|
Post by Deleted on Dec 23, 2014 11:17:28 GMT
The level of force used is the key . If he had a weapon such as a screwdriver or something and was resisting arrest or threatening to injure the officers involved , then the officers were right to use a Tazer. The fact he died is not the real issue here. It only becomes an issue if the level of force was disproportionate in his arrest and subsequent death .These type of crimes tend to be done by serial offenders but obviously this is not certain in every case. Come on mumf you're setting yourself up there fella....say someone breaks into your house, all rational thought goes out of the window. You're telling me you wouldn't use disproportionate force...? You wouldn't call the police and instead try to reason with said burglar...? "Excuse me young tyke, would you mind awfully putting that PS4 back please you cheeky scamp...? Would you bollox ! If anyone tried to get into my house, they'd get the 'disproportionately' thick end of a baseball bat round their fuckin' head and no mistake I think you misunderstood the point I'm making. I was referring to the powers of arrest in relation to this particular incident and the police specifically. I'm not referring to my ,or the general publics reaction or powers of arrest. There is a distinct difference between the two.
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Dec 23, 2014 11:31:05 GMT
This " police Taser a man to death" headline is utter bullshit. Reality is Police use a Taser on a burglar, following complete protocol, and it results in a death. Just spare a thought for the copper, who when he clocked on did not for 1 minute think " I Know...I'm gonna Taser someone to death tonight" However the burglar probably thought" Shit...getting a bit low on crack cocaine supplies, I know, lets go and rob someone" That copper has got to carry that burden for his entire life now, all in the line of duty.
|
|
|
Post by wizzardofdribble on Dec 23, 2014 12:03:20 GMT
What are the odds this death could have been avoided, as could the crime, if heroin was given away free in a controlled environment. Perhaps this would even reduce the cost of house insurance for us all. Just a guess before the world closes in upon me like, and it was only the odds i was asking for. 8 to 1? Methadone is freely available though Billy. Making heroin available legally isn't going to stop 15 year olds from breaking into peoples houses. (The Peak age of offending is 15) because they wouldn't be able to get hold of heroin legally anyway. On the other hand, making heroin legally available would create a black market in the drug as older addicts (or supposed addicts) sold the drug to underage youth. Instead of eradicating the problem you would just spread it around. The fact that Youth Courts give out far more lenient sentences to Young Offenders than Adult Offenders actually means that you would make the problem worse, because the 'deterrent factor' for under 18's is much less than over 18's. Youth Courts are given Home Office Directives to keep young people out of Custody because the re-offending rate is about 90%. That's why they get Supervision Orders for committing 30 odd burglaries.
|
|
|
Post by kbillyh on Dec 23, 2014 12:22:27 GMT
What are the odds this death could have been avoided, as could the crime, if heroin was given away free in a controlled environment. Perhaps this would even reduce the cost of house insurance for us all. Just a guess before the world closes in upon me like, and it was only the odds i was asking for. 8 to 1? Methadone is freely available though Billy. Making heroin available legally isn't going to stop 15 year olds from breaking into peoples houses. (The Peak age of offending is 15) because they wouldn't be able to get hold of heroin legally anyway. On the other hand, making heroin legally available would create a black market in the drug as older addicts (or supposed addicts) sold the drug to underage youth. Instead of eradicating the problem you would just spread it around. The fact that Youth Courts give out far more lenient sentences to Young Offenders than Adult Offenders actually means that you would make the problem worse, because the 'deterrent factor' for under 18's is much less than over 18's. Youth Courts are given Home Office Directives to keep young people out of Custody because the re-offending rate is about 90%. That's why they get Supervision Orders for committing 30 odd burglaries. I'm not sure i follow your logic there Wizz, why do you think a new black market would be created? Most street level heroin dealers are heroin addicts, it's what they do to pay for their habit. Would it not be more likely that the need to promote the drug amongst others would be nullified to a great extent if they didn't have a funding issue. Heroin addiction would be treated as an illness and viewed as such by the next generation of potential users thus taking away a huge slice of the perceived glamour.
|
|
|
Post by lordb on Dec 23, 2014 13:00:03 GMT
Right: take or leave this:
Here's what I know
No burgulary involved,that's nonsense from the media A party got out of hand,victim was apparently on something & got very aggressive (knife was pulled) once Police turned up - hence taser - victim was 1: afro-carribean 2: off his face 3: a family man,very popular with his neighbours. 4:weilding a knife
|
|
|
Post by mermaidsal on Dec 23, 2014 13:10:10 GMT
I'm so sorry the title of this thread got changed, that's a wrong decision imho.
