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Post by Olgrligm on Mar 4, 2013 15:08:22 GMT
I do enjoy a good long, well written, well thought out, reasonable post.
I'm in no rush to see the manager removed but I do sympathise with a lot of what you're saying. I'm very worried about the direction that we have headed in in the last couple of years and I do wonder if our failure to replicate our best strike partnership of Mama and Fuller (save for the period when we had Jones and Walters playing very well together) bears some parallels with Peter Reid's failure to replicate his successful strike partnership of Kevin Phillips and Niall Quinn, leading to his demise. Funnily enough, Reid replaced a very effective target man in Quinn with an ageing, immobile, physically weak despite being rather tall big name player who'd been at some big clubs in Tore Andre Flo.
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Post by Stretfordpotterer on Mar 4, 2013 15:20:00 GMT
Good post, Dixie, well constructed argument. Where we differ is that I believe that Pulis wants the same as you, me and everybody else. I think he is trying to change and has bought better quality players who offer more. He is struggling to get it right though. The plan of playing Adam higher up the pitch with Crouch hasn't worked out yet, and the wide players have been so out of sorts we have become really one dimensional. It's a bit of a mess at the moment and we need sort out our best way of playing, best formation and make some changes to the squad in summer. We are in a great position though with a brilliant owner, fantastic facilities and infrastructure. If we can sort the wide positions out, which isn't easy, we can get back on track. Many said that 2011 was one of the best in our history. 2012 and the first 2 months of 2013 haven't lived up to that, and it's the first time we seem to have stopped improving or even gone backwards. It's a hell of a job to keep that upward development every season. Tony Pulis made me feel really proud of my club again and, as I have said before, I think he deserves a bit of loyalty and time. Thing is Okey, whether he is trying to chang ethings, or he isn't, and i'd probably tend to agree with you that he is trying something that just isn't working. The fact of the matter is that he has spent millions and not been able to do it, he's gone out and bought players that he obviously has no clear idea what to do with, only to then try to shoehorn them into increasingly bizarre formations. The other point is that when he does hit on something that looks like it's got a chance, we don't work on it, as soon as we concede a goal the baby gets thrown out with the bath water. Just look at Wigan at home, that formation and line up looked like it might work, but we have hardly ever played 5 at the back so when we came under pressure it started to creak a bit, Rather than a swift and simple reversion to 4 4 2 or 4 5 1, in game, that we had the personal to facilitate, he just went fucking mental moving people about like chess pieces. What followed was utter mayhem all of his making. Then thats it, we never try that formation again. On top of that, and this is something he gets nowhere near enough criticism for, he has been at this club for 10 years! That sort of tenure carries a responsibility which he has utterly abdictate - Youth development, he could have molded a youth system in his own imagein that time but has shown absolutely no interest whatsoever.
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Post by nik80 on Mar 4, 2013 15:30:35 GMT
Shotton was a promising central defender forced into a full back position. The song is remarkably similar to those of Higgy, Wilkinson, Wilson etc etc etc... I don't know what he was like as centre half but I thought he did okay Saturday, made some important tackles, looked assured going forward. Okay he cannot cross, that was made all too obvious last season with Pulis telling us he was the best winger at the club!! That said, and I know it isn't saying much but his crossing pisses over Kighley's at the moment. Till the end of the season, I'm reasonably happy with Shotton to continue at right back. My original point was simply that, the article was great but I'd be inclined to cut Shotton some slack on this season's viewing. Last season, I woulda happily given him a proper round of fucks but I've seen a marked improvement.
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Post by Northy on Mar 4, 2013 15:33:35 GMT
Very well put VP, IMO TP is strangling the life and enjoyment out of being a Stoke Supporter and needs to change very quickly or go
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Post by Vestan Pance on Mar 4, 2013 15:38:15 GMT
Shotton was a promising central defender forced into a full back position. The song is remarkably similar to those of Higgy, Wilkinson, Wilson etc etc etc... I don't know what he was like as centre half but I thought he did okay Saturday, made some important tackles, looked assured going forward. Okay he cannot cross, that was made all too obvious last season with Pulis telling us he was the best winger at the club!! That said, and I know it isn't saying much but his crossing pisses over Kighley's at the moment. Till the end of the season, I'm reasonably happy with Shotton to continue at right back. My original point was simply that, the article was great but I'd be inclined to cut Shotton some slack on this season's viewing. Last season, I woulda happily given him a proper round of fucks but I've seen a marked improvement. Perfectly reasonable counter-argument. As i said, my ego doesn't require everything i have written to be set in stone. Opinions will vary, but i do stand by the body of my argument (for what that's worth
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Post by stokiejoe on Mar 4, 2013 15:40:54 GMT
Dixie, that was brilliant and eloquently sums up my feelings. Well said
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Post by Deleted on Mar 4, 2013 15:59:11 GMT
Excellent post VP. That has gone to the top of my top 5 favourite oatcake posts.
