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Post by maninasuitcase on Oct 14, 2022 18:54:24 GMT
Got the Eartha Kitts and the shakes mate. Not pretty š¤Øš¤Ø Oh dear get well soon matešš» Cheers mate. Lemsip and teddy throw are in use.
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Post by terryconroysmagic on Oct 14, 2022 18:58:51 GMT
I see a number of media reporting that kids are at risk of heart attacks/issues from playing video gamesā¦
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Post by knype on Oct 14, 2022 19:19:38 GMT
I see a number of media reporting that kids are at risk of heart attacks/issues from playing video gamesā¦ More like from the jabs
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Post by musik on Oct 14, 2022 19:21:34 GMT
Got the Eartha Kitts and the shakes mate. Not pretty š¤Øš¤Ø Get well! šøšŖ
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Post by riverman on Oct 14, 2022 19:50:01 GMT
Amazing how a population can be coerced into compliance - get the media on board, suppress/demonise dissenters and people will believe anything they are told. I can understand the creation of fear factor initially back in 2020 as it wasn't clear what we were dealing with but the nonsense afterwards was a disgrace - the pinnacle being the absolutely ridiculous vaccine passports for a vaccine they knew did bugger all for transmission and the insistence on jabbing children for no reason whatsoever. When did the vaccine passports stop? We had good evidence the vaccines reduced transmission through delta so it made sense to think they might keep doing it. And unfortunately it takes ages to get the data so there's always a lag. I guess it depends on how you'd bet. If something has reduced the spread for every other version of the virus, each time there's a new version do you gamble on "this one's different" or "this one will be just like all the others"? Absolute bollocks. Go away . You were one of the twats calling people murderers.
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Post by mtrstudent on Oct 14, 2022 20:37:59 GMT
When did the vaccine passports stop? We had good evidence the vaccines reduced transmission through delta so it made sense to think they might keep doing it. And unfortunately it takes ages to get the data so there's always a lag. I guess it depends on how you'd bet. If something has reduced the spread for every other version of the virus, each time there's a new version do you gamble on "this one's different" or "this one will be just like all the others"? Absolute bollocks. Go away . You were one of the twats calling people murderers. Did I say murderer? Where? we can be confident that lots of people needlessly died because of those who chose not to wear masks or get vaccinated or whatever. That seems pretty clear.
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Post by terryconroysmagic on Oct 14, 2022 20:53:11 GMT
Absolute bollocks. Go away . You were one of the twats calling people murderers. Did I say murderer? Where? we can be confident that lots of people needlessly died because of those who chose not to wear masks or get vaccinated or whatever. That seems pretty clear. It does not seem clear at all vis a vis masks. Thatās a pretty aggressive supposition, in fact for me personally that an outrageous position to hold. Lots of people needlessly died because people didnāt wear completely ineffectual pieces of cloth or get vaccinated with a vaccine that didnāt stop transmission?
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Post by riverman on Oct 14, 2022 21:06:21 GMT
How do you feel about there being agreement that in triage, unvaccinated people fall to the bottom of the list? Sure, they are still helping to kill other people by reducing group immunity, and they're still forcing other taxpayers to pay for their decision, but it's one way of limiting how much harm they're causing to other people. And there you go with your disgusting accusations of murder again. You really are a piece of work. This ring any bells?
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Post by mtrstudent on Oct 14, 2022 21:16:39 GMT
And there you go with your disgusting accusations of murder again. You really are a piece of work. This ring any bells? Where did I say murder? Not every death is a murder.
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Post by riverman on Oct 14, 2022 22:12:58 GMT
Where did I say murder? Not every death is a murder. The implication is there or are you too dim to notice? The above quote follows on from your earlier brainwashed crap about people not wearing masks being killers and there's no point denying it. Your argument is dead. You were wrong. Now crawl off, deal with it and live the rest of your life worry free. Bye bye.
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Post by spitthedog on Oct 15, 2022 9:32:17 GMT
Absolute bollocks. Go away . You were one of the twats calling people murderers. Did I say murderer? Where? we can be confident that lots of people needlessly died because of those who chose not to wear masks or get vaccinated or whatever. That seems pretty clear. But Pfizer executives have now stated in the EU hearing that the vaccine was never tested for transmission. It may have helped but no-one still knows that yet? It may be that Pfizer never claimed that it would protect against transmission (they are saying that now) but the Governments, Health Services and employers certainly did and that was categorically a lie (a 100% lie)
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Post by cvillestokie on Oct 15, 2022 10:42:56 GMT
Did I say murderer? Where? we can be confident that lots of people needlessly died because of those who chose not to wear masks or get vaccinated or whatever. That seems pretty clear. It does not seem clear at all vis a vis masks. Thatās a pretty aggressive supposition, in fact for me personally that an outrageous position to hold. Lots of people needlessly died because people didnāt wear completely ineffectual pieces of cloth or get vaccinated with a vaccine that didnāt stop transmission? A study or about 20 million people showed that mask wearing does reduce transmission: www.pnas.org/doi/10.1073/pnas.2119266119Thatās about the largest study Iām aware of, and I often trust the research that comes out of PNAS as being of good standard.
