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Post by bayernoatcake on Dec 20, 2020 12:26:20 GMT
We're nowhere near good enough to go up in my opinion but what he's done to change the mentality and guts of the shambolic weak willed mob he inherited, isn't far short of a miracle. Why not? We’ve shown we are. But I’ve never bought that the issue was the players, they were being managed badly. MON has come in and just done basic things and done what I would have done..:..use the young players and build a side around them. I’ve been saying it for years. It was the obvious thing to do and would see shoot you the league. Here we are. It’s just not a shock.
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Post by foxysgloves on Dec 20, 2020 12:27:37 GMT
We're nowhere near good enough to go up in my opinion but what he's done to change the mentality and guts of the shambolic weak willed mob he inherited, isn't far short of a miracle. To be honest, and I’ve nothing against Jesus, but making a top half team out of the rabble he inherited pisses all over turning water into wine and walking on water.
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Post by foxysgloves on Dec 20, 2020 12:29:49 GMT
The manager is ace. The squad is slowly taking shape. Give him another year and the squad will be ace too. I agree though. People need to have faith. In MON. He is good. But he can easily be so much better. I don’t think it needs another and actually in another year Collins probably won’t be here, Souttar might not be and Campbell might not be. Then we’re fucked. That’s my worry. People have faith in him. But as I said the other day this season he has been the limiting factor. These young players are the drivers of this. Players will come and players will go. But if we keep MON we’ll have a chance. He’s proving on a weekly basis that he gets the best out of what he has.
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Post by sheikhmomo on Dec 20, 2020 12:43:39 GMT
We're nowhere near good enough to go up in my opinion but what he's done to change the mentality and guts of the shambolic weak willed mob he inherited, isn't far short of a miracle. Why not? We’ve shown we are. But I’ve never bought that the issue was the players, they were being managed badly. MON has come in and just done basic things and done what I would have done..:..use the young players and build a side around them. I’ve been saying it for years. It was the obvious thing to do and would see shoot you the league. Here we are. It’s just not a shock. I just don't think we're anywhere near being the full package. When we tighten up we never look like scoring and when we occasionally let the brakes off the defence suddenly resembles a sieve. I agree this should be the year though, as we will lose all our decent young players if we don't because they are most certainly the full package.
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Post by kronkie on Dec 20, 2020 12:46:29 GMT
As much as I believe as bad as we are we could get promoted on form and a lot of luck. It is like I don't want us too unless there's a plan in place already to give us a half chance of staying up if we do make it. Having seen how MON makes and execute plans as an international manager - and as a club manager at Stoke, he doesn't come across as the sort of manager who would not have a plan as to how to cope with promotion. And, don't forget, getting promoted to the Prem is by far the best and quickest way to remove the monkey of FFP restrictions off our back. Our annual income would, at a stroke, increase by over £100 million, meaning that life would be much easier for MON in that he would have decent money to improve the squad compared to this season when the amount he has had to spend on players is lower than any other Stoke manager since the pre Pulis days. That's well explained LL, my worry was IF we were to get promoted that the FFP rules were to remain as they are for us at the moment we would be totally out of our depth and be back down quicker than a whores draws in Bangkok.
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Post by thisisouryear on Dec 20, 2020 12:47:24 GMT
Were still in transition and MON could get a win playing school kids.
Despite the curse he has saved us from relegation and now has us hovering around the playoffs, it's incredible really.
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Post by bayernoatcake on Dec 20, 2020 12:48:22 GMT
He is good. But he can easily be so much better. I don’t think it needs another and actually in another year Collins probably won’t be here, Souttar might not be and Campbell might not be. Then we’re fucked. That’s my worry. People have faith in him. But as I said the other day this season he has been the limiting factor. These young players are the drivers of this. Players will come and players will go. But if we keep MON we’ll have a chance. He’s proving on a weekly basis that he gets the best out of what he has. But we’re better than that presently: much better than that.
