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Post by fitzy17 on Jan 2, 2020 7:19:51 GMT
He seems a really great bloke and I hope he can do a good job lower down. But this job really started to effect him badly, never good to see With him the best of luck I'm not sure how you can say that he was a 'nice bloke', in what way? To me he was a complete narcissist. The only bloke who matters to Nathan Jones is Nathan Jones. The bloke is a total fruitcake, a fraud of a manager and a tool. This has the best word to describe him...NARCISSIST. All he ever talked about was him, and how hard he was working. An absolute clown of a bloke. Had the arrogance of Wenger without the results.
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Post by crapslinger on Jan 2, 2020 7:21:46 GMT
He seems a really great bloke and I hope he can do a good job lower down. But this job really started to effect him badly, never good to see With him the best of luck Isthmian League? AFC Porth are looking for an assistant.
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Post by Goonie on Jan 2, 2020 7:24:58 GMT
Lots of good posts on here, each covering the Jones angle well
For me I initially liked his passion and self-belief but it soon wore off at the start of this season and proved a few things:
Player acquisition was poor, unbalanced and spent a lot on untalented plodders (Lindsay et al) despite the 'young, hungry, pacey' pledge Poor tactics: his obsession with the diamond, the failure to recruit to it and the chopping and changing was, as noted by others, consistently inconsistent Game management poor: tactics, substitutions and in game management poor Player management poor: morale very low, couldn't keep the huge squad happy, froze out people like Diouf, Badou and Etebo at times Delusional self-belief despite evidence to the contrary - James McClean is not, never has and never will be a defensive wingback!
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Post by slicko on Jan 2, 2020 7:31:28 GMT
10/10 for enthusiasm 9/10 for honesty 8/10 for loyalty to the owners 3/10 for effective tactics 2/10 for commanding a dresssing room 1/10 for sticking to his principals ie red flags, 20 man squad.
Lovely guy but was a kid in candyland at our club.
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Post by crapslinger on Jan 2, 2020 7:38:07 GMT
10/10 for enthusiasm 9/10 for honesty 8/10 for loyalty to the owners 3/10 for effective tactics 2/10 for commanding a dresssing room 1/10 for sticking to his principals ie red flags, 20 man squad. Lovely guy but was a kid in candyland at our club. 9/10 for honesty young, hungry, pacey footballers a team to be proud of
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Post by Gary Hackett on Jan 2, 2020 7:39:51 GMT
10/10 for enthusiasm 9/10 for honesty 8/10 for loyalty to the owners 3/10 for effective tactics 2/10 for commanding a dresssing room 1/10 for sticking to his principals ie red flags, 20 man squad. Lovely guy but was a kid in candyland at our club. 9/10 for honesty young, hungry, pacey footballers a team to be proud of And continually PROMISING to fans that we'd have a team to be proud of
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Post by robrigo on Jan 2, 2020 7:43:44 GMT
When Jones was first appointed, I was thinking that the club had made a great appointment. That we had adopted a new approach with a young upcoming manager rather than the same names on the manager merry go round.
I looked at his Luton team and thought we’d got it right. His first interview impressed me immensely.
It took about 4/6 weeks to realise he hadn’t a clue. A man out of his depth completely.
For me he is the worst manager ever to sit in our dugout and he could well have consigned us to league one. He certainly would have if we’d have stuck.
At least now we have a fighting chance.
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Post by heworksardtho on Jan 2, 2020 7:44:00 GMT
Did his best , didn’t work out , shit happens
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Post by crapslinger on Jan 2, 2020 7:47:34 GMT
Did his best , didn’t work out , shit happens That was his best never take advice from a bloke in a pub about hiring managers.
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Post by zerps on Jan 2, 2020 8:01:15 GMT
He seems a really great bloke and I hope he can do a good job lower down. But this job really started to effect him badly, never good to see With him the best of luck I could never "take" to him. Obviously the players felt the same. Massive fraud. You don’t mention it enough tbf
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Post by Deleted on Jan 2, 2020 9:42:29 GMT
I was a Nathan Jones fanboy. It wasn't that I still backed him right til the end - just more of a case of wishing it would work out for him. It just got to a desperation point where we'd line up with something new, then change things around 5 times during the game and wondering why nothing worked. He seemed to go over a tipping point of working hard to complete obsession and the whole thing ended up consuming him.
