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Post by foghornsgleghorn on Jun 27, 2022 16:48:52 GMT
And privatisation has had a big part to play in UK driver salaries being the highest. A combination of unions picking off the companies one at-a-time, and multiple short-term franchises, winning the bids by promising high frequency services finding themselves in need of lots of drivers. Training drivers in the UK being a lengthy and expensive process it was easier for operator A to pay more to attract operator B's drivers away. www.traindriver.org/uk-trains-news-roundup/#
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Post by partickpotter on Jul 11, 2022 17:11:18 GMT
Seems the train drivers strike in Scotland has been resolved while ASLEF are now calling their members out on strike in England.
You might recall these are the highly paid people folk were “confusing” with the RMT folk whose dispute is still rumbling on.
Anyway, worth noting that the pay deal ASLEF accepting Scotland is 5% - which may surprise you. I suspect the deal was secured by the promise of no compulsory redundancies for the next five years. Which is an extraordinary offer bearing in mind how few trains are running just now competed to pre-pandemic.
I guess this is the benefit of being nationalised - over staffing ain’t a problem when the government is picking up the tab on behalf of us tax payers.
Be interesting to see how the private companies handle this in England. I suspect, massive over staffing might be more of an issue.
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Post by foghornsgleghorn on Jul 11, 2022 18:47:01 GMT
Seems the train drivers strike in Scotland has been resolved while ASLEF are now calling their members out on strike in England. You might recall these are the highly paid people folk were “confusing” with the RMT folk whose dispute is still rumbling on. Anyway, worth noting that the pay deal ASLEF accepting Scotland is 5% - which may surprise you. I suspect the deal was secured by the promise of no compulsory redundancies for the next five years. Which is an extraordinary offer bearing in mind how few trains are running just now competed to pre-pandemic. I guess this is the benefit of being nationalised - over staffing ain’t a problem when the government is picking up the tab on behalf of us tax payers. Be interesting to see how the private companies handle this in England. I suspect, massive over staffing might be more of an issue. The main reason the number of trains running in Scotland has been reduced is a shortage of drivers (mainly due to the dispute with drivers refusing to work rest days etc). In mid-May UK passenger numbers hit 90% of 2019 levels , which suggests the narrative being trotted out about massive reductions in passenger numbers does not reflect the recovery post-covid which was being seen before the latest strikes. As for the private companies in England, from personal experience a few weeks back both the outbound and return Transpennine Express services between Berwick and Waverley we had intended to take were cancelled due to driver shortages, and you frequently hear of cancellations due to driver shortages in many areas . I doubt there are many companies overstaffed with drivers.
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Post by partickpotter on Jul 11, 2022 20:48:35 GMT
Seems the train drivers strike in Scotland has been resolved while ASLEF are now calling their members out on strike in England. You might recall these are the highly paid people folk were “confusing” with the RMT folk whose dispute is still rumbling on. Anyway, worth noting that the pay deal ASLEF accepting Scotland is 5% - which may surprise you. I suspect the deal was secured by the promise of no compulsory redundancies for the next five years. Which is an extraordinary offer bearing in mind how few trains are running just now competed to pre-pandemic. I guess this is the benefit of being nationalised - over staffing ain’t a problem when the government is picking up the tab on behalf of us tax payers. Be interesting to see how the private companies handle this in England. I suspect, massive over staffing might be more of an issue. The main reason the number of trains running in Scotland has been reduced is a shortage of drivers (mainly due to the dispute with drivers refusing to work rest days etc). In mid-May UK passenger numbers hit 90% of 2019 levels , which suggests the narrative being trotted out about massive reductions in passenger numbers does not reflect the recovery post-covid which was being seen before the latest strikes. As for the private companies in England, from personal experience a few weeks back both the outbound and return Transpennine Express services between Berwick and Waverley we had intended to take were cancelled due to driver shortages, and you frequently hear of cancellations due to driver shortages in many areas . I doubt there are many companies overstaffed with drivers. Passenger numbers at 90% is incredibly high. Any chance you could share a link for that info. I couldn’t find anything like that. The latest data I could find only goes to end March in an article published last month ( link) that has Scotrail at 50%, which sounds more likely noting how few people have resumed office work. My place, for example, has most folk working from home - 80+% min..
