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Post by Paul Spencer on Mar 4, 2021 1:10:17 GMT
In what context are you making this statement? 1. That you think there's no chance that we will get relegated next season? 2. That you think we're safely on course for automatic promotion next season? 3. That you think we're likely to continue to draw lot's of games next season again and so we won't have to worry about either relegation or promotion (again)? Surely there's always something to worry about, unless of course you're content with number three, isn't that's what football is actually all about? 1) not a chance 2) mid table with a bad window, play offs with a good one 3) that would be shit yes and if it carries on next season then there’s decisions to be made I think there's plenty to worry about mate. You started a thread a few months ago saying that you thought we had a good team but yet here we are, yet again, fielding a shocking midfield ... if Joe Allen starts against Wycombe, then red flags should be going up everywhere over the manager's ability to be objective about his playing staff. We really are a side that struggles to win matches and when that's the case, it doesn't take a whole lot of variance (tonight's penalty being a good example) to turn a few of those draws into defeats and we could be staring at another relegation battle. |
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Post by bayernoatcake on Mar 4, 2021 1:13:47 GMT
1) not a chance 2) mid table with a bad window, play offs with a good one 3) that would be shit yes and if it carries on next season then there’s decisions to be made I think there's plenty to worry about mate. You started a thread a few months ago saying that you thought we had a good team but yet here we are, yet again, fielding a shocking midfield ... if Joe Allen starts against Wycombe, then red flags should be going up everywhere over the manager's ability to be objective about his playing staff. We really are a side that struggles to win matches and when that's the case, it doesn't take a whole lot of variance (tonight's penalty being a good example) to turn a few of those draws into defeats and we could be staring at another relegation battle. I think we have got a good team. I really enjoyed how we played tonight tbh. I can’t argue re Allen but we’ve just got to hope. The evidence shows that not many in the footballing world wouldn’t play him. And we know that’s mad but they don’t seem to agree. It also doesn’t take a lot for it to go the other way either and that’s where I think we are if we can some decent signings. |
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Post by Paul Spencer on Mar 4, 2021 1:18:18 GMT
I think there's plenty to worry about mate. You started a thread a few months ago saying that you thought we had a good team but yet here we are, yet again, fielding a shocking midfield ... if Joe Allen starts against Wycombe, then red flags should be going up everywhere over the manager's ability to be objective about his playing staff. We really are a side that struggles to win matches and when that's the case, it doesn't take a whole lot of variance (tonight's penalty being a good example) to turn a few of those draws into defeats and we could be staring at another relegation battle. I think we have got a good team. I really enjoyed how we played tonight tbh. I can’t argue re Allen but we’ve just got to hope. The evidence shows that not many in the footballing world wouldn’t play him. And we know that’s mad but they don’t seem to agree. It also doesn’t take a lot for it to go the other way either and that’s where I think we are if we can some decent signings. Indeed and that's another thing to worry about, to date, the one's he has made so far, haven't been much cop. |
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Post by bayernoatcake on Mar 4, 2021 1:23:21 GMT
I think we have got a good team. I really enjoyed how we played tonight tbh. I can’t argue re Allen but we’ve just got to hope. The evidence shows that not many in the footballing world wouldn’t play him. And we know that’s mad but they don’t seem to agree. It also doesn’t take a lot for it to go the other way either and that’s where I think we are if we can some decent signings. Indeed and that's another thing to worry about, to date, the one's he has made so far, haven't been much cop. They haven’t but I just think it’s way too soon to be making him walk the plank. He’s got this summer and from there he has to improve. But for now I don’t think losing your mind over losing to a dubiously awarded penalty where we’ve actually played well helps no one. Sometimes it’s best to take a step back. And now is a perfect opportunity for that. Of course there are worries there. I can’t argue against that and indeed I was one of that started to point them out. They haven’t gone. But I do think the last two game have been a hell of a lot better as was the Luton win. The season is over for me already. The things to look forward to are the youth cup and watching the 23s play. And if he realises re Allen/Mikel along the way then praise be to God 😂 |
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Post by Paul Spencer on Mar 4, 2021 1:37:50 GMT
