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Post by dutchstokie on Dec 2, 2020 11:36:50 GMT
This is comfortably the most inept parliament of our lifetime. Agree...its akin to a circus isnt it....
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Post by followyoudown on Dec 2, 2020 13:41:53 GMT
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Post by sheikhmomo on Dec 2, 2020 15:26:20 GMT
The long winter evenings must fly by! Even if that is your sort of comedy, losing your majority in a crucial vote in less than a year (including plenty of the 2019 intake) with hard line Brexiteers waiting in the wings threatening to take you out and being a laughing stock with your reputation as a philandering, lazy drunk enhanced, I think you could file that under a bad year!
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Post by followyoudown on Dec 2, 2020 18:46:20 GMT
The long winter evenings must fly by! Even if that is your sort of comedy, losing your majority in a crucial vote in less than a year (including plenty of the 2019 intake) with hard line Brexiteers waiting in the wings threatening to take you out and being a laughing stock with your reputation as a philandering, lazy drunk enhanced, I think you could file that under a bad year! Boris's legacy will be brexit, Jezza's is the EHRC report, Starmer well he would have to actually take a position on something and seeing how ace his brexit tactics were and the two week firebreak he claimed had to be done in half term and how well it worked out in Wales he probably won't take another one !
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Post by Rednwhitenblue on Dec 3, 2020 7:47:47 GMT
Boris's legacy will be Brexit, an isolated, less significant, poorer country with poorer public services for everyone; Boris and Cameron's joint legacy will be Brexit and the destruction of the United Kingdom as we've known it for 300 years.
Still, Corbyn and the Jews eh...
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Post by wagsastokie on Dec 3, 2020 9:04:48 GMT
Boris's legacy will be Brexit, an isolated, less significant, poorer country with poorer public services for everyone; Boris and Cameron's joint legacy will be Brexit and the destruction of the United Kingdom as we've known it for 300 years. Still, Corbyn and the Jews eh... Boris’s legacy will be to deliver the freedom that the democratic will of the people asked for And a greener more environmentally friendly country with vast tracks of the country levelled upwards Corbyn’s legacy will be being sacked for telling the truth to a leader with not a ounce of his integrity
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Post by bigjohnritchie on Dec 3, 2020 10:58:54 GMT
Boris's legacy will be Brexit, an isolated, less significant, poorer country with poorer public services for everyone; Boris and Cameron's joint legacy will be Brexit and the destruction of the United Kingdom as we've known it for 300 years. Still, Corbyn and the Jews eh... I cannot recall any useful contribution to the Brexit debate from Labour, other than those by Kate Hoey and Gisella Stuart, if we disregard Corbyn's pre-leadership Euroscepticism. even the LibDems made a contribution to the biggest political issue of this generation. Perhaps they are waiting for everything to go wrong so that they can say " we told you so", although Starmer does seem to want to move slightly off the fence ( just for political reasons). Not sure what Corbyn now thinks. As far as the anti -Semitism, anti-Zionist argument that seems to be a self inflicted internal party issue. Anyway, not Labour's/the Left's fault, always someone else to blame.
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Post by followyoudown on Dec 3, 2020 12:51:18 GMT
Now this would really cause panic in the Tory ranks the thing is even though its a parody with Labour you just never know.....
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Post by sheikhmomo on Dec 14, 2020 15:55:17 GMT
We all know Sir Keith isn't that keen on opposing the Tories, it seems he can't even bring himself to properly take on White Supremacists now!
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Post by followyoudown on Dec 14, 2020 19:56:20 GMT
We all know Sir Keith isn't that keen on opposing the Tories, it seems he can't even bring himself to properly take on White Supremacists now! Amazing how all this cunts can suddenly spot racism again yet years of anti semitism they couldn't see anything wrong. Has little Owen demanded an apology for the EHRC report or was it just one of those things....
