Full praise to Mark Hughes.

[mickmacc]

If you had told me I'd be watching a Stoke city side pass and indeed annoyingly  overpass at times like they did last night I never would have believed it.

The transformation in such a short space of time is nothing short of remarkable .

To be honest I didnt think it was possible and full credit to Hughes and the coaching staff for the work that must have been put in on the training ground.

To hear an old experienced football hand like Ronnie Moore wax lyrical about our passing was almost surreal.

Long may it continue but praise where praise is due.

[banburypotter]

Not to mention the amount of shots we have had outside the box

[leicspotter]

It also seems to back up what many have said on here (and what I have heard from the coaches) and that is, we have some very good players! The one major criticism of TP was that he stuck rigidly to his game plan and didn't allow the players to express themselves...like they are doing now.

My lad said to me Sunday..."this team with a fit Fuller (of maybe 3 years ago) would be awesome"!

[Malcolm Clarke]

To me, the only thing which matters is points on the Board,or progress to the next round in a Cup competition, which of course we did very comfortably last night. I have very little interest in how many passes we make because you don't get any points for "passing football". I find the "we're stoke city and were passing the ball" song a tad embarrassing, because it effectively says we were wrong to sing "we're stoke city and we'll play how we want" and legitimises the past criticisms of us. I also agreed with Peter Coates when he said that what matters is not whether it's a long ball or a short ball, but whether it's a good ball.

In terms of goals scored, which is ultimately the only thing which matters, last season we had the 7th best defence in the PL but the 2nd worst attack (at least better that than the other way round). Away from home we actually had the 3rd best defence.

The challenge for Mark Hughes is to keep that defensive strength but create more chances and take more of the chances we do create. If a different style of football can achieve that - then great. If it doesn't, then I for one will take no comfort from an increased number of passes.

[leicspotter]

Malcolm, I can't disagree that results are still what it's all about, but don't you think that many teams had pretty much sussed us out and it was becoming ever more difficult to achieve those results with our rigid system and without the "unexpected" that a player such as Fuller could provide?

I certainly don't want to see Stoke become a "tippy tappy" side such as West Brom under Ardilles, but what we seem to be getting is a balance of style that will hopefully play to the strengths we have in the team, whilst being a bit more pleasing to watch. Hoof it when necessary, play long, short or whatever,but play with energy and passion too.

First half v Palace was a concern, but since then we appear to be better balanced and more progressive...just need to sort out the set-piece defending!!

BTW I agree with you about "passing the ball"

[Malcolm Clarke]

Sept 26, 2013 10:01:42 GMT leicspotter said:

Malcolm, I can't disagree that results are still what it's all about, but don't you think that many teams had pretty much sussed us out and it was becoming ever more difficult to achieve those results with our rigid system and without the "unexpected" that a player such as Fuller could provide?

I certainly don't want to see Stoke become a "tippy tappy" side such as West Brom under Ardilles, but what we seem to be getting is a balance of style that will hopefully play to the strengths we have in the team, whilst being a bit more pleasing to watch. Hoof it when necessary, play long, short or whatever,but play with energy and passion too.

First half v Palace was a concern, but since then we appear to be better balanced and more progressive...just need to sort out the set-piece defending!!

BTW I agree with you about "passing the ball"

Yes, I agree with that all Leics. I also think that effective wing play from Pennant and Etherington was important in TP's style, and for whatever reason we lost that.

I should perhaps have added that from what we've seen so far I'm quite optimistic that MH will achieve the sort of balance I referred to.

[blooter]

You can only score goals though by creating chances which we are doing in abundance this season. It will come, im sure of it, and some team is going to be on the end of a drubbing.

Loving it so far.

[Deleted]

Malcolm, I know that I am getting boring with this, but Mark,s hands were tied with the attack he was left with. I think that the January transfer window will tell us how far we can go. I don,t need to beat on about where we need to strengthen, but up to now I,m mightily impressed with the play. Let,s face it, despite Liverpool being the better team on the day, we should have gleaned a point, and should have taken all three off City. Like I say, I,m more than impressed, up to now. It,s certainly better than what we,ve had to put up with in the last couple of seasons.

