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Post by Deleted on Aug 2, 2020 0:22:12 GMT
Hughes tried to sign Timo Werner and Van Dijk let's not forget.
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Post by JoeinOz on Aug 2, 2020 2:04:30 GMT
Harry McGuire , Andy Robertson , Cedric Soares were his first choice replacements and then the process kicks in add Tadic and Delph to that list Only seven people have Won more games in the history of the premier league but someone thought Paul Lambert was a good idea to replace him . Of course Hughes made mistakes they all do but His record at Blackburn Fulham and here says he’s a decent manager . He then saved Southampton and helped send us down while we we bounced from lambert to Rowett to Jones none of which are in his league as a manger someone thought all that was the answer and it wasn’t Mark Hughes Lambert wasn't first choice. And you know it
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Post by mtrstudent on Aug 2, 2020 5:27:53 GMT
Hughes was a poor man’s Wenger. Like Wenger did post Graham, he took a solid backbone and built some flair on top. The problem Hughes had with Stoke is that when that solid backbone started to fade or be moved out, he had no idea how to replace it. That gave us a few awesome years and some memorable moments. It also put us in a position of being a mentally and physically weak squad in a tough league by the end of his tenure. I prefer to remember him for the good times, much in the same way I do Pulis. One more season with Pulis at the helm could have led to our relegation in my view, we were falling apart. Hughes came in and extended our tenure for a few more years. That's how I feel too. He failed to repair the spine, we needed more players like Faye, Shawcross, Huth, Whelan, Walters to give us the grit to get through bad periods. But three of the best seasons of footy I've ever seen us play so I'm still grateful. I bet a lot of fans of the likes of Forest, Brizzle etc would snap your hand off if you offered them that.
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Post by benjaminbiscuit on Aug 2, 2020 6:01:20 GMT
Harry McGuire , Andy Robertson , Cedric Soares were his first choice replacements and then the process kicks in add Tadic and Delph to that list Only seven people have Won more games in the history of the premier league but someone thought Paul Lambert was a good idea to replace him . Of course Hughes made mistakes they all do but His record at Blackburn Fulham and here says he’s a decent manager . He then saved Southampton and helped send us down while we we bounced from lambert to Rowett to Jones none of which are in his league as a manger someone thought all that was the answer and it wasn’t Mark Hughes Saved Southampton by winning 1 in 10 or something ridiculous QPR we also filled with absolute wasters. Hughes has no idea So he Took Blackburn into the top 6 , he took us to three ninths . Good record at Fulham , ok at Man City only seven have ever won more games at the top level played the best football here since the 70’s and he’s no idea As for Southampton perhaps that game was the one that would have saved is time is proving a brutal judge for those that made those decisions look honey at the fate of the two clubs hanging on to change was clearly the Better option He made Mistakes sure but history will be kind yogi he’s at stoke it already is and rightly so
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Post by benjaminbiscuit on Aug 2, 2020 6:04:29 GMT
Harry McGuire , Andy Robertson , Cedric Soares were his first choice replacements and then the process kicks in add Tadic and Delph to that list Only seven people have Won more games in the history of the premier league but someone thought Paul Lambert was a good idea to replace him . Of course Hughes made mistakes they all do but His record at Blackburn Fulham and here says he’s a decent manager . He then saved Southampton and helped send us down while we we bounced from lambert to Rowett to Jones none of which are in his league as a manger someone thought all that was the answer and it wasn’t Mark Hughes Lambert wasn't first choice. And you know it Irrelevant they gave him the job and there are plenty of options not least to stick until they knew or the season end The current Mrs Biscuit wasn’t my first choice but because Kate Moss wasn’t available I’ didn’t run out and Marry Ena Sharples
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Post by JoeinOz on Aug 2, 2020 10:17:04 GMT
Lambert wasn't first choice. And you know it Irrelevant they gave him the job and there are plenty of options not least to stick until they knew or the season end The current Mrs Biscuit wasn’t my first choice but because Kate Moss wasn’t available I’ didn’t run out and Marry Ena Sharples I also think Hughes would’ve kept us up. But his position was absolutely untenable. I know that seems contradictory but there you go.
