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Post by welcumtobearpit on Mar 1, 2011 14:58:32 GMT
it would be nice to score a few more from open play, but at the end of the day whether it's a 40 yarder or a header from a yard out, it counts for exactly the same
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Post by RipRoaringPotter on Mar 1, 2011 16:30:00 GMT
As long as our set-pieces keep working, why should it matter how we get our goals? Because there's a large element of luck associated to set pieces. If a team defends well we're hoping for the run of the ball to save the day. What really pisses me off about our fans is that if a couple of long throws had resulted in a couple of scrappy first half goals last night this board would be full of people claiming that we played well. Why can't some of you just accept that our football is and has been utter fucking horseshit? It's horseshit because Pulis has played horseshit football since the day he started management. His tactics are based purely on defensive direct play with minimal football and maximum gain from set pieces. That's it - always has been and always will be. Simple passes that I'd expect to see from 12 year olds are greeted with embarrassing levels of applause at Stoke. Last night, our defenders, probably in an attempt to prove a point, managed to grow some balls and passed between themselves on the odd occasion. It still resulted in an aimless punt up field but what was quite laughable was how uneasy they appeared when there was enough time and space to do a few keepy ups before making the pass. We play a game that only a mother could love. Every goal needs luck. It's not just pure luck that means we score off at set-pieces more than most. It's hard work on the the training ground and good discipline.
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Post by padders01 on Mar 1, 2011 16:33:04 GMT
Thats a bit depressing
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Post by Cupid Stunt on Mar 1, 2011 19:41:14 GMT
Was it the Kenwyne mazey run and finish v Liverpool. No, it was Wilson at Blackburn, before that it was Etherington at Wigan and before that it was Etherington against Man City. Christ, some people have shit memories
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sting
Youth Player
Posts: 354
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Post by sting on Mar 1, 2011 19:42:11 GMT
What's open play?
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Post by Deleted on Mar 1, 2011 20:55:04 GMT
As long as our set-pieces keep working, why should it matter how we get our goals? Exactly the sort of comment that makes me wonder if there are people out there, that would literally accept 'any old shit' What next - we'll be happy if the largest proportion of our goals come from penalties and own goals? As long as those cracks get papered over? As much as you can practice set-plays, there's still an amount of luck involved with having a chance drop for you. Hence you're playing percentages. But hey - that's what we do better than anyone?
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Post by RipRoaringPotter on Mar 1, 2011 22:15:43 GMT
As long as our set-pieces keep working, why should it matter how we get our goals? Exactly the sort of comment that makes me wonder if there are people out there, that would literally accept 'any old shit' What next - we'll be happy if the largest proportion of our goals come from penalties and own goals? As long as those cracks get papered over? As much as you can practice set-plays, there's still an amount of luck involved with having a chance drop for you. Hence you're playing percentages. But hey - that's what we do better than anyone? Can you explain the luck involved in Delap's goal then?
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Post by tony harrison on Mar 1, 2011 22:34:51 GMT
Both open play goals this year assisted by Tuncay Sanli (remember him?) I miss Tuncay Sanli
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Post by devonstokie on Mar 2, 2011 5:52:14 GMT
We're painful to watch, are oppostion fans really talking bollox when they say we play Rugby?? I watch most of our games through cringe tinted vision, come on Coates man up, do us all a favour at the end of the season.
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Post by RAF on Mar 2, 2011 7:16:31 GMT
So we've scored 2 league goals from open play this year? Both from left-wing crosses and really good headers. And that's it? Gulp. Samartians number please Is that some kind of Intergalactic helpline? H
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Post by OldStokie on Mar 2, 2011 7:45:50 GMT
Was it Ether's goal up the Stoke End that Tuncay treaded through for him? I dunno... I've forgotten.
OS.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 2, 2011 8:00:02 GMT
Fuller against Brum
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Post by Deleted on Mar 2, 2011 8:55:09 GMT
As long as our set-pieces keep working, why should it matter how we get our goals? But they're not going to always work are they? Hence we need a bit of variety to make us less depressingly predictable. If a team knows we're only a threat from set plays, don't they just have to organise themselves to deal with them? West Brom did it pretty well bar that one lapse. Fulham did it easily. Sunderland would have beaten us comfortably had they been able to do it.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 2, 2011 8:56:19 GMT
Exactly the sort of comment that makes me wonder if there are people out there, that would literally accept 'any old shit' What next - we'll be happy if the largest proportion of our goals come from penalties and own goals? As long as those cracks get papered over? As much as you can practice set-plays, there's still an amount of luck involved with having a chance drop for you. Hence you're playing percentages. But hey - that's what we do better than anyone? Can you explain the luck involved in Delap's goal then? Yep. West Brom went to sleep. Delap wasn't properly picked up. Carson was nowhere.
