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Post by scfcbiancorossi on Mar 12, 2013 16:25:42 GMT
We have simply got to win. Losing isn't an option to me. Point taken Jamo mate but let me put a slightly different slant on things. If the difference between TP keeping his job and TP losing his job pended on results at home Albion, Norwich and Villa..would you prefer to see TP lose his job? Another question i'd pose to some is and I accept a lot of people will be highly critical of this question but...would you prefer relegation if it meant a fresh start with a new manager who had a different philosophy? Or would you rather persist with finishing 14th in the league and Pulis as manager next season?
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Post by mightymike on Mar 12, 2013 16:26:08 GMT
I'm sorry but there are some pretty self-contradictory concepts being put across here. Some people who have clearly stated "TP has to go...not the man to take us forward" etc etc are now claiming they want to see us win games until the end of the season which would have the effect (one would expect) of TP keeping his job. Where is the logic behind that? Maybe i'm being a bit too cynical in think the vast majority of fans who want Pulis out couldnt give a shit if we lost on Saturday if it pressed the issue (which it would). What's wrong with winning until the end of the season? Would give us a top half finish which everybody wants?
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Post by kylelightbourne on Mar 12, 2013 16:27:17 GMT
I'm sorry but there are some pretty self-contradictory concepts being put across here. Some people who have clearly stated "TP has to go...not the man to take us forward" etc etc are now claiming they want to see us win games until the end of the season which would have the effect (one would expect) of TP keeping his job. Where is the logic behind that? Maybe i'm being a bit too cynical in think the vast majority of fans who want Pulis out couldnt give a shit if we lost on Saturday if it pressed the issue (which it would). Hmm so if you want Pulis out then you have to want us to lose or you're being a hypocrite? Don't be silly, nobody wants us to lose, except a few it seems. And you're a bit of a shit fan if you're going to the game hoping for a loss I think, regardless of why you want it
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Post by scfcbiancorossi on Mar 12, 2013 16:27:29 GMT
Very wrong, lose on Saturday and we will be right in a relegation scrap And if we were to get relegated, I'm not convinced we'd come back up. Happiness is a state of mind ffs. Getting pleasure out of a football match is a state of mind. Premier league football means absolutely fuck all if its not enjoyable.
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Post by Robo10 on Mar 12, 2013 16:27:56 GMT
If they are your thoughts then really mate, it is time to fuck off up the Vale.
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Post by shep207 on Mar 12, 2013 16:28:40 GMT
We have simply got to win. Losing isn't an option to me. If the difference between TP keeping his job and TP losing his job pended on results at home Albion, Norwich and Villa..would you prefer to see TP lose his job? That's a completely hypothetical question. Let me ask you this, if Pulis won every game from now until the end of the season playing 'great football' and getting us a top 10 finish, would you still want him sacked?
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Post by mightymike on Mar 12, 2013 16:29:11 GMT
You make it sound like the last 5 years have been shite. If you genuinely have not enjoyed the last 5 years then I feel sorry for you.
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Post by Ryan_Shawjosh on Mar 12, 2013 16:30:23 GMT
We have simply got to win. Losing isn't an option to me. Point taken Jamo mate but let me put a slightly different slant on things. If the difference between TP keeping his job and TP losing his job pended on results at home Albion, Norwich and Villa..would you prefer to see TP lose his job? Another question i'd pose to some is and I accept a lot of people will be highly critical of this question but...would you prefer relegation if it meant a fresh start with a new manager who had a different philosophy? Or would you rather persist with finishing 14th in the league and Pulis as manager next season? I'd want him to win the games, however I don't necessarily want him to be sacked anyway. If we got relegated, a lot of our players would want to move on so I'm not convinced we'd come back up. Taking on a new manager then would not guarantee success and the Championship could be the highest we witness for years. Pulis won't stay forever and if he does, it'll be likely he's doing a better job than he is now. He can't stay under this much pressure forever.
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Post by scfcbiancorossi on Mar 12, 2013 16:32:12 GMT
I'm sorry but there are some pretty self-contradictory concepts being put across here. Some people who have clearly stated "TP has to go...not the man to take us forward" etc etc are now claiming they want to see us win games until the end of the season which would have the effect (one would expect) of TP keeping his job. Where is the logic behind that? Maybe i'm being a bit too cynical in think the vast majority of fans who want Pulis out couldnt give a shit if we lost on Saturday if it pressed the issue (which it would). Hmm so if you want Pulis out then you have to want us to lose or you're being a hypocrite? Don't be silly, nobody wants us to lose, except a few it seems. And you're a bit of a shit fan if you're going to the game hoping for a loss I think, regardless of why you want it You seem to be avoiding the point i'm clearly putting across. I know why you are avoiding it too because its human nature. If you really want Pulis out (which imo would be for the good of the football club) then grinding out a few results for a few games would almost certainly keep Pulis in a job would it not? So said person who Pulis out wants the manager sacked but isnt thinking of the consequence of winning games like the one v West Brom on Saturday. Are they? Winning games would result in the manager staying. Thus the desire of wanting TP to go either isnt that strong/genuine...or... At the end of the day winning games from now until the end of the season by playing the SAME way would hide some pretty obvious cracks. Wouldnt it? Playing some good football until the end of the season and i'm all for it. We all know that wont happen though.