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Post by sheikhmomo on Dec 14, 2020 20:02:04 GMT
We all know Sir Keith isn't that keen on opposing the Tories, it seems he can't even bring himself to properly take on White Supremacists now! Amazing how all this cunts can suddenly spot racism again yet years of anti semitism they couldn't see anything wrong. Has little Owen demanded an apology for the EHRC report or was it just one of those things.... Amazing isn't how the Starmer mob can supposedly spot racism in how someone once pronounced the name Epstein but are seemingly oblivious to 'Great Replacement' tropes. Amazing and revealing.
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Post by followyoudown on Dec 14, 2020 20:49:51 GMT
Amazing how all this cunts can suddenly spot racism again yet years of anti semitism they couldn't see anything wrong. Has little Owen demanded an apology for the EHRC report or was it just one of those things.... Amazing isn't how the Starmer mob can supposedly spot racism in how someone once pronounced the name Epstein but are seemingly oblivious to 'Great Replacement' tropes. Amazing and revealing. Whats amazing is how happily you would argue for hours over where Corbyn was standing and on which hamas murderers grave he laid a wreath but not picking up some silly bint over her ridiculous comments is beyond the pale.
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Post by felonious on Dec 21, 2020 7:43:25 GMT
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Post by Rednwhitenblue on Dec 21, 2020 8:53:45 GMT
Needs to forget about Scotland, it'll be independent soon, thanks to Brexit.
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Post by wagsastokie on Dec 21, 2020 10:35:08 GMT
Needs to forget about Scotland, it'll be independent soon, thanks to Brexit. I would imagine without Scotland it’s almost impossible for labour to form a government on its own
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Post by felonious on Dec 21, 2020 11:15:59 GMT
Needs to forget about Scotland, it'll be independent soon, thanks to Brexit. It was heading towards independence well before Brexit hence Blair's fudge all those years ago.
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Post by Rednwhitenblue on Dec 21, 2020 18:58:22 GMT
This hasn't aged well
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Post by Rednwhitenblue on Dec 21, 2020 18:59:10 GMT
Needs to forget about Scotland, it'll be independent soon, thanks to Brexit. It was heading towards independence well before Brexit hence Blair's fudge all those years ago. Well, obviously not, given the vote six years ago! It's Brexit that's tipped the majority towards independence, simple as that. I don't suppose Bluffer has helped either.
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Post by felonious on Dec 21, 2020 19:07:57 GMT
It was heading towards independence well before Brexit hence Blair's fudge all those years ago. Well, obviously not, given the vote six years ago! It's Brexit that's tipped the majority towards independence, simple as that. I don't suppose Bluffer has helped either. It was always going to head towards independence, it's been heading that way for decades, Brexit is just another stick to bash the UK government with. If it wasn't Brexit it would be something else. If we want to keep them in the UK we're going to have to offer them a better deal than any other nation or region in the UK.... oh wait
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Post by Rednwhitenblue on Dec 21, 2020 19:22:10 GMT
Well, obviously not, given the vote six years ago! It's Brexit that's tipped the majority towards independence, simple as that. I don't suppose Bluffer has helped either. It was always going to head towards independence, it's been heading that way for decades, Brexit is just another stick to bash the UK government with. If it wasn't Brexit it would be something else. If we want to keep them in the UK we're going to have to offer them a better deal than any other nation or region in the UK.... oh wait Brexit is obviously the salient factor, two thirds or thereabouts of Scots who voted did so to remain in the EU, in contrast to England and Wales. And all the latest polls show broadly a complete reversal of the 55/45 vote to stay in the Union last time around. Add in a general loathing for Conservatives north of the border which goes back to Thatcher using them as guinea pigs for the Poll Tax, and Bluffer's general unpopularity and we are where we are. What a legacy for Cameron and Bluffer to have, whatever the UK looks like when the history books come to write up the first half of the 21st century. Their actions will probably be seen in retrospect as catastrophically misguided for the country.
