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Post by davejohnno1 on Jun 7, 2012 9:00:34 GMT
In today's sentinel, Pulis is said to be hoping that a pre-season and strict fitness regime will see Palacios show us the player he can be and effectively be like a new signing next season.
All great. One comment from Pulis caught my eye though;
"There is no doubt he's a good player, that why Tottenham paid so much for him 3 years ago".
I wonder if this is indicative of how we try to sign players. If they cost someone a lot of money, then they must be a good player. Surely we should be saying "There is no doubt he is a good player. We wouldn't have spent 6-8m on him less than 12 months ago otherwise"?
Pulis seems to be insinuating that there remains lots of "ifs" and "buts" about whether we see the best of Palacios or not which could be seen to be a tad concerning.
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Post by scfcwebby on Jun 7, 2012 9:05:58 GMT
In today's sentinel, Pulis is said to be hoping that a pre-season and strict fitness regime will see Palacios show us the player he can be and effectively be like a new signing next season. All great. One comment from Pulis caught my eye though; "There is no doubt he's a good player, that why Tottenham paid so much for him 3 years ago". I wonder if this is indicative of how we try to sign players. If they cost someone a lot of money, then they must be a good player. Surely we should be saying "There is no doubt he is a good player. We wouldn't have spent 6-8m on him less than 12 months ago otherwise"? Pulis seems to be insinuating that there remains lots of "ifs" and "buts" about whether we see the best of Palacios or not which could be seen to be a tad concerning. Took the words right out of my mouth johnno.... My money on our first "new signing" is Wilson Palacios on 12th July!!  |
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Post by Deleted on Jun 7, 2012 9:25:35 GMT
I think we knew more about Palacios than the fact that he cost Spurs a lot of money for them. He was outstanding for them when he first went there and was outstanding for Wigan before that. Also, on paper he was absolutely perfect for how we play.
However, I think there are concerns about whether we'll see the best of him and it's by no means a given. He didn't look remotely fit at any stage of the season despite him claiming to be 100%. It's really up to him. How interested is he in getting himself back to peak condition, how much does he want it?
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Post by davejohnno1 on Jun 7, 2012 9:39:27 GMT
That ws also insinutated Rob with the comment "we are certainly doing everything we can to help him fitness wise..."
All of which begs the question, if Palacios desire is debatable, as to how he passed the famous DNA test?
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Post by Deleted on Jun 7, 2012 9:47:01 GMT
That ws also insinutated Rob with the comment "we are certainly doing everything we can to help him fitness wise..." All of which begs the question, if Palacios desire is debatable, as to how he passed the famous DNA test? Absolutely. Same with Eidur. |
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Post by bunnyscfc on Jun 7, 2012 10:01:03 GMT
I wonder what Saint Peter's thoughts are with TP spending £8 million on a player who it takes ONE WHOLE YEAR to get fit
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Post by wembley4372 on Jun 7, 2012 10:04:17 GMT
I wonder what Saint Peter's thoughts are with TP spending £8 million on a player who it takes ONE WHOLE YEAR to get fit Are you suggesting TP signed him knowing he wouldn't be fit for ONE WHOLE YEAR? |
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Post by jimmygscfc1234 on Jun 7, 2012 10:06:43 GMT
It begs the question as to why we spent so much on a player who was always going to take ages to get back to full fitness. No matter which way you spin it we didn't do our homework properly which suggests the DNA bollocks really is just that. If he doesn't show his mettle during pre-season and the friendlies I'd try and unload to a foreign club and get something back even though, in principle, I like him and desperately want him to succeed.
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thepom
Youth Player
Posts: 333
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Post by thepom on Jun 7, 2012 10:23:43 GMT
If Palacios was still at his peak, then spurs wouldn't have let him go and wouldn't have needed scott parker, but the death of his brother played a massive part in the whole saga...
