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Post by wherty on Dec 4, 2020 12:18:16 GMT
While I appreciate bet365’s financial clout that underpins the club, I have always been slightly uncomfortable with it, and especially have always disliked the renaming of the stadium. I know it’s all money these days, but couldn’t a more geographically or culturally referenced, more permanent, name for the stadium have been used, like The Potteries Stadium, or The Six Towns Stadium, or something? And what was wrong with Cristal Tiles anyway? As Bet365 is Staffordshire's biggest business (4 miles from the stadium) employing the most staff, I'd say you don't get more local..
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Post by cheadlepotter on Dec 4, 2020 12:28:30 GMT
Whatever happened to personal responsibility? Nobody forces anyone to part with their money on these apps or at betting shops. People choose to do it and if they are unable to control themselves they have to live with the consequences. I'm not saying gambling firms are perfect and they probably should be regulated more. But I don't think a valuable source of income should be removed from the game because some people can't control themselves. It's different from when tobacco companies were forced to stop advertising in sport and life in general. Unlike smoking, it's possible to enjoy betting in a healthy, sustainable way. Don't punish the majority because of a minority. The gambling industry is already one of the most heavily regulated industries in the country. Other than banking there is no other industry that has such a burden of proving affordability. The problem is it's paying for it's previous sins where new on line firms were virtually unregulated for a decade. It is mental though, there is no other purchase whether it be goods or services that necessitates you to rock up with your full personal financial history before being able to transact but that's where gambling is headed sadly and it will hit bottom lines significantly across the board. I work in the industry and confirm how heavily regulated it is. Even at shop level the stuff we’re required to do and record is crazy when you consider other arguably harmful industries that I’ve mentioned above don’t have to do anything.
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Post by iglugluk on Dec 4, 2020 12:51:28 GMT
I find this a complicated moral issue but ultimately personal responsibility has to be taken by the individual otherwise the whole country has to cut it's cloth according to the perceived limitations of others. Sport and gambling are inextricably linked and always will be. The instinct of governments to tax and regulate society to control it's habits encourages abrogation of personal responsibility, I'd say, plus it rarely achieves the desired result anyway. Prohibition in the USA was a prime example of that. If this government want less gambling addicts it should start by closing the economic gaps that encourage badly educated people to make poor and uninformed life choices in the hope that they will strike it BIG and enter into a better more golden tinged life. But hey? That would be helping out poor people at the expense of the richer and luckier ones ( they generally say hard working and resent any implication that they may have benefited from luck but luck nearly always plays a part in ones fortunes in life as far as I'm concerned ) A groundswell of disenfranchised people represents a danger to society and financial crashes and economic breakdowns lead to instability. There is a much bigger issue happening than fiddling with gambling rules, I reckon. I think you make some valid points but part of the problem is an over-reaction from the Freedom of Speech type lobbyists. There is not going to be Prohibition of Gambling ever! Regulation and Prohibition are 2 very different things. Yes I completely agree
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Post by wagsastokie on Dec 4, 2020 12:58:40 GMT
If the goal here is reducing the marketing reach of betting firms to protect vulnerable people from developing gambling problems, then I doubt how effective it would be if there wasn’t also a ban on TV advertising and sponsorship of sporting events. There’s no point removing a valuable source of revenue from clubs if people are still going to be bombarded by adverts for Paddy Power and Betway every time they turn on the TV to watch the SkyBet Football League or the William Hill World Darts Championship. Them bingo adverts need banning as well, full stop! Bingo should be banned online full stop And once all the old biddies have gone it will reach the timely death it deserves
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Post by iglugluk on Dec 4, 2020 13:03:23 GMT
I find this a complicated moral issue but ultimately personal responsibility has to be taken by the individual otherwise the whole country has to cut it's cloth according to the perceived limitations of others. Sport and gambling are inextricably linked and always will be. The instinct of governments to tax and regulate society to control it's habits encourages abrogation of personal responsibility, I'd say, plus it rarely achieves the desired result anyway. Prohibition in the USA was a prime example of that. If this government want less gambling addicts it should start by closing the economic gaps that encourage badly educated people to make poor and uninformed life choices in the hope that they will strike it BIG and enter into a better more golden tinged life. But hey? That would be helping out poor people at the expense of the richer and luckier ones ( they generally say hard working and resent any implication that they may have benefited from luck but