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Post by terryconroysmagic on Oct 15, 2022 11:03:27 GMT
It does not seem clear at all vis a vis masks. Thatās a pretty aggressive supposition, in fact for me personally that an outrageous position to hold. Lots of people needlessly died because people didnāt wear completely ineffectual pieces of cloth or get vaccinated with a vaccine that didnāt stop transmission? A study or about 20 million people showed that mask wearing does reduce transmission: www.pnas.org/doi/10.1073/pnas.2119266119Thatās about the largest study Iām aware of, and I often trust the research that comes out of PNAS as being of good standard. āThey estimate mean decreases in infection risk between 4% and 15% for surgical masks, but with large uncertainty: Individual results ranged from a 7% increase in infection risk to a 61% decrease in infection risk.ā So still completely uncertain and looking at regions that had N95 mask mandates like Italy where there was no perceptible decrease in transmission
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Post by knype on Oct 15, 2022 12:54:34 GMT
Absolute bollocks. Go away . You were one of the twats calling people murderers. Did I say murderer? Where? we can be confident that lots of people needlessly died because of those who chose not to wear masks or get vaccinated or whatever. That seems pretty clear. Absolute bullshit
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Post by cvillestokie on Oct 15, 2022 13:01:40 GMT
A study or about 20 million people showed that mask wearing does reduce transmission: www.pnas.org/doi/10.1073/pnas.2119266119Thatās about the largest study Iām aware of, and I often trust the research that comes out of PNAS as being of good standard. āThey estimate mean decreases in infection risk between 4% and 15% for surgical masks, but with large uncertainty: Individual results ranged from a 7% increase in infection risk to a 61% decrease in infection risk.ā So still completely uncertain and looking at regions that had N95 mask mandates like Italy where there was no perceptible decrease in transmission They look at mask use, not necessarily the effectiveness of mask mandates. Mandates only work when people actually follow them. If you think that masks donāt work to reduce the spread of virus and bacteria, ask your surgeon not to bother next time. Uncertainty around measurements are expected. Thatās why you need large sample sizes to make conclusions. If you look at studies around any drug, youāll see lots of uncertainty. Youād still take it if needed.
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Post by knype on Oct 15, 2022 13:09:57 GMT
āThey estimate mean decreases in infection risk between 4% and 15% for surgical masks, but with large uncertainty: Individual results ranged from a 7% increase in infection risk to a 61% decrease in infection risk.ā So still completely uncertain and looking at regions that had N95 mask mandates like Italy where there was no perceptible decrease in transmission They look at mask use, not necessarily the effectiveness of mask mandates. Mandates only work when people actually follow them. If you think that masks donāt work to reduce the spread of virus and bacteria, ask your surgeon not to bother next time. Uncertainty around measurements are expected. Thatās why you need large sample sizes to make conclusions. If you look at studies around any drug, youāll see lots of uncertainty. Youād still take it if needed. I'd ask your surgeon why he wears one...
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Post by terryconroysmagic on Oct 15, 2022 13:16:03 GMT
āThey estimate mean decreases in infection risk between 4% and 15% for surgical masks, but with large uncertainty: Individual results ranged from a 7% increase in infection risk to a 61% decrease in infection risk.ā So still completely uncertain and looking at regions that had N95 mask mandates like Italy where there was no perceptible decrease in transmission They look at mask use, not necessarily the effectiveness of mask mandates. Mandates only work when people actually follow them. If you think that masks donāt work to reduce the spread of virus and bacteria, ask your surgeon not to bother next time. Uncertainty around measurements are expected. Thatās why you need large sample sizes to make conclusions. If you look at studies around any drug, youāll see lots of uncertainty. Youād still take it if needed. If you canāt see that thereās more holes in that āstudyā, than a Swiss cheese then Iām not sure what else to say. The results were āself reportedā, immediately brings in a significant and distorting bias. The study was done between May-Sept! Many other caveats and riders Real world statistics show that mask mandates (Austria & Italy followed them zealously) and wearing had no effect on transmission when compared with countries with no mask wearing
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Post by spitthedog on Oct 15, 2022 13:48:27 GMT
I can understand why some folk are disturbed by masks because they are so prominent as a symbol, but I find it comparatively small fry as an issue compared to vaccinations, something that is pumped into your system with potentially serious short term, and/or long term consequences.