[mickmacc]

assaidi coming on showed the way forward.Up until then we hadnt got behind the defence-he did.We have to be really careful we just dont pass ion front of defences all the time.

[mrcoke]

Looks like beating Norwich then is a gimme! Don't think so. We are only 5 games into the season and changed a lot but it's long season ahead and if we lose to Norwich it will feel like we have just slipped down the greasy pole to the bottom again. Norwich desperately need a win to justify all there spending and we are in the way on Saturday. There needs to be a huge effort by everyone on Saturday to deliver the promise the team are showing with maximum support from the fans. Afterwards we could be sitting pretty and the football world could start to sit up and take notice of the Potters. I think it's the most important game of the season so far and a huge test of how much the club has progressed. Stoke weren't expected to get points from Man City or Arsenal but Norwich at home is a different matter and a draw would be desperately disappointing and a loss dire. Although we are attacking more and creating chances, there are too many missed opportunities and the team could dominate a game and still lose it. I hope I'm wrong.

[JoeinOz]

Good start from Mark. Early days learning curves. Lets see where we are and how we are evolving at chrimbo time.

[cartman123]

We're playing better football, yes, but we still have the same problem as we did under Pulis: Lack of goals. Remember we started last season well, then after Christmas it all went downhill. But the problem was, despite a good start, we weren't scoring many, and that eventually came back to bite us in the backside.

[lordb]

We did make 5 excllent chances v Man City though & we weren't doing that last season
We need to stick the ball in the net but then tahts always teh case.

[lancer]

Purely my own view, but I have always been of the opinion that a long ball is usually a 50/50 ball.It's more often in the air and its sod law who gets it. A good pass is usually about 95% effective and possession is kept.We are certainly having more possession now, and while we seem to be passing ineffectively a lot of the time, we are on a learning curve under Hughes. Once we have more faith in our passing, and get a couple up front to to the job, we'll be a force to be reckoned with.I'm loving the way we are playing right now.

[yeswilko]

Sept 26, 2013 15:05:11 GMT lancer said:

Purely my own view, but I have always been of the opinion that a long ball is usually a 50/50 ball.It's more often in the air and its sod law who gets it. A good pass is usually about 95% effective and possession is kept.We are certainly having more possession now, and while we seem to be passing ineffectively a lot of the time, we are on a learning curve under Hughes. Once we have more faith in our passing, and get a couple up front to to the job, we'll be a force to be reckoned with.I'm loving the way we are playing right now.

There is a natural progression it seems.. Better passing with more possession.. more chances created.. and eventually more goals scored. (as you mentioned we may need new faces to achieve the last bit)

[stokierabbit]

Sept 26, 2013 13:25:21 GMT cartman123 said:

We're playing better football, yes, but we still have the same problem as we did under Pulis: Lack of goals. Remember we started last season well, then after Christmas it all went downhill. But the problem was, despite a good start, we weren't scoring many, and that eventually came back to bite us in the backside.

Absolutely, the lack of a true goalscorer in our side is slightly worrying. Heres hoping Jones will come good and Walters actually bags some goals for once

[JoeinOz]

We still have a long way to go and we have a precedent to limit our expectation. At the end of the 1996/97 season Lou Macari left Stoke. Despite his popularity it was clear he’d reached the end of the road with us. During a poor run of form near the end of the season Macari repeated with monotonous regularity his belief Stoke had to play 100 mph football to be effective. Many of us felt he recited his mantra to hide a lack of ideas. In October of the 1997/98 campaign we won 1-0 at Maine Road to move up to a handily placed 6th in the table. Macari’s replacement Chic Bates had adopted a softer approach and we played with more craft. The wheels fell off soon after however. We quickly became a shambles and were deservedly relegated. Mark Hughes has made an impressive start to his Stoke City career. We must however keep expectations in check. Hopefully the coming years will be as enjoyable as the first few games have been.
Gwarn Mark!