luck nearly always plays a part in ones fortunes in life as far as I'm concerned ) A groundswell of disenfranchised people represents a danger to society and financial crashes and economic breakdowns lead to instability. There is a much bigger issue happening than fiddling with gambling rules, I reckon. I think you make some valid points but part of the problem is an over-reaction from the Freedom of Speech type lobbyists. There is not going to be Prohibition of Gambling ever! Regulation and Prohibition are 2 very different things. As an addendum, I would reiterate that I think that there is an increasing tendency to micromanage society via regulatory processes and this smacks of short-termism. Currently economic gaps are increasing alarmingly and this is leading to societal polarisation. I would be interested to see if the government are applying the same thought process to investments bring made in the futures market which is akin to gambling at a high level. My guess is that it's easier to aim at the less well educated and well off rather than the economically empowered individuals and institutions in our society. Just a though
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Post by spitthedog on Dec 4, 2020 13:07:46 GMT
For those concerned about the amount of regulation and infringement on their liberties, just how difficult is it to set an account and bet?? I didn’t find it much difference to setting up an account with Amazon tbh. I’m trying to kick the habit now, but the only restriction I encountered was when I got banned by one betting company because I won on one of their promotions too many times for their liking. They froze my account because they said my winning streak on a specific promotion was suspicious!!! They soon let me carry on betting on everything else I was losing on btw!!
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Post by spitthedog on Dec 4, 2020 13:08:40 GMT
I think you make some valid points but part of the problem is an over-reaction from the Freedom of Speech type lobbyists. There is not going to be Prohibition of Gambling ever! Regulation and Prohibition are 2 very different things. As an addendum, I would reiterate that I think that there is an increasing tendency to micromanage society via regulatory processes and this smacks of short-termism. Currently economic gaps are increasing alarmingly and this is leading to societal polarisation. I would be interested to see if the government are applying the same thought process to investments bring made in the futures market which is akin to gambling at a high level. My guess is that it's easier to aim at the less well educated and well off rather than the economically empowered individuals and institutions in our society. Just a though Interesting point
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Post by dutchstokie on Dec 4, 2020 13:12:10 GMT
If Mr Coates was a Tory party funder I’m sure things would be ‘sorted’ very quickly ! However the company didn’t build its fortune by being slow to react to changing market situations so I’m sure Denise will be on the case and making sure they don’t lose out. They'll react best because they always do but if some of the changes mooted go through, there's no way they'll keep their profitability at current levels. Quite a concern. Arent the gambling laws in America also changing in some way? I thought this was the next 'pot of honey' Denise was wanting to dip her fingers into.....
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Post by OldStokie on Dec 4, 2020 13:31:37 GMT
As usual, the actions of a few determine the fate of most. Every facet of liberalism is always open to attack in this way. The way to deal with excesses is to educate and then create a safety net for those who find it difficult to contrain themselves from excesses. If anything, the most harmful thing in society comes about through alcohol abuse. If we follow this line of banning things then alcohol advertising should be top of the list. So the question is, why isn't that being done? The answer is simple... it brings in too much dosh to attack it. I'll guarantee that if Denise threw a billion quid each in the coffers of the Tory and Labour parties we wouldn't be having this conversation.
OS.
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Post by sheikhmomo on Dec 4, 2020 13:38:32 GMT
They'll react best because they always do but if some of the changes mooted go through, there's no way they'll keep their profitability at current levels. Quite a concern. Arent the gambling laws in America also changing in some way? I thought this was the next 'pot of honey' Denise was wanting to dip her fingers into..... It's open on a state by state basis I think. 365 are already in New Jersey but I'm not certain it's proving to be the cash cow that many thought yet.
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Post by henry on Dec 4, 2020 13:53:58 GMT
As usual, the actions of a few determine the fate of most. Every facet of liberalism is always open to attack in this way. The way to deal with excesses is to educate and then create a safety net for those who find it difficult to contrain themselves from excesses. If anything, the most harmful thing in society comes about through alcohol abuse. If we follow this line of banning things then alcohol advertising should be top of the list. So the question is, why isn't that being done? The answer is simple... it brings in too much dosh to attack it. I'll guarantee that if Denise threw a billion quid each in the coffers of the Tory and Labour parties we wouldn't be having this conversation. OS. What’s your idea of a safety net OS ? Surely a couple of fat ex footballers cooling themselves down with a bingo fan covers it.
