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Post by xchpotter on Oct 25, 2020 8:35:52 GMT
He’s one of those players who has a fairly low back lift when he shoots making it difficult for defenders to work out if he’s shooting or taking another touch. Shooting on sight is also a useful asset. As he gains experience, stamina and strength, I agree he will be some player.. He reminds me a bit of Daniel Sturridge,but without that awkward running action.
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Post by nottsover60 on Oct 25, 2020 8:37:41 GMT
Thought he was excellent today but even within that, think he has so much to improve on, which is actually quite frightening. He still doesn't use his frame as well as he could, which for me is only a matter of time as he gets more experienced. When he does, christ. He's getting there though. I loved the way he left da Silva, no light weight himself, on the ground at one point in the second half.
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Post by bolders on Oct 25, 2020 8:55:26 GMT
If Burnley need another striker they can have Vokes back
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Post by Lakeland Potter on Oct 25, 2020 9:44:58 GMT
Last season we had a youngster who was very raw but obviously a potentially lethal striker. Much to the surprise of many (including me) we now have a player who looks as if he will develop into a really good second striker who will provide quality assists to match his own strike rate. There will be a lot of top strikers in the Premier League who will look at Campbell's assists and his new found ability to use both feet equally effectively, who will start to put pressure on their managers to sign him up if he carries on the way he is doing.
Another year should further improve his stamina (although he has improved in that respect) and a year or two should also see him start to use his physique to bully defenders more than he does. So there is more to come and I do hope that, if we eventually get an offer we can't refuse, it comes AFTER he has developed his stamina and strength so that we get the sort of fee which he will then be worth, rather than the lower fee which any top club would offer now. I'm sure that offers by next summer will be tempting to a club like ourselves which has FFP constraints - hopefully the Coates family will trust that a further 12 months beyond next summer will see his value double or better and will be able to convince Tyrese not to agitate for a move too early.
EDIT - I wonder if an England call up to the first team is on the cards? There are certainly youngsters being capped who won't get as many games for their club as Tyrese will this season.
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Post by tachyon on Oct 25, 2020 10:50:21 GMT
I mentioned "pitch control" a few weeks back in an analytics post. It's the area of the field a player can get to before an opponent. Here's a cool graphic that illustrates that point and shows how a) Fletcher (circled) found space to own the far post & b) Campbell got the ball there before it disappeared. Attachment Deleted
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Post by iglugluk on Oct 25, 2020 11:22:35 GMT
I mentioned "pitch control" a few weeks back in an analytics post. It's the area of the field a player can get to before an opponent. Here's a cool graphic that illustrates that point and shows how a) Fletcher (circled) found space to own the far post & b) Campbell got the ball there before it disappeared. View AttachmentThe Club should definitely offer you employment.
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Post by iglugluk on Oct 25, 2020 11:24:57 GMT
I see Burnley, amongst others, are reportedly sniffing around. Hopefully we continue building momentum and Campbell sees his future here for the time being.
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Post by gingerninja on Oct 25, 2020 11:26:51 GMT
He will obviously move on at some point in the future, we should be using the Ollie Watkins sale as a yard stick. A couple of seasons at this level of performance and more goals and the price should be reflected.
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Post by bayernoatcake on Oct 25, 2020 11:31:08 GMT
Mirror... I’d say out of every club in the Premier League, Burnley would be his least likely destination. I bet we pay him more now than they would. They were one of the clubs I was told were looking at him this summer.
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Post by kronkie on Oct 25, 2020 11:31:51 GMT
Last season we had a youngster who was very raw but obviously a potentially lethal striker. Much to the surprise of many (including me) we now have a player who looks as if he will develop into a really good second striker who will provide quality assists to match his own strike rate. There will be a lot of top strikers in the Premier League who will look at Campbell's assists and his new found ability to use both feet equally effectively, who will start to put pressure on their managers to sign him up if he carries on the way he is doing. Another year should further improve his stamina (although he has improved in that respect) and a year or two should also see him start to use his physique to bully defenders more than he does. So there is more to come and I do hope that, if we eventually get an offer we can't refuse, it comes AFTER he has developed his stamina and strength so that we get the sort of fee which he will then be worth, rather than the lower fee which any top club would offer now. I'm sure that offers by next summer will be tempting to a club like ourselves which has FFP constraints - hopefully the Coates family will trust that a further 12 months beyond next summer will see his value double or better and will be able to convince Tyrese not to agitate for a move too early. EDIT - I wonder if an England call up to the first team is on the cards? There are certainly youngsters being capped who won't get as many games for their club as Tyrese will this season. You have to be joking with your edit comment about England.