[DannyStokie]

Sept 26, 2013 9:51:52 GMT Malcolm Clarke said:

To me, the only thing which matters is points on the Board,or progress to the next round in a Cup competition, which of course we did very comfortably last night. I have very little interest in how many passes we make because you don't get any points for "passing football". I find the "we're stoke city and were passing the ball" song a tad embarrassing, because it effectively says we were wrong to sing "we're stoke city and we'll play how we want" and legitimises the past criticisms of us. I also agreed with Peter Coates when he said that what matters is not whether it's a long ball or a short ball, but whether it's a good ball.

In terms of goals scored, which is ultimately the only thing which matters, last season we had the 7th best defence in the PL but the 2nd worst attack (at least better that than the other way round). Away from home we actually had the 3rd best defence.

The challenge for Mark Hughes is to keep that defensive strength but create more chances and take more of the chances we do create. If a different style of football can achieve that - then great. If it doesn't, then I for one will take no comfort from an increased number of passes.

I think you misunderstand the song, I always see the song as though we are taking the piss out of what we used to sing, not the fact that we are actually passing?

[mickstupp]

Sept 26, 2013 23:45:09 GMT JoeinOz said:

We still have a long way to go and we have a precedent to limit our expectation. At the end of the 1996/97 season Lou Macari left Stoke. Despite his popularity it was clear he’d reached the end of the road with us. During a poor run of form near the end of the season Macari repeated with monotonous regularity his belief Stoke had to play 100 mph football to be effective. Many of us felt he recited his mantra to hide a lack of ideas. In October of the 1997/98 campaign we won 1-0 at Maine Road to move up to a handily placed 6th in the table. Macari’s replacement Chic Bates had adopted a softer approach and we played with more craft. The wheels fell off soon after however. We quickly became a shambles and were deservedly relegated. Mark Hughes has made an impressive start to his Stoke City career. We must however keep expectations in check. Hopefully the coming years will be as enjoyable as the first few games have been.
Gwarn Mark!

I had exactly the same thoughts as you, Joe. However I've come to the conclusion that the club we have now is completely different to the one we had then. With the money invested in this current squad, any comparison with the 1997/98 fiasco is futile. We have genuine quality in midfield, a strong defensive spine, and one of the best keepers in the league, all we need to do is add some quality up front and we are looking really, really good.

We had Muggleton, Steve Tweed, Jose Andrade, and Justin Whittle back then..........

[PotterLog]

Sept 26, 2013 23:54:24 GMT DannyStokie said:

Sept 26, 2013 9:51:52 GMT Malcolm Clarke said:

To me, the only thing which matters is points on the Board,or progress to the next round in a Cup competition, which of course we did very comfortably last night. I have very little interest in how many passes we make because you don't get any points for "passing football". I find the "we're stoke city and were passing the ball" song a tad embarrassing, because it effectively says we were wrong to sing "we're stoke city and we'll play how we want" and legitimises the past criticisms of us. I also agreed with Peter Coates when he said that what matters is not whether it's a long ball or a short ball, but whether it's a good ball.

In terms of goals scored, which is ultimately the only thing which matters, last season we had the 7th best defence in the PL but the 2nd worst attack (at least better that than the other way round). Away from home we actually had the 3rd best defence.

The challenge for Mark Hughes is to keep that defensive strength but create more chances and take more of the chances we do create. If a different style of football can achieve that - then great. If it doesn't, then I for one will take no comfort from an increased number of passes.

I think you misunderstand the song, I always see the song as though we are taking the piss out of what we used to sing, not the fact that we are actually passing?

Absolutely. It's self-deprecating and witty and a perfect example of Stokie terrace irony. God forbid we lost songs like that, lord knows there's not much subtlety in the rest of them.

[JoeinOz]

Yeah I know Mickstupp. Thankfully we are very different now! Hopefully SCFC can continue the heathy start.

