Wind yer neck in Tone..........

[Deleted]

Now I might be in a minority of one here but I think Pulis needs to stop bleating and get on with the job in hand of getting us back up the table and away from danger.

I'm all for him passing comment after the game but this media campaign to punish refs makes him look a bit pathetic and no better than Arsene Wenger.

Yes we've had some shocking decisions go against us but lets not get carried away like there's some national conspiracy to get us relegated. Pulis should be using the injustice to galvanize the team behind close doors and hopefully we'll see a reaction tonight.

But far more concerning for me at the moment is the amount of individual errors at the back that are costing us cheap goals and our inability to create more chances in open play.

So my message to you Tone is simply shut up and get on with your job, starting with 3 points against Brum tonight.

[Danstoke82]

I think Tone has a point though.

If it was just the one game with a dodgy decision then ok, take it on the chin and move on.

But this has happened regularly now mostly to us but other clubs have had decisions against them as well which at the time have been unbelievable.

These Premier League referees are meant to be trained and the best in the game, however some of thier decision making has been utterly horrendous and in result could cost clubs the one point that would keep them in the league and running as a stable business.

At the same time theres no point in Tone constantly question the referees as we all know nothing would be done unless Ferguson or Whinger came into the debate in support.

[Davef]

TP's is obviously right to highlight some of the shocking decisions that have gone against us this season, notably the Tottenham and Sunderland incidents and Neville's unpunished foul on Ethers, but he's on a very sticky wicket when he starts claiming that we'd be seven points better off without them.

The Tottenham goal would obviously have given us one extra point because it was so late in the game, but you can't just assume that had those decisions gone for us against Bolton, Everton, Man Utd and Sunderland that we'd have gone on and won those games.

Regardless of the refereeing decisions, we're not creating enough chances and we're looking extremely dodgy in defence lately. We've gone behind in ten out of eleven league games this season and apart the Everton game I don't think we can blame referees on that statistic.

We have to address these problems quickly and not just use the peformance of poor officials to gloss over them.

[diaoshairyballs]

Good little boy Tony, sit there and don't say a word.

People would be up in arms if he just passed this debacle off as nothing.

Plus, how do you honestly expect him to do his job properly when people who are supposed to be fairly officiating the games in which we play give decisions that make his job even more difficult, ie ruling out perfectly legitimate goals and not giving cast iron penalty decisions, how do you plan or train for that?

I know it's your opinion so fair play, however if TP said nothing I think you be questioning that instead.

[stokemachine]

Tone was right to have a rant and highlight the disgraceful refereeing that we have endured.
Use the media to your advantage... Fergie and Arshole Wanker do for their respective agendas!!
We play at the top level of football in the country, yet the refs standard has not even been worthy of gracing the PDSL!!

Peno tonight please referee!!! ;D ;D ;D

[dexter97]

Nov 9, 2010 8:44:50 GMT Davef said:

TP's is obviously right to highlight some of the shocking decisions that have gone against us this season, notably the Tottenham and Sunderland incidents and Neville's unpunished foul on Ethers, but he's on a very sticky wicket when he starts claiming that we'd be seven points better off without them.

The Tottenham goal would obviously have given us one extra point because it was so late in the game, but you can't just assume that had those decisions gone for us against Bolton, Everton, Man Utd and Sunderland that we'd have gone on and won those games.

Regardless of the refereeing decisions, we're not creating enough chances and we're looking extremely dodgy in defence lately. We've gone behind in ten out of eleven league games this season and apart the Everton game I don't think we can blame referees on that statistic.

We have to address these problems quickly and not just use the peformance of poor officials to gloss over them.

The "seven points" claim is gilding the lily a little, which you'd expect any manager to do under the circumstances, but I think to say that officials have cost us between four and six points is entirely reasonable:

- One against Spurs - No question about that one.
- Surely two points from the Manure and Everton matches - Yes, it's an assumption, but you'd have to say we'd have got something out of those games if we'd got the key decisions.
- One, and I believe three would've been more likely, against a ten-man Sunderland.

The Bolton one I've ignored. I don't think that decision changed the game.

It's correct that we shouldn't use our run of bad luck to "gloss-over" elements of our performances at times, but there's little doubt that with the benefit of competent officiating, we'd be comfortably mid table and satisfied with a respectable haul of points from some difficult games.

I don't normally approve of "bleating", but I'm coming round to the idea that sometimes you just have to "play the game" to get anything. There isn't another manager in the league that wouldn't be ranting in the media if they'd been dealt the hand that Stoke have recently, and most would be doing it with less decorum than Pulis.