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Post by prestwichpotter on Jul 11, 2022 21:17:52 GMT
The main reason the number of trains running in Scotland has been reduced is a shortage of drivers (mainly due to the dispute with drivers refusing to work rest days etc). In mid-May UK passenger numbers hit 90% of 2019 levels , which suggests the narrative being trotted out about massive reductions in passenger numbers does not reflect the recovery post-covid which was being seen before the latest strikes. As for the private companies in England, from personal experience a few weeks back both the outbound and return Transpennine Express services between Berwick and Waverley we had intended to take were cancelled due to driver shortages, and you frequently hear of cancellations due to driver shortages in many areas . I doubt there are many companies overstaffed with drivers. Passenger numbers at 90% is incredibly high. Any chance you could share a link for that info. I couldn’t find anything like that. The latest data I could find only goes to end March in an article published last month ( link) that has Scotrail at 50%, which sounds more likely noting how few people have resumed office work. My place, for example, has most folk working from home - 80+% min.. The week of May 16th - 22nd saw 90% of pre-Covid activity across the UK, not seen any data since then...... Passenger data w/c May 16th
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Post by foghornsgleghorn on Jul 11, 2022 21:29:02 GMT
The main reason the number of trains running in Scotland has been reduced is a shortage of drivers (mainly due to the dispute with drivers refusing to work rest days etc). In mid-May UK passenger numbers hit 90% of 2019 levels , which suggests the narrative being trotted out about massive reductions in passenger numbers does not reflect the recovery post-covid which was being seen before the latest strikes. As for the private companies in England, from personal experience a few weeks back both the outbound and return Transpennine Express services between Berwick and Waverley we had intended to take were cancelled due to driver shortages, and you frequently hear of cancellations due to driver shortages in many areas . I doubt there are many companies overstaffed with drivers. Passenger numbers at 90% is incredibly high. Any chance you could share a link for that info. I couldn’t find anything like that. The latest data I could find only goes to end March in an article published last month ( link) that has Scotrail at 50%, which sounds more likely noting how few people have resumed office work. My place, for example, has most folk working from home - 80+% min.. Edit- deleted as prestwich has posted a better link. Much of the recovery is in leisure travel, rather than work-related.
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Post by partickpotter on Jul 12, 2022 6:33:25 GMT
Passenger numbers at 90% is incredibly high. Any chance you could share a link for that info. I couldn’t find anything like that. The latest data I could find only goes to end March in an article published last month ( link) that has Scotrail at 50%, which sounds more likely noting how few people have resumed office work. My place, for example, has most folk working from home - 80+% min.. Edit- deleted as prestwich has posted a better link. Much of the recovery is in leisure travel, rather than work-related. Thanks both for the link. I’m astonished - and don’t really believe that data, at least in so much as it applies to Scotland The reason is the busiest train service in Scotland is the Glasgow Edinburgh shuttle which used to run every 15 mins now runs half hourly. It used to be packed during commuter hours; on the dozen or so occasions I’ve used it recently it has been very quiet… at best 10% occupancy. The reason for this is obvious… city centre offices are also incredibly quiet. At my work there are half a dozen company offices which you can see as you take the elevator (I’m on the top floor). Those offices are the same as mine, very few people. I think you’re spot on regards leisure travel. People are back to normal in that regards, you only have to see the packed sports stadiums to see that. But I can’t see how that compensates for the collapse in commuter travel that I am witnessing. I do appreciate I’m making a mostly qualitative assessment, but even so, 90% levels is just incredible.
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Post by prestwichpotter on Jul 12, 2022 7:50:13 GMT
Edit- deleted as prestwich has posted a better link. Much of the recovery is in leisure travel, rather than work-related. Thanks both for the link. I’m astonished - and don’t really believe that data, at least in so much as it applies to Scotland The reason is the busiest train service in Scotland is the Glasgow Edinburgh shuttle which used to run every 15 mins now runs half hourly. It used to be packed during commuter hours; on the dozen or so occasions I’ve used it recently it has been very quiet… at best 10% occupancy. The reason for this is obvious… city centre offices are also incredibly quiet. At my work there are half a dozen company offices which you can see as you take the elevator (I’m on the top floor). Those offices are the same as mine, very few people. I think you’re spot on regards leisure travel. People are back to normal in that regards, you only have to see the packed sports stadiums to see that. But I can’t see how that compensates for the collapse in commuter travel that I am witnessing. I do appreciate I’m making a mostly qualitative assessment, but even so, 90% levels is just incredible. I’ll have to find the link but I read that long distance journeys such as Glasgow/Edinburgh to London and vice versa are up massively due to issues with the reliability of domestic flights and airport disruption……. (Sent whilst sat on a train ironically, and it’s really busy)
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Post by foghornsgleghorn on Jul 12, 2022 11:50:29 GMT
Edit- deleted as prestwich has posted a better link. Much of the recovery is in leisure travel, rather than work-related. Thanks both for the link. I’m astonished - and don’t really believe that data, at least in so much as it applies to Scotland The reason is the busiest train service in Scotland is the Glasgow Edinburgh shuttle which used to run every 15 mins now runs half hourly. It used to be packed during commuter hours; on the dozen or so occasions I’ve used it recently it has been very quiet… at best 10% occupancy. The reason for this is obvious… city centre offices are also incredibly quiet. At my work there are half a dozen company offices which you can see as you take the elevator (I’m on the top floor). Those offices are the same as mine, very few people. I think you’re spot on regards leisure travel. People are back to normal in that regards, you only have to see the packed sports stadiums to see that. But I can’t see how that compensates for the collapse in commuter travel that I am witnessing. I do appreciate I’m making a mostly qualitative assessment, but even so, 90% levels is just incredible. Agree that it doesn't appear as busy from what I've seen. Certainly revenue is way down on pre-pandemic due to the fall in season ticket sales. Most train fares haven't yet been fully impacted by this year's inflation, so I know people who are now using the train because it's cheaper than driving.
