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Post by boskampsflaps on Aug 24, 2020 11:02:42 GMT
Why don't we just keep Lindsay? For sure he got off to a bad start, but how many players settle in from the go? How many players settle when the manager is mad Nathan? Lindsay's more assured on the ball than any of the other slow feet we have in the position. He's not slower than they are (well not exactly a recommendation, but still quicker than Batth, Bruno, Chester, and the other one). He's got good positional sense and is strong in the air. He doesn't get sent off all the time. He just had a bad start, but I can't understand why he doesn't at least get 30-45 mins to prove himself. O'Neill doesn't operate a bomb squad, or so he says, but he does come mighty close with some. I'd happily have him in over Chester, clearly O'Neill has his favorites, most do, its a shame one of them has shown to be poor and we still signed him.
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Post by benjaminbiscuit on Aug 24, 2020 11:06:29 GMT
How much money have we lost on players since he came here £14m Berahino, £18.3m Imbula, £18m Wimmer and on it goes, we are now scratching around for old freebies which he has overseen, we have players out on loan just to get the wage bill down who have contributed very little and will contribute even less, can you explain why he is still in a job here ? He doesn't pick the players and given he's not really a football man would have to have advice etc from the managers and scouts re what we're willing to spend, I'm amazed he gats the brunt of it, I souldn't be because whatever goes wrong at the club its always on him for some. Wimmer/Bera for example, Hughes wanted both and raved about both but Scholes gets it in the neck still for their signings, he's the money man, if they're in budget and he gets them signed he's done his job. He’s either the chief executive Running the business as he’s paid to do or he’s the bean counter if it’s the first he’s utterly clueless Measured by every metric If it’s the latter he’s 700k overpaid either way he’s a huge issue
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Post by chiswickpotter on Aug 24, 2020 11:07:47 GMT
Genuine question, do you think Tony Scholes suggested and forced Nathan Jones to sign Liam Lindsey? Isn't this where we need a technical director though? At the time we had Shawcross, Batth, Indi, Collins, Souttar, Cameron, Wimmer and then after we signed him we got Carter-Vickers too. There was absolutely no need for either. Indi was meant to leave, Cameron had said he didn't want to play for us anymore as had Wimmer, Souttar isn't good enough and Collins was largely untested. Signing a left sided centre ack who was relatively cheap and young seemed the right strategy. Problem is he is hopeless, slow, awful on the ball, poor positional sense and not good at marking a man but Nathan Jones wanted him.
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Post by chiswickpotter on Aug 24, 2020 11:09:59 GMT
He doesn't pick the players and given he's not really a football man would have to have advice etc from the managers and scouts re what we're willing to spend, I'm amazed he gats the brunt of it, I souldn't be because whatever goes wrong at the club its always on him for some. Wimmer/Bera for example, Hughes wanted both and raved about both but Scholes gets it in the neck still for their signings, he's the money man, if they're in budget and he gets them signed he's done his job. He’s either the chief executive Running the business as he’s paid to do or he’s the bean counter if it’s the first he’s utterly clueless Measured by every metric If it’s the latter he’s 700k overpaid either way he’s a huge issue But the only way Rowett and Jones would come to Stoke was if they were allowed to sign who they wanted. Given how desperate the owners were to secure both managers, control over transfers was effectively given away. The CEO's job was to make them happen, he is down the pecking order on the football side
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Post by CBUFAWKIPWH on Aug 24, 2020 11:15:02 GMT
Why don't we just keep Lindsay? For sure he got off to a bad start, but how many players settle in from the go? How many players settle when the manager is mad Nathan? Lindsay's more assured on the ball than any of the other slow feet we have in the position. He's not slower than they are (well not exactly a recommendation, but still quicker than Batth, Bruno, Chester, and the other one). He's got good positional sense and is strong in the air. He doesn't get sent off all the time. He just had a bad start, but I can't understand why he doesn't at least get 30-45 mins to prove himself. O'Neill doesn't operate a bomb squad, or so he says, but he does come mighty close with some. I'd happily have him in over Chester, clearly O'Neill has his favorites, most do, its a shame one of them has shown to be poor and we still signed him. Do you actually think O'Neill just likes some players over others or forms an opinion about players based on there performances in training and in games? I think the latter - any manager who bases selection decisions on anything as irrelevant as how likeable they are is doomed to failure. O'Neill has sidelined players like Etebo for not wanting to be here and Edwards because of his behaviour but not many on what appear to footballing grounds. He simply doesn't seem to rate Lindsay - and might that be because Lindsay actually isn't that good rather than he isn't teacher's pet?
