|
Post by alster on Jun 14, 2013 10:20:58 GMT
The exact opposite really, you want players with ambition to go right to the top of the game. At this moment in time doing that with Stoke City is not a realistic option much as we'd all like it to be. Players on their way up is not a problem for the club players on their way down are the millstone around our neck. Yeah, we have to accept that for young promising players we are, generally, going to be seen as a stepping stone. Correct just like managers they have to be doing pretty well for other clubs to covet them. Its a win win situation provided we don't allow them to run their contracts down and walk for nothing.
|
|
|
Post by Stretfordpotterer on Jun 14, 2013 10:21:56 GMT
There is an element of that, but there's also an argument to say that although some of Stoke's players might be wanted bids don't come in because we aren't in a position where we have to sell, therefore there is better value on the market buyong from teams who aren't in such a strong financial position. i wouldn't say that was true at all to be honest, there are a hell of a lot of clubs out there (especially in the Prem) that don't HAVE to sell but plenty of bids are made and players sold regardless. in fact there are very few teams in our league that do HAVE to sell anyone.the simple fact is that if people wanted any of our players they would bid; if we turned around and said no then fair enough but if they really wanted them they'd at least make a bid. we didn't get Crouch because Spurs HAD to sell him, we didn't get KJ because Sunderland HAD to sell etc. etc. it's a fair argument to make in the lower leagues but not at all when you're talking about Prem players..the cold, hard facts are that the players we had were still mostly ones that: a) were bought when we came up so came in to be players that would help us stay up and simply haven't moved on since then b) players we bought in since then and just aren't up to scrathc (Palacios, Kightly) c) players no-one sees anything of so no-one will bid for (Jerome, Edu, Ness etc.) d) players who are old so no-one in the Prem wants nowadays (Crouch, Upson, Woodgate etc.) the simple reason for us not selling is that the players aren't of any quality when we're done with them other than Championship at best. evn if Crouch and KJ do go to newly promoted teams we're going to end up having to make a loss on both of them..how many other teams make a loss on Prem players when they're not in a position where they HAVE to sell? You're going to the extreme end of the reasoning though, proobably "have to" is a bit much also in my initial statement. there are probably not too many teams in the Prem at the minute who need to sell desperately, but there have certainly been plenty who are a lot more inclined to balance their books than we have over the last few years. Villa, Bolton, Blackburn, Sunderland just of the top of my head. Villa are actively reducing their wage bill and the age of there squad, actively reducing costs, and when a club is in that phase while they are not desperate to sell they will be less likely to press a price until the point where a buyer pulls out, whereas Stoke will largely say "balls to you" unless the price is right. I'm not saying we have that much in teh way of saleable assets, but if Bego was at Villa at the moment we would be talking less (even if only by a few mill) than the 12-15 million which Stoke will want.
|
|
|
Post by FullerMagic on Jun 15, 2013 8:45:47 GMT
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Jun 15, 2013 11:22:45 GMT
That would be good news for us in my opinion because out of all the top clubs in the premier league I would have thought they would be favourites to be in for him. The only other top club who don't have a stand out number one is Arsenal and I'm not so sure Wenger knows what a top keeper looks like.
|
|
|
Post by bayernoatcake on Jun 15, 2013 11:26:06 GMT
That would be good news for us in my opinion because out of all the top clubs in the premier league I would have thought they would be favourites to be in for him. The only other top club who don't have a stand out number one is Arsenal and I'm not so sure Wenger knows what a top keeper looks like. Julio Caesar is written all over them imo.
|
|
|
Post by harryburrows on Jun 15, 2013 11:27:15 GMT
That would be good news for us in my opinion because out of all the top clubs in the premier league I would have thought they would be favourites to be in for him. The only other top club who don't have a stand out number one is Arsenal and I'm not so sure Wenger knows what a top keeper looks like. Maybe a bit of player exchange if we must loose bego ,I'm sure bentners still available
|
|
|
Post by boskampsflaps on Jun 15, 2013 13:06:19 GMT
Theres no chance of Butland replacing Begovic or Sorenson , hes not good enough and never will , he panicks and has slow reactions . Perhaps 1s or 2nd division standard .. He's still a little kid in keeper terms, he has plenty of time to improve, I agree he won't be replacing them any time soon though
|
|
|
Post by harryburrows on Jun 15, 2013 13:14:17 GMT
Theres no chance of Butland replacing Begovic or Sorenson , hes not good enough and never will , he panicks and has slow reactions . Perhaps 1s or 2nd division standard .. He's still a little kid in keeper terms, he has plenty of time to improve, I agree he won't be replacing them any time soon though The problem with butland is his age , in keeper terms he's a long way from reaching his peek , a lot can go wrong if hese not developed in the right way , as was the case with weaver, Carson , and fostér
|
|
|
Post by robwahlmann on Jun 15, 2013 13:16:30 GMT
That would be good news for us in my opinion because out of all the top clubs in the premier league I would have thought they would be favourites to be in for him. The only other top club who don't have a stand out number one is Arsenal and I'm not so sure Wenger knows what a top keeper looks like. Maybe a bit of player exchange if we must loose bego ,I'm sure bentners still available Bendtner + £12M? I could accept that!