[mateybass]

With the strength of the current style and the weakness in front of goal, it makes me wonder if Owen could have filled the role of poacher for us had he not retired... I think our new approach would have suited him perfectly.

[Lakeland Potter]

Sept 26, 2013 23:54:24 GMT DannyStokie said:

Sept 26, 2013 9:51:52 GMT Malcolm Clarke said:

To me, the only thing which matters is points on the Board,or progress to the next round in a Cup competition, which of course we did very comfortably last night. I have very little interest in how many passes we make because you don't get any points for "passing football". I find the "we're stoke city and were passing the ball" song a tad embarrassing, because it effectively says we were wrong to sing "we're stoke city and we'll play how we want" and legitimises the past criticisms of us. I also agreed with Peter Coates when he said that what matters is not whether it's a long ball or a short ball, but whether it's a good ball.

In terms of goals scored, which is ultimately the only thing which matters, last season we had the 7th best defence in the PL but the 2nd worst attack (at least better that than the other way round). Away from home we actually had the 3rd best defence.

The challenge for Mark Hughes is to keep that defensive strength but create more chances and take more of the chances we do create. If a different style of football can achieve that - then great. If it doesn't, then I for one will take no comfort from an increased number of passes.

I think you misunderstand the song, I always see the song as though we are taking the piss out of what we used to sing, not the fact that we are actually passing?

I agree Danny. I've always regarded the "we're passing the ball" chant as being ironic - taking the mick out of ourselves as much as out of the opposition. I think the ability to laugh at yourself is a good thing in a football fan - maybe there would be less trouble if more fans could do it more often. Certainly, unlike Malcolm, I have never found it in the least embarrassing.

[Deleted]

Sept 27, 2013 1:18:25 GMT mateybass said:

With the strength of the current style and the weakness in front of goal, it makes me wonder if Owen could have filled the role of poacher for us had he not retired... I think our new approach would have suited him perfectly.

Not convinced you can play a poacher as a lone striker. You need someone powerful and good in the air playing there ideally, or someone hugely skilful and creative who can pull defences all over the shop.

[kiwistokie]

we need a speedy, skillful, thinking lad up front. And under 25 years of age. No prem experience needed, just a big heart that can run all day, well JW can do 1 bit of that.
Sparky has done wonders so far and his sights are a top 10 finish and as many points as we can get because he can count past 40, although he is talking to the board about the summer transfer requirements already and they are listening. They like what they are seeing.

[jstoke7]

Sept 26, 2013 9:51:52 GMT Malcolm Clarke said:

To me, the only thing which matters is points on the Board,or progress to the next round in a Cup competition, which of course we did very comfortably last night. I have very little interest in how many passes we make because you don't get any points for "passing football". I find the "we're stoke city and were passing the ball" song a tad embarrassing, because it effectively says we were wrong to sing "we're stoke city and we'll play how we want" and legitimises the past criticisms of us. I also agreed with Peter Coates when he said that what matters is not whether it's a long ball or a short ball, but whether it's a good ball.

In terms of goals scored, which is ultimately the only thing which matters, last season we had the 7th best defence in the PL but the 2nd worst attack (at least better that than the other way round). Away from home we actually had the 3rd best defence.

The challenge for Mark Hughes is to keep that defensive strength but create more chances and take more of the chances we do create. If a different style of football can achieve that - then great. If it doesn't, then I for one will take no comfort from an increased number of passes.

The reason we had such a good defence is because we were so defensive and rigid...

It all depends on what you care about. I get no joy out of watching players worth tens of millions of pounds lump a ball in the air and play a percentages game, if I want to see that I'll go down to the park (in fact at least they try and play decent football in the park). Football is a release and should be enjoyable, you should (IMO) be watching professionals doing things that you can't, being able to admire their quality.

Our long balls before weren't good balls, they were percentage balls in which we hoped to pick up the scraps from. If a good ball is sticking a ball in a general area then I'm the best passer in the world.