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Post by knype on Jun 1, 2022 6:02:18 GMT
I still think it is odd that Stade de France has been open for a quarter of a century now and nothing has gone wrong until the weekend. I was in the stadium only 8 short weeks ago for the climax of the 6-nations rugby where France beat England and it could have sold out 100 times over and it all worked like clockwork. It will work fine for the rugby World Cup in 2023 and for the Olympic Games the year after that. So is the difference the police reaction to english football fans or the presence of ungodly numbers of dickheads without tickets hoping to wing it? My guess is both, but I have zero evidence of that, only the fact that I walk around with my eyes open and I know what goes down. Its definitely the police reaction to English football fans, this has been backed up by Real Madrid fans
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Post by JoeinOz on Jun 1, 2022 6:05:00 GMT
I still think it is odd that Stade de France has been open for a quarter of a century now and nothing has gone wrong until the weekend. I was in the stadium only 8 short weeks ago for the climax of the 6-nations rugby where France beat England and it could have sold out 100 times over and it all worked like clockwork. It will work fine for the rugby World Cup in 2023 and for the Olympic Games the year after that. So is the difference the police reaction to english football fans or the presence of ungodly numbers of dickheads without tickets hoping to wing it? My guess is both, but I have zero evidence of that, only the fact that I walk around with my eyes open and I know what goes down. OK, you explain then....what's the difference between Paris in 2022 and Madrid in 2019? Or Kyiv in 2018. Or Basel in 2016 for that matter.
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Post by Davef on Jun 1, 2022 6:10:03 GMT
Another first hand account of Saturday night for some of you to completely ignore...
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Post by lordb on Jun 1, 2022 7:23:40 GMT
I still think it is odd that Stade de France has been open for a quarter of a century now and nothing has gone wrong until the weekend. I was in the stadium only 8 short weeks ago for the climax of the 6-nations rugby where France beat England and it could have sold out 100 times over and it all worked like clockwork. It will work fine for the rugby World Cup in 2023 and for the Olympic Games the year after that. So is the difference the police reaction to english football fans or the presence of ungodly numbers of dickheads without tickets hoping to wing it? My guess is both, but I have zero evidence of that, only the fact that I walk around with my eyes open and I know what goes down. Its definitely the police reaction to English football fans, this has been backed up by Real Madrid fans And has been seen over and over again Some kind of problem? Quick get the tear has out!
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Post by leesandfordstoupe on Jun 1, 2022 8:12:37 GMT
Not so much Liverpool fans as Scousers generally. Having dealt with people from most parts of the country and overseas in my experience they've a tendency to be a massive pain in the arse. It's not PC but comes from real life experience so I won't apologise for it I’ve kept off this thread until now firstly because of the inevitable spewing out of bile from some quarters towards Liverpool fans and indeed people from my region in general…. to those who’ve posted in a more balanced manner or with true context I send my genuine thanks Secondly because my own feelings and emotions are at present all over the place , having cared for and seen my mum pass away on Monday after 4 plus years of dementia including the last 9 long months of pallative care when back in September I was informed she had just days not weeks and certainly not months to live…I include that not for sympathy or empathy but for context if my aghast might be OTT and why my reactions might be defensive in the extreme. However , I find the above post as one of the most offensive posts I’ve EVER read on this board .. I’m not looking for nor seeking an apology ..I wouldn’t accept one even if one was offered .your expressed views Sir or Madame are that offensive. im not perfect , far from it , the same is true of the vast majority of Scousers , but I like to think I and we are not so dissimilar from many millions if not billions of other people on this planet.. ..we really don’t grow two heads or anything once past junction 6 on the M62. In life and my travels I’ve met and dealt with all kinds of people , they’ve come from the entire range of social , educational , monetary , religious and academic demographics. Including people from all kinds of backgrounds who’ve tried to kill me ( literally ) to people who saved my life ( literally ) from people who’ve tried to rob me to people who’ve shared with me their riches be it in pure monetary terms or the unmeasurable but even more valuable quality of time , knowledge and friendship. in life I’ve always treated and seen , or at least tried , to see people as individuals , not least when it comes to throwing insults As I say my emotions are an absolute mess at present but I’m as saddened as I’ve ever been to read such an attack in purely general terms by the above post Gutted Sorry for your loss. I’m not perfect either in fact I probably demonstrate most of the behaviours I associate with many of the Scousers it’s not been my pleasure to have to deal with down the years. Trappy, confrontational, anti authority, non conformist, just a right pain in the arse to deal with. To believe that isn’t quite a widely held view of the person/people on the other end of it is to be in denial. You could name any other town or city in the country but no other would make collective hearts sink like hearing the words “we’re getting a bus load of scousers in”. So from one pain in the arse to a city characterised by them you just need to wear it, people would rather deal with someone else.