Indeed and that's another thing to worry about, to date, the one's he has made so far, haven't been much cop. They haven’t but I just think it’s way too soon to be making him walk the plank. He’s got this summer and from there he has to improve. But for now I don’t think losing your mind over losing to a dubiously awarded penalty where we’ve actually played well helps no one. Sometimes it’s best to take a step back. And now is a perfect opportunity for that. Of course there are worries there. I can’t argue against that and indeed I was one of that started to point them out. They haven’t gone. But I do think the last two game have been a hell of a lot better as was the Luton win. The season is over for me already. The things to look forward to are the youth cup and watching the 23s play. And if he realises re Allen/Mikel along the way then praise be to God 😂 Yep, hence why I highlighted your post suggesting that there wasn't actually anything to worry about. I don't want him to remotely walk the plank at the moment, I actually like him more on a personal level than any of our manger's since Lou but that doesn't mean that I'm going to overlook some of the worries about his ability at this level. I so really want to it come right for him because he's a proper decent egg and I'd love him to be here for years but there are certainly some doubts that need addressing. |
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Post by malisastokie on Mar 4, 2021 2:46:36 GMT
It’s not just about tonight. 3 defeats on the bounce for the first time this season, just 3 league wins since losing Campbell, who he failed to replace in January and let a striker leave, strange game management, negative set up and tactics, he isn’t the same manager that saved us last year, where has that MON gone? He is still the same manager. The January window was all about balancing FFP books and as such he did not replace Campbell because he could'nt. Campbell is a unique talent and even if there was a replacement available it would cost north of 15 million and whilst the Coates family have the money their hands are tied by FFP. Our issue is we invested so heavily ( both in terms of retaining players and buying new players) in the first season after relegation that when we did not go straight back up , it was always going to be a hard slog for the managers that followed Rowett and Jones. Next year will be no different FFP will be there and so will the Wimmers of the world. Next years January window will be interesting as Campbell will have had six months back in the shop window, we will need to be creative in how we keep him in the second half the season. Something Mr Scholes is not renowned for. I agree with MON's game management, however every Stoke manager of recent times from Hughes to current for some reason have let games slide and not tactically made replacements until its to late. I sit there sometimes and see sides start to build and over power us in the midfield and no movement until the 2nd goal finds its way into the net. I thought we played well tonight. |
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Post by zerps on Mar 4, 2021 5:59:07 GMT
Bayerns trolling is next level 😂
He realises the majority now think we’re completely wank so says the opposite.
Text book.
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Post by citynickscfc on Mar 4, 2021 6:01:55 GMT
This summer will be ultimately disappointing yet again. Zero players are out of contract.
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Post by ChrisKamarasPerm on Mar 4, 2021 6:02:17 GMT
It’s not just about tonight. 3 defeats on the bounce for the first time this season, just 3 league wins since losing Campbell, who he failed to replace in January and let a striker leave, strange game management, negative set up and tactics, he isn’t the same manager that saved us last year, where has that MON gone? He is still the same manager. The January window was all about balancing FFP books and as such he did not replace Campbell because he could'nt. Campbell is a unique talent and even if there was a replacement available it would cost north of 15 million and whilst the Coates family have the money their hands are tied by FFP. Our issue is we invested so heavily ( both in terms of retaining players and buying new players) in the first season after relegation that when we did not go straight back up , it was always going to be a hard slog for the managers that followed Rowett and Jones. Next year will be no different FFP will be there and so will the Wimmers of the world. Next years January window will be interesting as Campbell will have had six months back in the shop window, we will need to be creative in how we keep him in the second half the season. Something Mr Scholes is not renowned for. I agree with MON's game management, however every Stoke manager of recent times from Hughes to current for some reason have let games slide and not tactically made replacements until its to late. I sit there sometimes and see sides start to build and over power us in the midfield and no movement until the 2nd goal finds its way into the net. I thought we played well tonight. Campbell won't have had 6 months back by next January that's certain. |
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Post by robwahlmann on Mar 4, 2021 6:06:55 GMT
If a team deserved to win yesterday it certainly wasn't Swansea!  |
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Post by nonameface on Mar 4, 2021 6:13:09 GMT
Bayerns trolling is next level 😂 He realises the majority now think we’re completely wank so says the opposite. Text book. the thing is, he's right though |
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Post by The Toxic Avenger on Mar 4, 2021 6:16:05 GMT
I didn’t think we did play especially well beyond about the first 10 minutes of the first half and the first 20 of the second. We seemed to take them by surprise, first with our pressing and later with our change of shape, but on each occasion they worked us out and we offered very little thereafter.