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Post by mrred on Mar 12, 2013 16:32:44 GMT
I'll be honest, at 80 minutes in I wanted a second to go in against West Ham, but wanting to lose before a whistle's been blown, just to spite the manager? Ridiculous.
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Post by scfcbiancorossi on Mar 12, 2013 16:33:27 GMT
If the difference between TP keeping his job and TP losing his job pended on results at home Albion, Norwich and Villa..would you prefer to see TP lose his job? That's a completely hypothetical question. Let me ask you this, if Pulis won every game from now until the end of the season playing 'great football' and getting us a top 10 finish, would you still want him sacked? I would give him the start of next season for sure. Would I give him a shit load of money? No. Is your hypothetical realistic? Absolutely not. TP only knows how to play one way. Lets not pretend we might play good football on Saturday or any other week until the end of this dire season.
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Post by nik80 on Mar 12, 2013 16:34:23 GMT
Part of me is thinking, obviously I want Stoke to win. the other part is thinking I hope we lose in order to put another nail in TP's coffin. Is that wrong? How has this man let us lose so much hope in our fixtures? Yes it's wrong, we're in the shit here as it is. I think we need to act now and ask questions later. Even if we win all our remaining home matches (which we won't) questions should still be asked about Pulis but we're not safe so for now solidarity between us supporters and the players might just be key to getting us over the finishing line despite Pulis' iffy tactics and squad selections. After last weekend's results, that's an axe to grind for another day I reckon
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Post by Ryan_Shawjosh on Mar 12, 2013 16:34:55 GMT
And if we were to get relegated, I'm not convinced we'd come back up. Happiness is a state of mind ffs. Getting pleasure out of a football match is a state of mind. Premier league football means absolutely fuck all if its not enjoyable. You can criticise other peoples opinions all you want, but I was happy when we went on the unbeaten run earlier this season, beating the likes of Liverpool in the way that we did. I'd prefer to experience that in the premier league with the potential of either changing the manager or the manager adapting to a better style than being relegated, losing all the good players we currently have and not being guaranteed to play "good" football anyway. Who's to say we won't get relegated and get an equally "unenjoyable" manager?
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Post by scfcbiancorossi on Mar 12, 2013 16:35:21 GMT
You make it sound like the last 5 years have been shite. If you genuinely have not enjoyed the last 5 years then I feel sorry for you. I enjoyed the first season, parts of the second and the final couple of months of the Cup final season. The last 2 seasons have been fucking appalling (to watch). If you enjoy what you're seeing, then you sir, are the one who deserves sympathy.
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Post by alster on Mar 12, 2013 16:35:35 GMT
The only time I have ever wanted us to lose was against Bolton away 92-93 and I'm sure a lot of Stoke fans were with me on that. However that was a case where we were already champions! Any other time, yes it is completely wrong! Would you really walk away from the Brit if we lost to West Brom with a sense of satisfaction?? Didn't even want us to lose then, never have never will. won't ever bet on us to lose either, even when I'm convinced we will. Always been a dyed in the wool Stokie but have even been to Vale games back in the day when football was a less expensive hobby (either that or I just had less responsibilities) and Stoke were away. Never been much for awaydays, nothing to do with Pulis more to do with being herded like cattle and treated like shit by the police back in the 80's.
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Post by kylelightbourne on Mar 12, 2013 16:36:16 GMT
Hmm so if you want Pulis out then you have to want us to lose or you're being a hypocrite? Don't be silly, nobody wants us to lose, except a few it seems. And you're a bit of a shit fan if you're going to the game hoping for a loss I think, regardless of why you want it You seem to be avoiding the point i'm clearly putting across. I know why you are avoiding it too because its human nature. If you really want Pulis out (which imo would be for the good of the football club) then grinding out a few results for a few games would almost certainly keep Pulis in a job would it not? So said person who Pulis out wants the manager sacked but isnt thinking of the consequence of winning games like the one v West Brom on Saturday. Are they? Winning games would result in the manager staying. Thus the desire of wanting TP to go either isnt that strong/genuine...or... At the end of the day winning games from now until the end of the season by playing the SAME way would hide some pretty obvious cracks. Wouldnt it? Playing some good football until the end of the season and i'm all for it. We all know that wont happen though. I wasn't avoiding anything, that was my view of it You talk as if you hold daily conversations with Peter Coates, you don't know if winning a few games will keep Pulis here, you don't that if we finish 17th Pulis will go. The point being you, and all of us, don't know anything. I go to the match hoping for a win not a loss.
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Post by onionman on Mar 12, 2013 16:36:19 GMT
It doesn't make you less of a fan if, in your opinion, the best thing for Stoke in the long-run is to lose a couple games in the short-run so the manager gets replaced (although in my opinion losing to West Brom could have dire long-term consequences).