A year has now passed and perhaps his 'mournings' are over and perhaps palacios has come to terms with his 'life's tragedies' and he is ready to tackle his own 'life' and get back to where he was ... because of the style of his play it should only be the 'commitment' that has been lacking and in hindsight we may just have the 'missing link' between defence and midfield all along, it's just we haven't seen it yet .... (then we just need the ball player / reserve winger and the midfield will be good) with Whelan the supersub ...
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Post by nott1 on Jun 7, 2012 10:25:47 GMT
I wonder what Saint Peter's thoughts are with TP spending £8 million on a player who it takes ONE WHOLE YEAR to get fit He never did get fit, which doesn't say much for the fitness coaches! |
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Post by cousindupree on Jun 7, 2012 10:33:58 GMT
The mythical Pulis pre season regime doesn't have to be implemented just pre season does it?The manager could have introduced this program to Palacios at any time during the season if his injury allowed. Its seems that TP didn't for whatever reason or he did and it didn't work and Palacios never reached the required level. Clearly he often looked way way off the pace. So my hunch is that his injury doesn't allow for such intensive physical activity or he didn't want to do it. Either way it may be we have spunked 8m yes 8m thats 16 times the cost of a glen whelan down the drain. Don't get me wrong Palacios was the perfect player for us and its tragic that it may never work out.  |
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Post by Deleted on Jun 7, 2012 10:40:03 GMT
The mythical Pulis pre season regime doesn't have to be implemented just pre season does it?The manager could have introduced this program to Palacios at any time during the season if his injury allowed. Its seems that TP didn't for whatever reason or he did and it didn't work and Palacios never reached the required level. Clearly he often looked way way off the pace. So my hunch is that his injury doesn't allow for such intensive physical activity or he didn't want to do it. Either way it may be we have spunked 8m yes 8m thats 16 times the cost of a glen whelan down the drain. Don't get me wrong Palacios was the perfect player for us and its tragic that it may never work out. I don't believe for a second that the club haven't been doing everything in their power to get him fit and firing from the day he arrived. |
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Post by cousindupree on Jun 7, 2012 11:05:19 GMT
The mythical Pulis pre season regime doesn't have to be implemented just pre season does it?The manager could have introduced this program to Palacios at any time during the season if his injury allowed. Its seems that TP didn't for whatever reason or he did and it didn't work and Palacios never reached the required level. Clearly he often looked way way off the pace. So my hunch is that his injury doesn't allow for such intensive physical activity or he didn't want to do it. Either way it may be we have spunked 8m yes 8m thats 16 times the cost of a glen whelan down the drain. Don't get me wrong Palacios was the perfect player for us and its tragic that it may never work out. I don't believe for a second that the club haven't been doing everything in their power to get him fit and firing from the day he arrived. Indeed and therin lies a huge concern |
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Post by JurgenVandeurzen on Jun 7, 2012 11:06:29 GMT
The mythical Pulis pre season regime doesn't have to be implemented just pre season does it?The manager could have introduced this program to Palacios at any time during the season if his injury allowed. Its seems that TP didn't for whatever reason or he did and it didn't work and Palacios never reached the required level. Clearly he often looked way way off the pace. So my hunch is that his injury doesn't allow for such intensive physical activity or he didn't want to do it. Either way it may be we have spunked 8m yes 8m thats 16 times the cost of a glen whelan down the drain. Don't get me wrong Palacios was the perfect player for us and its tragic that it may never work out. I don't believe for a second that the club haven't been doing everything in their power to get him fit and firing from the day he arrived. +1, how can it be taking so long?! |
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Post by Davef on Jun 7, 2012 11:08:54 GMT
If Palacios was still at his peak, then spurs wouldn't have let him go and wouldn't have needed scott parker, but the death of his brother played a massive part in the whole saga... A year has now passed and perhaps his 'mournings' are over and perhaps palacios has come to terms with his 'life's tragedies' and he is ready to tackle his own 'life' and get back to where he was ... because of the style of his play it should only be the 'commitment' that has been lacking and in hindsight we may just have the 'missing link' between defence and midfield all along, it's just we haven't seen it yet .... (then we just need the ball player / reserve winger and the midfield will be good) with Whelan the supersub ... Wilson Palacios played 43 games for Tottenham in 2009/10, the season immediately after his brother's death. He was an integral part of the Spurs team which reached the Champions League. As tragic as it is, the death of his brother really cannot be used as an excuse for his lack of impact during his time with us so far. If it was the case that he was still struggling to come to terms with it, then we really should have stayed well clear. |
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Post by stokeramblers on Jun 7, 2012 11:11:14 GMT
I think the difference with the proper pre season is that the management can regulate for a couple of weeks what he is stuffing his fat face with.