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Post by RipRoaringPotter on Mar 2, 2011 9:39:11 GMT
Can you explain the luck involved in Delap's goal then? Yep. West Brom went to sleep. Delap wasn't properly picked up. Carson was nowhere. Shit defending isn't luck though is it? If it is, Arsenal were lucky to beat us. Both of Sunderland's goals against us were also lucky, as well as Fulham's goals against us. If bad defending is luck for the opposition does it mean it's unlucky for the defending team? Then it's fair to say we've been bloody unlucky ourselves recently.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 2, 2011 13:41:55 GMT
Yep. West Brom went to sleep. Delap wasn't properly picked up. Carson was nowhere. Shit defending isn't luck though is it? If it is, Arsenal were lucky to beat us. Both of Sunderland's goals against us were also lucky, as well as Fulham's goals against us. If bad defending is luck for the opposition does it mean it's unlucky for the defending team? Then it's fair to say we've been bloody unlucky ourselves recently. The point is that had they done their job properly on that one occasion, West Brom would have won. That doesn't suggest that our system is a roaring success at the moment does it? All it takes is a team to stay awake at set pieces and double mark the wingers and we're fucked. We need more strings to our bow, not less.
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Post by Ron Jeremy on Mar 2, 2011 16:57:05 GMT
Jones against liverpool
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Post by RipRoaringPotter on Mar 2, 2011 17:12:59 GMT
Shit defending isn't luck though is it? If it is, Arsenal were lucky to beat us. Both of Sunderland's goals against us were also lucky, as well as Fulham's goals against us. If bad defending is luck for the opposition does it mean it's unlucky for the defending team? Then it's fair to say we've been bloody unlucky ourselves recently. The point is that had they done their job properly on that one occasion, West Brom would have won. That doesn't suggest that our system is a roaring success at the moment does it? If our defence did their job we would've won. Suggesting our system might not be a roaring success but isn't completely fucked as people are suggesting. I still fail to see why a goal from a set piece is any more lucky than most goals scored. Nearly every goal needs luck, either in the build-up or in the execution. Looks at Giggs' goal against Arsenal in the FA Cup a few years back, it bounced off Dixon's shin about three times. Also, if we keep scoring from set-pieces it would suggest that a) it's not down to luck but something more thoughtful and b) it's not as easy as simply keeping your concentration to keep us out.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 2, 2011 18:35:43 GMT
The point is that had they done their job properly on that one occasion, West Brom would have won. That doesn't suggest that our system is a roaring success at the moment does it? If our defence did their job we would've won. Suggesting our system might not be a roaring success but isn't completely fucked as people are suggesting. I still fail to see why a goal from a set piece is any more lucky than most goals scored. Nearly every goal needs luck, either in the build-up or in the execution. Looks at Giggs' goal against Arsenal in the FA Cup a few years back, it bounced off Dixon's shin about three times. Also, if we keep scoring from set-pieces it would suggest that a) it's not down to luck but something more thoughtful and b) it's not as easy as simply keeping your concentration to keep us out. Putting all your eggs in one basket is a terrible idea. It isn't going to keep working. We're seeing that now in recent performances aren't we?
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Post by RipRoaringPotter on Mar 3, 2011 10:19:38 GMT
If our defence did their job we would've won. Suggesting our system might not be a roaring success but isn't completely fucked as people are suggesting. I still fail to see why a goal from a set piece is any more lucky than most goals scored. Nearly every goal needs luck, either in the build-up or in the execution. Looks at Giggs' goal against Arsenal in the FA Cup a few years back, it bounced off Dixon's shin about three times. Also, if we keep scoring from set-pieces it would suggest that a) it's not down to luck but something more thoughtful and b) it's not as easy as simply keeping your concentration to keep us out. Putting all your eggs in one basket is a terrible idea. It isn't going to keep working. We're seeing that now in recent performances aren't we? While scoring off set-pieces has always been a part of our game, it's only the last six weeks/ two months that it's been pretty much the only part of our game. I'm pretty confident it's just a phase and we'll start to score more goals from open play soon (and probably less from set pieces). It's probably helped that we've played some sides at home that aren't great at defending. The scary thing is how many points would we have gained over this period if we weren't a threat from set-pieces? Far from being embarrassed by it, thank fuck we are scoring from them. We'd be in shit now if we weren't.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 3, 2011 13:17:59 GMT
Putting all your eggs in one basket is a terrible idea. It isn't going to keep working. We're seeing that now in recent performances aren't we? While scoring off set-pieces has always been a part of our game, it's only the last six weeks/ two months that it's been pretty much the only part of our game. I'm pretty confident it's just a phase and we'll start to score more goals from open play soon (and probably less from set pieces). It's probably helped that we've played some sides at home that aren't great at defending. The scary thing is how many points would we have gained over this period if we weren't a threat from set-pieces? Far from being embarrassed by it, thank fuck we are scoring from them. We'd be in shit now if we weren't. I'm not saying scoring from set pieces is a bad thing. I'm saying that only looking remotely threatening exclusively from set pieces is very much a bad thing. We didn't rely totally on them before because we had players like both wingers, Fuller and Tuncay in the team. Who's going to create the chances to end this "phase" now?
