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Post by scfconnor on Jul 2, 2020 15:48:19 GMT
Absolute state of this thread.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 2, 2020 15:53:34 GMT
Our 'rightful place' (If there's such a thing in football) is in the top-flight. Number of years in the top-flight. Villa 106 (Puts them 2nd in the all-time table behind Everton) Sunderland 86 (8th) Derby 65 (15th) Stoke 62 (17th) Forest 56 (23rd) Leeds 50 (25th) Coventry 34 (28th) Portsmouth 33 (29th) Our rightful place is exactly where we are. A team could be formed now and in 10 years be in the PL their rightful place would be the PL. You earn your right to play at the big table and just because you've been there before makes no difference to playing there again. Absolutely. Where you are on merit. PSG were only formed 50 years ago, they don't have the top flight history of many French or European clubs, is irrelevant. No one has the right to be in the top flight in football, anywhere
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Post by spiderpuss on Jul 2, 2020 16:06:40 GMT
If Coates sold the club, it'd be the final nail in the coffin Correct what we need right now is dedicated owner with lots of cash, Coates is the man. The fact he's made more than a few managerial blunders over the years is irrelevant right now. If you disagree, just ask Wigan fans.
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Post by kustokie on Jul 2, 2020 16:24:55 GMT
I think we should take pride in the fact we have local owners that are passionate about the club. Rather than millionaire from abroad that knows jack shit about the club. Coates isn’t the problem. I’d take a foreign owner that knows how to run a business by hiring the right management team, rather than a local one that won’t make tough decisions, especially when it comes to misplaced loyalty to incompetent executives (including the managers).
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Post by thevoid on Jul 2, 2020 16:29:49 GMT
Why would it? It all depends on who may buy it at the time, so it's a bit of a daft statement really. They are running the club into the ground (again). You would need to find someone willing to buy a club with limited profit potential, who has more money than the Coates family and supports the club. Where are you going to find said person? You exploit the foreign market and the revenue streams that can bring, as Wolves and Leicester have done (and I'm certain that's a road we'd have gone down had Denise been involved). I'm not saying there are Asian owners itching to buy Stoke but to make a blanket statement such as Coates selling would be 'the final nail' is defeatist because who knows what's around the corner. Weren't there rumours of Chinese interest a couple of years ago? Even little Bournemouth found a foreign owner who improved them.
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Post by thisisouryear on Jul 2, 2020 16:46:51 GMT
It was great being in the Prem whilst it lasted but the beauty of a proper football club like Stoke is the ups and downs. The bad times make the good times so much sweeter. We are going through a shit period now but we will get through it and the good times will one day return.
Our owners will always have the club's best interests at heart and I don't think calling for them to go helps us at all. If you can't handle the rough times you shouldn't be a football supporter. In my opinion we are going through a tough patch but we are in good hands, how many clubs can say their owners are actual supporters? We are very lucky to have the Coates family as owners of our club and it's ridiculous to think otherwise.
Wigan were owned by a fan who sold up and now look where they are. Changing owners won't guarantee we will be better for it.
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Post by nottsover60 on Jul 2, 2020 17:05:27 GMT
Our rightful place is probably somewhere in the lower half of the Championship but Villa, Sunderland and Leeds should definitely be Premiership clubs. Forest and Derby have better claims than us and Coventry and Portsmouth could definitely claim to be our equals. Our 'rightful place' (If there's such a thing in football) is in the top-flight. Number of years in the top-flight. Villa 106 (Puts them 2nd in the all-time table behind Everton) Sunderland 86 (8th) Derby 65 (15th) Stoke 62 (17th) Forest 56 (23rd) Leeds 50 (25th) Coventry 34 (28th) Portsmouth 33 (29th) So how far back do you go? We've probably been in existence for longer than most of those clubs and spent several years in the top flight before they were established. Back to the start of the Premier League? Once upon a time Preston and Huddersfield were big clubs but I don't think anyone would say they should be in the Premier League. You have to take several factors into account and in my opinion the success that Leeds had under Revie and Derby and Forest under Clough would in most football fans' eyes put them ahead of Stoke in the top 20 teams. Crowd wise and past successes we are a long way behind most of those clubs. The fact that Everton and Villa are the top two just proves that length of time spent in the top flight is not the best way of judging.
