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Post by bayernoatcake on Nov 22, 2020 0:26:54 GMT
I was thinking of a side made from the two sets of players and there’s some horrible decisions up front.
But I honestly think I’d go with Fletcher and Campbell over Mama and Fuller.
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Post by stokefaninde on Nov 22, 2020 3:12:36 GMT
Nothing in points between the top 7. We have scores of young players being bled in and a manager that knows what he is doing. The future is bright for the Potters!
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Post by robwahlmann on Nov 22, 2020 7:58:41 GMT
I was thinking of a side made from the two sets of players and there’s some horrible decisions up front. But I honestly think I’d go with Fletcher and Campbell over Mama and Fuller.  |
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Post by zerps on Nov 22, 2020 8:52:28 GMT
We’ve scored more goals in our last two games than derby have managed all season 🤣
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Post by StaffordPotter on Nov 22, 2020 9:11:33 GMT
I have a good feeling as well. But we'd have to massively invest. This team wouldn't be anywhere close to competing in the Prem. We would certainly need two new fullbacks and a winger, but apart from that we really should have a chance of staying up?  I'd say a new striker as well. Fletcher has been decent but he's getting on a bit now. |
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Post by bayernoatcake on Nov 22, 2020 9:52:52 GMT
I was thinking of a side made from the two sets of players and there’s some horrible decisions up front. But I honestly think I’d go with Fletcher and Campbell over Mama and Fuller. Fletcher is obviously better than Mama so that’s no contest. It then comes down to what you want from the other striker. Fuller was more skilful, Campbell is a better finisher by a mile. |
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Post by BristolMick on Nov 22, 2020 10:14:32 GMT
I had a good instinct about this season and week by week I'm checking points wise v our promotion season. After 12 games that season we had 20 points, scored 19 against 16. So we are 1 point ahead. Also after 17 games that year we had 24 points and we are on 21 already. Fingers crossed 🙏 In other news after 12 games last season sitting in 7th place on 21 points just like we are today, were Charlton Athletic. BM |
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Post by Lakeland Potter on Nov 22, 2020 10:23:33 GMT
We would certainly need two new fullbacks and a winger, but apart from that we really should have a chance of staying up? I'd say a new striker as well. Fletcher has been decent but he's getting on a bit now. Don't get side tracked by the need to upgrade the team if we get promoted. ALL sides promoted to the Prem need to spend good money to upgrade their starting eleven. Luckily a promoted club's income increases by AT LEAST £100 MILLION and all of it needs to be spent on transfer fees and increased wages. We need to concern ourselves now about getting promotion - and leave the "how do we cope when we are promoted?" until it happens. |
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Post by march4 on Nov 22, 2020 10:58:10 GMT
I will update my regular comparison with our previous three promotion campaigns after another game.
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Post by followyoudown on Nov 22, 2020 11:13:29 GMT
Fletcher is obviously better than Mama so that’s no contest. It then comes down to what you want from the other striker. Fuller was more skilful, Campbell is a better finisher by a mile. Campbell is probably the best finisher we have had since Stein, without Fuller the promotion side would have finished mid table, Campbell will undoubtedly be the better player long term and go further but for now I'd still pick Fuller, although as long as Pulis isnt manager of the combined team playing his favoured 8-1----------1 formation no reason we couldn't play 4-3-3 and pick both  |
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Post by bayernoatcake on Nov 22, 2020 11:15:35 GMT
Fletcher is obviously better than Mama so that’s no contest. It then comes down to what you want from the other striker. Fuller was more skilful, Campbell is a better finisher by a mile. Campbell is probably the best finisher we have had since Stein, without Fuller the promotion side would have finished mid table, Campbell will undoubtedly be the better player long term and go further but for now I'd still pick Fuller, although as long as Pulis isnt manager of the combined team playing his favoured 8-1----------1 formation no reason we couldn't play 4-3-3 and pick both Yeah and I did make an XI and typed it out and had Fuller on the left of a 3 and hated even looking at it so deleted it 😂 But that is what you’d have to do. |
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Post by RF10 on Nov 22, 2020 12:07:16 GMT