Having spent time in Japan where it has always been common courtesy to wear a mask when infected with a cold.
I always thought that was quite thoughtful and a mark of respect for others so I find it difficult to get angry about tbh.
It should be a personal choice.
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Post by terryconroysmagic on Oct 15, 2022 14:26:42 GMT
I can understand why some folk are disturbed by masks because they are so prominent as a symbol, but I find it comparatively small fry as an issue compared to vaccinations, something that is pumped into your system with potentially serious short term, and/or long term consequences. Having spent time in Japan where it has always been common courtesy to wear a mask when infected with a cold. I always thought that was quite thoughtful and a mark of respect for others so I find it difficult to get angry about tbh. It should be a personal choice. Absolutely no problem with people wearing masks in any setting that they choose as long as itās a personal choice.
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Post by mtrstudent on Oct 15, 2022 15:10:14 GMT
When did the vaccine passports stop? We had good evidence the vaccines reduced transmission through delta so it made sense to think they might keep doing it. And unfortunately it takes ages to get the data so there's always a lag. I guess it depends on how you'd bet. If something has reduced the spread for every other version of the virus, each time there's a new version do you gamble on "this one's different" or "this one will be just like all the others"? Donāt agree there was never any good empirical evidence that it stopped transmission I've tried to never say it "stopped" transmission, but it reduced transmission. So far fewer people got infected thanks to the vaccines. Perhaps I'm missing evidence, but what did you think of this study: "the likelihood of household transmission was approximately 40 to 50% lower in households of index patients who had been vaccinated 21 days or more before testing positive" Or this study: "Full-schedule vaccination was associated with significant protection against infection. In addition, mRNA-vaccines reduced onward transmission: VE-estimates increased to >90% when index and contact were fully vaccinated." Or this study: "Adjusted vaccine effectiveness of Fully Vaccinated compared with Unvaccinated participants was 80.3% (95% confidence interval [CI], 73.5ā85.4)" The results I've seen depend on time since vaccination and the strain of virus. And some studies are more powerful than others: there's a UK household one and the Belgian one where they did regular PCR testing and I think those are the most convincing. They also both had samples during Delta and showed fewer infected people got any detectable virus, and you can't give a virus to someone if you don't have it - so the vaccines pretty clearly reduced the spread up to and including Delta... From what I can tell of course - I'll change my opinion if there's more empirical evidence going the other way.
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Post by terryconroysmagic on Oct 15, 2022 15:20:52 GMT
Donāt agree there was never any good empirical evidence that it stopped transmission I've tried to never say it "stopped" transmission, but it reduced transmission. So far fewer people got infected thanks to the vaccines. Perhaps I'm missing evidence, but what did you think of this study: "the likelihood of household transmission was approximately 40 to 50% lower in households of index patients who had been vaccinated 21 days or more before testing positive" Or this study: "Full-schedule vaccination was associated with significant protection against infection. In addition, mRNA-vaccines reduced onward transmission: VE-estimates increased to >90% when index and contact were fully vaccinated." Or this study: "Adjusted vaccine effectiveness of Fully Vaccinated compared with Unvaccinated participants was 80.3% (95% confidence interval [CI], 73.5ā85.4)" The results I've seen depend on time since vaccination and the strain of virus. And some studies are more powerful than others: there's a UK household one and the Belgian one where they did regular PCR testing and I think those are the most convincing. They also both had samples during Delta and showed fewer infected people got any detectable virus, and you can't give a virus to someone if you don't have it - so the vaccines pretty clearly reduced the spread up to and including Delta... From what I can tell of course - I'll change my opinion if there's more empirical evidence going the other way. Ill try and read those studies later but for me personally many in the medical profession have been compromised and even a cursory look at those studies suggest they are not reflective of what was happening in the real world. (80% effectiveness!) Also amazing that they could produce these studies so quickly but Pfizer themselves (because they were moving at the āspeed of scienceā!) couldnāt provide any data that it stopped/reduced transmission Anyway itās all moot as its unequivocally clear that vaccines currently do not reduce/stop transmission (but yet we have people still clamouring to jab 5 year olds despite the increasing evidence of vaccine induced harms) Edit: are you seriously suggesting that that first study is credible, am I reading the sampling sizes between vaccinated and vaccinated groups correctly, if so thatās just a joke.