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Post by Pugsley on Jul 2, 2020 17:21:59 GMT
Peter and John Coates need to wake up and get rid of Scholes, get a proper CEO in who can appoint a Director of Football who can run the footballing side of the club.
It's crystal clear that they know nothing about running a modern day football club.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 2, 2020 17:23:00 GMT
Peter and John Coates need to wake up and get rid of Scholes, get a proper CEO in who can appoint a Director of Football who can run the footballing side of the club. ..and it needs to be a proper football man and not one of their mates who thinks he can do it.
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Post by nottsover60 on Jul 2, 2020 17:23:29 GMT
Anyway I apologise for that last post as it isn't really on topic of being crazy if you think for even a second of wanting Coates to put the club up for sale and very disrespectful of everything they have done for the club.
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Post by chigstoke on Jul 2, 2020 17:29:00 GMT
We have had a series of major fuck ups the past 3 years, but Lord knows how much further in the mire we could be if we sold up.
Peter and John need to grow a pair of bollocks as Pugs as said, sack Teflon Tony and appoint a true DoF with the necessary experience. Not Derek from the pub.
The problem is that Peter is still reading from the 'How to run a football club' 1998 edition book. We are so far behind the times in all reality it's frightening. Stoke City needs a big overhaul to modernise itself. I don't know if Peter and John have it in them.
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Post by Pugsley on Jul 2, 2020 17:33:37 GMT
We have had a series of major fuck ups the past 3 years, but Lord knows how much further in the mire we could be if we sold up. Peter and John need to grow a pair of bollocks as Pugs as said, sack Teflon Tony and appoint a true DoF with the necessary experience. Not Derek from the pub. The problem is that Peter is still reading from the 'How to run a football club' 1998 edition book. We are so far behind the times in all reality it's frightening. Stoke City needs a big overhaul to modernise itself. I don't know if Peter and John have it in them. New owners or not, keep doing the same things and we'll be dropping lower than league 1. Make no mistake.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 2, 2020 17:34:50 GMT
You would need to find someone willing to buy a club with limited profit potential, who has more money than the Coates family and supports the club. Where are you going to find said person? You exploit the foreign market and the revenue streams that can bring, as Wolves and Leicester have done (and I'm certain that's a road we'd have gone down had Denise been involved). I'm not saying there are Asian owners itching to buy Stoke but to make a blanket statement such as Coates selling would be 'the final nail' is defeatist because who knows what's around the corner. Weren't there rumours of Chinese interest a couple of years ago? Even little Bournemouth found a foreign owner who improved them. Think it kind of backfired on Bournemouth a bit and they spent big and badly Also the new stadium he promised has so far come to nothing. He did put his money up transfer wise but they bought some rubbish.
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Post by chigstoke on Jul 2, 2020 17:52:20 GMT
We have had a series of major fuck ups the past 3 years, but Lord knows how much further in the mire we could be if we sold up. Peter and John need to grow a pair of bollocks as Pugs as said, sack Teflon Tony and appoint a true DoF with the necessary experience. Not Derek from the pub. The problem is that Peter is still reading from the 'How to run a football club' 1998 edition book. We are so far behind the times in all reality it's frightening. Stoke City needs a big overhaul to modernise itself. I don't know if Peter and John have it in them. New owners or not, keep doing the same things and we'll be dropping lower than league 1. Make no mistake. Definitely mate. To be quite honest, I really am worried about the next year for Stoke. As you say, whatever league we end up in, we cannot afford to keep repeating the same mistakes. I keep thinking that this season had to have finally been the wake up call Coates needed. But then I think back to relegation and how it changed nothing. The size of the overhaul we actually need cannot be underestimated by anyone. It's root and branch stuff needed now. I just pray that come end of season, we see swift and decisive action. Will they finally wake up and smell the coffee? We'll find out in a month's time. No time for dallying.
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Post by wakeypotter on Jul 2, 2020 18:04:27 GMT
I fucking despair at some threads and this one has gone straight in at number 1 Come on then. You tell us how we guna get out of this shit before we end up in the fucking conference
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Post by wakeypotter on Jul 2, 2020 18:06:56 GMT
A few wins and we’re in great hands. A few defeats and we’re a shambles. The good people of the Oatcake never fail to impress. No we are a shambles and have been for a while. Time to take your blinkers of mate
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Post by dastokie on Jul 2, 2020 18:18:50 GMT
It's not the owners it's the shower of shit fleecing the club of a wage claiming to be professional footballers.