Fletcher is obviously better than Mama so that’s no contest. It then comes down to what you want from the other striker. Fuller was more skilful, Campbell is a better finisher by a mile. The Great Man was a genius at coming off the bench and flipping the game, so let's just bring him on at 60 mins every week. Nah I've changed my mind already he starts. |
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Post by Widget123 on Nov 22, 2020 12:56:10 GMT
Fletcher is obviously better than Mama so that’s no contest. It then comes down to what you want from the other striker. Fuller was more skilful, Campbell is a better finisher by a mile. Also the games weren't quite so thick and fast in 07/08. We were knocked out of both cups first round too. That said you'd still need squad rotation. Fuller and Campbell with either fletcher or sidebe around them providing service and knockdowns would be lethal in this league. Cresswell did so much that season in a fudged wing position too and this season we have a more wing based setup. Midfield wise there's an embarrassment of riches : Allen, eustice, clucas, Powell, delap, whelan and mcclean. (I'm trying to avoid one season loanees too). Defence wise: Griffin, batth, shawcross, Soutter, chesters... Goal: simonsen and Davies. I've probably messed up and forfotten someone and obviously that's more players than a single team too...was a fun process though. |
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Post by datguy on Nov 22, 2020 13:04:08 GMT
Campbell is probably the best finisher we have had since Stein, without Fuller the promotion side would have finished mid table, Campbell will undoubtedly be the better player long term and go further but for now I'd still pick Fuller, although as long as Pulis isnt manager of the combined team playing his favoured 8-1----------1 formation no reason we couldn't play 4-3-3 and pick both Yeah and I did make an XI and typed it out and had Fuller on the left of a 3 and hated even looking at it so deleted it 😂 But that is what you’d have to do. Which Shawcross did you pick? 07/08 or 20/21? |
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Post by bayernoatcake on Nov 22, 2020 13:05:22 GMT
Yeah and I did make an XI and typed it out and had Fuller on the left of a 3 and hated even looking at it so deleted it 😂 But that is what you’d have to do. Which Shawcross did you pick? 07/08 or 20/21? 07/08, the current one broke down en route 😭 |
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Post by blackpoolred on Nov 22, 2020 18:56:07 GMT
Heartwarming: is the form of Campbell, the potential of Clucas, Powell, Fletcher coming into full form and if we could get Allen back and in form too, we are a threat. Also some of the youngsters coming through particularly TOB and Souttar Heartbreaking: The defence - been catastrophic for years and nothing ever changes and now we are in a position where we can't change it. We have absolutely no chance of promotion - the promotion team was built on solid foundations and a strong defence, this team will need to score at least 3 to get a result against the better teams The defence - if Shawcross comes back at anywhere near top form will improve. I think we underestimate how much he organises the defence and coaches younger players with quiet words. After what MON said yesterday I'm optimistic. True, but is he now not part of our problem if truth be told: Wimmer has a contract till 2022 and he is on prem wages and we will not get rid of him until his contract ends in 2022 - at least there is an endpoint with Wimmer even if we now have to wait 2 years. However, Shawx could potentially be a chain around our neck for some time to come, we could be paying him prem wages for quite some time if we/he keeps trying to persist - the reality is - is that he may never have a decent run in our team again. Until both move on we cannot bring another central defender in - which potentially could be quite a few years away. Collins could turn out to be a great player but he is not ready now, in my opinion - and maybe even our managers and with all of the aforementioned it leaves us very little option in the centre of defence - quality wise and depth. We have a manger that likes to play wing-backs but has none in his squad and we are in dire straights once again in terms of goalkeepers - at the very least until xmas which is a quarter of the season in terms of games from now till then. MON is a miracle worker when it comes to getting results, very clever yesterday with his tactics - but he can't perform the impossible. For me he is going to need 5 or 6 windows and 3 years before he can build a team of players that he would like to work with, and possibly a top six team, and more importantly get rid of the high earners in the squad so that we don't incur any FFP penalties |
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Post by nottsover60 on Nov 22, 2020 19:02:58 GMT