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Post by crapslinger on Dec 21, 2020 22:47:59 GMT
It was heading towards independence well before Brexit hence Blair's fudge all those years ago. Well, obviously not, given the vote six years ago! It's Brexit that's tipped the majority towards independence, simple as that. I don't suppose Bluffer has helped either. Oh well never mind I am sure the EU will welcome them with open arms they love a country who re runs a once in a lifetime referendum if it doesn't go their way of course, personally I have no problem with the Scots leaving the union and going it alone or perhaps not alone if the EU vote to accept them, good luck to them I would prefer if the whole of the UK is included in the next vote for their independence as long as they are paying for it
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Post by Soro's Sorrows on Dec 21, 2020 23:31:46 GMT
It was always going to head towards independence, it's been heading that way for decades, Brexit is just another stick to bash the UK government with. If it wasn't Brexit it would be something else. If we want to keep them in the UK we're going to have to offer them a better deal than any other nation or region in the UK.... oh wait Brexit is obviously the salient factor, two thirds or thereabouts of Scots who voted did so to remain in the EU, in contrast to England and Wales. And all the latest polls show broadly a complete reversal of the 55/45 vote to stay in the Union last time around. Add in a general loathing for Conservatives north of the border which goes back to Thatcher using them as guinea pigs for the Poll Tax, and Bluffer's general unpopularity and we are where we are. What a legacy for Cameron and Bluffer to have, whatever the UK looks like when the history books come to write up the first half of the 21st century. Their actions will probably be seen in retrospect as catastrophically misguided for the country. You really need to stop posting your predictions and Fantasias as fact, nothing you post is fact it is all just a thought in your brain that you have decided is a fact. We haven't as yet left without a deal and Scotland has not yet been granted another vote, but for you it is all done dusted! Post after post of the same unfounded shit! Do us all a favour and take a break you boring f**k!
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Post by felonious on Dec 22, 2020 6:28:54 GMT
It was always going to head towards independence, it's been heading that way for decades, Brexit is just another stick to bash the UK government with. If it wasn't Brexit it would be something else. If we want to keep them in the UK we're going to have to offer them a better deal than any other nation or region in the UK.... oh wait Brexit is obviously the salient factor, two thirds or thereabouts of Scots who voted did so to remain in the EU, in contrast to England and Wales. And all the latest polls show broadly a complete reversal of the 55/45 vote to stay in the Union last time around. Add in a general loathing for Conservatives north of the border which goes back to Thatcher using them as guinea pigs for the Poll Tax, and Bluffer's general unpopularity and we are where we are. What a legacy for Cameron and Bluffer to have, whatever the UK looks like when the history books come to write up the first half of the 21st century. Their actions will probably be seen in retrospect as catastrophically misguided for the country. There's a general loathing of all the three main parties of England North of the border and that's been the case for decades. It's the reason why Labour put in place the Scottish Parliament to appease the Scots and to try and enable Labour to keeps seats which rapidly dwindled over the intervening years when Brexit was not even a dream. This legacy that you talk about is all about the will of the Scottish people to self determination.
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Post by partickpotter on Dec 22, 2020 6:48:04 GMT
Brexit is obviously the salient factor, two thirds or thereabouts of Scots who voted did so to remain in the EU, in contrast to England and Wales. And all the latest polls show broadly a complete reversal of the 55/45 vote to stay in the Union last time around. Add in a general loathing for Conservatives north of the border which goes back to Thatcher using them as guinea pigs for the Poll Tax, and Bluffer's general unpopularity and we are where we are. What a legacy for Cameron and Bluffer to have, whatever the UK looks like when the history books come to write up the first half of the 21st century. Their actions will probably be seen in retrospect as catastrophically misguided for the country. There's a general loathing of all the three main parties of England North of the border and that's been the case for decades. It's the reason why Labour put in place the Scottish Parliament to appease the Scots and to try and enable Labour to keeps seats which rapidly dwindled over the intervening years when Brexit was not even a dream. This legacy that you talk about is all about the will of the Scottish people to self determination. I don’t think there is a loathing for Labour and the Lib Dems, more a sense of apathy. The loathing of the Tories is a real thing though and goes back to Thatcher generally and the Poll Tax particularly. A toxic legacy of her leadership. That said it’s been nurtured, cultivated and exploited by the SNP in an attempt to reproduce in Scotland the sectarian politics of Northern Ireland (excluding, mercifully, the guns). They are positioning the independence debate not so much as one of independence vs union but of Scotland the Brave (as typified by Nicola and the SNP) vs Foppish England (Boris and the Tories). It could well be a winning strategy for them. In any case, it’s still a strategy. Not something you could accuse the unionist parties of having.