Where I don't agree with TP is his suggested solution. Even if a "league table" of refs was the correct way to address this (and I don't think it is), then managers are the last people I'd allow to control their destiny. I hope (but I'm not optimistic) that this debate might strengthen the case for the use of video replays.

[foster]

I think Tone shouldn't say anything more about the reffing incidents and focus on the next game. I'm pretty sure that the media will pick up on any future controversial decisions without him needing to go into details.

[stokemark]

I think he has been absoutley right to say what he has and raise awareness of the issue.

Other clubs have the press to help represent their needs (particularly those in SE) - Who do we have other than ourselves ?

[Lakeland Potter]

I don't see why TP's highlighting of the referees' failings means he can't also be concentrating on trying to win tonight's game. Despite all the media focus on his comments, the original interviews probably lasted 15 minutes in total. I'm sure Tone can give 15 minutes of interviews in two days without compromising his efforts to get the team ready for tonight.

[ted1965]

I think Tone has a duty to the club, his players and the supporters to voice his concerns about the number of shocking refereeing errors that the club has suffered over the last few months. If he kept quiet we as supporters would be asking why no comments from him, why no defending of the club. Though sadly it wont make any difference because he has no clout where it counts in the star struck minds of those who run the game.

There are very few quality referees in the Premier League, in fact there are many who are simply star struck and who referee games with the fear of actually making the correct call. They know the consequences of upsetting certain managers, clubs and players. The media friends and sycophants of those players and managers will immediately crucify those who take a stand for consistency and fairness.

The examples of star struck refs, Ferdinand chipping in from the peanut gallery while the decision of Nani’s gaol was being made. Tottenham players dismissed like school children because this was Old Trafford and they weren’t the big club today. How many times has Gerrard or Terry committed near assault on the field without punishment from some referees, yet other players will be dismissed for one or two lesser indiscretions.

It stinks and no amount of papering over the cracks by some will change the facts, there’s one rule for some and one for the rest.

[Cyprusdelilah]

I think tonight we need Harry Hill in between the two managers, I can see a fight if there is a bad decision leading to a goal.

[nqsdiscopants]

Pulis can't stop bleating on about referee's though - if he did there would be nothing to deflect attention from the shortcomings of him and his team.

[Teddler Stokie Born and Bred]

Nov 9, 2010 8:16:28 GMT prestwichpotter said:

Now I might be in a minority of one here but I think Pulis needs to stop bleating and get on with the job in hand of getting us back up the table and away from danger.

I'm all for him passing comment after the game but this media campaign to punish refs makes him look a bit pathetic and no better than Arsene Wenger.

Yes we've had some shocking decisions go against us but lets not get carried away like there's some national conspiracy to get us relegated. Pulis should be using the injustice to galvanize the team behind close doors and hopefully we'll see a reaction tonight.

But far more concerning for me at the moment is the amount of individual errors at the back that are costing us cheap goals and our inability to create more chances in open play.

So my message to you Tone is simply shut up and get on with your job, starting with 3 points against Brum tonight.

And your telling us that Tone needs to wind his neck in!!!!
practice what you preach and accept OUR manager is dissgruntled by alot of unfair, punishable decisions!!!

[Deleted]

Disagree with the OP.

TP's absolutely right to highlight it, and from the interviews I've seen, has done it in a calm and professional manner.

[stantheman]

I think that the amount of favourable press/air time we got after the Sunderland match was enough to leave things as they were.

MOTD showing the Neville incident and Tunny's goal at Everton was enough to show that we've not had the 'rub of the green' this season.

Coming out yesterday and saying what he did is only going to make him/us look like we are after referee's to start giving us massive favours to make up for all the bad decisions we've had.

His response to what Danny Murphy said could also have been handled better, like Mick McCarthy and big Sam did.

We need to stop looking like the victim and start looking at our own performances.

Lets face it, unless we smash the ball in the net or someone pulls a knife on one of our players, we're going to continue getting nothing out of referees.

STM

[boneym]

Give it a rest. You get certain managers in this league having the media/refs dance to their tune every week.

Don't confuse this with a struggling manager of a struggling team in desperation. Stoke have had some shocking decisions go against them and while you discoprick, may think it's one incident in one game of your season, we have seen it week in week out for 4 league games on the bounce. Anyone who tries to say it hasn't cost us is a fool when you consider that in only one of those games we have lost by more than one goal. In that game we were behind by one and would have either a goal or a penalty and a man advantage.

Tony has to play the game that other managers do. It's a sorry fact about this league, but if you don't bring attention to yourself and your not in the top 6 then no one will do it for you. It's taken 4 weeks before programmes like MotD and goals on sunday have cottened on, you watch, things will start going our way sooner or later and only because of a bit of exposure... that's the shame, not our managers outburst at all.