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Post by Gods on Jun 1, 2022 8:27:22 GMT
I’ve kept off this thread until now firstly because of the inevitable spewing out of bile from some quarters towards Liverpool fans and indeed people from my region in general…. to those who’ve posted in a more balanced manner or with true context I send my genuine thanks Secondly because my own feelings and emotions are at present all over the place , having cared for and seen my mum pass away on Monday after 4 plus years of dementia including the last 9 long months of pallative care when back in September I was informed she had just days not weeks and certainly not months to live…I include that not for sympathy or empathy but for context if my aghast might be OTT and why my reactions might be defensive in the extreme. However , I find the above post as one of the most offensive posts I’ve EVER read on this board .. I’m not looking for nor seeking an apology ..I wouldn’t accept one even if one was offered .your expressed views Sir or Madame are that offensive. im not perfect , far from it , the same is true of the vast majority of Scousers , but I like to think I and we are not so dissimilar from many millions if not billions of other people on this planet.. ..we really don’t grow two heads or anything once past junction 6 on the M62. In life and my travels I’ve met and dealt with all kinds of people , they’ve come from the entire range of social , educational , monetary , religious and academic demographics. Including people from all kinds of backgrounds who’ve tried to kill me ( literally ) to people who saved my life ( literally ) from people who’ve tried to rob me to people who’ve shared with me their riches be it in pure monetary terms or the unmeasurable but even more valuable quality of time , knowledge and friendship. in life I’ve always treated and seen , or at least tried , to see people as individuals , not least when it comes to throwing insults As I say my emotions are an absolute mess at present but I’m as saddened as I’ve ever been to read such an attack in purely general terms by the above post Gutted Sorry for your loss. I’m not perfect either in fact I probably demonstrate most of the behaviours I associate with many of the Scousers it’s not been my pleasure to have to deal with down the years. Trappy, confrontational, anti authority, non conformist, just a right pain in the arse to deal with. To believe that isn’t quite a widely held view of the person/people on the other end of it is to be in denial. You could name any other town or city in the country but no other would make collective hearts sink like hearing the words “we’re getting a bus load of scousers in”. So from one pain in the arse to a city characterised by them you just need to wear it, people would rather deal with someone else. I don't think I've ever heard those immortal words Not sure what I'd do if I did, a mixture of panic and fascination I think
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Post by werrington on Jun 1, 2022 8:31:57 GMT
Sorry for your loss. I’m not perfect either in fact I probably demonstrate most of the behaviours I associate with many of the Scousers it’s not been my pleasure to have to deal with down the years. Trappy, confrontational, anti authority, non conformist, just a right pain in the arse to deal with. To believe that isn’t quite a widely held view of the person/people on the other end of it is to be in denial. You could name any other town or city in the country but no other would make collective hearts sink like hearing the words “we’re getting a bus load of scousers in”. So from one pain in the arse to a city characterised by them you just need to wear it, people would rather deal with someone else. I don't think I've ever heard those immortal words Not sure what I'd do if I did, a mixture of panic and fascination I think Why? What if he’d said a bus load of blacks or Asians ….would you of found that funny also or would you have rightly found it offensive? Seriously what’s with the laughing imogy
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Post by Gods on Jun 1, 2022 8:40:15 GMT
I don't think I've ever heard those immortal words Not sure what I'd do if I did, a mixture of panic and fascination I think Why? What if he’d said a bus load of blacks or Asians ….would you of found that funny also or would you have rightly found it offensive? Seriously what’s with the laughing imogy Lighten up, it was a joke.