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Jun 15, 2013 16:11:22 GMT
Looks like Bego will be staying and Butland going out on loan for the season,well that's my take on it anyway
|
|
|
Post by Miles Offside on Jun 15, 2013 16:25:24 GMT
I seriously believe that Begovic is now possibly the best keeper in the Premier League.
If he was with another club and we signed him for about £15M we would all think Stoke had pulled off a fantastic coup.
Much better he stays with us than have an extra £15M in Stoke's bank account.
|
|
|
Post by alster on Jun 15, 2013 17:01:30 GMT
I seriously believe that Begovic is now possibly the best keeper in the Premier League. If he was with another club and we signed him for about £15M we would all think Stoke had pulled off a fantastic coup. Much better he stays with us than have an extra £15M in Stoke's bank account. Possibly the best keeper in the Prem likely to develop into possibly the best keeper in the world. We're in a no lose situation just as long as we keep him well in contract.
|
|
|
Post by alster on Jun 15, 2013 17:07:21 GMT
He's still a little kid in keeper terms, he has plenty of time to improve, I agree he won't be replacing them any time soon though The problem with butland is his age , in keeper terms he's a long way from reaching his peek , a lot can go wrong if hese not developed in the right way , as was the case with weaver, Carson , and fostér Foster is still a bloody good Premier League goaly. The biggest danger to Butlands development would be to stay with us and sit on the bench. He needs to be playing lots of games making his mistakes and learning from them.
|
|
|
Post by SneydGreenStokie on Jun 15, 2013 18:14:33 GMT
Wait so why did we buy Butland? Surely we will have to continue to send him out on loan until Begovic goes as there's no way he'd play ahead of him and he signed for first team Premier League football. I thought the Butland purchase was done because we knew Begovic would be off. No, Cartwright bought Butland in. Pulis never wanted him and he was never a replacement for Begovic. We need to build out team around Begovic, not go selling him the second a bigger club comes knocking. SGS
|
|
|
Post by boskampsflaps on Jun 15, 2013 18:45:01 GMT
Wait so why did we buy Butland? Surely we will have to continue to send him out on loan until Begovic goes as there's no way he'd play ahead of him and he signed for first team Premier League football. I thought the Butland purchase was done because we knew Begovic would be off. No, Cartwright bought Butland in. Pulis never wanted him and he was never a replacement for Begovic. We need to build out team around Begovic, not go selling him the second a bigger club comes knocking. SGS When did Pulis say he didn't want him? I don't think I remember seeing that.
|
|
tayterz
Academy Starlet
Me Owd Tayter...
Posts: 161
|
Post by tayterz on Jun 15, 2013 18:46:36 GMT
|
|
|
Post by ohbottom on Jun 15, 2013 18:52:03 GMT
Maybe a bit of player exchange if we must loose bego ,I'm sure bentners still available Bendtner + £12M? I could accept that! If they want us to take Bendtner they'll have to pay us extra!
|
|
|
Post by robwahlmann on Jun 15, 2013 19:48:32 GMT
Bendtner + £12M? I could accept that! If they want us to take Bendtner they'll have to pay us extra! Bentner is a decent player though, but has a reputation as real bellend!
|
|
|
Post by harryburrows on Jun 15, 2013 23:08:57 GMT
The problem with butland is his age , in keeper terms he's a long way from reaching his peek , a lot can go wrong if hese not developed in the right way , as was the case with weaver, Carson , and fostér Foster is still a bloody good Premier League goaly. The biggest danger to Butlands development would be to stay with us and sit on the bench. He needs to be playing lots of games making his mistakes and learning from them. Foster came good after a lot of set backs , if he'd stayed with us it may have been better for his development
|
|
|
Post by oatcake17 on Jun 15, 2013 23:16:43 GMT
Looks like Bego will be staying and Butland going out on loan for the season,well that's my take on it anyway You are correct,Butland may go back to Brum for next season,but Asmir is staying,his family are settled and happy...But i do belive he will move to pastures new next season...unless We really push on
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Jun 15, 2013 23:20:57 GMT
The chances of Begovic being here at the start of the new season I would put at less than 5%.
I can feel it in my water.
Arsenal I believe are favourites...£18 million
|
|
|
Post by redwhite on Jun 16, 2013 10:34:07 GMT
Wait so why did we buy Butland? Surely we will have to continue to send him out on loan until Begovic goes as there's no way he'd play ahead of him and he signed for first team Premier League football. I thought the Butland purchase was done because we knew Begovic would be off. No, Cartwright bought Butland in. Pulis never wanted him and he was never a replacement for Begovic. We need to build out team around Begovic, not go selling him the second a bigger club comes knocking. SGS I agree that we should do as much as possible to keep hold of Bego, I'm just very confused with the Butland situation. I'm not believing that Pulis doesn't have a say on who comes into the club either. The facts are that Butland wants Premier League football. He turned down Chelsea because he would have to sit on their bench, so he wouldn't have signed for a much weaker team like us if he got the same deal. So surely this means until Begovic inevitably goes to a top club we will have to keep loaning him out? This is what I don't understand - if he wasn't brought in as a replacement, how on Earth did we persuade him to come? He wants to play Premier League football and we couldn't have offered him a place in the starting squad without knowing Begovic was going and he wouldn't have signed for our bench as opposed to Chelsea's. Can't see him being a very happy chappy if he's loaned out every season as playing in the Championship isn't what he wants.
|
|