Ince McClean Butland etc. Should hang their boots up.
They have robbed the Coates's family of millions fraudsters.
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Post by werrington on Jul 2, 2020 18:20:31 GMT
I fucking despair at some threads and this one has gone straight in at number 1 Come on then. You tell us how we guna get out of this shit before we end up in the fucking conference Jesus wept
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Post by wakeypotter on Jul 2, 2020 18:29:45 GMT
Come on then. You tell us how we guna get out of this shit before we end up in the fucking conference Jesus wept He probably did but that’s not the issue. I like other fans would like to see Coates turn this around but with his son in charge it is never going to happen as he is not going to get rid of him or Scholes. Coates sr promised us household changes when we got relegated from the prem and it didn’t happen. Nothings going to change unfortunately while the Coates are in charge and I am not being disrespectful just honest. We haven’t had a mediocre 10 seasons in the prem at all for a club like ours it was incredible. We keep buying shit is mostly to blame but someone upstairs is agreeing to the shit we are buying.
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Post by TrentValePotter96 on Jul 2, 2020 19:05:31 GMT
It won't be sold but they're not as good as people suggest they are. Yes the memories are good but we have been left in a worse place than when the Icelandics left.
This is a disaster and a completely unnecessary one. To see Leicester, Wolves and Sheff United all in the top seven whilst we face league one football is awful. Yeah, we have no automatic right to premier league football but we spent £100m+ and had finished 9th for three successive seasons. Pissed it away.
The worst thing is you can see it. If we go down to League One we will outspend all of the division combined and then wonder why we have finished behind Peterborough and Doncaster. We will sign people like Will Grigg whilst Edward's, Collins and Verlinden make no progress in their stoke careers.
Problem is Scholes is unaccountable, and it drips down into the players. Coates Jr has done zero to warrant his position, hes gone into the family business well it's not plumbers it's a big professional football club mate. Coates Sr is also past it.
They can still own the club for all I care but they must get new people to run it.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 2, 2020 19:10:16 GMT
Come on then. You tell us how we guna get out of this shit before we end up in the fucking conference Jesus wept To be fair Wez, you didn't answer his question...
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Post by spirered on Jul 2, 2020 19:12:52 GMT
It's not the owners it's the shower of shit fleecing the club of a wage claiming to be professional footballers. Ince McClean Butland etc. Should hang their boots up. They have robbed the Coates's family of millions fraudsters. Really???? I'm not much for the guy on a personal level, but I think McClean is one of a very small number that can say that they've tried their best in spite of the shit that they are surrounded by..
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Post by mickeythemaestro on Jul 2, 2020 19:45:48 GMT
I don't want the owners to go. Bloody hell they are billionaires and Stoke fans. Proper Stoke fans. I just want them to spend some money upstairs and get a proper plan together instead of this haphazard BS that has been going on for nearly 5 years now.
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Post by The Drunken Communist on Jul 2, 2020 19:54:04 GMT
Our 'rightful place' (If there's such a thing in football) is in the top-flight. Number of years in the top-flight. Villa 106 (Puts them 2nd in the all-time table behind Everton) Sunderland 86 (8th) Derby 65 (15th) Stoke 62 (17th) Forest 56 (23rd) Leeds 50 (25th) Coventry 34 (28th) Portsmouth 33 (29th) So how far back do you go? We've probably been in existence for longer than most of those clubs and spent several years in the top flight before they were established. Back to the start of the Premier League? Once upon a time Preston and Huddersfield were big clubs but I don't think anyone would say they should be in the Premier League. You have to take several factors into account and in my opinion the success that Leeds had under Revie and Derby and Forest under Clough would in most football fans' eyes put them ahead of Stoke in the top 20 teams. Crowd wise and past successes we are a long way behind most of those clubs. The fact that Everton and Villa are the top two just proves that length of time spent in the top flight is not the best way of judging. Look, we're where we are on merit, all I'm defending is this notion that we're some pathetic small time club who don't belong anywhere near the top-flight, when the history of English football says if we built an all-time top-flight, it would include Stoke City. You can't argue about "How far back do you want to go?" and then go & bring up a bunch of achievements for other clubs from decades ago. We've spent ten years in the Premier League, reached FA Cup Finals, League Cup semi-finals & the knockout stages of Europe since Derby, Forest & Leeds managed a single season in the top-flight combined.