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Post by crapslinger on Aug 24, 2020 11:20:13 GMT
How much money have we lost on players since he came here £14m Berahino, £18.3m Imbula, £18m Wimmer and on it goes, we are now scratching around for old freebies which he has overseen, we have players out on loan just to get the wage bill down who have contributed very little and will contribute even less, can you explain why he is still in a job here ? He doesn't pick the players and given he's not really a football man would have to have advice etc from the managers and scouts re what we're willing to spend, I'm amazed he gats the brunt of it, I souldn't be because whatever goes wrong at the club its always on him for some. Wimmer/Bera for example, Hughes wanted both and raved about both but Scholes gets it in the neck still for their signings, he's the money man, if they're in budget and he gets them signed he's done his job. Was he also instrumental as a board member of keeping Hughes two seasons too long ? many of those pathetic signings would not have happened if Hughes had gone when he should, he can't have it all ways he must also have responsibility in carrying out due process ie. we watch every signing 25 times he is part of the process that has failed miserably yet he gets a pay rise FFS it's laughable.
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Post by crapslinger on Aug 24, 2020 11:24:08 GMT
I'd happily have him in over Chester, clearly O'Neill has his favorites, most do, its a shame one of them has shown to be poor and we still signed him. Do you actually think O'Neill just likes some players over others or forms an opinion about players based on there performances in training and in games? I think the latter - any manager who bases selection decisions on anything as irrelevant as how likeable they are is doomed to failure. O'Neill has sidelined players like Etebo for not wanting to be here and Edwards because of his behaviour but not many on what appear to footballing grounds. He simply doesn't seem to rate Lindsay - and might that be because Lindsay actually isn't that good rather than he isn't teacher's pet? James Chester !
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Post by lordb on Aug 24, 2020 11:25:00 GMT
Scholes isn't responsible for every bad signing He is responsible for negotiations re contracts and fees. In Lyndsey case we paid a low fee and will probably get our money back. He's also rest for general dithering in the transfer market
He's also responsible for piss poor attitude re informing supporters generally E.g. lack of info re who the U23 and U18 are playing E.t.c.
Why he is still employed is beyond sense
However Lyndsey signing isn't in itself a stick to beat him with
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Post by bayernoatcake on Aug 24, 2020 11:32:46 GMT
Isn't this where we need a technical director though? At the time we had Shawcross, Batth, Indi, Collins, Souttar, Cameron, Wimmer and then after we signed him we got Carter-Vickers too. There was absolutely no need for either. Indi was meant to leave, Cameron had said he didn't want to play for us anymore as had Wimmer, Souttar isn't good enough and Collins was largely untested. Signing a left sided centre ack who was relatively cheap and young seemed the right strategy. Problem is he is hopeless, slow, awful on the ball, poor positional sense and not good at marking a man but Nathan Jones wanted him. I disagree and I said so at the time. We didn’t need anyone.
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Post by jimmygscfc1234 on Aug 24, 2020 11:35:28 GMT
'I said so at the time'...and repeat ad infinitum
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Post by boskampsflaps on Aug 24, 2020 15:46:43 GMT
I'd happily have him in over Chester, clearly O'Neill has his favorites, most do, its a shame one of them has shown to be poor and we still signed him. Do you actually think O'Neill just likes some players over others or forms an opinion about players based on there performances in training and in games? I think the latter - any manager who bases selection decisions on anything as irrelevant as how likeable they are is doomed to failure. O'Neill has sidelined players like Etebo for not wanting to be here and Edwards because of his behaviour but not many on what appear to footballing grounds. He simply doesn't seem to rate Lindsay - and might that be because Lindsay actually isn't that good rather than he isn't teacher's pet? I think pretty much all managers do this, its not a dig at MON by the way its just the way it is whether they suit their system or a willing to do pretty much anything for them, most managers have their faves that may get picked over someone that others consider more skillfull or whatever. Edit: I can't remeber but has he given Lindsay a game?
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Post by bayernoatcake on Aug 24, 2020 16:15:02 GMT
'I said so at the time'...and repeat ad infinitum I did though 🤷♂️ But let’s be honest it was obvious we didn’t need a centre back then.
