Eek!!

[Seymour Beaver]

11 years - wow!

BBC News - TV fraud gang jailed for illegally streaming Premier League games
www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-65697595

[skip]

Mental.

[riproaringagain]

That almost insinuates they will go after subscribers. It’s no more than a cartal

[Veritas]

May 30, 2023 14:57:54 GMT Seymour Beaver said:

11 years - wow!

BBC News - TV fraud gang jailed for illegally streaming Premier League games
www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-65697595

11 years for £7m fraud, not that surprising

[desman2]

Always makes you believe that an offence which involves money is far more serious than one which can take someone's life eg death by dangerous driving, manslaughter drug dealing etc

[andystokey]

May 30, 2023 15:18:36 GMT Veritas said:

May 30, 2023 14:57:54 GMT Seymour Beaver said:

11 years - wow!

BBC News - TV fraud gang jailed for illegally streaming Premier League games
www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-65697595

11 years for £7m fraud, not that surprising

Has that set the benchmark for PPE then?

[stokiemac]

One of the men was found with indecent images of children on his computer and still managed get less time than his mate who's streaming football there's still no option to legally buy in 2023

[theonlooker]

Don't take money from a Tory!

You've been warned!

[st3mark]

What they do is less criminal than what sky do.

The crooks are providing a lot more for £10 than what sky are providing for £80 plus the extra for box office and bt etc.

If sky halved what they charge it would still be expensive.

[Boothen]

They interviewed a yank outside of the Emirates on the news earlier, he was shocked at what they charge over here. He said that they pay $5 a month and have access to all the games they want over there.

[willieeetmiout]

The working class game now only fit for the well off.

[flea79]

May 30, 2023 18:25:02 GMT Boothen said:

They interviewed a yank outside of the Emirates on the news earlier, he was shocked at what they charge over here. He said that they pay $5 a month and have access to all the games they want over there.

That’s how it was in Dubai, 5 a month for all sporting events, we are getting ripped off big style

[terryconroysmagic]

May 30, 2023 15:19:17 GMT desman2 said:

Always makes you believe that an offence which involves money is far more serious than one which can take someone's life eg death by dangerous driving, manslaughter drug dealing etc

This exactly.

White collar crime d serves to be be prosecuted but on a fair and consistent basis.

You could knife someone and get less time

[metalhead]

May 30, 2023 15:19:17 GMT desman2 said:

Always makes you believe that an offence which involves money is far more serious than one which can take someone's life eg death by dangerous driving, manslaughter drug dealing etc

Well this is proof isn't it? There are rapists who get less than this. In some cases, child rapists.

It's a fucking ridiculous sentence quite frankly. The money they made is on the extreme end of what most of these lot make and the sentence should have reflected accordingly. Not 11 fucking years though.

Mental.

[andystokey]

May 30, 2023 19:55:48 GMT metalhead said:

May 30, 2023 15:19:17 GMT desman2 said:

Always makes you believe that an offence which involves money is far more serious than one which can take someone's life eg death by dangerous driving, manslaughter drug dealing etc

Well this is proof isn't it? There are rapists who get less than this. In some cases, child rapists.

It's a fucking ridiculous sentence quite frankly. The money they made is on the extreme end of what most of these lot make and the sentence should have reflected accordingly. Not 11 fucking years though.

Mental.

The sentence is influenced by the victim and the perpetrator. If the "victim" is a peasant it doesn't even get to court. The "victim" in this case is a mega corporation hence 11 years. Meanwhile the tax payer defends Boris with a million pound lawyer bill for fixed penalty fine.

Anyone who believes crime and punishment is egalitarian is deluded.

[liamo]

11 years is fucking mental, football is a working class game and is literally what some poorer people around the world live for

Stop pricing people out of the sport they love and use this case as free market research, people are willing to pay… just not the extortionate amount over multiple providers

[FbrgVaStkFan]

May 30, 2023 17:55:00 GMT st3mark said:

What they do is less criminal than what sky do.

The crooks are providing a lot more for £10 than what sky are providing for £80 plus the extra for box office and bt etc.

If sky halved what they charge it would still be expensive.

If that's 80 a month, then holy shit Batman. That's nuts.

[prestwichpotter]

The good old British justice system, brutally rape someone, kill someone whilst being shit faced at the wheel and it's "see you in a few years if you keep your head down".

But take money from billion pound corporations and it's "make an example of them"

[wagsastokie]

May 31, 2023 8:19:19 GMT prestwichpotter said:

The good old British justice system, brutally rape someone, kill someone whilst being shit faced at the wheel and it's "see you in a few years if you keep your head down".