I've seen him in Frankie & Bennys before and I know other people that've seen him in there.
Aren't footballers supposed to be all pasta, veg and fish etc.
Not fatty mclard arse burgers like the rest of us.
(Maybe he gets a discount there like us season ticket holders do) ;D
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Post by scfc1987 on Jun 7, 2012 11:15:17 GMT
Can you lot not remember when Fuller was a chunk and went under a strict regime to lose some of his bulk and how he came back a stronger player, I expect to see a 100% better Palacios in the new season. I have no doubt in saying he has the footballing ability and under some strict guidelines his fitness will improve - I think he will have a defining season with us this next year!!
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Post by Deleted on Jun 7, 2012 11:15:58 GMT
I just think he was quite rightly pointing out that up until his injury last season, he was a quality player - as recongised by Spurs, and that hopefully a full pre-season will have his fitness levels back to where they were and in turn his performance levels.
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Post by stokeramblers on Jun 7, 2012 11:19:02 GMT
Can you lot not remember when Fuller was a chunk and went under a strict regime to lose some of his bulk and how he came back a stronger player, I expect to see a 100% better Palacios in the new season. I have no doubt in saying he has the footballing ability and under some strict guidelines his fitness will improve - I think he will have a defining season with us this next year!! Let's hope so, because if he remains like the lardbucket he is now he'll be as good as useless to us. He has lost some weight since he joined us in fairness, I just hope he's had a good summer and hasn't spent it on his arse stuffing his cakehole. |
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Post by Deleted on Jun 7, 2012 11:22:05 GMT
No matter how hard Stoke "work" him to get fit if he is injured or has decided not to put the effort in he will still fail to make an impact. At the end of the day fitness is his responsibility by being professional off the field, if he is living his life eating " mclard arse burgers" then more fool him and I would get rid if that is the case because he is taking up a squad place from a player who wants to play. If however he does have this "injury" then careful management is all we can hope for to get some return for our investment and I would still get rid if there is no " cure" to get him fully fit, we are not big enough to carry players imo.
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Post by FullerMagic on Jun 7, 2012 11:22:15 GMT
The more we speak on Palacios, the more it's difficult to make head nor tail of what's going on... from March.. www.thisisstaffordshire.co.uk/Stoke-City-Pulis-Palacios-summer-fitness-regime/story-15610132-detail/story.html“He’s getting closer to being right,” Pulis said, “but he hasn’t been strong enough to get through games, and there’s always that worry that if he’s not fit enough the injury will flare up again.
“He can only do a certain amount. We can only take him to certain levels and because he’s not strong enough physically yet. He gets close to where it might break down.”
“The close-season will be important in building up his strength on his own before he comes back for pre-season,” Pulis added. “Next season, we will witness the best of him,”
Just a bit hard for us on the outside to put your finger on what's wrong with him? Does he need time for the injury, whatever it is, to 'heal' ? Time to strengthen something? Have we taken a flyer on him and lost out now we've seen how things have fallen? It's as clear as mud. It's not as if he's 'injured' in the truest sense as he has completed 90 minutes on occasion I'm sure our best medical minds are on the case - and there aren't any easy answers - but wouldn't it have been possible to drag him out of the first-team shake-up for the season and get him started on a long-term programme designed to have him firing for next August? We wouldn't have really missed his NINE starts. As Rob says, though, the player actually needs to want to get back to peak fitness. You can lead a horse to water.... |
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Post by stokeramblers on Jun 7, 2012 11:29:26 GMT
You can lead a horse to water but you can't make him close down shots from outside the box for love nor money?
