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Post by bayernoatcake on Apr 28, 2024 9:16:23 GMT
We played bloody well under MoN that season and it was good to watch for the most part under him that season. And Jones was so fucking bad. People are saying that. The green shoots are a manager who at the first sign of trouble shat himself. A cheerleader sporting director and the one thing I actually have slight fairh in….Jared Dublin. Yeah MON turned us around but there were still a few bumps in the road. When we came back after Covid I recall a few dreadful results and performances which kept us in the relegation mix. I really like the look of Manhoef and Junho. Add a decent centre forward and we’ve got the makings of a bloody good forward line there. The midfield is ok and doesn’t need much adding to it. Also, I’ve seen a few things recently that I like about the mentality of the players. Coming back from losing positions three times, a multi player scrap against Plymouth, coming under siege at Sheffield Wednesday and getting a valuable point. All things that we’ve not seen for years really. Agree re Manhoef and Bae. But the only midfielder we have that I want to be here next season is Burger really. Baker on the bench is fine. The rest can leave. I think Thompson will stay but he should be a bench player too. Laurent can fuck right off. I just don’t have faith in the manager not to crap himself again tbh. There was no need for when he did it after the Brum game and that led to this situation. If he’d have carried on results would have come. I don’t like how the club handled the January window either given that I do think we were playing well. It seemed unnecessary and threw the players under the bus. Totally naive when you know you’d be keeping most of them and needing them to win some games.
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Post by thornestein on Apr 28, 2024 9:16:37 GMT
it’s got be a push for the playoffs with the backing our club gets , and i agree with Bayern it is a shit league
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Post by mickstupp on Apr 28, 2024 9:18:39 GMT
I don’t see us going from where we are now to promotion contenders. I’d settle for a top ten spot, more goals and a better home record. Baby steps. What a sad little world when you can’t dare to dream for fear of disappointment. The initial goal should be to come first. Of course I’d be happy with more goals and much improved home form and performances but a bit of disappointment never hurt anyone. Right, but we aren’t in control of anything are we. It’s just internet chit chat that has no bearing on what’s actually going to happen.
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Post by cheekymatt71 on Apr 28, 2024 9:18:50 GMT
If we can win 3 on the bounce at the end of the season it should have us and players looking forward to next season positively.
Since relegation we find it impossible to win many games in a row and create some consistency - especially at home.
I hope Shumacher has had time to work out the league and what is needed for next season.
Get rid of Ennis if possible and one of Campbell/Mmae and sign a better striker - couple of centre-halfs, new keeper (the Rotherham lad would be ideal) and a quality left-back (Stevens as back up I wouldnt mind).
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Post by cobhamstokey on Apr 28, 2024 9:19:09 GMT
It’s impossible to predict. In Manhoef, Burger and Bae we have 3 quality players who should be better next season. if supported with 3 equally good quality signings then we might have a shout of the playoffs. If we get a 15+ goalscorer, CB and creative CM then we really could be cooking. If we don’t get in a striker CB LB keeper then we could be in for a struggle again.
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Post by dirtygary69 on Apr 28, 2024 9:20:00 GMT
I’m sure, internally, there will be an aim but I don’t necessarily think there needs to be any for the fan base given just how bad we’ve been since we came down. We know when we “expect” to do well it just doesn’t happen, or it happens in flashes usually in the early throes of the season before tailing off.
Just see where it takes us. There have been seasons where Barnsley have got to the play offs then relegated the next season, and seasons where a team from League One, in Ipswich, have somehow been absolutely brilliant and look like doing a back to back promotions. Yet Plymouth who got 101 points last year are in danger of a return back to League One.
I’d like us to get promoted easily with 100 points like everyone else would, but the league is that unpredictable season after season that who really knows. We have to aim as good as we can be. If teams like Barnsley and Huddersfield in the past and Ipswich this season can perform like they have then there’s no reason we can’t. You just need to capitalise when you have the chance and believe in what you are doing. Barnsley in particular were no good at playing football but had a way of playing that meant they knew what they were doing.
There’s no point saying you’d be “happy” with top 10 because that would inevitably mean you’ve probably finished just a few points off the play offs and disappointed that we didn’t win another 2 or 3 games, and ruing a missed opportunity.
If we carry on this form into next with more of Schumacher’s players implemented then we’ll certainly do better than this season. There is no reason if all goes well that we can’t be in and around the top half, but you never know who or what this league will throw up. Oxford will probably come up and be like fucking Brazil.