Swansea are a decent side but they looked like a better version of what MON aspires for us to be - hard pressing, hard working, well drilled but not a team that scores many themselves either. They didn’t cause us many problems and we, those spells aside, didn’t cause them many. They were better first half, second half was generally a bit drab.
We’re just so plodding and predictable. I know MON can only play the hand he’s been dealt and there’s a lack of dynamism and invention throughout the squad, but did we really need to start with a back three again? Did we really need to keep both midfielders on that long as we steadily lost our foothold?
We didn’t deserve to lose but Jesus Christ are we a tough watch.
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Post by zerps on Mar 4, 2021 6:17:15 GMT
Bayerns trolling is next level 😂 He realises the majority now think we’re completely wank so says the opposite. Text book. the thing is, he's right though He’s right by trolling those who think we’re decent. They deserve it. |
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Post by chiswickpotter on Mar 4, 2021 10:39:41 GMT
We outplayed one of the best sides in the division for a good 60 minutes of the game imo. Yes there was elements to it that weren’t good. Allen was awful. Mikel was knackered and needed subbing but we played well. We created the better chances and should have got a point but for a inept ref. Swansea are an excellent side and we more than matched them. I’ve been as frustrated with MON as anyone and he definitely needs to learn fast re game management and about Mikel and Allen. But tonight was perfectly fine bar the result. We created chances, we had some good passages of play and we showed that we’re a perfectly decent side. Just like the first half at the weekend. This isn’t the time to be throwing the shit against the wall because we lost to a dodgy penalty. We’re not going down so stop that. Yes the season is over but meh, it happens. It shouldn’t have happened but it has. Going mental now helps no one. I still think we’re a gnats cock off being a very good team and have seen so much hope in these last two games even with Allen and Mikel in there. Now isn’t the time to man the barricades, now is the time to relax. Life is tough, worrying over 12 or however many games that mean nowt helps no one. And pray that he finally learns to not play Allen and Mikel together.  I agree. Press was good first half and then we played some good stuff in the 4-2-3-1 shape this is our best despite MON’s reluctance to use it. We also played good football in this shape in the last two home games. If he is brave, next season with this team looks promising Davies/Gunn/Bursik Smith Collins Souttar Fox Allen Clucas Campbell Powell Doughty Fletcher Smith has looked good at RB in the last few games. RND is no better than Fox. Need more legs in central midfield and cover for Fletcher but a base is ther e |
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Post by emmbrook1956 on Mar 4, 2021 10:46:18 GMT
Bayern,
I have to agree with you. That may be a first! Played well, pressed hard and had little luck last night. Thought the penalty was very very soft. Should have booked Naughton. I can only think that Wenger slipped into the Spurs ground some years ago and taught them all how to dive and get penalties!
i hope there is the same intensity on Saturday!
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Post by The Toxic Avenger on Mar 4, 2021 10:50:10 GMT
We pressed hard for what, 15 minutes until they scored, and they proceeded to control most of the rest of the half?
Then we started well second half and had fizzled again after about 65 minutes?