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Post by spitthedog on Aug 2, 2020 11:21:22 GMT
Irrelevant they gave him the job and there are plenty of options not least to stick until they knew or the season end The current Mrs Biscuit wasn’t my first choice but because Kate Moss wasn’t available I’ didn’t run out and Marry Ena Sharples I also think Hughes would’ve kept us up. But his position was absolutely untenable. I know that seems contradictory but there you go. Name me a club outside of the top 6 where success (and 3 x 9th was a very huge success) can be sustained over several years. It just doesn't happen. I think fans have to realise this. It means that its bloody difficult for anyone. At some point the level drops for whatever reason (and it can be a combination of several factors) Even clubs with healthy resources (Newcastle , WHU etc) struggle. Do any of these teams ever have 4 or 5 consecutive seasons in the top half of the top division? MH made some monumental mistakes (as all managers do at some point) but I don't for 1 second buy that it was this alone that contributed to our downfall. 3 seasons at 9th for this club was a huge achievement, the longer time goes on, the more this will be appreciated.
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Post by JoeinOz on Aug 2, 2020 11:23:50 GMT
I also think Hughes would’ve kept us up. But his position was absolutely untenable. I know that seems contradictory but there you go. Name me a club outside of the top 6 where success (and 3 x 9th was a very huge success) can be sustained over several years. It just doesn't happen. I think fans have to realise this. It means that its bloody difficult for anyone. At some point the level drops for whatever reason (and it can be a combination of several factors) Even clubs with healthy resources (Newcastle , WHU etc) struggle. Do any of these teams ever have 4 or 5 consecutive seasons in the top half of the top division? MH made some monumental mistakes (as all managers do at some point) but I don't for 1 second buy that it was this alone that contributed to our downfall. 3 seasons at 9th for this club was a huge achievement, the longer time goes on, the more this will be appreciated. I agree.
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Post by spitthedog on Aug 2, 2020 11:26:44 GMT
Name me a club outside of the top 6 where success (and 3 x 9th was a very huge success) can be sustained over several years. It just doesn't happen. I think fans have to realise this. It means that its bloody difficult for anyone. At some point the level drops for whatever reason (and it can be a combination of several factors) Even clubs with healthy resources (Newcastle , WHU etc) struggle. Do any of these teams ever have 4 or 5 consecutive seasons in the top half of the top division? MH made some monumental mistakes (as all managers do at some point) but I don't for 1 second buy that it was this alone that contributed to our downfall. 3 seasons at 9th for this club was a huge achievement, the longer time goes on, the more this will be appreciated. I agree. also factoring in that we also on a downward slope when he arrived with a threadbare squad.
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Post by JoeinOz on Aug 2, 2020 11:36:36 GMT
also factoring in that we also on a downward slope when he arrived with a threadbare squad. The second half of his first season felt fantastic. Realising we’d recovered and evolved was brilliant.
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Post by iglugluk on Aug 2, 2020 11:53:25 GMT
I also think Hughes would’ve kept us up. But his position was absolutely untenable. I know that seems contradictory but there you go. Name me a club outside of the top 6 where success (and 3 x 9th was a very huge success) can be sustained over several years. It just doesn't happen. I think fans have to realise this. It means that its bloody difficult for anyone. At some point the level drops for whatever reason (and it can be a combination of several factors) Even clubs with healthy resources (Newcastle , WHU etc) struggle. Do any of these teams ever have 4 or 5 consecutive seasons in the top half of the top division? MH made some monumental mistakes (as all managers do at some point) but I don't for 1 second buy that it was this alone that contributed to our downfall. 3 seasons at 9th for this club was a huge achievement, the longer time goes on, the more this will be appreciated. It will be interesting to see if Leicester can maintain whay they've acheived
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Post by Northy on Aug 2, 2020 12:07:52 GMT
The bloke thought it would be a good idea to let Huth leave on a free and replace him with Wollschied and Wimmer The 9th place finishes we’re great but so what? By time he left we were down with players who were repulsive little shits. I’m looking at you Imbula, Berahino, Jese, Wimmer... Leicester paid £3M for Huth, and while it turned out differently, it appeared at the time that Huth was coming to an end. he had been unfit for more than a year. Hughes probably thought he was doing Huth a favour by letting him leave to what at the time looked like relegation bound Leicester. If he knew what was to happen, he would have done differently, don't you think. Problem with that is Huth had been on loan at Leicester and played a great part in their survival, he didn't look finished at all.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 2, 2020 12:21:45 GMT
It’s been mentioned already and I think it’s a fairly common and obvious observation that if you provide Hughes with a solid but basic spine of players with the right character, he can build something great by adding a few pieces, but is unable to build those foundations himself.
My theory now is that, if Hughes had the right management partner to see to the foundational side that he lacks himself (similar to Clough Taylor) then he could be a great manager.