It’s a competitive league and we need to compete. It’s then fine margins between finishing where you really want to be.
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Post by lordb on Apr 28, 2024 9:20:49 GMT
Am I reading this right? On the one hand we have just had one of the worst seasons in 20 years but it's also realistic to go from that to a promotion campaign?
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Post by xchpotter on Apr 28, 2024 9:22:18 GMT
I just don’t know anymore. Just when you think we’ve hit rock bottom, we managed to find a new depth of shiteness to go to. Promised myself after repeated disappointment I wouldn’t hope for much, but already I’m excited for next season.
Anyway, in answer to the question…..a positive goal difference might be nice 😁
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Post by bayernoatcake on Apr 28, 2024 9:23:01 GMT
Am I reading this right? On the one hand we have just had one of the worst seasons in 20 years but it's also realistic to go from that to a promotion campaign? Yes. Plenty of teams have turned that around in this league. It pretty much happens every year. It’s a fucking shit league.
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Post by mickstupp on Apr 28, 2024 9:24:08 GMT
Yeah MON turned us around but there were still a few bumps in the road. When we came back after Covid I recall a few dreadful results and performances which kept us in the relegation mix. I really like the look of Manhoef and Junho. Add a decent centre forward and we’ve got the makings of a bloody good forward line there. The midfield is ok and doesn’t need much adding to it. Also, I’ve seen a few things recently that I like about the mentality of the players. Coming back from losing positions three times, a multi player scrap against Plymouth, coming under siege at Sheffield Wednesday and getting a valuable point. All things that we’ve not seen for years really. Agree re Manhoef and Bae. But the only midfielder we have that I want to be here next season is Burger really. Baker on the bench is fine. The rest can leave. I think Thompson will stay but he should be a bench player too. Laurent can fuck right off. I just don’t have faith in the manager not to crap himself again tbh. There was no need for when he did it after the Brum game and that led to this situation. If he’d have carried on results would have come. I don’t like how the club handled the January window either given that I do think we were playing well. It seemed unnecessary and threw the players under the bus. Totally naive when you know you’d be keeping most of them and needing them to win some games. I think the midfield is ok. It’s certainly not the most concerning area of the squad at the moment. The defence needs to be completely reconstructed. Pearson, Thompson, Laurent, Burger, Baker and maybe one new face is a good set of options.
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Post by GeneralFaye on Apr 28, 2024 9:25:19 GMT
The league is largely absolute pudding, just look at West Brom and where they are. Every time I've seen them this season they've been awful.
Get a dependable back 4/5 and that alone will see us around the play offs imo.
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Post by theonlooker on Apr 28, 2024 9:25:30 GMT
Realistic is probably top half with an outside play off push. I'd hope for more as a fan but the word realistic lays heavy. We can't and won't go from struggling for 6 years to a realistic tilt at promotion, we just won't. Overall with the teams coming up and those coming down, I can see a closer division than ever before. T here will be a fag paper difference between top and bottom.Ultimately as a club we need to drop promotion from all conversations and just concentrate on trying to be better at everything we do. Get into that marginal gains mindset and you'll eventually improve yourself into the top 6. I agree, that's why marginal gains are so important... A good loan signing, a dominant centre back, a good start to create belief, a collective stiffening of the fibres. Those kind of things. Please talk to me a bit about a collective stiffening of the fibres? Sounds a bit too fruity for a Sunday?
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Post by bayernoatcake on Apr 28, 2024 9:29:06 GMT
Agree re Manhoef and Bae. But the only midfielder we have that I want to be here next season is Burger really. Baker on the bench is fine. The rest can leave. I think Thompson will stay but he should be a bench player too. Laurent can fuck right off. I just don’t have faith in the manager not to crap himself again tbh. There was no need for when he did it after the Brum game and that led to this situation. If he’d have carried on results would have come. I don’t like how the club handled the January window either given that I do think we were playing well. It seemed unnecessary and threw the players under the bus. Totally naive when you know you’d be keeping most of them and needing them to win some games. I think the midfield is ok. It’s certainly not the most concerning area of the squad at the moment. The defence needs to be completely reconstructed. Pearson, Thompson, Laurent, Burger, Baker and maybe one new face is a good set of options. I don’t like it. Laurent is the epitome of why this club has been so shit for getting on the best part a decade now. The bloke turns up for 6 games a season and that’s about it. We can’t be keeping absolute wasters like him.