The defence - if Shawcross comes back at anywhere near top form will improve. I think we underestimate how much he organises the defence and coaches younger players with quiet words. After what MON said yesterday I'm optimistic. True, but is he now not part of our problem if truth be told: Wimmer has a contract till 2022 and he is on prem wages and we will not get rid of him until his contract ends in 2022 - at least there is an endpoint with Wimmer even if we now have to wait 2 years. However, Shawx could potentially be a chain around our neck for some time to come, we could be paying him prem wages for quite some time if we/he keeps trying to persist - the reality is - is that he may never have a decent run in our team again. Until both move on we cannot bring another central defender in - which potentially could be quite a few years away. Collins could turn out to be a great player but he is not ready now, in my opinion - and maybe even our managers and with all of the aforementioned it leaves us very little option in the centre of defence - quality wise and depth. We have a manger that likes to play wing-backs but has none in his squad and we are in dire straights once again in terms of goalkeepers - at the very least until xmas which is a quarter of the season in terms of games from now till then. MON is a miracle worker when it comes to getting results, very clever yesterday with his tactics - but he can't perform the impossible. For me he is going to need 5 or 6 windows and 3 years before he can build a team of players that he would like to work with, and possibly a top six team, and more importantly get rid of the high earners in the squad so that we don't incur any FFP penalties Totally disagree. To compare Shawcross to Wimmer is ludicrous and disrespectful. He has more than repaid the club over the years and like Mikel if he an come back fit enough not to break down injured every 2 or 3 matches will be such a calming presence in that defence unlike Batth who is the first to panic under pressure. Why would we want to bring in another centre half? We have at least two for the future and Chester will leave at the end of the season if Shawcross is back fit. I know which I'd have as my calming presence. |
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Post by Rt Hon Reverend Luvpump on Nov 22, 2020 19:15:04 GMT
Just sorting Sunday dinner watching the Leeds game and thinking about yesterday’s match,I think last season Leeds went through a patch of high scoring games and me thinking they’ll never get promoted with a defence like that but they did maybe we’ll emulate that this season
Lamb dinner by the way with a bottle of red 😀
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Post by mickstupp on Nov 22, 2020 19:26:11 GMT
It’s worth pointing out that there were several occasions in the 07/08 season that we were a shambles defensively aswell which seems to have been forgotten over time.
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Post by mrcoke on Nov 22, 2020 20:30:42 GMT
The Championship is a marathon, you need a squad with a depth of talent, players with stamina and not injury prone, and character. I think we are alright. The going gets tough as you go into the last quarter of the season when teams in relegation places start causing upsets. How many times did Leeds look like promotion only to fall away in the final weeks? Every team has upsets and hits a sticky patch at some point of the season. You need players whose heads don't go down and able to dig out results. We have played poorly this season and still got a result. I think we are alright. You need a good manager. I think we are alright. Successful teams have sound defences. We are not good enough yet and must get better.  Luck? You make your own luck.  |
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Post by lordb on Nov 22, 2020 20:37:18 GMT
It’s worth pointing out that there were several occasions in the 07/08 season that we were a shambles defensively aswell which seems to have been forgotten over time. Coventry put 4 past us at home |
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Post by mickstupp on Nov 22, 2020 20:40:32 GMT
It’s worth pointing out that there were several occasions in the 07/08 season that we were a shambles defensively aswell which seems to have been forgotten over time. Coventry put 4 past us at home And then another 3 at home to Sheffield Wednesday the following week. |
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Post by blackpoolred on Nov 23, 2020 17:44:17 GMT