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Post by mcf on Mar 4, 2013 16:08:20 GMT
Like you say VP (welcome back btw - you are impartial. People can wank all over you by copying and pasting a plethora of PHW posts it seems ;D I agree with okey The bloke deserves a bit of loyalty and time for me.
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Post by Vestan Pance on Mar 4, 2013 16:18:48 GMT
Like you say VP (welcome back btw - you are impartial. People can wank all over you by copying and pasting a plethora of PHW posts it seems ;D I agree with okey The bloke deserves a bit of loyalty and time for me. People are entitled to their opinion Merk. It's important that people remember that. Except for you. Fuck off
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Post by Trouserdog on Mar 4, 2013 22:28:11 GMT
Brilliant post and welcome back!
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Post by supergerrytaggart on Mar 4, 2013 22:48:56 GMT
For me all could be forgiven if he just showed some humility and acknowledge that he has made some major mistakes this season or even just in an individual match.
As others have said, I think he has tried to evolve but fucked up the working Pulis formula in the process. Before we had players who were grateful to be in the Premier League working their hearts out for a united fanbase. In amongst those players were quality players like Pennant and Etherington who also shared the gratitude to just be playing again. This perfect formula was put together expertly by Pulis and is too his great credit.
Pulis wins himself no favours by ignoring the huge amounts of money he has wasted since the cup final and branding any fans against him as 'non-sensible'.
I certainly believe that if he just treated the fan's misgivings with some respect he would win back huge swathes of the Stoke faithful. No one is perfect but he never for one moment gives the impression he believes that it applies to him.
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Post by banburypotter on Mar 4, 2013 22:49:08 GMT
A great ted-esque piece that I could not have put any better.
I saw all this coming ages ago, but would be slated for even mentioning about our managers shortcomings, but it did for me a while back, and if you remember Dixie, you once said it was about time we met up in the gardeners and had a yarn and a beer, sadly my friend until the manager is replaced, and I have changed slightly to admit it will be better at the end of the season than immediately, it isn't going to happen anytime soon.
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Post by Vestan Pance on Mar 5, 2013 11:20:55 GMT
Sorry to hear mate, but i couldn't agree more. This ST will be my last for a while, i fear...
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Post by Deleted on Mar 5, 2013 13:03:44 GMT
Finally an 'anti-pulis post' that has not immediately got my back up.
Not sure if its because it was well reasoned and thought out or because I am wavering!
No thanks to Poyet though.
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jamodinho
Academy Starlet
"I wonder if there's a weight loss formula i can take in powder form?" ..... Ahem
Posts: 137
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Post by jamodinho on Mar 5, 2013 15:32:35 GMT
Well I don't know. I like well-written and thought-out posts criticizing Pulis, and I like well-written and thought-out posts defending Pulis.
But which one is better?
There's only one way to find out......
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mhbsurf
Academy Starlet
Marshmalade skies...
Posts: 147
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Post by mhbsurf on Mar 5, 2013 18:17:35 GMT
HURRAH!! Great post.
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Post by knightonstokie on Mar 5, 2013 18:53:12 GMT
An excellent post which sums up the situation and mood in an elegant and articulate manner without the need to resort to expletives to make a point.
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Post by underdog on Mar 5, 2013 19:03:26 GMT
That sir, is the finest post I have read on this forum by some way. There's nothing else to be said about Pulis after that. Lets just hope Screaming TP reads it and recognises the truth of it.
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Post by surreystokie on Mar 5, 2013 23:24:26 GMT
DG/VP (blimey you do choose 'em) that was an outstanding post, for which thanks and an appeal to you to stay with us on here and with the lads via ST's. Every such analytical supporter - in either camp - is worth a thousand mindless and stubborn ranters.
Cheers also to those who stayed with your post - once more on both sides - which is what made this MB so riveting originally and could ensure its longevity.
More! More!
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