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Post by bayernoatcake on Dec 20, 2020 12:49:31 GMT
Why not? We’ve shown we are. But I’ve never bought that the issue was the players, they were being managed badly. MON has come in and just done basic things and done what I would have done..:..use the young players and build a side around them. I’ve been saying it for years. It was the obvious thing to do and would see shoot you the league. Here we are. It’s just not a shock. I just don't think we're anywhere near being the full package. When we tighten up we never look like scoring and when we occasionally let the brakes off the defence suddenly resembles a sieve. I agree this should be the year though, as we will lose all our decent young players if we don't because they are most certainly the full package. That’s totally down to tactics though. Hence why I think he is limiting us atm and only being ok. There is no reason not to be playing Verlinden other than being scared.
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Post by sheikhmomo on Dec 20, 2020 12:52:14 GMT
I just don't think we're anywhere near being the full package. When we tighten up we never look like scoring and when we occasionally let the brakes off the defence suddenly resembles a sieve. I agree this should be the year though, as we will lose all our decent young players if we don't because they are most certainly the full package. There is no reason not to be playing Verlinden other than being scared. 100% agree with that.
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Post by foxysgloves on Dec 20, 2020 12:53:03 GMT
I just don't think we're anywhere near being the full package. When we tighten up we never look like scoring and when we occasionally let the brakes off the defence suddenly resembles a sieve. I agree this should be the year though, as we will lose all our decent young players if we don't because they are most certainly the full package. That’s totally down to tactics though. Hence why I think he is limiting us atm and only being ok. There is no reason not to be playing Verlinden other than being scared. How do you know there’s no other reason not to play Verlinden?
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Post by lordherefordsknob on Dec 20, 2020 12:54:10 GMT
We are about where I expected us to be, happy with results not so much about performances. I said at the start of the season we would finish between 6th and 10th so not to far away from my expectations.
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Post by mickstupp on Dec 20, 2020 12:56:42 GMT
I just don't think we're anywhere near being the full package. When we tighten up we never look like scoring and when we occasionally let the brakes off the defence suddenly resembles a sieve. I agree this should be the year though, as we will lose all our decent young players if we don't because they are most certainly the full package. That’s totally down to tactics though. Hence why I think he is limiting us atm and only being ok. There is no reason not to be playing Verlinden other than being scared. Why on earth would he be scared of playing Verlinden? What’s to be scared about? He’s played numerous other young players without hesitation. It’s clear that he just either doesn’t think he’s ready or doesn’t overly rate him.
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Post by prestwichpotter on Dec 20, 2020 13:08:22 GMT
That’s totally down to tactics though. Hence why I think he is limiting us atm and only being ok. There is no reason not to be playing Verlinden other than being scared. How do you know there’s no other reason not to play Verlinden? He doesn't.
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Post by crouchpotato1 on Dec 20, 2020 13:29:30 GMT
I just don't think we're anywhere near being the full package. When we tighten up we never look like scoring and when we occasionally let the brakes off the defence suddenly resembles a sieve. I agree this should be the year though, as we will lose all our decent young players if we don't because they are most certainly the full package. That’s totally down to tactics though. Hence why I think he is limiting us atm and only being ok. There is no reason not to be playing Verlinden other than being scared. Scared 🤣🤣you really are one strange bod
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Post by Staffsoatcake on Dec 20, 2020 14:08:41 GMT
In my time, John Ritchie would piss all over Stein.
All is goals came in the top Division, against some of the top sides too,on a regular basis.
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Post by bayernoatcake on Dec 20, 2020 14:33:56 GMT
That’s totally down to tactics though. Hence why I think he is limiting us atm and only being ok. There is no reason not to be playing Verlinden other than being scared. How do you know there’s no other reason not to play Verlinden? Because Brown has been garbage and needs dropping. McClean has been poor and has needed dropping. And you’ve got to wonder why Fletcher isn’t scoring the amount of goals I’d expect him to? Supply from wide areas? There’s no reason not to be playing Verlinden.
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Post by bayernoatcake on Dec 20, 2020 14:35:24 GMT
That’s totally down to tactics though. Hence why I think he is limiting us atm and only being ok. There is no reason not to be playing Verlinden other than being scared. Why on earth would he be scared of playing Verlinden? What’s to be scared about? He’s played numerous other young players without hesitation. It’s clear that he just either doesn’t think he’s ready or doesn’t overly rate him. He’s been hesitant with them from the off and eased them in. Finally he’s getting there and 3 of them are playing the amount they should have been for the last 18 months but let’s not go ott about it.