Obviously, if you're hoping Stoke lose so you can come on here and say I told you so, you're a Grade A tosser. However, that's not what Rick Oshea is suggesting at all.
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Post by robwahlmann on Mar 12, 2013 16:36:48 GMT
Part of me is thinking, obviously I want Stoke to win. the other part is thinking I hope we lose in order to put another nail in TP's coffin. Is that wrong? How has this man let us lose so much hope in our fixtures? As I support Stoke I'll always hope the'll win!
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Post by mattj4678 on Mar 12, 2013 16:37:22 GMT
I can see your point, sad but true I'm afraid If I had to cut hand off to save my arm...I would. If we lost on Sat and we get rid of Pulis, we would all be better off in the long run.
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Post by scfcbiancorossi on Mar 12, 2013 16:37:34 GMT
Happiness is a state of mind ffs. Getting pleasure out of a football match is a state of mind. Premier league football means absolutely fuck all if its not enjoyable. You can criticise other peoples opinions all you want, but I was happy when we went on the unbeaten run earlier this season, beating the likes of Liverpool in the way that we did. I'd prefer to experience that in the premier league with the potential of either changing the manager or the manager adapting to a better style than being relegated, losing all the good players we currently have and not being guaranteed to play "good" football anyway. Who's to say we won't get relegated and get an equally "unenjoyable" manager? But thats a gamble you have to take isnt it??!!! Swansea had to take that gamble...West Brom had to take that gamble...Norwich had to take a gamble....Christ mate thats football. We might be relegated...OR...we might have a cracking manager who plays cracking football whilst keeping us in this league.
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Post by shep207 on Mar 12, 2013 16:37:35 GMT
That's a completely hypothetical question. Let me ask you this, if Pulis won every game from now until the end of the season playing 'great football' and getting us a top 10 finish, would you still want him sacked? I would give him the start of next season for sure. Would I give him a shit load of money? No. Is your hypothetical realistic? Absolutely not. Unfortunately, neither is yours. There is nothing to suggest that Coates is even remotely considering sacking Pulis, yet your argument revolves around the idea that if we lose a few more games, he's definitely gone.
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Post by mightymike on Mar 12, 2013 16:38:53 GMT
I would give him the start of next season for sure. Would I give him a shit load of money? No. So the club should back him by not backing him? 8-10 players will leave in the summer, so if don't strengthen and everybody else does then surely we would be even weaker than we are now?
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Post by PotteringThrough on Mar 12, 2013 16:39:07 GMT
Totally wrong and idiotic. If you want us to lose then you're as stubborn as TP.
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Post by alster on Mar 12, 2013 16:39:19 GMT
Happiness is a state of mind ffs. Getting pleasure out of a football match is a state of mind. Premier league football means absolutely fuck all if its not enjoyable. an equally "unenjoyable" manager? Does such a thing really exist. I've seen far worse football managers than Pulis but when it comes to completely sucking the life out of the game he's in a league all of his own.
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Post by scfcbiancorossi on Mar 12, 2013 16:39:29 GMT
I would give him the start of next season for sure. Would I give him a shit load of money? No. Is your hypothetical realistic? Absolutely not. Unfortunately, neither is yours. There is nothing to suggest that Coates is even remotely considering sacking Pulis, yet your argument revolves around the idea that if we lose a few more games, he's definitely gone. Really? I think you're going to have a nasty shock in the summer.
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Post by jeycov on Mar 12, 2013 16:39:45 GMT
Wanting to lose a game? It's very wrong.
A bit like an earlier post suggesting that it may be good for the team selection if certain players were injured!! Choosing the best 11 to start is a very different matter
First priority for me is 3 points on saturday and then as many as possible after that!
Ideally the teams below us to get the minimum points possible for the remainder of the season - taking into account that some of them play against each other.
Then review the management situation and hope for a more transparent view as to where our intentions will be for the coming season / seasons in the Premiership
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Post by jonnynico on Mar 12, 2013 16:39:57 GMT
I think most of us support the team not the manager so would never want us to lose.
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Post by Paul Spencer on Mar 12, 2013 16:40:27 GMT
There's an old saying ...
"It's going to have to get worse before it can get better."
Whether that applies to us right now I'm unsure but I guess it's that sentiment which the OP was alluding to.
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Post by scfcbiancorossi on Mar 12, 2013 16:41:01 GMT
I would give him the start of next season for sure. Would I give him a shit load of money? No. So the club should back him by not backing him? 8-10 players will leave in the summer, so if don't strengthen and everybody else does then surely we would be even weaker than we are now? When has Pulis done well when spending big? Huth aside. We all know hes a disaster when given a lot financially. Of course you would have to give him a few million to replace the out of contraact players or keep them on...but ultimately hes proven time and time again that his best buys are those who he DOES NOT spend big money on.
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Post by shep207 on Mar 12, 2013 16:41:15 GMT
Unfortunately, neither is yours. There is nothing to suggest that Coates is even remotely considering sacking Pulis, yet your argument revolves around the idea that if we lose a few more games, he's definitely gone. Really? I think you're going to have a nasty shock in the summer. We'll see won't we.. Don't get your hopes up.
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