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Post by samwidge on Mar 4, 2021 10:57:25 GMT
We outplayed one of the best sides in the division for a good 60 minutes of the game imo. Yes there was elements to it that weren’t good. Allen was awful. Mikel was knackered and needed subbing but we played well. We created the better chances and should have got a point but for a inept ref. Swansea are an excellent side and we more than matched them. I’ve been as frustrated with MON as anyone and he definitely needs to learn fast re game management and about Mikel and Allen. But tonight was perfectly fine bar the result. We created chances, we had some good passages of play and we showed that we’re a perfectly decent side. Just like the first half at the weekend. This isn’t the time to be throwing the shit against the wall because we lost to a dodgy penalty. We’re not going down so stop that. Yes the season is over but meh, it happens. It shouldn’t have happened but it has. Going mental now helps no one. I still think we’re a gnats cock off being a very good team and have seen so much hope in these last two games even with Allen and Mikel in there. Now isn’t the time to man the barricades, now is the time to relax. Life is tough, worrying over 12 or however many games that mean nowt helps no one. And pray that he finally learns to not play Allen and Mikel together. Have you had a bang on the head recently bayern, or got your end away, or something? I've 99 times out of 100 got the polar opposite opinion to yours, but since the Brentford game, and again tonight, where we've played well in both games, you've described and conveyed exactly the same things that I thought too. I like this new bayern, hope to read more from him. |
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Post by davejohnno1 on Mar 4, 2021 11:09:56 GMT
I'll have a guess at the answer. Their league position indicates that they are a good side at this level? We dropped at the same time, but we are 5 years away and need transition where swans are already there, im sorry but this team is still Under performing, like the sky pundit said. PPG last season MON was a promotion side, this season after adding players he’s midtable / lower I disagree wholeheartedly and you should never rely on what the Sky pundits say. They described a stray pass from Allen as unusual. Described Clarke as someone who loves to get at the full-back and get crosses in and said that Mikel and Allen were reliable. They also said Clarke was clumsy in challenging Naughton for the penalty. This team is shit. It's loaded with experienced professionals on big contracts who are not fit for purpose. Had O'Neill not integrated the youngsters so successfully, we'd almost certainly be fighting another relegation battle. Criticism is valid and fair. We are a very frustrating team, missing sitters whilst gifting soft goals at the other end. It's not a good combination. However, all criticism has to be mitigated by the crippling injury list and copious amounts of misfortune that has cost us valuable points. We've barely been on the end of a lucky refereeing call and have paid the price for the Preston decision several times over. We've had injuries to key men in key positions, our best players have missed long chunks of the season and it's hurt us. With our best team available we were doing well. We might not have been playing wonderfully well but we were doing well and continuing the renaissance of last season. That has stalled. It's really frustrating but the criticism has to be tempered a little in my opinion. The hyperbole of many on here doesn't help. O'Neill was a negative bastard for taking Powell off but he's been manager long enough for everyone to know that O'Neill would never sub Powell unless he absolutely had to. He just wouldn't do it. If he had more Powell's he'd play one of them in pretty much every position on the pitch I'm sure. Posters on here are so welded to one negative view that they'll never balance a viewpoint. We even had one Chester hater saying that he was at fault for the 1st goal last night because he let the attacker across him to score. Simply because Chester has been playing on the left side of the backline, he assumed he was at fault when the truth is he started on the right of the 3 yesterday and was in no way culpable for their goal. People welded to a viewpoint take that as gospel and the negativity increases. At no point yesterday was O'Neill negative. We dominated large chunks of the game against a very good championship team, one who reached the play-offs last season and is pushing for automatic promotion this season. The fact we were relegated at the same time is zero reflection on O'Neill and a sorry indictment on those that have been involved prior to his appointment. |
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Post by christhepotter on Mar 4, 2021 11:50:14 GMT
The problem is we don’t play well for whole 90 mins
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Post by lordb on Mar 4, 2021 12:13:03 GMT
The problem is we don’t play well for whole 90 mins who does? Swansea didn't either neither did Brentford in fact neither did Norwich can't think of any game ever (including 6.1 v Liverpool, 7.2 v Leeds, 5 at Wembley) where we played well non stop for 90 minutes |
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Post by The Toxic Avenger on Mar 4, 2021 12:27:26 GMT
Playing well for 50-60 would be a start.