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Post by dutchstokie on Dec 4, 2020 13:57:48 GMT
Arent the gambling laws in America also changing in some way? I thought this was the next 'pot of honey' Denise was wanting to dip her fingers into..... It's open on a state by state basis I think. 365 are already in New Jersey but I'm not certain it's proving to be the cash cow that many thought yet. Ah got you..... This is a quick read BUT seems very confusing to me at least.... some things seem to contradict each other......at least thats the way I read it. www.legalzoom.com/articles/online-gambling-is-it-legal#:~:text=There%20is%20no%20federal%20law,is%20little%20chance%20of%20prosecution.
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Post by spitthedog on Dec 4, 2020 14:36:52 GMT
As usual, the actions of a few determine the fate of most. Every facet of liberalism is always open to attack in this way. The way to deal with excesses is to educate and then create a safety net for those who find it difficult to contrain themselves from excesses. If anything, the most harmful thing in society comes about through alcohol abuse. If we follow this line of banning things then alcohol advertising should be top of the list. So the question is, why isn't that being done? The answer is simple... it brings in too much dosh to attack it. I'll guarantee that if Denise threw a billion quid each in the coffers of the Tory and Labour parties we wouldn't be having this conversation. OS. That's fair enough. I'd be interested to know in what way people feel their rights would be diminished by these specific proposals though. There are obviously strong powerful lobbyists around Government who are against any restrictions on Gambling, that is why the excellent Tracey Crouch was forced to resign after the Gov't failed to fulfil its own Manifesto promise to limit maximum stakes for fixed-odds betting machines after sitting on it for 2 years.
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Post by mickeythemaestro on Dec 4, 2020 15:38:27 GMT
If they do have to drop the name of the Stadium, I'd like to go back to the original Britannia name, possibly in combination with the name of a new main sponsor. So the JCB Britannia or something similar would suit the bill and we fans could simply carry on calling it "The Brit". I've never stopped calling it the Vic to be honest.
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Post by flea79 on Dec 4, 2020 15:46:29 GMT
Them bingo adverts need banning as well, full stop! Bingo should be banned online full stop And once all the old biddies have gone it will reach the timely death it deserves disgraceful opinion that my wife and i enjoy a trip to the bingo, we used to go a lot more before we had a daughter, we have both won a lot of money over the years, we used to go with her mother before she passed away too so its nice but i digress, the variety of ages that go is huge, during the weekday it is mainly the older ladies but evenings and weekends you get lots of ages, cheap drink and the chance to win your night our paid for makes it a great starting point
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Post by lawrieleslie on Dec 4, 2020 15:48:53 GMT
I wonder if they will do what F1 did and have similar logos to actual gambling logos. One famous one was Buzzing Hornets which looked remarkably like Benson & Hedges. And in motorcycling they had Lucky Stryer, which looked like Lucky Strike. Elizabeth365 strikes a chord with me
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Post by werrington on Dec 4, 2020 15:49:31 GMT
It would be the ultimate irony (and a very Stoke type situation) if a wonderful local owner of a club was hounded out of the game while a plethora of foreign owners bent on destroying the structure of our game are allowed to run amok - especially as the source of their funds in many cases really does not bare close examination!! That’s a superb post
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Post by salopstick on Dec 4, 2020 20:17:01 GMT
Anybody registered to a club be it player or staff should not be allowed in gambling adverts either.
How can they not let players or managers gamble but allow klopp and morhino be in the adverts
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Post by Linx on Dec 4, 2020 20:48:10 GMT
While I appreciate bet365’s financial clout that underpins the club, I have always been slightly uncomfortable with it, and especially have always disliked the renaming of the stadium. I know it’s all money these days, but couldn’t a more geographically or culturally referenced, more permanent, name for the stadium have been used, like The Potteries Stadium, or The Six Towns Stadium, or something? And what was wrong with Cristal Tiles anyway? As Bet365 is Staffordshire's biggest business (4 miles from the stadium) employing the most staff, I'd say you don't get more local.. I appreciate that but, if you asked people across the world what they associate with Stoke, I think the potteries would come top, and some might get to the six towns. Bet365 might get a look in at a local level but it won’t necessarily be in the history books in a couple of hundred years time. The name of the stadium is linked to its chief sponsor, whoever it is at that time; my point was that a stadium’s name should have more permanence and therefore resonance.