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Post by mickstupp on Dec 20, 2020 14:42:09 GMT
Why on earth would he be scared of playing Verlinden? What’s to be scared about? He’s played numerous other young players without hesitation. It’s clear that he just either doesn’t think he’s ready or doesn’t overly rate him. He’s been hesitant with them from the off and eased them in. Finally he’s getting there and 3 of them are playing the amount they should have been for the last 18 months but let’s not go ott about it. He’s put them in at the right time. If you’re correct about them coming in 18 months too late then that’s the fault of the previous manager. Nothing to do with MON being “scared”.
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Post by bayernoatcake on Dec 20, 2020 14:43:36 GMT
He’s been hesitant with them from the off and eased them in. Finally he’s getting there and 3 of them are playing the amount they should have been for the last 18 months but let’s not go ott about it. He’s put them in at the right time. If you’re correct about them coming in 18 months too late then that’s the fault of the previous manager. Nothing to do with MON being “scared”. He really hasn’t. He got there in the end with them but he was way too reluctant with them. It is definitely. And yes he has been scared with them. But we are getting there, so that’s good.
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Post by mickstupp on Dec 20, 2020 14:57:12 GMT
He’s put them in at the right time. If you’re correct about them coming in 18 months too late then that’s the fault of the previous manager. Nothing to do with MON being “scared”. He really hasn’t. He got there in the end with them but he was way too reluctant with them. It is definitely. And yes he has been scared with them. But we are getting there, so that’s good. It’s a nonsense argument. He had Campbell in the side regularly within a month of him joining us last November and his personal intervention enabled us to keep him and get him to sign a new contract. He couldn’t do anything with Souttar because the previous manager had sent him out to Fleetwood on a season long loan. As soon as he was back, MON got him involved in the first team straight away. Collins wasn’t even training with the first team when MON first arrived. After assessing all of the players, he could see his potential and integrated him into the squad using him occasionally. Collins didn’t impress particularly last season, but he’s certainly looked the part this year so far, barring the odd rash indisciplined moment here and there. Verlinden was another one who was on loan. MON called him back, used him as a sub and a few weeks later he did his ACL and he’s been out until recently. Throw in Tymon, Bursik, Booth, and Brown and I simply cannot understand this constant bleating about the youngsters. He’s proven time and time again that he’s prepared to give them a chance if they apply themselves.
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Post by bayernoatcake on Dec 20, 2020 15:02:10 GMT
He really hasn’t. He got there in the end with them but he was way too reluctant with them. It is definitely. And yes he has been scared with them. But we are getting there, so that’s good. It’s a nonsense argument. He had Campbell in the side regularly within a month of him joining us last November and his personal intervention enabled us to keep him and get him to sign a new contract. He couldn’t do anything with Souttar because the previous manager had sent him out on loan to Fleetwood on a season long loan. As soon as he was back, MON got him involved in the first team straight away. Collins wasn’t even training with that first team when MON first arrived. After assessing all of the players, he could see his potential and integrated him into the squad using him occasionally. Collins didn’t impress particularly last season, but he’s certainly looked the part this year so far, barring the odd rash indisciplined moment here and there. Verlinden was another one who was on loan. MON called him back, used him as a sub and a few weeks later he did his ACL and he’s been out until recently. Throw in Tymon, Bursik, Booth, and Brown and I simply cannot understand this constant bleating about the youngsters. He’s proven time and time again that he’s prepared to give them a chance if they apply themselves. Campbell should have been in from the get go. Collins was wasted last season and even this is not ideal with him at right back. Souttar imo should have been recalled in January. And even this season, Souttar was the best CB in pre season by a mile and he didn’t start. I found that really strange.