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Post by cobhamstokey on Jul 15, 2022 6:11:36 GMT
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Post by partickpotter on Jul 15, 2022 6:48:23 GMT
Not sure it will have much impact. Occasional one day strikes are more inconvenience to most folk than serious disruption. One that is substantially ameliorated by new wfh practices. The only time this type of things gains results is when the strike day coincides with some major event that it will harm severely. A case in point being COP26. There was a long standing Sunday rail strike for over a year that got nowhere. Suddenly, with a strike called to coincide with COP26, a settlement was quickly reached. Same thing happened with a long standing bin workers dispute with Glasgow council. I’m not sure there is an equivalent anytime soon that would cause similar angst prompting a rapid resolution.
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Post by cobhamstokey on Jul 15, 2022 7:24:39 GMT
Not sure it will have much impact. Occasional one day strikes are more inconvenience to most folk than serious disruption. One that is substantially ameliorated by new wfh practices. The only time this type of things gains results is when the strike day coincides with some major event that it will harm severely. A case in point being COP26. There was a long standing Sunday rail strike for over a year that got nowhere. Suddenly, with a strike called to coincide with COP26, a settlement was quickly reached. Same thing happened with a long standing bin workers dispute with Glasgow council. I’m not sure there is an equivalent anytime soon that would cause similar angst prompting a rapid resolution. and with more people working from home or being able to work from home it probably will just give people an excuse for a day in the sun.
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Post by Davef on Jul 15, 2022 9:08:47 GMT
Goooaarrn Eddie. Taking no shit from an entitled and probably overpaid presenter. What is it with these ignorant gits talking over their guests?
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Post by thewonderstuff on Jul 15, 2022 10:08:29 GMT
Goooaarrn Eddie. Taking no shit from an entitled and probably overpaid presenter. What is it with these ignorant gits talking over their guests? Eddie schooling MP's on the structural issues here and skewering the old 'times are tough, we're all in it together' line.
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Post by thewonderstuff on Jul 15, 2022 11:46:30 GMT
Join a Union
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Post by Rednwhitenblue on Aug 18, 2022 12:27:17 GMT
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Post by partickpotter on Aug 18, 2022 13:27:16 GMT
What’s an eye opener from this piece of union propaganda is one critical piece of missing information. That information is essential in judging whether we should be thanking them (the Germans, Dutch, French) or them thanking us. Do you know what that piece of information is?
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Post by Hereward the Wake ᛊᛏᛟᚲᛖ on Aug 18, 2022 16:23:05 GMT
Been a member of unite and unison . They were wank. Ill never join a union again
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Post by thewonderstuff on Aug 18, 2022 16:42:28 GMT
Been a member of unite and unison . They were wank. Ill never join a union again Heard it all before fella, until a boss shits on you, then it gets a bit mardy
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Post by Hereward the Wake ᛊᛏᛟᚲᛖ on Aug 18, 2022 17:08:26 GMT
Been a member of unite and unison . They were wank. Ill never join a union again Heard it all before fella, until a boss shits on you, then it gets a bit mardy Still shit
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Post by followyoudown on Aug 18, 2022 17:31:39 GMT
What’s an eye opener from this piece of union propaganda is one critical piece of missing information. That information is essential in judging whether we should be thanking them (the Germans, Dutch, French) or them thanking us. Do you know what that piece of information is? Propaganda that if it had come from the likes of Farage all those people saying how brilliant it is would be screaming racism, its 5 years old and also factually incorrect these franchises dont get net subsidies they pay significant franchise fees and also profit shares as well as track acess fees that alone make up 20%-40%+ of each companies costs. Having being a member of the TSSA union I can also only say I found them to be fucking useless on the two occasions I ever had need for them, first time they advised everyone to take voluntary redundancy offer which was a minimum £3k + 3 months salary, after speaking to the lead consultant he advised us not to take it as they didnt have the numbers and sure enough within 3 months it was 12 months salary, the second one was a dispute over a change to the token company wide bonus scheme. As for you information needed, I could only think of passenger number information to see how much of the profits was capacity rather than price.