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Post by TrentValePotter96 on Jul 2, 2020 20:03:32 GMT
We have spent more than half of our league seasons as a top flight club. More than Leeds and Forest for example.
We managed 45 years after the war in the top two tiers. Only finishing in the bottom third of the second tier twice.
I think our 90s problems coupled with Vale doing well has affected how some of us see our potential.
We have done great things these last decades,and they are great memories. But it's all relative.
Since our last cup final Cardiff, , Bradford, Swansea, Wigan, Hull, Aston Villa (twice) Crystal Palace, Watford, Southampton and Sunderland have played in finals. It will be an ever growing list. And multiple teams have won promotion since 2008.
Given their branding as local big fans multi billionaires perhaps expecting a little more is to be expected.
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Post by hampsonp66 on Jul 2, 2020 20:09:34 GMT
Let's get something straight. If the Icelandic consortium hadn't bought stoke when they did we were going into administration. Coates then bought the club back when he was the only option as he had slipped in a minority stake into there purchase. Luckily by then bet365 had made him rich. Whatever u say about better they have stuck with stoke and the uk. All the other bookies have there has offshore to stop paying as much tax. I just wish stoke would get rid of scholes.
Bfb
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Post by hampsonp66 on Jul 2, 2020 20:10:48 GMT
better should be Bet365
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Post by thevoid on Jul 2, 2020 20:13:25 GMT
Our 'rightful place' (If there's such a thing in football) is in the top-flight. Number of years in the top-flight. Villa 106 (Puts them 2nd in the all-time table behind Everton) Sunderland 86 (8th) Derby 65 (15th) Stoke 62 (17th) Forest 56 (23rd) Leeds 50 (25th) Coventry 34 (28th) Portsmouth 33 (29th) So how far back do you go? We've probably been in existence for longer than most of those clubs and spent several years in the top flight before they were established. Back to the start of the Premier League? Once upon a time Preston and Huddersfield were big clubs but I don't think anyone would say they should be in the Premier League. You have to take several factors into account and in my opinion the success that Leeds had under Revie and Derby and Forest under Clough would in most football fans' eyes put them ahead of Stoke in the top 20 teams. Crowd wise and past successes we are a long way behind most of those clubs. The fact that Everton and Villa are the top two just proves that length of time spent in the top flight is not the best way of judging. I take your point about Forest and Derby but they happened to benefit from the presence of a genius in the dugout. Both clubs, especially Forest, have a pretty mediocre record pre- and post-Clough. He may even have brought a title to the Potteries if he managed here, he was that good. Had Clough turned up at Leeds with a different attitude and kept the job beyond a month, you'd probably be viewing Forest as on a par with Norwich, Boro or Southampton. Which would probably be about right.
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Post by thevoid on Jul 2, 2020 20:16:30 GMT
You exploit the foreign market and the revenue streams that can bring, as Wolves and Leicester have done (and I'm certain that's a road we'd have gone down had Denise been involved). I'm not saying there are Asian owners itching to buy Stoke but to make a blanket statement such as Coates selling would be 'the final nail' is defeatist because who knows what's around the corner. Weren't there rumours of Chinese interest a couple of years ago? Even little Bournemouth found a foreign owner who improved them. Think it kind of backfired on Bournemouth a bit and they spent big and badly Also the new stadium he promised has so far come to nothing. He did put his money up transfer wise but they bought some rubbish. Probably a good job. The last thing Bournemouth need is a Reading-sized ground with Leyton Orient-sized crowds once their inevitable tailspin kicks in.
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Post by thevoid on Jul 2, 2020 20:19:54 GMT
He probably did but that’s not the issue. I like other fans would like to see Coates turn this around but with his son in charge it is never going to happen as he is not going to get rid of him or Scholes. Coates sr promised us household changes when we got relegated from the prem and it didn’t happen. Nothings going to change unfortunately while the Coates are in charge and I am not being disrespectful just honest. We haven’t had a mediocre 10 seasons in the prem at all for a club like ours it was incredible. We keep buying shit is mostly to blame but someone upstairs is agreeing to the shit we are buying. I'd have more confidence in JC if he didn't turn up for Meet the Fans nights looking like he'd been up all night on ketamine.
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