Whoever the guy was and whatever he was doing, the one thing we certainly know is he died as a result of a police attack. Man killed by police seems a pretty fair description of what happened therefore. So far the official version is he was doing nothing to threaten anyone else's life, let's wait and see how the full story emerges rather than rumours.
Staffs is the most taser happy force in the UK statistically, an incident like this has been coming.
|
|
|
Post by mrred on Dec 23, 2014 15:03:15 GMT
Good fucking riddance.
|
|
|
Post by RipRoaringPotter on Dec 23, 2014 15:59:21 GMT
Good to see another situation with sketchy details completely dissected and passed judgement on.
Keep up the good nonsensical work guys.
|
|
|
Post by bathstoke on Dec 23, 2014 20:10:35 GMT
I'm so sorry the title of this thread got changed, that's a wrong decision imho. Whoever the guy was and whatever he was doing, the one thing we certainly know is he died as a result of a police attack. Man killed by police seems a pretty fair description of what happened therefore. So far the official version is he was doing nothing to threaten anyone else's life, let's wait and see how the full story emerges rather than rumours. Staffs is the most taser happy force in the UK statistically, an incident like this has been coming. ThanX Mermaid, truth is, not only was the initial title of the thread changed, but my "Kim Jong Un" response was also Deleted & this is exactly how Nazi Germany started!!!
|
|
|
Post by SamB_SCFC on Dec 23, 2014 21:34:21 GMT
If he's broken in and not surrendered he deserved to be tasered and the fact he died is an irrelevance. Got no sympathy for thieving bastards.
|
|
|
Post by Bojan Mackey on Dec 23, 2014 21:34:34 GMT
Well the phrase "Been charged for Burglary" just took on a whole new meaning.
|
|
|
Post by salopstick on Dec 23, 2014 21:38:58 GMT
I'm so sorry the title of this thread got changed, that's a wrong decision imho. Whoever the guy was and whatever he was doing, the one thing we certainly know is he died as a result of a police attack. Man killed by police seems a pretty fair description of what happened therefore. So far the official version is he was doing nothing to threaten anyone else's life, let's wait and see how the full story emerges rather than rumours. Staffs is the most taser happy force in the UK statistically, an incident like this has been coming. Are you seriously stating this is a "police attack" I take police attack to mean an unprovoked Act of violence - I'm not having that
|
|
|
Post by Nick1984 on Dec 23, 2014 21:59:20 GMT
Good, if it were my house that was burgled I'd want the pikey tasered to death too.
|
|
|
Post by bayernoatcake on Dec 23, 2014 23:13:24 GMT
I'm so sorry the title of this thread got changed, that's a wrong decision imho. Whoever the guy was and whatever he was doing, the one thing we certainly know is he died as a result of a police attack. Man killed by police seems a pretty fair description of what happened therefore. So far the official version is he was doing nothing to threaten anyone else's life, let's wait and see how the full story emerges rather than rumours. Staffs is the most taser happy force in the UK statistically, an incident like this has been coming. I think you should wait for the "official" version before posting bullshit like this Sal.