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Post by werrington on Oct 25, 2020 11:36:22 GMT
Last season we had a youngster who was very raw but obviously a potentially lethal striker. Much to the surprise of many (including me) we now have a player who looks as if he will develop into a really good second striker who will provide quality assists to match his own strike rate. There will be a lot of top strikers in the Premier League who will look at Campbell's assists and his new found ability to use both feet equally effectively, who will start to put pressure on their managers to sign him up if he carries on the way he is doing. Another year should further improve his stamina (although he has improved in that respect) and a year or two should also see him start to use his physique to bully defenders more than he does. So there is more to come and I do hope that, if we eventually get an offer we can't refuse, it comes AFTER he has developed his stamina and strength so that we get the sort of fee which he will then be worth, rather than the lower fee which any top club would offer now. I'm sure that offers by next summer will be tempting to a club like ourselves which has FFP constraints - hopefully the Coates family will trust that a further 12 months beyond next summer will see his value double or better and will be able to convince Tyrese not to agitate for a move too early. EDIT - I wonder if an England call up to the first team is on the cards? There are certainly youngsters being capped who won't get as many games for their club as Tyrese will this season. You have to be joking with your edit comment about England. I’m sure he means the U23s
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Post by Deleted on Oct 25, 2020 11:37:17 GMT
Im trying to think of a chance he had in his Stoke career when he missed the target? He almost always makes the keeper work which is worth its weight in gold as an attacker.....
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Post by Lakeland Potter on Oct 25, 2020 12:02:08 GMT
You have to be joking with your edit comment about England. I’m sure he means the U23s Obviously a call up to the U21's is the next logical step for Tyrese. But Southgate does seem quite keen to blood youngsters in the first team so it wouldn't surprise me if Ty got a call up after a few U21 games.
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Post by swampmongrel on Oct 25, 2020 12:31:25 GMT
I mentioned "pitch control" a few weeks back in an analytics post. It's the area of the field a player can get to before an opponent. Here's a cool graphic that illustrates that point and shows how a) Fletcher (circled) found space to own the far post & b) Campbell got the ball there before it disappeared. View AttachmentOffside!
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Post by ColonelMustard on Oct 25, 2020 12:31:29 GMT
I dont know if it's been said already, but the third goal was more than a little Fulleresque. Not quite so somehow casual and lugubrious as Rics style, but very nice to see all the same.
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Post by GeneralFaye on Oct 25, 2020 12:36:04 GMT
I’d say out of every club in the Premier League, Burnley would be his least likely destination. I bet we pay him more now than they would. They were one of the clubs I was told were looking at him this summer. When we were "actively trying to sell him" ?.. still think that was complete made up bollocks myself.
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Post by leicspotter on Oct 25, 2020 12:54:20 GMT
I've said before that Ty is the best "finisher" we have on the books. I still think his stamina is a concern because, when he isn't on the pitch, he can't score
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Post by werrington on Oct 25, 2020 12:55:06 GMT
I dont know if it's been said already, but the third goal was more than a little Fulleresque. Not quite so somehow casual and lugubrious as Rics style, but very nice to see all the same. His goal v West Brom at home when he got his hat trick was very similar
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Post by bayernoatcake on Oct 25, 2020 13:20:08 GMT
They were one of the clubs I was told were looking at him this summer. When we were "actively trying to sell him" ?.. still think that was complete made up bollocks myself. I can assure you it wasn't.
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Post by tachyon on Oct 25, 2020 13:21:24 GMT
I mentioned "pitch control" a few weeks back in an analytics post. It's the area of the field a player can get to before an opponent. Here's a cool graphic that illustrates that point and shows how a) Fletcher (circled) found space to own the far post & b) Campbell got the ball there before it disappeared. View AttachmentOffside! The 4 steps in just before Campbell crosses, we're fine. Here's one showing our defensive shape. The Brentford player shoots (terrible decision). Both the wide defenders are slightly hung out to dry. The left side isn't too bad (one Brentford player is likely offside, the other's fairly wide & the ball carrier has turned his back on them, anyway). Right side is more dodgy. Our positioning could be better, players have been sucked into the D & either of their left sided attackers has a decent amount of uncontested penalty area to run into with a half decent pass. Attachment Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Oct 25, 2020 13:35:18 GMT
Don't see him going to Burnley, he has done a good job of putting his development first in his career it's why he rightly wanted to leave us when Jones was in charge and chose to stay when MON took over.
Burnley are very much a 'do this role' kind of club, which I don't see developing players and allow absolutely no freedom. Not sure he is quite Premier League ready so I don't think he will leave next summer so long as we play alright, but if we don't get promoted the following season I imagine he could well be off.
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Post by biglad180 on Oct 25, 2020 14:40:13 GMT
we have 3 or 4 very good prospects comming through now and ty is very much one of them we should not be tempted by any offer other than a massive one for any of them, if we have any thoughts of going up we must keep them,
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Post by nott1 on Oct 25, 2020 14:45:53 GMT
Not really much of a tempter being chased by Burnley, he might as well stay with us for another few months when we go up!
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Post by GeneralFaye on Oct 25, 2020 15:04:22 GMT
Can Burnley even afford him? Dyche has hardly been backed of late and we've got to be looking towards £20m for him even if it seems inflated.