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Post by mickstupp on Dec 20, 2020 15:03:57 GMT
It’s a nonsense argument. He had Campbell in the side regularly within a month of him joining us last November and his personal intervention enabled us to keep him and get him to sign a new contract. He couldn’t do anything with Souttar because the previous manager had sent him out on loan to Fleetwood on a season long loan. As soon as he was back, MON got him involved in the first team straight away. Collins wasn’t even training with that first team when MON first arrived. After assessing all of the players, he could see his potential and integrated him into the squad using him occasionally. Collins didn’t impress particularly last season, but he’s certainly looked the part this year so far, barring the odd rash indisciplined moment here and there. Verlinden was another one who was on loan. MON called him back, used him as a sub and a few weeks later he did his ACL and he’s been out until recently. Throw in Tymon, Bursik, Booth, and Brown and I simply cannot understand this constant bleating about the youngsters. He’s proven time and time again that he’s prepared to give them a chance if they apply themselves. Campbell should have been in from the get go. Collins was wasted last season and even this is not ideal with him at right back. Souttar imo should have been recalled in January. And even this season, Souttar was the best CB in pre season by a mile and he didn’t start. I found that really strange. Christ almighty, talk about nit picking. Unbelievable.
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Post by bayernoatcake on Dec 20, 2020 15:05:11 GMT
Campbell should have been in from the get go. Collins was wasted last season and even this is not ideal with him at right back. Souttar imo should have been recalled in January. And even this season, Souttar was the best CB in pre season by a mile and he didn’t start. I found that really strange. Christ almighty talk about nit picking. Unbelievable. It’s not nit picking. I just thought it was poor management and it was. He rectified it though.
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Post by mickstupp on Dec 20, 2020 15:09:53 GMT
Christ almighty talk about nit picking. Unbelievable. It’s not nit picking. I just thought it was poor management and it was. He rectified it though. Every issue you have here is plain wrong. You can’t just break the terms of a season long loan for a start, so your criticism of the way he’s dealt with Harry Souttar is a nonsense straight away.
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Post by bayernoatcake on Dec 20, 2020 15:12:33 GMT
It’s not nit picking. I just thought it was poor management and it was. He rectified it though. Every issue you have here is plain wrong. You can’t just break the terms of a season long loan for a start, so your criticism of the way he’s dealt with Harry Souttar is a nonsense straight away. There are ways and means if you really want it. And I do think the start of this season was shoddy with him. But that’s why I like him, he will change things.
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Post by mickstupp on Dec 20, 2020 15:14:50 GMT
Every issue you have here is plain wrong. You can’t just break the terms of a season long loan for a start, so your criticism of the way he’s dealt with Harry Souttar is a nonsense straight away. There are ways and means if you really want it. And I do think the start of this season was shoddy with him. But that’s why I like him, he will change things. No there isn’t. Read his article today in the athletic, he explains exactly what the situation was like when he got here, and why Campbell and others weren’t involved immediately.
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Post by bayernoatcake on Dec 20, 2020 15:15:55 GMT
There are ways and means if you really want it. And I do think the start of this season was shoddy with him. But that’s why I like him, he will change things. No there isn’t. Read his article today in the athletic, he explains exactly what the situation was like when he got here, and why Campbell and others weren’t involved immediately. There’s no excuse for it. And that’s all it will be.
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Post by bayernoatcake on Dec 20, 2020 15:18:12 GMT
I’ve just read it.
It took him weeks to figure out Campbell was the best finisher at the club? 😂😂
Fuck me 🤦♂️
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Post by mickstupp on Dec 20, 2020 15:19:36 GMT
No there isn’t. Read his article today in the athletic, he explains exactly what the situation was like when he got here, and why Campbell and others weren’t involved immediately. There’s no excuse for it. And that’s all it will be. So he was just supposed to come in on a Friday, pick a team for the next day and just overlook 25 senior pros and bring in kids who weren’t even training with the first team?
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Post by foxysgloves on Dec 20, 2020 15:26:19 GMT
How do you know there’s no other reason not to play Verlinden? Because Brown has been garbage and needs dropping. McClean has been poor and has needed dropping. And you’ve got to wonder why Fletcher isn’t scoring the amount of goals I’d expect him to? Supply from wide areas? There’s no reason not to be playing Verlinden. What if his attitude stinks? What if MON thinks his defensive game isn’t good enough at the moment? What if he doesn’t link well with the other players around him in the starting eleven? What if his fitness levels aren’t good enough to be starting a game? What if he shagged Beagrie’s Mrs in the players bath?
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