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Post by leesandfordstoupe on Jun 1, 2022 8:40:19 GMT
I don't think I've ever heard those immortal words Not sure what I'd do if I did, a mixture of panic and fascination I think Why? What if he’d said a bus load of blacks or Asians ….would you of found that funny also or would you have rightly found it offensive? Seriously what’s with the laughing imogy I’m not sure why you’d find any of them offensive, anyone who claims to have no prejudice is a liar. Prejudice isn’t illegal discrimination is. Understanding your prejudice is more likely to help you avoid discrimination not less, especially in a situation where you know your actions are likely to be scrutinised.
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Post by spitthedog on Jun 1, 2022 9:40:08 GMT
I’ve kept off this thread until now firstly because of the inevitable spewing out of bile from some quarters towards Liverpool fans and indeed people from my region in general…. to those who’ve posted in a more balanced manner or with true context I send my genuine thanks Secondly because my own feelings and emotions are at present all over the place , having cared for and seen my mum pass away on Monday after 4 plus years of dementia including the last 9 long months of pallative care when back in September I was informed she had just days not weeks and certainly not months to live…I include that not for sympathy or empathy but for context if my aghast might be OTT and why my reactions might be defensive in the extreme. However , I find the above post as one of the most offensive posts I’ve EVER read on this board .. I’m not looking for nor seeking an apology ..I wouldn’t accept one even if one was offered .your expressed views Sir or Madame are that offensive. im not perfect , far from it , the same is true of the vast majority of Scousers , but I like to think I and we are not so dissimilar from many millions if not billions of other people on this planet.. ..we really don’t grow two heads or anything once past junction 6 on the M62. In life and my travels I’ve met and dealt with all kinds of people , they’ve come from the entire range of social , educational , monetary , religious and academic demographics. Including people from all kinds of backgrounds who’ve tried to kill me ( literally ) to people who saved my life ( literally ) from people who’ve tried to rob me to people who’ve shared with me their riches be it in pure monetary terms or the unmeasurable but even more valuable quality of time , knowledge and friendship. in life I’ve always treated and seen , or at least tried , to see people as individuals , not least when it comes to throwing insults As I say my emotions are an absolute mess at present but I’m as saddened as I’ve ever been to read such an attack in purely general terms by the above post Gutted Sorry for your loss. I’m not perfect either in fact I probably demonstrate most of the behaviours I associate with many of the Scousers it’s not been my pleasure to have to deal with down the years. Trappy, confrontational, anti authority, non conformist, just a right pain in the arse to deal with. To believe that isn’t quite a widely held view of the person/people on the other end of it is to be in denial. You could name any other town or city in the country but no other would make collective hearts sink like hearing the words “we’re getting a bus load of scousers in”. So from one pain in the arse to a city characterised by them you just need to wear it, people would rather deal with someone else. 'people would rather deal with someone else' Who are these people?....it seems just you who has got this issue here, please don't include me in that because my experience is quite different. I interacted with two people from Liverpool at work yesterday and lo and behold they demonstrated none of the above. I have also worked in Liverpool and Stoke and I know which one was the better experience for me. The difference could be that I tend not to assume everyone else is like the person or persons I happen to meet.