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Post by mickstupp on Apr 28, 2024 9:32:18 GMT
I think the midfield is ok. It’s certainly not the most concerning area of the squad at the moment. The defence needs to be completely reconstructed. Pearson, Thompson, Laurent, Burger, Baker and maybe one new face is a good set of options. I don’t like it. Laurent is the epitome of why this club has been so shit for getting on the best part a decade now. The bloke turns up for 6 games a season and that’s about it. We can’t be keeping absolute wasters like him. He’s certainly inconsistent. He’s also under contract and we would therefore need to find a willing buyer, much like Pearson and Baker. With a new defence, goalkeeper and striker required, it’s not a priority for me.
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Post by orfyboothen on Apr 28, 2024 9:38:24 GMT
A top half finish has to be minimum requirement.
Oh the imagined joy of featuring on page 1 of the Ceefax table instead of page bastard 2!
But... 4th/5th/6th is not impossible with judicious recruitment.
I'm a big believer that even 2 new players having a big impact can transform the fortunes of a whole squad.
A Sheron of 95/96, a Taggart-style impact etc.
Stick a Shawcross & Fuller in this current team and we finish 10th-ish I'd say...
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Post by cobhamstokey on Apr 28, 2024 9:39:14 GMT
I think the midfield is ok. It’s certainly not the most concerning area of the squad at the moment. The defence needs to be completely reconstructed. Pearson, Thompson, Laurent, Burger, Baker and maybe one new face is a good set of options. I don’t like it. Laurent is the epitome of why this club has been so shit for getting on the best part a decade now. The bloke turns up for 6 games a season and that’s about it. We can’t be keeping absolute wasters like him. Agreed. When he’s on his game he’s very good but he’s just not consistent and with him being captain it’s made it more difficult to drop him. He comes across as a laid back nice guy in interview but he needs to be more dynamic on the pitch. Burgers the future and for me needs a similar multi talented player alongside him. Pearson’s the type we need he’s just looked unfit though and I think we need someone younger in there (maybe Sidibe in time). Thompsons good reliable cover.
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Post by moon on Apr 28, 2024 9:42:03 GMT
I think the manager needs the full backing of the board next time around. If we find ourselves lingering around 16th come December I don’t want to see another mid season change of manager - it will only set us back further. Of course the situation is different if we are in the bottom three and starting to fall away like when we had 2 points after 10 games under mad Nath, but I’d be surprised if that is the case.
I expect to see an improved home record and more goals, especially from the forwards. That combined with a strong mid table or top 10 finish would be a significant improvement and something on which to build for the following season.
There has to be a clear distinction between what a realistic aim is, versus the minimum the manager has to achieve to still be in a job. Top 10 would be a good season, mid table with 60 points would be enough to justify the manager for another season, anything below that and there would have to be a significant improvement in style and clear potential to justify continuing down this path.
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Post by lordb on Apr 28, 2024 9:42:53 GMT
The league is largely absolute pudding, just look at West Brom and where they are. Every time I've seen them this season they've been awful. Get a dependable back 4/5 and that alone will see us around the play offs imo. It's the goals tally, less than a goal a game, which is why we have struggled
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Post by Goonie on Apr 28, 2024 9:43:34 GMT
Promotion. This league is fucking shit. You don’t need to be good to get out of it. You just need to be consistent average 7/10 most games and we'd be in the playoffs The likes of Leicester, Leeds WBA etc all getting easily beaten by the bottom clubs in the run in proves your assessment of this league in general 👍
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Post by cvillestokie on Apr 28, 2024 9:44:25 GMT
Challenging for the top 6 has to be the aim for almost every club who haven’t just been promoted (or relegated) + 1 of Southampton, Ipswich or Leeds.
If we can bring in a few dependable defenders and goalkeeper, I think we could finish in the top half. It will be a big season for Bae and Million.