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Post by spitthedog on Aug 2, 2020 13:05:46 GMT
Name me a club outside of the top 6 where success (and 3 x 9th was a very huge success) can be sustained over several years. It just doesn't happen. I think fans have to realise this. It means that its bloody difficult for anyone. At some point the level drops for whatever reason (and it can be a combination of several factors) Even clubs with healthy resources (Newcastle , WHU etc) struggle. Do any of these teams ever have 4 or 5 consecutive seasons in the top half of the top division? MH made some monumental mistakes (as all managers do at some point) but I don't for 1 second buy that it was this alone that contributed to our downfall. 3 seasons at 9th for this club was a huge achievement, the longer time goes on, the more this will be appreciated. It will be interesting to see if Leicester can maintain whay they've acheived Leicester have done incredibly well, but sustaining it is going to be incredibly difficult, and of course as soon as they drop in the bottom half of the table, the manager is under huge pressure because everyone has got used to the success and that will be seen as failure.
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Post by lordb on Aug 2, 2020 13:42:07 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Aug 2, 2020 14:30:06 GMT
Leicester paid £3M for Huth, and while it turned out differently, it appeared at the time that Huth was coming to an end. he had been unfit for more than a year. Hughes probably thought he was doing Huth a favour by letting him leave to what at the time looked like relegation bound Leicester. If he knew what was to happen, he would have done differently, don't you think. Problem with that is Huth had been on loan at Leicester and played a great part in their survival, he didn't look finished at all. As I said he was doing Huth a favour, and he didn't back down on his word, even though it transpired that Huth still had legs to walk on and play a bit.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 2, 2020 17:47:16 GMT
Stoke have never been a club that has spent long periods of time in the higher reaches of the top division, in fact far from it. Two top 5 finishes in the mid 70s but either side of that we have been a lower half side or even not in the division at all. The 1970/71 & 72 seasons we finished in fairly ok positions in 13th, 17th and 15th in what many describe as arguably our best years ever.Maybe the expectations were too high and we took the top half of the Prem for granted. Once you reach those heights there's not much further you can go in the Prem, Leicester have been an exception but many now seeing their missing out on the CL as a bit of a failure.In the 1970s we were competing financially with the best of them, we even broke a transfer world record, what we did under Hughes was quite exceptional but with that group of 8 or 9 teams who were always on par with each other like ourselves, West Ham, Soton, West Brom even Everton at the time....we were never going to sustain it and one bad season and it collapses. Soton just stayed up the year we went and have managed to rebuild, most of that pack have been relegated at some point, some more than once.
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Post by Vadiation_Ribe on Aug 2, 2020 20:34:53 GMT
Hughes was a poor man’s Wenger. Like Wenger did post Graham, he took a solid backbone and built some flair on top. The problem Hughes had with Stoke is that when that solid backbone started to fade or be moved out, he had no idea how to replace it. That gave us a few awesome years and some memorable moments. It also put us in a position of being a mentally and physically weak squad in a tough league by the end of his tenure. I prefer to remember him for the good times, much in the same way I do Pulis. One more season with Pulis at the helm could have led to our relegation in my view, we were falling apart. Hughes came in and extended our tenure for a few more years. I still think Wenger failed at signing those players with grit and steel. He didn't sign Viera, who other than Henry, I'd say was the most important player in that 'invincibles' season. I thought Hughes lost confidence somehow when he dropped Bojan after his return from injury, and it started going downhill from there.
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Post by lordb on Aug 2, 2020 20:36:59 GMT
Hughes was a poor man’s Wenger. Like Wenger did post Graham, he took a solid backbone and built some flair on top. The problem Hughes had with Stoke is that when that solid backbone started to fade or be moved out, he had no idea how to replace it. That gave us a few awesome years and some memorable moments. It also put us in a position of being a mentally and physically weak squad in a tough league by the end of his tenure. I prefer to remember him for the good times, much in the same way I do Pulis. One more season with Pulis at the helm could have led to our relegation in my view, we were falling apart. Hughes came in and extended our tenure for a few more years. I still think Wenger failed at signing those players with grit and steel. He didn't sign Viera, who other than Henry, I'd say was the most important player in that 'invincibles' season. I thought Hughes lost confidence somehow when he dropped Bojan after his return from injury, and it started going downhill from there. He did sign Viera. You might be thinking of Bergkamp who was signed by Rioch
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Post by Vadiation_Ribe on Aug 2, 2020 20:39:23 GMT
I still think Wenger failed at signing those players with grit and steel. He didn't sign Viera, who other than Henry, I'd say was the most important player in that 'invincibles' season. I thought Hughes lost confidence somehow when he dropped Bojan after his return from injury, and it started going downhill from there. He did sign Viera. You might be thinking of Bergkamp who was signed by Rioch The Viera transfer was wrapped up before Wenger joined.