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Post by CBUFAWKIPWH on Aug 24, 2020 17:07:24 GMT
Do you actually think O'Neill just likes some players over others or forms an opinion about players based on there performances in training and in games? I think the latter - any manager who bases selection decisions on anything as irrelevant as how likeable they are is doomed to failure. O'Neill has sidelined players like Etebo for not wanting to be here and Edwards because of his behaviour but not many on what appear to footballing grounds. He simply doesn't seem to rate Lindsay - and might that be because Lindsay actually isn't that good rather than he isn't teacher's pet? I think pretty much all managers do this, its not a dig at MON by the way its just the way it is whether they suit their system or a willing to do pretty much anything for them, most managers have their faves that may get picked over someone that others consider more skillfull or whatever. Edit: I can't remeber but has he given Lindsay a game? I think manager's might favour one player over another because in their judgement they are a better player but not for any non-footballing reasons - that just doesn't make sense to me. If I remember rightly he did give Lindsay a few games but dropped him pretty quickly. My take on Lindsay is that there are some fundamental issues with his game. For one he goes to ground quite a lot - it looks great when he gets the timing right but at Championship level he's a sending off waiting to happen. The other thing he does is try to play a Glenn Hoddle pass in preference to the safe option - which again looks good when it comes off but isn't what you want in a central defender. To me that looks niave - maybe O'Neill doesn't trust him to make the right decisions in a game and prefers more of a percentage player at centre back?
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Post by shrewspotter on Aug 24, 2020 17:48:15 GMT
My issues with Liam Lindsay aren’t his defending, I think he’s decent in the air and ok tacking and positional sense. However his distribution is awful, there were quite a few occasions where he played us into trouble with shocking passing for a pro footballer
If someone will give us our money back I’d take it in a heartbeat but a loan is more likely
As for Tony Scholes I just don’t see why he’d be at fault, surely it was Nathan Jones that wanted him and Scholes just negotiated his contract .
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Post by crapslinger on Aug 24, 2020 21:47:59 GMT
My issues with Liam Lindsay aren’t his defending, I think he’s decent in the air and ok tacking and positional sense. However his distribution is awful, there were quite a few occasions where he played us into trouble with shocking passing for a pro footballer If someone will give us our money back I’d take it in a heartbeat but a loan is more likely As for Tony Scholes I just don’t see why he’d be at fault, surely it was Nathan Jones that wanted him and Scholes just negotiated his contract . Did he watch him 25 times did he carry out due diligence before allowing Nutty Nathan to sign him ? after all he is in the position to protect the clubs finances which at the moment are perilous, as a board member surely he has the power to veto these obviously piss poor signings if not what is the point in employing him, we have more players out on loan than any other Championship Club many have cost us a fortune with no realistic chance of recouping any of the money we spunked away signing them. Would any other Club have allowed this situation ? having done so would any other club still be employing Scholes with his track record let alone giving him a fcuking pay rise, until he has been axed we will never be "a well run club" he is the proverbial albatross around the clubs neck dragging us down, he's a failure on so many levels it's embarrassing that we are reduced to signing over the hill unfit useless footballers to replace the expensive dross we already have on the books.
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Post by shipshape on Aug 25, 2020 4:45:09 GMT
Since who's arrival? Scholes arrived in 2004. He deserves to be out after the last few years but to say its been shit since he arrived is not true. How much money have we lost on players since he came here £14m Berahino, £18.3m Imbula, £18m Wimmer and on it goes, we are now scratching around for old freebies which he has overseen, we have players out on loan just to get the wage bill down who have contributed very little and will contribute even less, can you explain why he is still in a job here ? Yes I think I can explain why he still has a job here. It's because his employers have decided not to get rid of him. Why don't you direct your ire at them?
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Post by crapslinger on Aug 25, 2020 6:11:36 GMT
How much money have we lost on players since he came here £14m Berahino, £18.3m Imbula, £18m Wimmer and on it goes, we are now scratching around for old freebies which he has overseen, we have players out on loan just to get the wage bill down who have contributed very little and will contribute even less, can you explain why he is still in a job here ? Yes I think I can explain why he still has a job here. It's because his employers have decided not to get rid of him. Why don't you direct your ire at them? I already have !
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Post by robwahlmann on Aug 25, 2020 7:43:26 GMT
I've said it before, but I'll say it again! I think a lot of the posters on this board are a bit harsh towards our owners. As said before they have the best wishes for the club and have really been willing to spend money. They spent big to keep us in the PL and they spent big money on getting us back. All of this was done to back the managers at the time and they could afford it. I guess Scholes only does what he is told to by the owners so a lot of the abuse he gets here isn't really deserved. Because we failed to stay in the PL and again failed in our attempts to get back up we are now in a delicate situation because of FFP, not because the owners haven't got money to spend. OK, a lot of money has been spent without the success we hoped for, this goes for the owners too I guess, but still I wouldn't swap our owners for any others. This because they are true supporters and want the best for Stoke City Football Club! Yes, mistakes have been made in an attempt to support the managers and their transfer targets, but I guess a lot of the same people who now moan because of our financial delicate situation would have been moaning the most if the club and the owners hadn't showed ambition by spending money. For me the Coates family are the best owners we could hope and dream of at this football club.