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Post by leesandfordstoupe on Jun 1, 2022 9:52:33 GMT
Sorry for your loss. I’m not perfect either in fact I probably demonstrate most of the behaviours I associate with many of the Scousers it’s not been my pleasure to have to deal with down the years. Trappy, confrontational, anti authority, non conformist, just a right pain in the arse to deal with. To believe that isn’t quite a widely held view of the person/people on the other end of it is to be in denial. You could name any other town or city in the country but no other would make collective hearts sink like hearing the words “we’re getting a bus load of scousers in”. So from one pain in the arse to a city characterised by them you just need to wear it, people would rather deal with someone else. 'people would rather deal with someone else' Who are these people?....it seems just you who has got this issue here, please don't include me in that because my experience is quite different. I interacted with two people from Liverpool at work yesterday and lo and behold they demonstrated none of the above. I have also worked in Liverpool and Stoke and I know which one was the better experience for me. The difference could be that I tend not to assume everyone else is like the person or persons I happen to meet. These people are people in public service from my experience. People who outside of Liverpool are probably more used to dealing with Scousers than the general population. People with no axe to grind with Liverpool whatsoever who'd probably rather deal with people from just about anywhere else. Your having good life experiences of dealing with Scousers fuels your opinion just as theirs does their own.
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Post by werrington on Jun 1, 2022 10:05:33 GMT
The most noticeable thing is nearly all of the original posters who couldn’t wait to jump on this thread with their predetermined bollocks have all now fucked off as there wishful events of Saturday night have been shown up for what they are
Sad really that they’ve slinked off without so much as “fuck me i got that wrong” but they’ll be back just awaiting the next time
Pathetic and embarrassing
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Post by spitthedog on Jun 1, 2022 10:16:15 GMT
'people would rather deal with someone else' Who are these people?....it seems just you who has got this issue here, please don't include me in that because my experience is quite different. I interacted with two people from Liverpool at work yesterday and lo and behold they demonstrated none of the above. I have also worked in Liverpool and Stoke and I know which one was the better experience for me. The difference could be that I tend not to assume everyone else is like the person or persons I happen to meet. These people are people in public service from my experience. People who outside of Liverpool are probably more used to dealing with Scousers than the general population. People with no axe to grind with Liverpool whatsoever who'd probably rather deal with people from just about anywhere else. Your having good life experiences of dealing with Scousers fuels your opinion just as theirs does their own. I don't have an opinion as such, I just take people on their face value. I don't feel any compulsion to generalise about populations tbh. My only opinion is that making generalisations about groups based on limited random experiences of people is of no value to anybody. The last few interactions Ive had with people who happen to be from Stoke have been quite negative, and some of them quite disturbing, but I don't feel any need to go around slagging off people from Stoke, or making out they are all bad.
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Post by leesandfordstoupe on Jun 1, 2022 10:20:58 GMT
The most noticeable thing is nearly all of the original posters who couldn’t wait to jump on this thread with their predetermined bollocks have all now fucked off as there wishful events of Saturday night have been shown up for what they are Sad really that they’ve slinked off without so much as “fuck me i got that wrong” but they’ll be back just awaiting the next time Pathetic and embarrassing Of course they will because until Scousers do something to change their perspective of Scousers and football fans do something to change the perspective of football fans nothing much changes.
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Post by leesandfordstoupe on Jun 1, 2022 10:25:31 GMT
These people are people in public service from my experience. People who outside of Liverpool are probably more used to dealing with Scousers than the general population. People with no axe to grind with Liverpool whatsoever who'd probably rather deal with people from just about anywhere else. Your having good life experiences of dealing with Scousers fuels your opinion just as theirs does their own. I don't have an opinion as such, I just take people on their face value. I don't feel any compulsion to generalise about populations tbh. My only opinion is that making generalisations about groups based on limited random experiences of people is of no value to anybody. The last few interactions Ive had with people who happen to be from Stoke have been quite negative, and some of them quite disturbing, but I don't feel any need to go around slagging off people from Stoke, or making out they are all bad. OK then normal people who can admit to themselves even if not openly that they have prejudices, burying them is what's negative talking about them definitely isn't.