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Post by RipRoaringPotter on Mar 3, 2011 13:37:52 GMT
While scoring off set-pieces has always been a part of our game, it's only the last six weeks/ two months that it's been pretty much the only part of our game. I'm pretty confident it's just a phase and we'll start to score more goals from open play soon (and probably less from set pieces). It's probably helped that we've played some sides at home that aren't great at defending. The scary thing is how many points would we have gained over this period if we weren't a threat from set-pieces? Far from being embarrassed by it, thank fuck we are scoring from them. We'd be in shit now if we weren't. I'm not saying scoring from set pieces is a bad thing. I'm saying that only looking remotely threatening exclusively from set pieces is very much a bad thing. We didn't rely totally on them before because we had players like both wingers, Fuller and Tuncay in the team. Who's going to create the chances to end this "phase" now? Well it doesn't take a genius to figure out most of our created chances come from the wing so we'd be looking for Ethers and Pennant to do that job. I think them two not being fit is more to blame for our dip in form than Fuller or Tuncay not playing to be honest.
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Post by Olgrligm on Mar 3, 2011 13:37:54 GMT
Samartians number please Is that some kind of Intergalactic helpline? H ;D
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Post by Deleted on Mar 3, 2011 13:41:55 GMT
I'm not saying scoring from set pieces is a bad thing. I'm saying that only looking remotely threatening exclusively from set pieces is very much a bad thing. We didn't rely totally on them before because we had players like both wingers, Fuller and Tuncay in the team. Who's going to create the chances to end this "phase" now? Well it doesn't take a genius to figure out most of our created chances come from the wing so we'd be looking for Ethers and Pennant to do that job. I think them two not being fit is more to blame for our dip in form than Fuller or Tuncay not playing to be honest. And what if they don't both regain full fitness this season? Shouldn't we have thought about that and got some decent cover in? Especially since we sold Tuncay. He doesn't always play them both even if they're both fit. Again, relying just on the wingers makes us predictable. Fulham had twigged that and double marked them. They both played against Sunderland and we could have played all night and not scored from open play.
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Post by RipRoaringPotter on Mar 3, 2011 14:00:41 GMT
Well it doesn't take a genius to figure out most of our created chances come from the wing so we'd be looking for Ethers and Pennant to do that job. I think them two not being fit is more to blame for our dip in form than Fuller or Tuncay not playing to be honest. And what if they don't both regain full fitness this season? Shouldn't we have thought about that and got some decent cover in? Especially since we sold Tuncay. He doesn't always play them both even if they're both fit. Again, relying just on the wingers makes us predictable. Fulham had twigged that and double marked them. They both played against Sunderland and we could have played all night and not scored from open play. I actually think we're just as predictable as we have been for most of the season. We've just been a bit wank at doing what we normally do recently. Tuncay was always good to have on the bench but never did that much when he started games. Fuller, for whatever reason, seems disinterested and simply doesn't look that sharp at the moment. Without knowing what's gone on I've got no idea whether he can be sorted out. So we've lost a couple of 'off the bench' options admittedly but I think a few of the players just need a good slap back to form.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 3, 2011 19:35:14 GMT
And what if they don't both regain full fitness this season? Shouldn't we have thought about that and got some decent cover in? Especially since we sold Tuncay. He doesn't always play them both even if they're both fit. Again, relying just on the wingers makes us predictable. Fulham had twigged that and double marked them. They both played against Sunderland and we could have played all night and not scored from open play. I actually think we're just as predictable as we have been for most of the season. We've just been a bit wank at doing what we normally do recently. Tuncay was always good to have on the bench but never did that much when he started games. Fuller, for whatever reason, seems disinterested and simply doesn't look that sharp at the moment. Without knowing what's gone on I've got no idea whether he can be sorted out. So we've lost a couple of 'off the bench' options admittedly but I think a few of the players just need a good slap back to form. We create far less from open play without Fuller in the team. Tuncay offered something unpredictable, which we're crying out for. We don't always play two wingers and we have no cover when one/both is unfit. That's why we're creating nothing from open play.
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