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Post by dadofsam on Jun 7, 2012 11:35:35 GMT
Annoying and apparantley inconsistant that Ba is rejected and this waste of space taken on
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Post by Deleted on Jun 7, 2012 11:50:18 GMT
I think we knew more about Palacios than the fact that he cost Spurs a lot of money for them. He was outstanding for them when he first went there and was outstanding for Wigan before that. Also, on paper he was absolutely perfect for how we play. However, I think there are concerns about whether we'll see the best of him and it's by no means a given. He didn't look remotely fit at any stage of the season despite him claiming to be 100%. It's really up to him. How interested is he in getting himself back to peak condition, how much does he want it? This. I would worry that Palacios doesn't have the desire anymore,it happens with players from time to time and it looked that way from his limited pitch time last season.I just don't share the same optimism as some Stokies and don't think we are ever going to see the player we want to.Hopefully i'm proved wrong but i just don't see it happening. |
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Post by JurgenVandeurzen on Jun 7, 2012 12:05:52 GMT
I have a feeling we may have wasted our money here...the longer it goes on the more i worry.
He HAS to be fit ready for August.
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Post by Gods on Jun 7, 2012 12:22:30 GMT
I agree with the two posters above.
Palacios does not seem to a jot bit interested in the whole thing.
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Post by foxysgloves on Jun 7, 2012 12:28:31 GMT
In today's sentinel, Pulis is said to be hoping that a pre-season and strict fitness regime will see Palacios show us the player he can be and effectively be like a new signing next season. All great. One comment from Pulis caught my eye though; "There is no doubt he's a good player, that why Tottenham paid so much for him 3 years ago". I wonder if this is indicative of how we try to sign players. If they cost someone a lot of money, then they must be a good player. Surely we should be saying "There is no doubt he is a good player. We wouldn't have spent 6-8m on him less than 12 months ago otherwise"? Pulis seems to be insinuating that there remains lots of "ifs" and "buts" about whether we see the best of Palacios or not which could be seen to be a tad concerning. Either that Dave or have a read of this MB. I remember a lot of posters on here saying Palacios was ideal for us and we should go all out to sign him. If he had been mentally and physically 100% then I doubt we would have got him. We took a gamble on a player who in many ways was just what we needed. Perhaps the most worrying thing is that after this experience both Pulis and more importantly PC will be reluctant to take chances on players. So more Ba type failed transfers and less Fuller style spectacular gambles. |
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Post by jeycov on Jun 7, 2012 12:35:07 GMT
However, I think that he was a big part of the deal to secure the services of Peter Crouch.
Let's hope that Wilson will return to form - he needs to be in the starting eleven more often to get the message that we value him here at the club. Then sub him if necessary.
A new forward or midfielder to link with, may also give him the chance to play to his potential
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Post by rawli on Jun 7, 2012 12:37:47 GMT
If a preseason is so important why do we always piss about until the last day of the transfer window before signing players?
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Post by boskampsflaps on Jun 7, 2012 12:38:02 GMT
It begs the question as to why we spent so much on a player who was always going to take ages to get back to full fitness. No matter which way you spin it we didn't do our homework properly which suggests the DNA bollocks really is just that. If he doesn't show his mettle during pre-season and the friendlies I'd try and unload to a foreign club and get something back even though, in principle, I like him and desperately want him to succeed. I very much doubt that Pulis etc thought it would take so long to get him back to full fitness, they can only do so much for him, he needs to be fully committed to it, which unfortunately it seems WP cant be arsed to do, for what ever reason. |
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