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Post by knype on Jun 1, 2022 10:27:37 GMT
The most noticeable thing is nearly all of the original posters who couldn’t wait to jump on this thread with their predetermined bollocks have all now fucked off as there wishful events of Saturday night have been shown up for what they are Sad really that they’ve slinked off without so much as “fuck me i got that wrong” but they’ll be back just awaiting the next time Pathetic and embarrassing Of course they will because until Scousers do something to change their perspective of Scousers and football fans do something to change the perspective of football fans nothing much changes. This isn't about the perspective of "Scousers" though is it, its the perception of English football fans abroad. You obviously have a bee in your bonnet about scousers, most of the ones I have met have been no different aside from their accents than Mancs, Brummies or Stokies
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Post by alsagerstokie on Jun 1, 2022 10:39:06 GMT
As the chap who started the thread i stick by it. I gave my best wishes to Liverpool on Sat.
The City is a great city. Every area has its problems. I live in Alsager we have our issues in certain areas but this isn't about Liverpool in general. Its about the way things were handled.
Some of the posts I see on here on a general basis do puzzle me. Almost hatred towards Liverpool mind you i bet you may find some posters who would find an argument to dislike Forest Green or Oxford. In the past I've seen "hope the scousers are crying tonight". "Cant stand them" "Klopps a prick" etc. Have you ever met him. Id guess no so how do you make that conclusion.
Don't get me wrong in my opinion its great when United Loose and the current situation they are in makes me laugh. However i wouldn't personally chuck loads of abuse at them. Calling them every name under the sun. Not the way i do things.
Yes every team with have a minority of supporters who think its ok to be a prick especially through drink or drugs. Not for me personally.
Clearly the authorities in Paris fucked up and as I've stated should have a period where they are not allowed to host another sporting event.
Apart from the odd few who may have acted like an idiot. Most on Sat night should not have been treated that way.
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Post by leesandfordstoupe on Jun 1, 2022 10:47:13 GMT
Of course they will because until Scousers do something to change their perspective of Scousers and football fans do something to change the perspective of football fans nothing much changes. This isn't about the perspective of "Scousers" though is it, its the perception of English football fans abroad. You obviously have a bee in your bonnet about scousers, most of the ones I have met have been no different aside from their accents than Mancs, Brummies or Stokies There are fairly widely held negative perceptions of English football fans both abroad and at home and not without reason. I don't have a bee in my bonnet about Scousers at all, I'm just open enough to admit I have a generalised negative perspective of them. Just like Mancs, Brummies, Scousers, Stokies have generalised perspectives of one another. I really don't get all faux offended if I hear a term like "Stokie bagheads" TSB's (thick Stokie bastards etc), even people from different parts of Stoke apply generalised perspectives to one another. Get over it.
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Post by lordb on Jun 1, 2022 11:22:43 GMT
The most noticeable thing is nearly all of the original posters who couldn’t wait to jump on this thread with their predetermined bollocks have all now fucked off as there wishful events of Saturday night have been shown up for what they are Sad really that they’ve slinked off without so much as “fuck me i got that wrong” but they’ll be back just awaiting the next time Pathetic and embarrassing & damaging football fans getting shit on should be a concern for all of us
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Post by tommycarlsberg on Jun 1, 2022 11:25:21 GMT
'people would rather deal with someone else' Who are these people?....it seems just you who has got this issue here, please don't include me in that because my experience is quite different. I interacted with two people from Liverpool at work yesterday and lo and behold they demonstrated none of the above. I have also worked in Liverpool and Stoke and I know which one was the better experience for me. The difference could be that I tend not to assume everyone else is like the person or persons I happen to meet. These people are people in public service from my experience. People who outside of Liverpool are probably more used to dealing with Scousers than the general population. People with no axe to grind with Liverpool whatsoever who'd probably rather deal with people from just about anywhere else. Your having good life experiences of dealing with Scousers fuels your opinion just as theirs does their own. Never read such bollox in my life. You really need to stop posting. You seem to be confusing challenging your own prejudices and justifying them, you need to do more of the former.