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Post by dirtclod on Dec 4, 2020 21:43:45 GMT
Good evening ladies and gentlemen and welcome to Viagra Stadium! We ask you to remain erect for the singing of the national anthem...
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Post by spitthedog on Dec 4, 2020 22:57:09 GMT
As Bet365 is Staffordshire's biggest business (4 miles from the stadium) employing the most staff, I'd say you don't get more local.. I appreciate that but, if you asked people across the world what they associate with Stoke, I think the potteries would come top, and some might get to the six towns. Bet365 might get a look in at a local level but it won’t necessarily be in the history books in a couple of hundred years time. The name of the stadium is linked to its chief sponsor, whoever it is at that time; my point was that a stadium’s name should have more permanence and therefore resonance. I agree. Bet365 is both a crass and soulless name for the home of a football club that's been around for over 150 years.
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Post by madnellie on Dec 5, 2020 6:00:18 GMT
If we’re going to ban gambling advertising then fast-food and alcohol advertising should be banned also. Obesity costs the NHS and society billions each year and according to the NHS website 1 in 7 premature deaths could be prevented by people being a healthy weight. The statistics on alcohol abuse are also similar and both cause misery on families. I very much agree with this. If you ban the advertising of one thing that the majority of people enjoy without any issue, where do you draw the line? Alcohol for example is absolutely everywhere, to the extent that a significant minority of people find you weird for not drinking. I'm sober myself and of course it's hard having it in my face all the time, but part of recovery is learning to deal with that.
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Post by fca47 on Dec 5, 2020 11:17:17 GMT
If anything the families of gambling addicts want protection from them. They are whiney little shits who can't control their urges , have no sympathy for them at all, always blaming someone else for their own actions, take some responsibilty. It's just become a campaign by the "holier than thou" middle class lefties.
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Post by BristolMick on Dec 5, 2020 11:58:13 GMT
If anything the families of gambling addicts want protection from them. They are whiney little shits who can't control their urges , have no sympathy for them at all, always blaming someone else for their own actions, take some responsibilty. It's just become a campaign by the "holier than thou" middle class lefties. I never have understood how anyone can get addicted to gambling either and was once of the opinion that that people who do that are feckless selfish imbeciles who deserve all they get, BUT I now understand that it’s a mental health illness and as dangerous a addiction as any other addiction for which there is so little support for its addicts compared to addicts of drugs and alcohol. That to me is unacceptable considering how much comes into the treasury coffers from this otherwise utterly unproductive industry. Remember when SOTs biggest industries were engaged in necessary production now it’s biggest employer is in the industry of parting people from their cash for nothing in return. BM
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Post by spitthedog on Dec 5, 2020 12:06:26 GMT
If anything the families of gambling addicts want protection from them. They are whiney little shits who can't control their urges , have no sympathy for them at all, always blaming someone else for their own actions, take some responsibilty. It's just become a campaign by the "holier than thou" middle class lefties. You would call the families of young guys who have committed suicide due to gambling debts/addictions whiney little shits??? Really? Wow! That's quite shocking tbh
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Post by fca47 on Dec 5, 2020 17:03:45 GMT
If anything the families of gambling addicts want protection from them. They are whiney little shits who can't control their urges , have no sympathy for them at all, always blaming someone else for their own actions, take some responsibilty. It's just become a campaign by the "holier than thou" middle class lefties. You would call the families of young guys who have committed suicide due to gambling debts/addictions whiney little shits??? Really? Wow! That's quite shocking tbh you obviously didn't read what I wrote.
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Post by prestwichpotter on Sept 22, 2021 22:11:32 GMT
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Post by BuzzB on Sept 22, 2021 22:14:50 GMT
We will still look good with Hamzas on the front though.
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Post by march4 on Sept 22, 2021 22:15:01 GMT
A chance for us to advertise the Donna Louise Trust or Caudwell Children on our shirts then. It would be a good way of the club and our very generous owners supporting a local charity.
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Post by danceswithclams on Sept 22, 2021 22:17:00 GMT
Tile Mountain next season then I imagine. Either that or Niğde Kebab House. (I'd deffo buy a Stoke shirt emblazoned with the latter...make it happen Scholesy!)
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