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Post by lordb on Apr 28, 2024 9:44:59 GMT
Am I reading this right? On the one hand we have just had one of the worst seasons in 20 years but it's also realistic to go from that to a promotion campaign? Yes. Plenty of teams have turned that around in this league. It pretty much happens every year. It’s a fucking shit league. 'every year' If you mean knocking on the play offs, yes that happens but actual promotion from this position 'every year' No it doesn't
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Post by GeneralFaye on Apr 28, 2024 9:46:32 GMT
The league is largely absolute pudding, just look at West Brom and where they are. Every time I've seen them this season they've been awful. Get a dependable back 4/5 and that alone will see us around the play offs imo. It's the goals tally, less than a goal a game, which is why we have struggled Yes, I know we need to score more goals, but its hard to play the game you want to play with a defence like we've got and I believe its linked to how we attack teams. It appears we've clicked to a certain extent in the passed few games and got a nice balance about us but the West Brom game at home is an example of the defence letting us down when we're by far the better team.
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Post by lordb on Apr 28, 2024 9:46:49 GMT
Priority has to be scoring more goals especially at home
To be fair last 3 home games despite only winning one of them the football has been better, more attacking, more shots on goal
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Post by bayernoatcake on Apr 28, 2024 9:47:32 GMT
Yes. Plenty of teams have turned that around in this league. It pretty much happens every year. It’s a fucking shit league. 'every year' If you mean knocking on the play offs, yes that happens but actual promotion from this position 'every year' No it doesn't That would be going for promotion….
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Post by lordb on Apr 28, 2024 9:47:44 GMT
It's the goals tally, less than a goal a game, which is why we have struggled Yes, I know we need to score more goals, but its hard to play the game you want to play with a defence like we've got and I believe its linked to how we attack teams. It appears we've clicked to a certain extent in the passed few games and got a nice balance about us but the West Brom game at home is an example of the defence letting us down when we're by far the better team. Defence is fine/OK, it's no worse than West Brom or Norwich defence
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Post by Goonie on Apr 28, 2024 9:48:33 GMT
Am I reading this right? On the one hand we have just had one of the worst seasons in 20 years but it's also realistic to go from that to a promotion campaign? Make that 7-8 seasons! Every new season is a reset. I see no reason with 2 good windows that squad couldn't hit top 6. Not sure if SS will end the season though as Head Coach. If he delivers I'm fine with him, or anyone else for that matter
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Post by bayernoatcake on Apr 28, 2024 9:48:35 GMT
I don’t like it. Laurent is the epitome of why this club has been so shit for getting on the best part a decade now. The bloke turns up for 6 games a season and that’s about it. We can’t be keeping absolute wasters like him. He’s certainly inconsistent. He’s also under contract and we would therefore need to find a willing buyer, much like Pearson and Baker. With a new defence, goalkeeper and striker required, it’s not a priority for me. I think we’d find a buyer easily. 500k and off he fucks. Good riddance. 7/8 new first teamers are needed.
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Post by lordb on Apr 28, 2024 9:50:21 GMT
'every year' If you mean knocking on the play offs, yes that happens but actual promotion from this position 'every year' No it doesn't That would be going for promotion…. Going for promotion is attacking the top 2, 80+ points Knocking on the play offs 65+ points is not the same thing if you mean the latter that's not unrealistic aim (if everything goes right) If you mean the former - which to me going for promotion really is - then that's unrealistic
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Post by GeneralFaye on Apr 28, 2024 9:54:42 GMT
Yes, I know we need to score more goals, but its hard to play the game you want to play with a defence like we've got and I believe its linked to how we attack teams. It appears we've clicked to a certain extent in the passed few games and got a nice balance about us but the West Brom game at home is an example of the defence letting us down when we're by far the better team. Defence is fine/OK, it's no worse than West Brom or Norwich defence Can't agree at all. Cb's are consistently too weak. Our rb can't defend Our lb is aging and injury prone. Our goalkeeper is on loan and poor at crosses.
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Post by davejohnno1 on Apr 28, 2024 9:55:16 GMT
The positives are that the manager and some players don’t seem to be in the mood to celebrate survival, openly stating it’s not good enough, not acceptable and that they shouldn’t be in the mess we’ve experienced.
Like many, I’d be reasonably content with simply seeing signs of progression which in the main is better football, more goals and certainly more home wins. Consistently in top half of table and a flirtation with play off positions. A Middlesbrough type season for example.
That being said, I’m also in the Bayern camp in that this league is shit. There is nothing to fear from any team and you are never more than 3 good signings from the top of the league or 3 bad signings from the bottom of it.
From our previous promotion team, just stick a 19 year old Shawcross at the back, Rory in midfield and Ric up front and this squad would likely be at the top end of the league.
Sign players, the majority of which are the calibre of Ennis, and we’ll again be at the wrong end of the table.
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