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Post by prestwichpotter on Jun 1, 2022 11:26:16 GMT
The most noticeable thing is nearly all of the original posters who couldn’t wait to jump on this thread with their predetermined bollocks have all now fucked off as there wishful events of Saturday night have been shown up for what they are Sad really that they’ve slinked off without so much as “fuck me i got that wrong” but they’ll be back just awaiting the next time Pathetic and embarrassing Of course they will because until Scousers do something to change their perspective of Scousers and football fans do something to change the perspective of football fans nothing much changes. Scousers don't need to do anything, it's your hang up not theirs.........
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Post by leesandfordstoupe on Jun 1, 2022 11:29:00 GMT
These people are people in public service from my experience. People who outside of Liverpool are probably more used to dealing with Scousers than the general population. People with no axe to grind with Liverpool whatsoever who'd probably rather deal with people from just about anywhere else. Your having good life experiences of dealing with Scousers fuels your opinion just as theirs does their own. Never read such bollox in my life. You really need to stop posting. You seem to be confusing challenging your own prejudices and justifying them, you need to more of the former. You challenge them by accepting they exist and not acting them out into discrimination. Justifying them is simply something I have no need to do whatsoever. Maybe you need to stop reading because I've no intention of not posting on your advice.
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Post by leesandfordstoupe on Jun 1, 2022 11:31:29 GMT
Of course they will because until Scousers do something to change their perspective of Scousers and football fans do something to change the perspective of football fans nothing much changes. Scousers don't need to do anything, it's your hang up not theirs......... Then perceptions of them won't change. They're not claiming I've done something to them so my perception of them is fairly irrelevant.
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Post by noustie on Jun 1, 2022 12:05:24 GMT
That's why this is so clearly the fault of authorities. Everyone has the same account of the incidents. Journalists and supporters of both teams And I think some people's dislike of the Liverpool team is playing a part in their viewpoint. It isn't about dangerous disorganisation for some. It's about Alan Hansen kicking Ian Painter in 1983 or something. Indeed Joe, it's classic confirmation bias, they're eager to hang this on the Liverpool fans because it fits with their already established prejudices. This mindless tribalism and rampant desire to believe lies over clear facts will result, at some point, in another football stadium disaster, and next time it could be any one of us. This desire to believe lies and protect the guilty, then to heap the blame onto the victims is a recipe for disaster. It plays into the hands of the incompetent and the corrupt, and it leads to yet more complacency. We all know where that eventually leads. This willingness to believe only the lies, whilst discarding the truth because it doesn't fit the prejudice simply enables the incompetent to get away with it, and this will come at great cost at some point further down the line. One day, it might very well be us or our loved ones caught up in a terrible disaster, and we'll wonder why it was ever allowed to happen.
Without hint of irony you’re right that the thread is absolutely riddled with confirmation bias and it goes beyond merely tainting Liverpool fans – there’s loads of old skool favourites in here: working class vs authority; football fans vs authority; UEFA couldn’t run a bath and; obviously the good old England vs French historical xenophobia steeped in historical conflict with a presumption there isn’t similar beef between France and Spain steeped in the same (there is but not to the same extent). My own confirmation bias doesn’t come from any prejudice towards Liverpool – if the Scotland game tonight arguably the biggest game at Hampden this century, which is suffering from transport fuck ups, police Scotland being a shambles and automatic ticket gates that have seriously struggled in the past, turns into something similarly dangerous with accusations of fake tickets and fans bobbing in within that then my view will remain unchanged in fans having to take some sort of accountability. The level of which is to be ascertained within follow-up investigations likely to ensue and is consistent with what I’ve said throughout. Where my bias does come from though is from my field, qualified/ chartered so written at length on stuff like this and involved in surveys all the time on risk management procedures so stuff like this floats my boat. Following an incident or near miss there’s usually a scramble for improvement with the focus usually always on changing the controls in the erroneous belief that is what is required to avoid a repeat moving forward. Altering the controls alone may prove insufficient though if the culture that caused the need for the controls in the first place remains unchanged – someone lops a finger off for example an upgrade on the guard alone isn’t going to avoid a repeat of a similar incident if the management culture in the background isn’t improved. Unless there is a top down review from authority like UEFA and police following both Wembley and the CL final (eg: ease of forging tickets; outer perimeters to weed out ticketless/ leathered fans; etc) plus a bottom up approach of fans controlling their own behaviours (not getting coked off their tits; buying tickets unofficially; turning up at the ground ticketless; being absolutely steamboats (there will be loads tonight); etc then it continues to be an accident waiting to happen. We can argue all day whether it’s more top down than bottom up or vice versa but it definitely isn’t one way traffic. However, it won’t be the authorities who suffer the consequences if tragedy does follow so it seems counterproductive to me to approach these things with any form of myopia. I extend that to the media singing from the same hymn sheet – common practice up here with Old Firm hacks comparing notes and acting like a cabal.