[vickyground]

Nov 9, 2010 8:16:28 GMT prestwichpotter said:

Now I might be in a minority of one here but I think Pulis needs to stop bleating and get on with the job in hand of getting us back up the table and away from danger.

I'm all for him passing comment after the game but this media campaign to punish refs makes him look a bit pathetic and no better than Arsene Wenger.

Yes we've had some shocking decisions go against us but lets not get carried away like there's some national conspiracy to get us relegated. Pulis should be using the injustice to galvanize the team behind close doors and hopefully we'll see a reaction tonight.

But far more concerning for me at the moment is the amount of individual errors at the back that are costing us cheap goals and our inability to create more chances in open play.

So my message to you Tone is simply shut up and get on with your job, starting with 3 points against Brum tonight.

Normally I would agree with you. But someone has to stick up for Stoke. Its ridiculous, to me it seems as if it is a case of 11v12. Personally, I would have liked to see Peter Coates making a lot of the statements and I am a bit disappointed there. But Tony Pulis has every right to stick up for us and more power to his elbow.

[dexter97]

Nov 9, 2010 11:07:24 GMT nqsdiscopants said:

Pulis can't stop bleating on about referee's though - if he did there would be nothing to deflect attention from the shortcomings of him and his team.

Frankly, that's bollocks. The first thing that TP talked about in his post-match interview on Saturday was how poor we'd been in the first half. The fact is that we've been shafted out of at least four points, probably a couple more, which would have put us comfortably mid-table and happy with the points we'd taken from a run of tough games. Had we been comfortably beaten and created nothing, then there'd be something in what you're saying.

Hopefully we can start to put it behind us tonight, but you can't knock Pulis for moaning; any other manager would have done the same.

[sheikhmomo]

Nov 9, 2010 11:07:24 GMT nqsdiscopants said:

Pulis can't stop bleating on about referee's though - if he did there would be nothing to deflect attention from the shortcomings of him and his team.

A little bit rich coming from the supporter of a club whose manager has spent most of the season making out his team is victmised and that Lee Cattermole is Mother fucking Theresa.

[stokie23]

Tony has to defend his football club, fergie and wenger both do it, sometimes when they are blaitently wrong, tony actually has a point....but best thing to do is go out and win tonight, and im sure we will.

[stokerambler]

I can't blame Pulis for venting his anger about the ref decisions that have undoubtedly cost us points this season. I don't actually agree with his remedy of relegating refs. Refs are assessed on each game by an assessor. But there is a lack of transparency about these assessments. It is not clear what the consequence of a poor or a good assessment is? That is the problem. There appears to be no accountability. And for that I can't blame managers getting angry and frustrated.

[JetBlack]

Firstly I think the term 'bleating' is the wrong description. Secondly, the reason it makes me cringe when TP goes on the tele and talks about how we're being treated differently than other teams is this, we are already a very disliked club thanks not just to people like Wenger, but sometimes our style of play. Pulis may just be handing them more ammunition for later media shots against us in the future and let's be honest there will be more. I agree with the first post, but at the same time I wish that Pulis wouldn't do this sort of thing. He should just use his anger to create the siege mentality in the dressing room, which we had in our first season.
Perhaps too, if the chant "We've got another shit ref" could be stopped perhaps that would help with decisions?

[stokie23]

Dont agree JetBlack ,

You suggest were becoming more and more disliked by the media and other clubs, but then ask for a siege mentality. But surely were creating that now by coming out and saying these things. I dont want to be like the big clubs, loved by the media and cant put a foot wrong...and i tell you....if we get an awful decision , ill be singing we got another shit ref at the top of my voice....fuck em all

[davejohnno1]

I think he needed to say his piece really because the Sunderland incident was an absolute shocker and when added to the rest of the decisions, was clearly the straw that broke the camels back.

It clearly affected the players and the frustration was there for all to see, particularly in two challenges, 1 from Shawcross and 1 from Fuller.

That said he needs to let it drop now. We have taken it on the chin and hopefully it will have the affect of getting everyone's backs up and start to see us return to something a bit more resembling normal.

[nqsdiscopants]

Nov 9, 2010 11:36:57 GMT dexter97 said:

Nov 9, 2010 11:07:24 GMT nqsdiscopants said:

Pulis can't stop bleating on about referee's though - if he did there would be nothing to deflect attention from the shortcomings of him and his team.

Frankly, that's bollocks. The first thing that TP talked about in his post-match interview on Saturday was how poor we'd been in the first half. The fact is that we've been shafted out of at least four points, probably a couple more, which would have put us comfortably mid-table and happy with the points we'd taken from a run of tough games. Had we been comfortably beaten and created nothing, then there'd be something in what you're saying.