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Post by felonious on Dec 22, 2020 7:01:21 GMT
There's a general loathing of all the three main parties of England North of the border and that's been the case for decades. It's the reason why Labour put in place the Scottish Parliament to appease the Scots and to try and enable Labour to keeps seats which rapidly dwindled over the intervening years when Brexit was not even a dream. This legacy that you talk about is all about the will of the Scottish people to self determination. I don’t think there is a loathing for Labour and the Lib Dems, more a sense of apathy. The loathing of the Tories is a real thing though and goes back to Thatcher generally and the Poll Tax particularly. A toxic legacy of her leadership. That said it’s been nurtured, cultivated and exploited by the SNP in an attempt to reproduce in Scotland the sectarian politics of Northern Ireland (excluding, mercifully, the guns). They are positioning the independence debate not so much as one of independence vs union but of Scotland the Brave (as typified by Nicola and the SNP) vs Foppish England (Boris and the Tories). It could well be a winning strategy for them. In any case, it’s still a strategy. Not something you could accuse the unionist parties of having. I think the strategy has been give them more, give them more and from Starmer's comments above this continues to be the direction of travel. There will surely come a point where the leap between what Scotland has and full independence is not that great. It already feels like Scotland has a Prime Minister
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Post by partickpotter on Dec 22, 2020 7:16:20 GMT
I don’t think there is a loathing for Labour and the Lib Dems, more a sense of apathy. The loathing of the Tories is a real thing though and goes back to Thatcher generally and the Poll Tax particularly. A toxic legacy of her leadership. That said it’s been nurtured, cultivated and exploited by the SNP in an attempt to reproduce in Scotland the sectarian politics of Northern Ireland (excluding, mercifully, the guns). They are positioning the independence debate not so much as one of independence vs union but of Scotland the Brave (as typified by Nicola and the SNP) vs Foppish England (Boris and the Tories). It could well be a winning strategy for them. In any case, it’s still a strategy. Not something you could accuse the unionist parties of having. I think the strategy has been give them more, give them more and from Starmer's comments above this continues to be the direction of travel. There will surely come a point where the leap between what Scotland has and full independence is not that great. It already feels like Scotland has a Prime Minister I’ve always thought that devolution is a stage on the road to something else - probably independence but maybe something federal. The problem with devolution is the friction that results when different parties are in control of Westminster and Holyrood, which is most pronounced when it’s the Tories against the SNP. Of course, in the halcyon days of Blair when Labour ruled the roost north and south of the border this possibility was something that didn’t seem to feature. What we do have in Scotland is a First Minister. Who is incredibly popular. She is seen as the “prime” minister in Scotland, in terms of being the most important politician, Johnson and Westminster are generally seen as being somewhat distant and less relevant. The pandemic has certainly helped in this, something Sturgeon has exploited to the full. As mentioned several times, she is a very canny politician. Streets ahead of any of her contemporaries.
