 70s/80s when the NF was with out doubt a national threat. not so now a days the BNP is bankrupt the EDL are not racist no matter how many times the media say they are. then UKIP we know some of the old BNP membership were on board but as a party I haven't seen any election manifestos of "Send them back". Think its more just concerned citizens. You will not find many racist from my generation we grew up in multicultural Britain. I don't care what colour you are black white or yellow don't matter. What bothers me is what is in your heart and your head. If you consider yourself to be British fair play crack on with it.
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Post by kinetic on Mar 27, 2015 13:01:34 GMT
I see Ed Miliband was attacked trying to get to his waiting car yesterday sound familiar to anyone ?? Difference is though no question by the media if it was just a "Carnival atmosphere" Instead it's a "disgusting attack carried out by thugs" As for the punch in the guts. No chance he has none. Oh the hypocrisy. www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/ed-miliband-punched-shoved-protesters-5409428
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Post by Northy on Mar 27, 2015 13:10:22 GMT
I see Ed Miliband was attacked trying to get to his waiting car yesterday sound familiar to anyone ?? Difference is though no question by the media if it was just a "Carnival atmosphere" Instead it's a "disgusting attack carried out by thugs" As for the punch in the guts. No chance he has none. Oh the hypocrisy. www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/ed-miliband-punched-shoved-protesters-5409428It was like jelly when my fist went in, he doesn't do ab crunches
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Post by thevoid on Mar 27, 2015 13:21:54 GMT
The problem with the far left is that they're so far to the left of the spectrum, they think that anyone with a centre-right viewpoint is far right.
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Post by kinetic on Mar 27, 2015 19:42:48 GMT
I see Ed Miliband was attacked trying to get to his waiting car yesterday sound familiar to anyone ?? Difference is though no question by the media if it was just a "Carnival atmosphere" Instead it's a "disgusting attack carried out by thugs" As for the punch in the guts. No chance he has none. Oh the hypocrisy. www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/ed-miliband-punched-shoved-protesters-5409428It was like jelly when my fist went in, he doesn't do ab crunches How could ya miss that chin ?? Usually all over the floor.
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Post by mermaidsal on Mar 27, 2015 20:40:55 GMT
The problem with the far left is that they're so far to the left of the spectrum, they think that anyone with a centre-right viewpoint is far right. Or from where I sit... so growing up in the 80s I'd have called myself a moderate socialist, pretty mainstream really. I haven't changed that much but the political spectrum has, massively. As it is now, New Labour was to the Right of most 80s Tories (even under Thatcher), Milliband Labour is still only Cemntre, not sure I would add Left to that description. LibDems are nowhere in particular. In 80s terms, current Tories are Far Right and UKIP further. The only parties with any kind of anti-capitalist agenda (unless you count Gorgeous George as a party) are Green and Plaid Cymru, I can't vote Plaid in Castle and the Greens won't be making any effort round here because the seat's not remotely winnable for them (besides our pathetic sheeplike obsession with leaders and being led means people are judging leaders not ideology or morality and Natalie Bennett just doesn't do well on that basis). Wtf happened to us?
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Post by Deleted on Mar 27, 2015 21:06:33 GMT
The problem with the far left is that they're so far to the left of the spectrum, they think that anyone with a centre-right viewpoint is far right. Or from where I sit... so growing up in the 80s I'd have called myself a moderate socialist, pretty mainstream really. I haven't changed that much but the political spectrum has, massively. As it is now, New Labour was to the Right of most 80s Tories (even under Thatcher), Milliband Labour is still only Cemntre, not sure I would add Left to that description. LibDems are nowhere in particular. In 80s terms, current Tories are Far Right and UKIP further. The only parties with any kind of anti-capitalist agenda (unless you count Gorgeous George as a party) are Green and Plaid Cymru, I can't vote Plaid in Castle and the Greens won't be making any effort round here because the seat's not remotely winnable for them (besides our pathetic sheeplike obsession with leaders and being led means people are judging leaders not ideology or morality and Natalie Bennett just doesn't do well on that basis). Wtf happened to us? Europe
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Post by harryburrows on Mar 27, 2015 21:43:20 GMT
The problem with the far left is that they're so far to the left of the spectrum, they think that anyone with a centre-right viewpoint is far right. Or from where I sit... so growing up in the 80s I'd have called myself a moderate socialist, pretty mainstream really. I haven't changed that much but the political spectrum has, massively. As it is now, New Labour was to the Right of most 80s Tories (even under Thatcher), Milliband Labour is still only Cemntre, not sure I would add Left to that description. LibDems are nowhere in particular. In 80s terms, current Tories are Far Right and UKIP further. The only parties with any kind of anti-capitalist agenda (unless you count Gorgeous George as a party) are Green and Plaid Cymru, I can't vote Plaid in Castle and the Greens won't be making any effort round here because the seat's not remotely winnable for them (besides our pathetic sheeplike obsession with leaders and being led means people are judging leaders not ideology or morality and Natalie Bennett just doesn't do well on that basis). Wtf happened to us? Party politics died 20 years ago sal , it's purely a beauty contest these days . Ideology is no longer on offer " it's the economy stupid "
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Post by crapslinger on Mar 27, 2015 22:02:32 GMT
The problem with the far left is that they're so far to the left of the spectrum, they think that anyone with a centre-right viewpoint is far right. Or from where I sit... so growing up in the 80s I'd have called myself a moderate socialist, pretty mainstream really. I haven't changed that much but the political spectrum has, massively. As it is now, New Labour was to the Right of most 80s Tories (even under Thatcher), Milliband Labour is still only Cemntre, not sure I would add Left to that description. LibDems are nowhere in particular. In 80s terms, current Tories are Far Right and UKIP further. The only parties with any kind of anti-capitalist agenda (unless you count Gorgeous George as a party) are Green and Plaid Cymru, I can't vote Plaid in Castle and the Greens won't be making any effort round here because the seat's not remotely winnable for them (besides our pathetic sheeplike obsession with leaders and being led means people are judging leaders not ideology or morality and Natalie Bennett just doesn't do well on that basis). Wtf happened to us? Apathy , a general lack of realisation, media (radio gaga). political correctness gone mad, big brother (not that shit reality show), the loss of identity (English), suppression of sections of our society, greed (upper class's), European legislation(Cherie Blaire), Tony Blaire(new Labour) and most of all a lack of backbone.
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Post by wizzardofdribble on Mar 28, 2015 5:02:56 GMT
The last time there was any genuine difference between political parties was 1983. Since then they've both agreed on the main agenda despite all the rhetoric. Most policies vary in style not substance.
All peoples political views really tell you about is what newspaper they read. 'Those that own the means of production also own the intellectual means of production'. As true now as it was then.
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Post by kinetic on Mar 28, 2015 6:29:25 GMT
On the subject of fascism anyone out in Dubai ? Put Tommy in a search engine for us.
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