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Post by prestwichpotter on Jun 1, 2022 12:07:33 GMT
That's why this is so clearly the fault of authorities. Everyone has the same account of the incidents. Journalists and supporters of both teams And I think some people's dislike of the Liverpool team is playing a part in their viewpoint. It isn't about dangerous disorganisation for some. It's about Alan Hansen kicking Ian Painter in 1983 or something.
Indeed Joe, it's classic confirmation bias, they're eager to hang this on the Liverpool fans because it fits with their already established prejudices.
This mindless tribalism and rampant desire to believe lies over clear facts will result, at some point, in another football stadium disaster, and next time it could be any one of us.
This desire to believe lies and protect the guilty, then to heap the blame onto the victims is a recipe for disaster. It plays into the hands of the incompetent and the corrupt, and it leads to yet more complacency. We all know where that eventually leads.
This willingness to believe only the lies, whilst discarding the truth because it doesn't fit the prejudice simply enables the incompetent to get away with it, and this will come at great cost at some point further down the line. One day, it might very well be us or our loved ones caught up in a terrible disaster, and we'll wonder why it was ever allowed to happen.
On a separate note good to see you back posting Paul........
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Post by thevoid on Jun 1, 2022 13:49:19 GMT
This isn't about the perspective of "Scousers" though is it, its the perception of English football fans abroad. You obviously have a bee in your bonnet about scousers, most of the ones I have met have been no different aside from their accents than Mancs, Brummies or Stokies There are fairly widely held negative perceptions of English football fans both abroad and at home and not without reason. I don't have a bee in my bonnet about Scousers at all, I'm just open enough to admit I have a generalised negative perspective of them. Just like Mancs, Brummies, Scousers, Stokies have generalised perspectives of one another. I really don't get all faux offended if I hear a term like "Stokie bagheads" TSB's (thick Stokie bastards etc), even people from different parts of Stoke apply generalised perspectives to one another. Get over it. I've always found the locals to be friendly whenever I've visited Liverpool - a lot friendlier than Mancs. Smile as they walk past, that sort of thing. Which is a bit weird as I prefer MCR as a city. I do envy their sense of civic pride too- I guess having a top class football team and music culture helps.
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Post by alsagerstokie on Jun 1, 2022 13:51:33 GMT
There are fairly widely held negative perceptions of English football fans both abroad and at home and not without reason. I don't have a bee in my bonnet about Scousers at all, I'm just open enough to admit I have a generalised negative perspective of them. Just like Mancs, Brummies, Scousers, Stokies have generalised perspectives of one another. I really don't get all faux offended if I hear a term like "Stokie bagheads" TSB's (thick Stokie bastards etc), even people from different parts of Stoke apply generalised perspectives to one another. Get over it. I've always found the locals to be friendly whenever I've visited Liverpool - a lot friendlier than Mancs. Smile as they walk past, that sort of thing. Which is a bit weird as I prefer MCR as a city. I do envy their sense of civic pride too- I guess having a top class football team and music culture helps. I prefer Liverpool as a city weather its because of the Docks the music scene (Like going the Cavern) MCR is ok plenty to do. Just think there is more character in Liverpool.