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Post by thewonderstuff on Aug 18, 2022 17:48:21 GMT
Heard it all before fella, until a boss shits on you, then it gets a bit mardy Still shit Seriously, if you want to take on the hard right, union hating, workers rights hating, cabal about to take over on your own, the very best of luck to you! This country is about to find out exactly what deregulation means. Buy shares in workhouses and prepare to live in dosshouses and those with money are given the right to do whatever the fuck they want. Still you could still have a day out at the seaside to swim in some shit on your unpaid one day off a week!
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Post by Hereward the Wake ᛊᛏᛟᚲᛖ on Aug 18, 2022 17:50:41 GMT
Seriously, if you want to take on the hard right, union hating, workers rights hating, cabal about to take over on your own, the very best of luck to you! This country is about to find out exactly what deregulation means. Buy shares in workhouses and prepare to live in dosshouses and those with money are given the right to do whatever the fuck they want. Still you could still have a day out at the seaside to swim in some shit on your unpaid one day off a week! Still wank mate , absolutely useless and not worth the monthly dues.
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Post by partickpotter on Aug 18, 2022 17:53:05 GMT
What’s an eye opener from this piece of union propaganda is one critical piece of missing information. That information is essential in judging whether we should be thanking them (the Germans, Dutch, French) or them thanking us. Do you know what that piece of information is? Propaganda that if it had come from the likes of Farage all those people saying how brilliant it is would be screaming racism, its 5 years old and also factually incorrect these franchises dont get net subsidies they pay significant franchise fees and also profit shares as well as track acess fees that alone make up 20%-40%+ of each companies costs. Having being a member of the TSSA union I can also only say I found them to be fucking useless on the two occasions I ever had need for them, first time they advised everyone to take voluntary redundancy offer which was a minimum £3k + 3 months salary, after speaking to the lead consultant he advised us not to take it as they didnt have the numbers and sure enough within 3 months it was 12 months salary, the second one was a dispute over a change to the token company wide bonus scheme. As for you information needed, I could only think of passenger number information to see how much of the profits was capacity rather than price. Let’s see if redwhinenblue can figure out the missing crucial info. It could well be we are getting ripped off. We can’t tell from that video though.
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Post by thewonderstuff on Aug 18, 2022 17:53:22 GMT
Seriously, if you want to take on the hard right, union hating, workers rights hating, cabal about to take over on your own, the very best of luck to you! This country is about to find out exactly what deregulation means. Buy shares in workhouses and prepare to live in dosshouses and those with money are given the right to do whatever the fuck they want. Still you could still have a day out at the seaside to swim in some shit on your unpaid one day off a week! Still wank mate , absolutely useless and not worth the monthly dues. What have the unions ever done for us, eh?
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Post by Hereward the Wake ᛊᛏᛟᚲᛖ on Aug 18, 2022 18:14:04 GMT
Still wank mate , absolutely useless and not worth the monthly dues. What have the unions ever done for us, eh? Modern Unions...exactly 😀
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Post by ashleyscfc on Aug 18, 2022 22:07:29 GMT
Today sees a big day in the world of Rail; ScotRail goes back into public ownershipPredictably, the Tories don’t like the idea pointing out the omnishambles of current state owned transport endeavours like ferries and Prestwick Airport. The Unions on the other hand are very happy…as some bloke from Aslef says “The railway should be for the people, by the people.” I suspect most folk don’t much care for the political sound bites and point scoring but are interested in getting a decent service. We shall see over the coming years how well a public railway runs. Public, I’d rather know who I’m getting fucked by And it’s not a market. I want to get the 8:30 train into Manchester I don’t have a “choice” if I get it or not. There’s not 5 other 8:30 trains to choose from, there’s 1 and that’s it. It was stupid. It’s always been stupid. And us paying foreign countries run our railways is barmy. You don’t see British rail in France/Germany/Italy so why in gods name do they have a say in ours?
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Post by Hereward the Wake ᛊᛏᛟᚲᛖ on Aug 18, 2022 23:14:27 GMT
What’s an eye opener from this piece of union propaganda is one critical piece of missing information. That information is essential in judging whether we should be thanking them (the Germans, Dutch, French) or them thanking us. Do you know what that piece of information is? Tell us , I'd like to know
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Post by partickpotter on Aug 19, 2022 7:41:02 GMT
What’s an eye opener from this piece of union propaganda is one critical piece of missing information. That information is essential in judging whether we should be thanking them (the Germans, Dutch, French) or them thanking us. Do you know what that piece of information is? Tell us , I'd like to know I’m waiting for redwhinenblue to give the answer. I suspect he doesn’t know.
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Post by Hereward the Wake ᛊᛏᛟᚲᛖ on Aug 19, 2022 19:31:55 GMT
Tell us , I'd like to know I’m waiting for redwhinenblue to give the answer. I suspect he doesn’t know. I suspect your right 😁
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