But take money from billion pound corporations and it's "make an example of them"

The question is how much money did they actually take off sky

I would suggest very little as most of the people wouldn’t of of paid for sky at the current price
Structure

It could be argued that they actually helped by increasing the amount of people exposed to the advertising

[Eggybread]

May 31, 2023 8:19:19 GMT prestwichpotter said:

The good old British justice system, brutally rape someone, kill someone whilst being shit faced at the wheel and it's "see you in a few years if you keep your head down".

But take money from billion pound corporations and it's "make an example of them"

Financial crime is always dealt with as one of the most serious crimes as it undermines their authority and threatens financial markets.
Captalism

[wherty]

One of those convicted is from Stoke. The city that visited, not the football club. 😏

[Seymour Beaver]

It was a private prosection by Sky.

However you have to ask who was defrauded.

It wasn't their customers because I can't imagine any one of them didn't know their stream was 'dodgy'.

Arguably it wasn't Sky because people using the service were doing so because they couldn't or wouldn't pay Sky's subscription.

The biggest loser therefore was HMRC - the ringleader was estimated to have earned £1.4m so probably theoretically owes £5-600k in tax. He got 11 years.

For context Nadhim Zahawi fiddled an estimated £3.7m and got away with a fine when caught out.

[Ron]

Just broadcast the 3pm kickoffs. It’s that simple.
Don’t charge the earth and you’ll get more subscribers.
More adverts- I’m abroad at moment and get SA super sport. Whilst it’s annoying there are on screen ads for 90 mins. This would create revenue.
Crate an app- themselves or via sky- which allows access to all matches streamed.
The efl could do it too.
Install app to tv / device and stream. Allow individual match subscriptions at an increased price. Allow club season prices.
The possibilities are endless and there’s money to be made.
Fuck sky off and do it themselves.

[mickmillslovechild]

May 31, 2023 12:55:48 GMT Seymour Beaver said:

It was a private prosection by Sky.

However you have to ask who was defrauded.

It wasn't their customers because I can't imagine any one of them didn't know their stream was 'dodgy'.

Arguably it wasn't Sky because people using the service were doing so because they couldn't or wouldn't pay Sky's subscription.

The biggest loser therefore was HMRC - the ringleader was estimated to have earned £1.4m so probably theoretically owes £5-600k in tax. He got 11 years.

For context Nadhim Zahawi fiddled an estimated £3.7m and got away with a fine when caught out.

It was a private prosecution by the Premier League, not Sky. Sky and BT sport (BT sport also hold TV rights and charge stupid sums but for some reason everyone always lets them off and just blames Sky for everything solely) had nothing to do with it.

The defrauding part is because broadcasters pay the Prem for TV rights to show the games, these guys however paid nothing and made millions from it. It's not the customers who watched that have lost out, it's the Prem who should have received money for their product being "stolen and sold on", in much the same way any other company would prosecute you if you stole their products then sold them on for a massive profit. I don't agree with it at all personally but it's certainly nothing to do with Sky being pissed off for not getting a few more subscribers. The sentence is also not the fault of Sky, BT sport's or The Prem. They don't get to have any involvement with the sentencing laid down by the court.

[skip]

Stream all matches and make ticket prices affordable so if you can go you will, and if you can't, you can watch it remotely.

It's fucking really simple.

[wherty]

May 31, 2023 14:41:31 GMT skip said:

Stream all matches and make ticket prices affordable so if you can go you will, and if you can't, you can watch it remotely.

It's fucking really simple.

Then most clubs go bust within 12 months following playing in empty stadiums.

[skip]

May 31, 2023 15:02:46 GMT wherty said:

May 31, 2023 14:41:31 GMT skip said:

Stream all matches and make ticket prices affordable so if you can go you will, and if you can't, you can watch it remotely.

It's fucking really simple.

Then most clubs go bust within 12 months following playing in empty stadiums.

I didn't say clubs shouldn't have a pricing structure to make attending games more likely. And how many clubs play virtually every week with masses of empty seats? Sell three tickets for £15 or two for £20? Fewer empty seats, more fans in the ground. I live 180 miles away so when I can't attend, I can stick a fiver in the coffers and watch a legit stream. Build that business model from the ground up, dodgy streams disappear, clubs get more fans at the games, everyone wins.

[mickmillslovechild]

May 31, 2023 14:41:31 GMT skip said:

Stream all matches and make ticket prices affordable so if you can go you will, and if you can't, you can watch it remotely.

It's fucking really simple.

It's not that simple though is it?

If the clubs stream the games themselves, the Prem get no money from TV rights. If the Prem get no money from TV rights, the clubs will get a fraction of the money they now receive for where they finish in the league and nowhere near as much from streaming as they currently get for their share of the TV rights.