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Post by jaybee on Aug 25, 2020 15:26:40 GMT
I've said it before, but I'll say it again! I think a lot of the posters on this board are a bit harsh towards our owners. As said before they have the best wishes for the club and have really been willing to spend money. They spent big to keep us in the PL and they spent big money on getting us back. All of this was done to back the managers at the time and they could afford it. I guess Scholes only does what he is told to by the owners so a lot of the abuse he gets here isn't really deserved. Because we failed to stay in the PL and again failed in our attempts to get back up we are now in a delicate situation because of FFP, not because the owners haven't got money to spend. OK, a lot of money has been spent without the success we hoped for, this goes for the owners too I guess, but still I wouldn't swap our owners for any others. This because they are true supporters and want the best for Stoke City Football Club! Yes, mistakes have been made in an attempt to support the managers and their transfer targets, but I guess a lot of the same people who now moan because of our financial delicate situation would have been moaning the most if the club and the owners hadn't showed ambition by spending money. For me the Coates family are the best owners we could hope and dream of at this football club. Great post, but sadly too long for many of the negative types on here
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Post by robwahlmann on Aug 25, 2020 15:38:00 GMT
I've said it before, but I'll say it again! I think a lot of the posters on this board are a bit harsh towards our owners. As said before they have the best wishes for the club and have really been willing to spend money. They spent big to keep us in the PL and they spent big money on getting us back. All of this was done to back the managers at the time and they could afford it. I guess Scholes only does what he is told to by the owners so a lot of the abuse he gets here isn't really deserved. Because we failed to stay in the PL and again failed in our attempts to get back up we are now in a delicate situation because of FFP, not because the owners haven't got money to spend. OK, a lot of money has been spent without the success we hoped for, this goes for the owners too I guess, but still I wouldn't swap our owners for any others. This because they are true supporters and want the best for Stoke City Football Club! Yes, mistakes have been made in an attempt to support the managers and their transfer targets, but I guess a lot of the same people who now moan because of our financial delicate situation would have been moaning the most if the club and the owners hadn't showed ambition by spending money. For me the Coates family are the best owners we could hope and dream of at this football club. Great post, but sadly too long for many of the negative types on here Just felt I had to say it anyway!
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Post by spitthedog on Aug 25, 2020 15:51:54 GMT
I've said it before, but I'll say it again! I think a lot of the posters on this board are a bit harsh towards our owners. As said before they have the best wishes for the club and have really been willing to spend money. They spent big to keep us in the PL and they spent big money on getting us back. All of this was done to back the managers at the time and they could afford it. I guess Scholes only does what he is told to by the owners so a lot of the abuse he gets here isn't really deserved. Because we failed to stay in the PL and again failed in our attempts to get back up we are now in a delicate situation because of FFP, not because the owners haven't got money to spend. OK, a lot of money has been spent without the success we hoped for, this goes for the owners too I guess, but still I wouldn't swap our owners for any others. This because they are true supporters and want the best for Stoke City Football Club! Yes, mistakes have been made in an attempt to support the managers and their transfer targets, but I guess a lot of the same people who now moan because of our financial delicate situation would have been moaning the most if the club and the owners hadn't showed ambition by spending money. For me the Coates family are the best owners we could hope and dream of at this football club. Agreed. We are exceptionally fortunate to have these owners. They are not perfect, and no owners are. But the alternatives don't bear thinking about.
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Post by FullerMagic on Sept 30, 2020 17:41:51 GMT
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Post by realstokebloke on Sept 30, 2020 20:10:42 GMT
Good.
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Post by liathroid on Sept 30, 2020 20:59:40 GMT
playing time could do him well ,always made 1 big mistake when he played
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Post by daviddunn on Sept 30, 2020 21:48:43 GMT
100% right ,and I found also he would do one dodgy tackle he was a bit reckless a walking red card
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Post by shakermaker on Sept 30, 2020 22:00:07 GMT
I think he needs to go elsewhere and get his mojo back. No doubt there is a good, ball-playing defender in there but he came to the wrong team to be acquainted with Championship footie. Saying that, I'd play him ahead of Chester in a heartbeat.
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Post by FullerMagic on Jan 10, 2021 14:34:12 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Jan 10, 2021 14:41:48 GMT
Makes Wollscheid look like Beckenbauer. I'll drive him.
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Post by biglad180 on Jan 10, 2021 14:42:33 GMT
£500,000 loan would do nicely
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Post by Roger Everyone on Jan 10, 2021 14:56:26 GMT
We need to let Souttar go. If anyone offers 500k, let him go, stick add-ons into the deal. Lindsay, he will probably be a loan out I suppose. It's funny how times change 😉 good call on soutter
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