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Post by richardparker on Jun 1, 2022 14:15:39 GMT
I’ve kept off this thread until now firstly because of the inevitable spewing out of bile from some quarters towards Liverpool fans and indeed people from my region in general…. to those who’ve posted in a more balanced manner or with true context I send my genuine thanks Secondly because my own feelings and emotions are at present all over the place , having cared for and seen my mum pass away on Monday after 4 plus years of dementia including the last 9 long months of pallative care when back in September I was informed she had just days not weeks and certainly not months to live…I include that not for sympathy or empathy but for context if my aghast might be OTT and why my reactions might be defensive in the extreme. However , I find the above post as one of the most offensive posts I’ve EVER read on this board .. I’m not looking for nor seeking an apology ..I wouldn’t accept one even if one was offered .your expressed views Sir or Madame are that offensive. im not perfect , far from it , the same is true of the vast majority of Scousers , but I like to think I and we are not so dissimilar from many millions if not billions of other people on this planet.. ..we really don’t grow two heads or anything once past junction 6 on the M62. In life and my travels I’ve met and dealt with all kinds of people , they’ve come from the entire range of social , educational , monetary , religious and academic demographics. Including people from all kinds of backgrounds who’ve tried to kill me ( literally ) to people who saved my life ( literally ) from people who’ve tried to rob me to people who’ve shared with me their riches be it in pure monetary terms or the unmeasurable but even more valuable quality of time , knowledge and friendship. in life I’ve always treated and seen , or at least tried , to see people as individuals , not least when it comes to throwing insults As I say my emotions are an absolute mess at present but I’m as saddened as I’ve ever been to read such an attack in purely general terms by the above post Gutted Sorry for your loss. I’m not perfect either in fact I probably demonstrate most of the behaviours I associate with many of the Scousers it’s not been my pleasure to have to deal with down the years. Trappy, confrontational, anti authority, non conformist, just a right pain in the arse to deal with. To believe that isn’t quite a widely held view of the person/people on the other end of it is to be in denial. You could name any other town or city in the country but no other would make collective hearts sink like hearing the words “we’re getting a bus load of scousers in”. So from one pain in the arse to a city characterised by them you just need to wear it, people would rather deal with someone else. Anyone remember Woodbine Wrightwat ('The Voice of Reason') in The Oatcake, or Woodrow Wyatt (in The News Of The World, from the 1970s)!? ... It's perfectly OK to stereotype a few hundred thousand people because he said so. And yet he'd jump out of his skin if you made any generalisations and assumptions about his personality, traits and locality.
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Post by leesandfordstoupe on Jun 1, 2022 14:38:19 GMT
Sorry for your loss. I’m not perfect either in fact I probably demonstrate most of the behaviours I associate with many of the Scousers it’s not been my pleasure to have to deal with down the years. Trappy, confrontational, anti authority, non conformist, just a right pain in the arse to deal with. To believe that isn’t quite a widely held view of the person/people on the other end of it is to be in denial. You could name any other town or city in the country but no other would make collective hearts sink like hearing the words “we’re getting a bus load of scousers in”. So from one pain in the arse to a city characterised by them you just need to wear it, people would rather deal with someone else. Anyone remember Woodrow Wrightwat ('The Voice of Reason'), or Woodrow Wyatt (in The News Of The World, from the 1970s)!? ... It's perfectly OK to stereotype a few hundred thousand people because he said so. And yet he'd jump out of his skin if you made any assumptions about his personality and traits. No never heard of him. Sounds like a hypocrite.
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Post by richardparker on Jun 1, 2022 14:45:40 GMT
Anyone remember Woodrow Wrightwat ('The Voice of Reason'), or Woodrow Wyatt (in The News Of The World, from the 1970s)!? ... It's perfectly OK to stereotype a few hundred thousand people because he said so. And yet he'd jump out of his skin if you made any assumptions about his personality and traits. No never heard of him. Sounds like a hypocrite. They were both right hypocritical twats! (The former smoked Woodbines too).
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