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Dec 23, 2014 23:25:02 GMT
I'm so sorry the title of this thread got changed, that's a wrong decision imho. Whoever the guy was and whatever he was doing, the one thing we certainly know is he died as a result of a police attack. Man killed by police seems a pretty fair description of what happened therefore. So far the official version is he was doing nothing to threaten anyone else's life, let's wait and see how the full story emerges rather than rumours. Staffs is the most taser happy force in the UK statistically, an incident like this has been coming. I think you should wait for the "official" version before posting bullshit like this Sal. Indeed...
|
|
|
Post by mermaidsal on Dec 24, 2014 2:07:48 GMT
I'm so sorry the title of this thread got changed, that's a wrong decision imho. Whoever the guy was and whatever he was doing, the one thing we certainly know is he died as a result of a police attack. Man killed by police seems a pretty fair description of what happened therefore. So far the official version is he was doing nothing to threaten anyone else's life, let's wait and see how the full story emerges rather than rumours. Staffs is the most taser happy force in the UK statistically, an incident like this has been coming. Are you seriously stating this is a "police attack" I take police attack to mean an unprovoked Act of violence - I'm not having that Don't think I said 'unprovoked attack' anywhere, did I? I'm certain we'll find there was provocation, I'm sure there has been in all cases where police have tasered people. Question is how justified a life-threatening polcie reaction is in this and other similar case.
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Dec 24, 2014 4:20:10 GMT
I'm so sorry the title of this thread got changed, that's a wrong decision imho. Whoever the guy was and whatever he was doing, the one thing we certainly know is he died as a result of a police attack. Man killed by police seems a pretty fair description of what happened therefore. So far the official version is he was doing nothing to threaten anyone else's life, let's wait and see how the full story emerges rather than rumours. Staffs is the most taser happy force in the UK statistically, an incident like this has been coming. I'm delighted it got changed TBH, but " Suspected" burglar...FFS...1.00AM in yr house uninvited, who the fuck do they think he was...the freeking tooth fairy. And the police did not attack him, they used Home Office approved and tested equipment ideally designed for situations like this, they did not attack him in any way shape or form, and I pray to god that the officers involved are not disciplined, and that the thieving little low life's family get no compo, though I bet I am wrong on both counts.
|
|
|
Post by salopstick on Dec 24, 2014 7:01:52 GMT
Are you seriously stating this is a "police attack" I take police attack to mean an unprovoked Act of violence - I'm not having that Don't think I said 'unprovoked attack' anywhere, did I? I'm certain we'll find there was provocation, I'm sure there has been in all cases where police have tasered people. Question is how justified a life-threatening polcie reaction is in this and other similar case. The word attack means somthing more sinister than reasonable force Your choice of words often makes you look silly. If the police were faced with provocation to use a taser as reasonable force it is not a police attack. Your choice of words to people who don't know you would seem very one sided sgainst the police
|
|
|
Post by bathstoke on Dec 24, 2014 8:52:26 GMT
Don't think I said 'unprovoked attack' anywhere, did I? I'm certain we'll find there was provocation, I'm sure there has been in all cases where police have tasered people. Question is how justified a life-threatening polcie reaction is in this and other similar case. The word attack means somthing more sinister than reasonable force Your choice of words often makes you look silly. If the police were faced with provocation to use a taser as reasons hd force it is not a police attack. Your choice of words to people who don't know you would seem very one sided sgainst the police Hark at Samual Johnson rewitting the dictionary... Salop, Market Drayton. Specialist Subject: Everything!
|
|
|
Post by salopstick on Dec 24, 2014 8:56:33 GMT
The word attack means somthing more sinister than reasonable force Your choice of words often makes you look silly. If the police were faced with provocation to use a taser as reasons hd force it is not a police attack. Your choice of words to people who don't know you would seem very one sided sgainst the police Hark at Samual Johnson rewitting the dictionary... Salop, Market Drayton. Specialist Subject: Everything! I'm putting "rewitting" in my dictionary
|
|
|
Post by bathstoke on Dec 24, 2014 9:02:36 GMT
Hark at Samual Johnson rewitting the dictionary... Salop, Market Drayton. Specialist Subject: Everything! I'm putting "rewitting" in my dictionary I'd go back to bed, but I haven't got out of it yet...
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Dec 24, 2014 10:04:20 GMT
Hark at Samual Johnson rewitting the dictionary... Salop, Market Drayton. Specialist Subject: Everything! I'm putting "rewitting" in my dictionary Absolutely pissed myself at that one Salop my good pal....Just priceless.... And a happy Christmas to you and yours.