Hopefully we can start to put it behind us tonight, but you can't knock Pulis for moaning; any other manager would have done the same.

That isn't a fact at all - there's no way you can predict what would have happened in any of those games had the decisions in question gone your way.

You played us on Saturday on the back of our worst defeat in years, without Darren Bent for the first time since he signed for us, without Titus Bramble for the first time this season (he is our player of the year to date) and managed the sum total of two headers from corners.

You're where you are because you're not playing well. That IS a fact.

[JetBlack]

Stokie23 I understand what you're on about mate, I've sang the chant myself, but at the same time I wondered if this helps us out really. I agree with you in so far as I don't want us to become media darlings like NUFC for example, but he has made his points now and we should wait to see what the media fallout is like. As we've seen in the thread that contains the Daily Express link, we'll never ever become that.
The only people that see the injustices that we've had so far this season our ourselves and SCFC. The only time Sky Sports and MotD bring them up is when there are so many of them to ignore.

[diaoshairyballs]

We're hustling everybody in the league, and you, disco kegs have fallen for it, unlucky fucker.

We'll twat Brum tonight and Liverpool on Saturday, kick starting a run of 17 games unbeaten we'll then finish the campaign in 3rd, and thats only because we dont want to finish in the top 2 and deprive Sky of their 'oooooooh, is it going to be Chelsea, oooooooh, is it going to be Man Utd' spunk fest.

Heard it hear first fuckers.

[boneym]

Nov 9, 2010 12:37:07 GMT nqsdiscopants said:

Nov 9, 2010 11:36:57 GMT dexter97 said:

Frankly, that's bollocks. The first thing that TP talked about in his post-match interview on Saturday was how poor we'd been in the first half. The fact is that we've been shafted out of at least four points, probably a couple more, which would have put us comfortably mid-table and happy with the points we'd taken from a run of tough games. Had we been comfortably beaten and created nothing, then there'd be something in what you're saying.

Hopefully we can start to put it behind us tonight, but you can't knock Pulis for moaning; any other manager would have done the same.

That isn't a fact at all - there's no way you can predict what would have happened in any of those games had the decisions in question gone your way.

You played us on Saturday on the back of our worst defeat in years, without Darren Bent for the first time since he signed for us, without Titus Bramble for the first time this season (he is our player of the year to date) and managed the sum total of two headers from corners.

You're where you are because you're not playing well. That IS a fact.

On the back our 3 defeats on the bounce, whilst you were at home, with a £13m striker upfront, u managed the sum total of 4 notable shots, 1 a goal from our mistake, 2nd a penalty that you missed, 3rd Zenden's effort deep in the 2nd half and 4th your 2nd goal when we were down to 10 men and visibly in peices after another blatant wrong decision.... if we were shite, you weren't much better even as the home team and after benifiting from a match changing decision.... see you down the Brit mucker.

[thetron]

If Pulis had said nothing about this, prestwich, you would be moaning that he wasnt standing up for the club. Tony has done what most if not all manangers would of done, and that is standing up for his players, fans and club! We were all thinking it straight after the sunderland game, and Pulis raised not just his views but the fans views aswell! At the same time i agree that he needs get the team playing better but he has done the right thing in backing us up!
Our performances would dramatically improve if he made 1 change, and the would be to drop walters for pennant, and not even play walters at all. hes just cresswell in disguise!

[nqsdiscopants]

Nov 9, 2010 12:50:05 GMT boneym said:

Nov 9, 2010 12:37:07 GMT nqsdiscopants said:

That isn't a fact at all - there's no way you can predict what would have happened in any of those games had the decisions in question gone your way.

You played us on Saturday on the back of our worst defeat in years, without Darren Bent for the first time since he signed for us, without Titus Bramble for the first time this season (he is our player of the year to date) and managed the sum total of two headers from corners.

You're where you are because you're not playing well. That IS a fact.

On the back our 3 defeats on the bounce, whilst you were at home, with a £13m striker upfront, you managed the sum total of 4 notable shots, 1 a goal from our mistake, 2nd a penalty that you missed, 3rd Zenden's effort deep in the 2nd half and 4th your 2nd goal when we were down to 10 men and visibly in peices after another blatant wrong decision.... if we were shite, you weren't much better even as the home team and after benifiting from a match changing decision.... see you down the Brit mucker.

I didn't once suggest that we had played well, only that we were, on the day, the better side. It's actually the worst we have played at home this season.

First goal a mistake by Stoke? Think even I wouldn't be that harsh on you - the build up play to our first goal was the only piece of genuinely good football in the game. Barring perhaps Gyan's finish for the second.