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Post by tachyon on Oct 26, 2020 8:43:50 GMT
One last pitch control graphic. Our second goal, Campbell's part in it & the off the ball contribution that always goes unnoticed. Pic 1. Ball breaks to JOM, we've got a big overlap on the left. Plays a simple, but effective pass out to Campbell. (Mikel's part won't appear in counting stats, assists etc, but will appear in a ball progression model). Pic 2. Attacking youngsters improve for playing time (defenders improve for maturing & strengthening). Campbell has an easy option to shuffle the ball onto McClean, but that won't add much if any value to the possession (it'll probably reduce it). Pic 3. A game experienced Campbell instead carries the ball, that opens up the left hand bit of the area as a comfortable passing option to JM. Easy possession in the box is always a positive. It also adds value to the possession by getting closer to the Brentford goal. Pic 4. JM scores. But the interesting bits are SF getting in between the two central defenders to grab a huge piece of pitch control in the six yard box if the keeper parries it & JB undercuts SF to take control of a big chunk of real estate around the penalty spot. Campbell's now playing spectator (we can forgive him that), but a quick burst would have put him in front of the Brentford defender & Stoke would completely dominate the high value parts of the box *and* have possession of the ball. Nine out of ten for attacking boxes ticked. Attachment Deleted
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Post by Lakeland Potter on Oct 26, 2020 8:56:42 GMT
One last pitch control graphic. Our second goal, Campbell's part in it & the off the ball contribution that always goes unnoticed. Pic 1. Ball breaks to JOM, we've got a big overlap on the left. Plays a simple, but effective pass out to Campbell. (Mikel's part won't appear in counting stats, assists etc, but will appear in a ball progression model). Pic 2. Attacking youngsters improve for playing time (defenders improve for maturing & strengthening). Campbell has an easy option to shuffle the ball onto McClean, but that won't add much if any value to the possession (it'll probably reduce it). Pic 3. A game experienced Campbell instead carries the ball, that opens up the left hand bit of the area as a comfortable passing option to JM. Easy possession in the box is always a positive. It also adds value to the possession by getting closer to the Brentford goal. Pic 4. JM scores. But the interesting bits are SF getting in between the two central defenders to grab a huge piece of pitch control in the six yard box if the keeper parries it & JB undercuts SF to take control of a big chunk of real estate around the penalty spot. Campbell's now playing spectator (we can forgive him that), but a quick burst would have put him in front of the Brentford defender & Stoke would completely dominate the high value parts of the box *and* have possession of the ball. Nine out of ten for attacking boxes ticked. View Attachment Cheers for that Tachyon - fascinating stuff. As a matter of interest will Stoke have access to this sort of analysis for every part of every game? And, if they do, will they employ their own analysts to provide it, or can it be obtained (purchased?) from commercial sources? Finally, do you harbour any ambition to do this sort of job for Stoke - or could they not afford you?
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Post by tachyon on Oct 26, 2020 9:43:18 GMT
Cheers for that Tachyon - fascinating stuff. As a matter of interest will Stoke have access to this sort of analysis for every part of every game? And, if they do, will they employ their own analysts to provide it, or can it be obtained (purchased?) from commercial sources? Finally, do you harbour any ambition to do this sort of job for Stoke - or could they not afford you? Can't speak for the current setup, but I know some analytical companies that have previously made the trek to the Bet365. Liverpool run quantified pitch control via full video, to examine choices made & rejected by the players. Screen-grabbing, as above is a doddle & making a model to value any possession to annotate it took me a whole morning to build. So it's not difficult. I've seen the original TC play, so I'm strictly part time nowadays, but I've turned down (with all due respect to Stoke) much bigger clubs ;-)
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Post by Lakeland Potter on Oct 26, 2020 10:01:25 GMT
Cheers for that Tachyon - fascinating stuff. As a matter of interest will Stoke have access to this sort of analysis for every part of every game? And, if they do, will they employ their own analysts to provide it, or can it be obtained (purchased?) from commercial sources? Finally, do you harbour any ambition to do this sort of job for Stoke - or could they not afford you? Can't speak for the current setup, but I know some analytical companies that have previously made the trek to the Bet365. Liverpool run quantified pitch control via full video, to examine choices made & rejected by the players. Screen-grabbing, as above is a doddle & making a model to value any possession to annotate it took me a whole morning to build. So it's not difficult. I've seen the original TC play, so I'm strictly part time nowadays, but I've turned down (with all due respect to Stoke) much bigger clubs ;-) Ah, so you are close to the same generation as me. I quite understand that you are now part time. I do hope Stoke are alive to the possibilities of this sort of thing. They should be, seeing that their main business bet365 is only possible because of modern technology. Sometimes I can't help wishing that, of all the Coates family, it was Denise who was the Stoke fanatic.
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Post by sd22 on Oct 26, 2020 10:50:12 GMT
Thought he was excellent today but even within that, think he has so much to improve on, which is actually quite frightening. He still doesn't use his frame as well as he could, which for me is only a matter of time as he gets more experienced. When he does, christ. I saw him use his frame at a home game last year, in which he floored a couple of players whilst shielding the ball and turning to run into the box. To which I shouted the meme(if you know, you know) “LOOK AT THE STREEEEEEEEEEGTHHH” I’ve been advocating him to my family since the season before he made his debut and I couldn’t be more pleased of how he’s doing. A stellar player, with his best to come!
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Post by Deleted on Nov 3, 2020 16:05:03 GMT
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