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Post by Rednwhitenblue on Dec 22, 2020 7:28:24 GMT
Brexit is obviously the salient factor, two thirds or thereabouts of Scots who voted did so to remain in the EU, in contrast to England and Wales. And all the latest polls show broadly a complete reversal of the 55/45 vote to stay in the Union last time around. Add in a general loathing for Conservatives north of the border which goes back to Thatcher using them as guinea pigs for the Poll Tax, and Bluffer's general unpopularity and we are where we are. What a legacy for Cameron and Bluffer to have, whatever the UK looks like when the history books come to write up the first half of the 21st century. Their actions will probably be seen in retrospect as catastrophically misguided for the country. You really need to stop posting your predictions and Fantasias as fact, nothing you post is fact it is all just a thought in your brain that you have decided is a fact. We haven't as yet left without a deal and Scotland has not yet been granted another vote, but for you it is all done dusted! Post after post of the same unfounded shit! Do us all a favour and take a break you boring f**k! No need for name calling and abuse, Soro, we've a few people who do that and the same applies to all of them. It's a forum where people can post opinions. If you don't or can't read them without getting so wound up that you need to resort to abuse, do yourself a favour and do something else with your time!
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Post by Rednwhitenblue on Dec 22, 2020 7:35:06 GMT
There's a general loathing of all the three main parties of England North of the border and that's been the case for decades. It's the reason why Labour put in place the Scottish Parliament to appease the Scots and to try and enable Labour to keeps seats which rapidly dwindled over the intervening years when Brexit was not even a dream. This legacy that you talk about is all about the will of the Scottish people to self determination. I don’t think there is a loathing for Labour and the Lib Dems, more a sense of apathy. The loathing of the Tories is a real thing though and goes back to Thatcher generally and the Poll Tax particularly. A toxic legacy of her leadership. That said it’s been nurtured, cultivated and exploited by the SNP in an attempt to reproduce in Scotland the sectarian politics of Northern Ireland (excluding, mercifully, the guns). They are positioning the independence debate not so much as one of independence vs union but of Scotland the Brave (as typified by Nicola and the SNP) vs Foppish England (Boris and the Tories). It could well be a winning strategy for them. In any case, it’s still a strategy. Not something you could accuse the unionist parties of having. Agreed. I lived in Scotland for some time and, until I did, wasn't aware just how hated the Tories are up there. Independence is indeed portrayed as Scotland vs Westminster, or the SNP vs everyone else, that's the prime reason the SNP continues to do so well. That, plus the obvious contrast between what is seen as Sturgeon's competence and Bluffer's dithering ineptitude. That might be unreasonable, given their relative performances, but that's where public opinion is at the present.
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Post by Rednwhitenblue on Dec 22, 2020 8:17:38 GMT
Needs to forget about Scotland, it'll be independent soon, thanks to Brexit. I would imagine without Scotland it’s almost impossible for labour to form a government on its own Previously, Scotland provided a lot of Labour MPs but not so much now, and there was effectively a hung parliament in 2017, with only 7 Scottish Labour MPs, so it's more a case of relying on the red wall in England, which obviously crumbled last time around, plus a general lack of support for the Tories. Starmer has realised, not that it took much realising!, that England is essentially a right wing country and that with decreasing support north of the border, he needs to appeal more to the centre than Corbyn ever would, if he is to be elected.
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Post by wagsastokie on Dec 22, 2020 8:35:20 GMT
I would imagine without Scotland it’s almost impossible for labour to form a government on its own Previously, Scotland provided a lot of Labour MPs but not so much now, and there was effectively a hung parliament in 2017, with only 7 Scottish Labour MPs, so it's more a case of relying on the red wall in England, which obviously crumbled last time around, plus a general lack of support for the Tories. Starmer has realised, not that it took much realising!, that England is essentially a right wing country and that with decreasing support north of the border, he needs to appeal more to the centre than Corbyn ever would, if he is to be elected. It’s not currently the the number of labour MPs in Scotland It’s the fact that if they left before the election The government would lose 6 MPs and the opposition 57 MPs A almost unsurmountable majority considering that come the next election labour will struggle in wales
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