True, but is he now not part of our problem if truth be told: Wimmer has a contract till 2022 and he is on prem wages and we will not get rid of him until his contract ends in 2022 - at least there is an endpoint with Wimmer even if we now have to wait 2 years. However, Shawx could potentially be a chain around our neck for some time to come, we could be paying him prem wages for quite some time if we/he keeps trying to persist - the reality is - is that he may never have a decent run in our team again. Until both move on we cannot bring another central defender in - which potentially could be quite a few years away. Collins could turn out to be a great player but he is not ready now, in my opinion - and maybe even our managers and with all of the aforementioned it leaves us very little option in the centre of defence - quality wise and depth. We have a manger that likes to play wing-backs but has none in his squad and we are in dire straights once again in terms of goalkeepers - at the very least until xmas which is a quarter of the season in terms of games from now till then. MON is a miracle worker when it comes to getting results, very clever yesterday with his tactics - but he can't perform the impossible. For me he is going to need 5 or 6 windows and 3 years before he can build a team of players that he would like to work with, and possibly a top six team, and more importantly get rid of the high earners in the squad so that we don't incur any FFP penalties Totally disagree. To compare Shawcross to Wimmer is ludicrous and disrespectful. He has more than repaid the club over the years and like Mikel if he an come back fit enough not to break down injured every 2 or 3 matches will be such a calming presence in that defence unlike Batth who is the first to panic under pressure. Why would we want to bring in another centre half? We have at least two for the future and Chester will leave at the end of the season if Shawcross is back fit. I know which I'd have as my calming presence. No comparison made, 1 is an SCFC legend the other will finish playing football in 2022 unless he wants to play in the Belgium 8th division with Berahino. Both players, though, are preventing us from bringing in a quality centre-half who we can pay a decent wage for. Yes, If Shawx can come back and even reach 80% of his former self then he is miles better than anything that we currently have and he would be brilliant for the youngsters. What are the odds of him ever playing a prolonged period for us ever again though - I would say very short at the moment. Of course, the Coates family are not going to pull the trigger on Shawx - they will give him as long as he needs and keep backing him - the question is - is how long do we persist, it could go on for some time - even longer than the Wimmer saga. We cannot pay top whack wages to attract a decent centre-half, while we are paying prem wages for 2 other central defenders - both of which are not playing which leaves us short on quality and depth in that position and no real get-out clause, in terms of bringing backup/quality in. We have a manager whos preference is 5 at the back with 3 central defenders - do we have 3 viable central defenders to choose from at the moment - if we are thinking promotion as per the OP That is just in the central defence area, he also likes wing-backs and we don't have any - we arguably only have 1 viable left/right-back at the club and neither of those are what I would class as real top half material. So, as stated, I think it is going to take a couple of years - 5 or 6 windows - for MON to be able to start building the team he wants and for the club to be able to start making attractive offers to bring decent players in - for a while the rhetoric will be to offload in the coming windows as it has been in the last few and see if we can hunt around the lower leagues for a bargain. |
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Post by nottsover60 on Nov 24, 2020 10:08:58 GMT
Totally disagree. To compare Shawcross to Wimmer is ludicrous and disrespectful. He has more than repaid the club over the years and like Mikel if he an come back fit enough not to break down injured every 2 or 3 matches will be such a calming presence in that defence unlike Batth who is the first to panic under pressure. Why would we want to bring in another centre half? We have at least two for the future and Chester will leave at the end of the season if Shawcross is back fit. I know which I'd have as my calming presence. No comparison made, 1 is an SCFC legend the other will finish playing football in 2022 unless he wants to play in the Belgium 8th division with Berahino. Both players, though, are preventing us from bringing in a quality centre-half who we can pay a decent wage for. Yes, If Shawx can come back and even reach 80% of his former self then he is miles better than anything that we currently have and he would be brilliant for the youngsters. What are the odds of him ever playing a prolonged period for us ever again though - I would say very short at the moment. Of course, the Coates family are not going to pull the trigger on Shawx - they will give him as long as he needs and keep backing him - the question is - is how long do we persist, it could go on for some time - even longer than the Wimmer saga. We cannot pay top whack wages to attract a decent centre-half, while we are paying prem wages for 2 other central defenders - both of which are not playing which leaves us short on quality and depth in that position and no real get-out clause, in terms of bringing backup/quality in. We have a manager whos preference is 5 at the back with 3 central defenders - do we have 3 viable central defenders to choose from at the moment - if we are thinking promotion as per the OP That is just in the central defence area, he also likes wing-backs and we don't have any - we arguably only have 1 viable left/right-back at the club and neither of those are what I would class as real top half material. So, as stated, I think it is going to take a couple of years - 5 or 6 windows - for MON to be able to start building the team he wants and for the club to be able to start making attractive offers to bring decent players in - for a while the rhetoric will be to offload in the coming windows as it has been in the last few and see if we can hunt around the lower leagues for a bargain. And which top class centre half are you thinking of enticing to Stoke at the moment? No one who is better than Shawcross will join us unless they themselves are in decline or have injury problems. If they are lower league I'm pretty sure we would be a very attractive prospect at the moment even if we can't offer top wages. If we get promoted FFP won't hamper us so I don't understand where you're coming from on Shawcross. Even not playing he offers the club so much. He cannot be grouped alongside Wimmer and Bauer. |
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Post by FranktheRabbit on Nov 24, 2020 11:16:56 GMT
Don’t know about anyone else but I wouldn’t want to get promoted this season anyway. Not saying I would complain, but for one not being able to see it happen is a huge downer and I also don’t think we’re quite ready for it yet anyway. Wouldn’t mind another season in the championship.
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Post by apb1 on Nov 24, 2020 11:48:40 GMT
Don’t know about anyone else but I wouldn’t want to get promoted this season anyway. Not saying I would complain, but for one not being able to see it happen is a huge downer and I also don’t think we’re quite ready for it yet anyway. Wouldn’t mind another season in the championship. The money is such a factor. Even if we came straight back down our nest would be feathered for 3 more years of parachute payments. Also this is a very hard league to get out of so if we have a genie offering us that wish, we should deffo take it |
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Post by stokie1947 on Nov 24, 2020 12:07:33 GMT
Over the last 10 Championship seasons, no side has finished lower than fifth having claimed 84 points.
But as far as second place is concerned, sides in the Championship - since the league was restructured in 2004 - who take runner-up spot average a total of 87 points
Over the last 16 campaigns, Brighton (2016/17) and Burnley (2013/14) hold the joint-record for being the Championship runners-up to claim the most points (93).
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Post by FranktheRabbit on Nov 24, 2020 12:31:33 GMT
Don’t know about anyone else but I wouldn’t want to get promoted this season anyway. Not saying I would complain, but for one not being able to see it happen is a huge downer and I also don’t think we’re quite ready for it yet anyway. Wouldn’t mind another season in the championship. The money is such a factor. Even if we came straight back down our nest would be feathered for 3 more years of parachute payments. Also this is a very hard league to get out of so if we have a genie offering us that wish, we should deffo take it  Not so sure myself. I agree with the parachute payments would be useful, but going up to just come back down again isn't for me. I'd rather wait another season and strengthen a little more, just so we have a better chance at establishing ourselves in the Prem again. |
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Post by Fred Merger on Nov 24, 2020 12:35:00 GMT
Don’t know about anyone else but I wouldn’t want to get promoted this season anyway. Not saying I would complain, but for one not being able to see it happen is a huge downer and I also don’t think we’re quite ready for it yet anyway. Wouldn’t mind another season in the championship. The money is such a factor. Even if we came straight back down our nest would be feathered for 3 more years of parachute payments. Also this is a very hard league to get out of so if we have a genie offering us that wish, we should deffo take it If you come straight back down you would only get 2 years of parachute payments. But still not to be sneezed at. I would settle for being a top 8 or so championship team than becoming another Norwich or West Brom. |
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Post by xchpotter on Nov 24, 2020 12:46:26 GMT
You would have to take promotion...why wouldn’t you? It guarantees an increased income, better players arrive, you get to see better players in the flesh, the profile of the club is raised, the profile of the city is raised, you may get better youth players who decide to sign based upon being a Premier League club........and most of all? It pisses The Vale off even more. It’s a complete no brainier for me..promotion any time, any place, any how.
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