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Post by salopstick on Aug 2, 2020 20:48:21 GMT
The signs were there when we finished 13th. We didn’t have a great transfer summer. But that was no way deserving of the sack. He probably would have kept us up leaving that season a blip in terms of our prem era. And with either a decent transfer summer or thanks and move on we would have been better placed to replace him with someone equally as decent.
I’ve said it before loads of other teams get a few seasons of decline and great escapes. The season we went down it was down and out no second chances. We had no luck at all that season.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 2, 2020 20:58:07 GMT
He did sign Viera. You might be thinking of Bergkamp who was signed by Rioch The Viera transfer was wrapped up before Wenger joined. Not so sure about that as Viera was going elsewhere and then Rioch was fired and he joined Arsenal knowing Wenger was going there. Bergkamp was definitely Rioch as he said he had the choice of Baggio or Berkamp at the time
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Post by richardparker on Aug 3, 2020 9:00:17 GMT
Leslie seems to divide opinion on here more than Pulis ... if that were ever possible!
He definitely lost his way through bad decision-making and poor man management, but we should also remember some great times under his stewardship.
I recall a comment from a Man City fan at the time he joined us, saying Hughes was the worst manager around because he'd left them in such a complete mess.
Obviously he's not the only one culpable but there's no getting away from the fact we were in a totally dire situation when he left us.
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Post by BristolMick on Aug 3, 2020 10:49:13 GMT
Leslie seems to divide opinion on here more than Pulis ... if that were ever possible! He definitely lost his way through bad decision-making and poor man management, but we should also remember some great times under his stewardship. I recall a comment from a Man City fan at the time he joined us, saying Hughes was the worst manager around because he'd left them in such a complete mess. Obviously he's not the only one culpable but there's no getting away from the fact we were in a totally dire situation when he left us. There is a strong correlation between those that worshiped Pulis and hated Hughes. BM
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Post by supersimonstainrod on Aug 3, 2020 10:57:19 GMT
Leicester paid £3M for Huth, and while it turned out differently, it appeared at the time that Huth was coming to an end. he had been unfit for more than a year. Hughes probably thought he was doing Huth a favour by letting him leave to what at the time looked like relegation bound Leicester. If he knew what was to happen, he would have done differently, don't you think. Problem with that is Huth had been on loan at Leicester and played a great part in their survival, he didn't look finished at all. I thought MH let Huth go because he felt he didn't possess the ability to fit with his vision of CB's playing/carrying the ball out from the back?
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Post by lordb on Aug 3, 2020 11:02:22 GMT
Leslie seems to divide opinion on here more than Pulis ... if that were ever possible! He definitely lost his way through bad decision-making and poor man management, but we should also remember some great times under his stewardship. I recall a comment from a Man City fan at the time he joined us, saying Hughes was the worst manager around because he'd left them in such a complete mess. Obviously he's not the only one culpable but there's no getting away from the fact we were in a totally dire situation when he left us. There is a strong correlation between those that worshiped Pulis and hated Hughes. BM I loved and hated Pulis.Both sides of the argument are correct. Respected and disappointed with Hughes.
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Post by lordb on Aug 3, 2020 11:03:15 GMT
Problem with that is Huth had been on loan at Leicester and played a great part in their survival, he didn't look finished at all. I thought MH let Huth go because he felt he didn't possess the ability to fit with his vision of CB's playing/carrying the ball out from the back? That and also he wanted to defend higher up the pitch. Leicester defended very deep which suited Huth.
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Post by Northy on Aug 3, 2020 11:17:07 GMT
Problem with that is Huth had been on loan at Leicester and played a great part in their survival, he didn't look finished at all. I thought MH let Huth go because he felt he didn't possess the ability to fit with his vision of CB's playing/carrying the ball out from the back? Which was probably the start of his downfall, defend first
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Post by Deleted on Aug 3, 2020 15:37:22 GMT
I thought MH let Huth go because he felt he didn't possess the ability to fit with his vision of CB's playing/carrying the ball out from the back? Which was probably the start of his downfall, defend first Totally agree with that ..both Huth and Shawctoss had poor distribution and maybe we tried to play too much football. Muniesa seemed to be his player in there for me. Sad we remember one poor season over so many brilliant goals and performances.
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Post by Goonie on Aug 3, 2020 20:42:21 GMT
Apparently he refused point blank to discuss his role in Aussie soap Home and Away
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