Alternatively, if the Prem start a streaming service themselves, they won't make anything like what they do from the TV companies currently by selling individuals one match at a time.

Whether we like it or not, the Prem is built on money and all the clubs in the Prem rely on the money they get from their finishing positions and their share of the TV rights. The only way to do what you're suggesting is if everyone accepts we start again, go back to how football was in the 80s and very early 90s and, as a consequence, accept that English clubs and the national team will suffer in terms of success in the future because of that (we don't succeed as it is on an international level, we'd be miles behind if the clubs have to strip back all the sports science, technologies, facilities etc because they no longer have the money they used to).

Do I like it? Hell, no but unfortunately it's where we are now. It's waaay too late to put the genie back in the bottle now.

[skip]

May 31, 2023 15:10:22 GMT mickmillslovechild said:

May 31, 2023 14:41:31 GMT skip said:

Stream all matches and make ticket prices affordable so if you can go you will, and if you can't, you can watch it remotely.

It's fucking really simple.

It's not that simple though is it?

If the clubs stream the games themselves, the Prem get no money from TV rights. If the Prem get no money from TV rights, the clubs will get a fraction of the money they now receive for where they finish in the league and nowhere near as much as they do now for their share of the TV rights.

Alternatively, if the Prem start a streaming service themselves, they won't make anything like what they do from the TV companies currently.

Whether we like it or not, the Prem is built on money and all the clubs in the Prem rely on the money they get from their finishing positions and their share of the TV rights. The only way to do what you're suggesting is if everyone accepts we start again, go back to how football was in the 80s and very early 90s and, as a consequence, accept that English clubs and the national team will suffer in terms of success in the future because of that (we don't succeed as it is on an international level, we'd be miles behind if the clubs have to strip back all the sports science, technologies, facilities etc because they no longer have the money they used to).

Do I like it? Hell, no but unfortunately it's where we are now. It's waaay too late to put the genie back in the bottle now.

I don't care who supplies the stream but in an age where everything can be viewed all of the time (subscriptions permitting) why football is any different is crackers. They just need to think a bit harder and smarter.

[mickmillslovechild]

May 31, 2023 15:12:29 GMT skip said:

May 31, 2023 15:10:22 GMT mickmillslovechild said:

It's not that simple though is it?

If the clubs stream the games themselves, the Prem get no money from TV rights. If the Prem get no money from TV rights, the clubs will get a fraction of the money they now receive for where they finish in the league and nowhere near as much as they do now for their share of the TV rights.

Alternatively, if the Prem start a streaming service themselves, they won't make anything like what they do from the TV companies currently.

Whether we like it or not, the Prem is built on money and all the clubs in the Prem rely on the money they get from their finishing positions and their share of the TV rights. The only way to do what you're suggesting is if everyone accepts we start again, go back to how football was in the 80s and very early 90s and, as a consequence, accept that English clubs and the national team will suffer in terms of success in the future because of that (we don't succeed as it is on an international level, we'd be miles behind if the clubs have to strip back all the sports science, technologies, facilities etc because they no longer have the money they used to).

Do I like it? Hell, no but unfortunately it's where we are now. It's waaay too late to put the genie back in the bottle now.

I don't care who supplies the stream but in an age where everything can be viewed all of the time (subscriptions permitting) why football is any different is crackers. They just need to think a bit harder and smarter.

Anything can be streamed online....most services that offer online streaming though, don't do it for free (Netflix, Amazon, Hulu, etc you pay for their services).

If they do that, there isn't a chance in the world that they'd make as much money from individuals signing up for a match a time as they do from Sky, who'll pay hundreds of millions for the whole package and then show it (as well as their other channels/services you pay for) all around the globe.

That's what you have to remember, people aren't just paying Sky for one match a week (which is all the majority of individuals would do if the Prem did it themselves), they get access to many other channels and shitloads of other games too. If Sky said "Pay me a tenner a week and all you'll get it the Stoke game, no other Sky channels and no other games at all" no-one would be with them. Unless you get someone else (the clubs or the Prem, depending on who offers the stream) to offer a whole entertainment package, which would either mean a far higher fee to cover it or them having to make a loss, then it's never going to happen.

What I'm saying is, you can't say "It's really that simple" when you haven't looked at whether it's actually financially feasible for the businesses in the first place, and that's what they (including the clubs) all are; businesses. They're there to make money. If they don't make money, the club collapses.

P.S. I'm not disagreeing with the principle of where you're coming from and I personally would love it if we did go back to the days where money wasn't the be all and end all, as it is now. Simply pointing out that when the current system has been going on for 30years, it really ISN'T that simple to just change it completely now.