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Post by Scrotnig on Oct 15, 2022 17:01:05 GMT
āThey estimate mean decreases in infection risk between 4% and 15% for surgical masks, but with large uncertainty: Individual results ranged from a 7% increase in infection risk to a 61% decrease in infection risk.ā So still completely uncertain and looking at regions that had N95 mask mandates like Italy where there was no perceptible decrease in transmission They look at mask use, not necessarily the effectiveness of mask mandates. Mandates only work when people actually follow them. If you think that masks donāt work to reduce the spread of virus and bacteria, ask your surgeon not to bother next time. Uncertainty around measurements are expected. Thatās why you need large sample sizes to make conclusions. If you look at studies around any drug, youāll see lots of uncertainty. Youād still take it if needed. FFS not the surgeon argument again! Go and look it up! Clue: they donāt wear them to prevent transmission of viruses.
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Post by knype on Oct 15, 2022 18:25:36 GMT
They look at mask use, not necessarily the effectiveness of mask mandates. Mandates only work when people actually follow them. If you think that masks donāt work to reduce the spread of virus and bacteria, ask your surgeon not to bother next time. Uncertainty around measurements are expected. Thatās why you need large sample sizes to make conclusions. If you look at studies around any drug, youāll see lots of uncertainty. Youād still take it if needed. FFS not the surgeon argument again! Go and look it up! Clue: they donāt wear them to prevent transmission of viruses. Spot on
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Post by terryconroysmagic on Oct 16, 2022 17:23:37 GMT
Seems to be an awful lot of (non covid) excess deaths in heavily vaccinated countries that is getting next to no media attention, if these were excess covid deaths Iād imagine we see media saturation coverageā¦
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Post by noustie on Oct 17, 2022 8:40:53 GMT
Posted this before but thought the questions the Union rep asks to defend health/ care colleagues who don't want to wear the blue surgical masks are interesting: As a Workers of England Union representative, on an almost daily basis I now find myself sat in front of NHS and care home grievance panels, defending members who do not wish to spend 12+ hour working shifts, with their faces covered by a useless (but very harmful) blue surgical mask. On every occasion, I ask the chair of the meeting the same questions:
- Have you carried out an individual risk assessment, (as per section 3 of the Management of Health and Safety at Work Regulations 1999), declaring the employee is medically fit to wear a mask throughout their entire working shift?
- Have you undertaken an individual fit test, carried out by an appropriately qualified health and safety practitioner?
- According to the Health and Safety Executive (the governmentās own regulator on PPE), it states ā[fluid resistant surgical masks] do not provide full respiratory protection against smaller suspended droplets and aerosols. That is, they are not regarded as personal protective equipment (PPE) under the European Directive 89/686/EEC (PPE Regulation 2002 SI 2002 No. 1144).ā So, why are you insisting they be worn by all staff?
- Why do you believe masks work against SARS-CoV2 (Covid-19) but not against influenza, adenovirus, rhinovirus, or the other six identified coronaviruses, four of which cause the common cold?
- Can you provide any evidence of the efficacy of surgical masks against an airborne virus spread by aerosols, measuring approximately 50-100nm in size?
- Do you understand the difference between guidance and law?
- Do you understand that āguidanceā is not legally binding? If there is a conflict between guidance and law, it is the law which sets the precedent. Any āpolicyā set by an employer must be both lawful and operate with the existing Equality Act 2010 legislation.www.hartgroup.org/the-facts-about-mask-requirements/
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Post by The Drunken Communist on Oct 17, 2022 16:02:05 GMT
What could go wrong...
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jack1
Youth Player
Posts: 297
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Post by jack1 on Oct 17, 2022 19:00:11 GMT
But were those mice vaccinated?? š¤£
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Post by thehartshillbadger on Oct 17, 2022 19:05:34 GMT
They look at mask use, not necessarily the effectiveness of mask mandates. Mandates only work when people actually follow them. If you think that masks donāt work to reduce the spread of virus and bacteria, ask your surgeon not to bother next time. Uncertainty around measurements are expected. Thatās why you need large sample sizes to make conclusions. If you look at studies around any drug, youāll see lots of uncertainty. Youād still take it if needed. FFS not the surgeon argument again! Go and look it up! Clue: they donāt wear them to prevent transmission of viruses. Quite right, itās to hide their breath from the patients after hitting double figures on coffee in the staff room
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jack1
Youth Player
Posts: 297
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Post by jack1 on Oct 18, 2022 18:11:48 GMT
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Post by questionable on Oct 18, 2022 18:41:10 GMT
Everyone we speak to when out walking either has Covid, Flu or this Cold virus thatās doing the rounds at the moment.
Weāve got this bloody Cold virus and itās knocked us for six.
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