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Post by davejohnno1 on Mar 4, 2021 12:31:48 GMT
Playing well for 50-60 would be a start. I thought we did that last night. For large chunks of the game, Gunn never touched the ball. |
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Post by werrington on Mar 4, 2021 12:40:45 GMT
Playing well for 50-60 would be a start. I thought we did that last night. For large chunks of the game, Gunn never touched the ball. First 15 mins then Swansea sussed it then bossed the next 30 Second half and with a forced change at ht ( otherwise it wouldn’t of happened) we again bossed 15 mins before Swansea changed and bossed the next 30 It’s poor fayre mate and easy to play against |
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Post by crouchpotato1 on Mar 4, 2021 12:46:33 GMT
I thought we did that last night. For large chunks of the game, Gunn never touched the ball. First 15 mins then Swansea sussed it then bossed the next 30 Second half and with a forced change at ht ( otherwise it wouldn’t of happened) we again bossed 15 mins before Swansea changed and bossed the next 30 It’s poor fayre mate and easy to play against Connor Hourihane came on at 70 minutes and that’s when the 2nd half changed so I make that 25 minutes in the 2nd half.Very very harsh view on last nights performance for me |
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Post by prestwichpotter on Mar 4, 2021 12:48:42 GMT
I thought we did that last night. For large chunks of the game, Gunn never touched the ball. First 15 mins then Swansea sussed it then bossed the next 30 Second half and with a forced change at ht ( otherwise it wouldn’t of happened) we again bossed 15 mins before Swansea changed and bossed the next 30 It’s poor fayre mate and easy to play against We dominated for a good 25 minutes second half, the sub changed it when they had an extra man in midfield...... |
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Post by The Toxic Avenger on Mar 4, 2021 12:50:21 GMT
Playing well for 50-60 would be a start. I thought we did that last night. For large chunks of the game, Gunn never touched the ball. Is that the barometer then Dave? Whether we keep it away from our own goalkeeper for a bit? We pressed well for the first 15 or so until they equalised and were second best for the rest of the half. We changed shape and played well for the first 20 or so at the start of the second half and then faded again and were second best. |
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Post by werrington on Mar 4, 2021 12:51:19 GMT
First 15 mins then Swansea sussed it then bossed the next 30 Second half and with a forced change at ht ( otherwise it wouldn’t of happened) we again bossed 15 mins before Swansea changed and bossed the next 30 It’s poor fayre mate and easy to play against Connor Hourihane came on at 70 minutes and that’s when the 2nd half changed so I make that 25 minutes in the 2nd half.Very very harsh view on last nights performance for me We had 2 meaningful efforts at goal second half and they came within 2 seconds of each other mate, the rest is just possession football with no end product or an effort at goal If you find it acceptable ive no problem with it mutts but I’m bored shitless watching it |
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Post by crouchpotato1 on Mar 4, 2021 12:54:11 GMT
Connor Hourihane came on at 70 minutes and that’s when the 2nd half changed so I make that 25 minutes in the 2nd half.Very very harsh view on last nights performance for me We had 2 meaningful efforts at goal second half and they came within 2 seconds of each other mate, the rest is just possession football with no end product or an effort at goal If you find it acceptable ive no problem with it mutts but I’m bored shitless watching it If you’re bored shitless watching last night mate then there’s no hope I’m afraid.I’d judge it as one of our better performances this season to be honest especially since Campbell’s injury |
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Post by leesandfordstoupe on Mar 4, 2021 12:59:37 GMT
If that’s playing well then god help me. We are absolutely atrocious in possession. Yes we matched Swansea and had our share of the game but there is a fluency to their play and the way they move the ball that we are miles away from. We’ve more than matched better teams in years gone by playing shit agricultural football. Is that really the best we can hope for?
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Post by werrington on Mar 4, 2021 13:01:53 GMT
We had 2 meaningful efforts at goal second half and they came within 2 seconds of each other mate, the rest is just possession football with no end product or an effort at goal If you find it acceptable ive no problem with it mutts but I’m bored shitless watching it If you’re bored shitless watching last night mate then there’s no hope I’m afraid.I’d judge it as one of our better performances this season to be honest especially since Campbell’s injury We lost mate ...again 3 wins in 20 and 8 points from ( so far ) 42 points available against the current top 8 again tells its own story Even with our injuries we’ve still got a squad capable of giving any team in this league a game but sadly we aren’t |
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