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Dec 24, 2014 10:06:25 GMT
Is "rewitting" a contrafibularity.
|
|
|
Post by EccyStokie on Dec 24, 2014 10:13:05 GMT
Some cunt tried to break into my parents house at the weekend, smashing the front window to get in before being interrupted and running.
He was eventually caught and I shall find out who he is. I hope I have a taser handy when I do.
|
|
|
Post by localloser on Dec 24, 2014 12:46:45 GMT
|
|
|
Post by mermaidsal on Dec 24, 2014 16:17:07 GMT
Don't think I said 'unprovoked attack' anywhere, did I? I'm certain we'll find there was provocation, I'm sure there has been in all cases where police have tasered people. Question is how justified a life-threatening polcie reaction is in this and other similar case. The word attack means somthing more sinister than reasonable force Your choice of words often makes you look silly. If the police were faced with provocation to use a taser as reasonable force it is not a police attack. Your choice of words to people who don't know you would seem very one sided sgainst the police If the police were attacked first by someone with an equivalent weapon then I agree, attack wouldn't be the right word - nothing we've heard reported so far suggests that was the case. If it turns out that the guy was threatening the police with a gun or a taser or some other lethal weapon, then I'll take 'attack' back of course. Till then it still seems a good word to use to me. In many cases of 'provocation' I don't believe tasering is justifed and as this mess of a situation has proved, it can be lethal. Other forces manage with a lot less use of taser than Staffs - are suspected criminals really more threatening here than anywhere else in the country??
|
|
|
Post by The Drunken Communist on Dec 24, 2014 16:37:12 GMT
If the police were attacked first by someone with an equivalent weapon then I agree, attack wouldn't be the right word - nothing we've heard reported so far suggests that was the case. If it turns out that the guy was threatening the police with a gun or a taser or some other lethal weapon, then I'll take 'attack' back of course. Till then it still seems a good word to use to me. In many cases of 'provocation' I don't believe tasering is justifed and as this mess of a situation has proved, it can be lethal. Other forces manage with a lot less use of taser than Staffs - are suspected criminals really more threatening here than anywhere else in the country?? The Police don't just turn up & start firing tasers at people for no reason. If you've been a big enough bellend for there need to be a reason for police to turn up, you do as they tell you & then you'll be fine. If you act like an even bigger bellend & become agressive/have a weapon/charge towards them/etc... Then you deserve everything you get. (They're the fucking police! They're upholding the laws of the land & you should respect them! If they tell you to do something you do it! --- And I say that as someone who was no angel in my younger years.) The problem nowadays is everyone thinks they're above the law & thinks that their actions have no consequences. Well this fella found out the hard way that they do.
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Dec 24, 2014 17:05:31 GMT
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Dec 24, 2014 17:07:09 GMT
|
|
|
Post by bathstoke on Dec 24, 2014 17:55:51 GMT
If the police were attacked first by someone with an equivalent weapon then I agree, attack wouldn't be the right word - nothing we've heard reported so far suggests that was the case. If it turns out that the guy was threatening the police with a gun or a taser or some other lethal weapon, then I'll take 'attack' back of course. Till then it still seems a good word to use to me. In many cases of 'provocation' I don't believe tasering is justifed and as this mess of a situation has proved, it can be lethal. Other forces manage with a lot less use of taser than Staffs - are suspected criminals really more threatening here th an anywhere else in the country?? The Police don't just turn up & start firing at people for no reason. If you've been a big enough bellend for there need to be a reason for police to turn up, you do as they tell you & then you'll be fine. If you act like an even bigger bellend & become agressive/have a weapon/charge towards them/etc... Then you deserve everything you get. (They're the fucking police! They're upholding the laws of the land & you should respect them! If they tell you to do something you do it! --- And I say that as someone who was no angel in my younger years.) The problem nowadays is everyone thinks they're above the law & thinks that their actions have no consequences. Well this fella found out the hard way that they do. Well I'm sure he feels better now that he's learned his harsh lesson at the hands of the oh so wise & righteous police forse... Happy ChristmasXx
|
|