I don't think he's a fraud and charlatan like some claim, just that it was too big a job for him and was sad to see how it seemed to affect him towards the end. We've moved on. I don't harbour any ill will towards him - he was offered a bigger job than he'd got, on a much increased salary and an opportunity that most would jump at. That wasn't his fault. He was just shit for us and many of his signings were poor - though ironically some are looking better under MON.
I wish him the best, find another lower league team that he can build. Not particularly looking out for him, and if he comes to Stoke in charge of another team he'll get a shrug of the shoulders from me.
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Post by mamasgloves on Jan 2, 2020 9:45:47 GMT
It was the wrong job for him in the end, there was just to much to do, players out, FFP etc, with that and then trying to implament a system that he didn't really have the players for it was always too much for him, calling him a fraud seems a bit much, he did well at Luton and I can see him doing it again at some point, just at a club that isn't such a mess. I'm sorry, he was given a free swing for 6 months and allowed to bring in a DOZEN of his own players who were largely shite, the same players MON is now having to deal with and getting a tune out of too. He was an unmitigated disaster in every single sense. Where is the utter weapon who said sacking him would be the worst decision any club will make this year?
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Post by bayernoatcake on Jan 2, 2020 9:45:52 GMT
He seems a really great bloke and I hope he can do a good job lower down. But this job really started to effect him badly, never good to see With him the best of luck I'm not sure how you can say that he was a 'nice bloke', in what way? To me he was a complete narcissist. The only bloke who matters to Nathan Jones is Nathan Jones. The bloke is a total fruitcake, a fraud of a manager and a tool. You said something that caused a stir and was controversial due to the nature of it but was absolutely bang on for me. You mentioned his religious beliefs and how that branch of Christianity believes in what they do and nothing else and how narrow minded that can make someone. Or something similar anyway. And that was totally him. He had so much faith in what he stood for but in the end what he stood for was what was killing him. He never stood a chance.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 2, 2020 9:47:11 GMT
When Jones was first appointed, I was thinking that the club had made a great appointment. That we had adopted a new approach with a young upcoming manager rather than the same names on the manager merry go round. I looked at his Luton team and thought we’d got it right. His first interview impressed me immensely. It took about 4/6 weeks to realise he hadn’t a clue. A man out of his depth completely. For me he is the worst manager ever to sit in our dugout and he could well have consigned us to league one. He certainly would have if we’d have stuck. At least now we have a fighting chance. A lot I can agree with. I think I was blinded by the whole "lets write off this season, judge me after 10 games next season when I've bought in my own players". I was willing to put aside a lot of the issues last season and give him that time and chance as I felt that was better than changing manager again after another half a season so I still stand by that. I also gave him his 10 games, and still felt he'd been incredibly unfortunate with the sitters being missed, Butland developing butter fingers and doing our best to screw up. But - his time was up. We've all moved on and there is such a clear improvement since MON's appointment.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 2, 2020 9:48:03 GMT
He admitted about halfway through his tenure that he wasn't used to losing the games he did and wasn't sure how to handle it. I think that sums him and his suitability for the job down to a tee. He wasn't ready for it, especially with such a quirky system and less than a tenth of the money his predecessor had to spend to turn a failing club around.
I don't think it does him any harm and he should learn from it in the long run. To say he's a fraud is just plain wrong. You can't be a fraud if you turn a team of misfits at League Two or One level into the second highest scoring behind Man City if you don't know what you're doing.
It didn't work out for him here and I personally wish him all the best for the future.
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Post by bayernoatcake on Jan 2, 2020 9:54:02 GMT
He admitted about halfway through his tenure that he wasn't used to losing the games he did and wasn't sure how to handle it. I think that sums him and his suitability for the job down to a tee. He wasn't ready for it, especially with such a quirky system and less than a tenth of the money his predecessor had to spend to turn a failing club around. I don't think it does him any harm and he should learn from it in the long run. To say he's a fraud is just plain wrong. You can't be a fraud if you turn a team of misfits at League Two or One level into the second highest scoring behind Man City if you don't know what you're doing. It didn't work out for him here and I personally wish him all the best for the future. Less than a tenth? Rowett spent about 60m? Jones spent about 12/13? Plus some massive signing on fees for Gregory and Powell etc.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 2, 2020 9:59:07 GMT
When Jones was first appointed, I was thinking that the club had made a great appointment. That we had adopted a new approach with a young upcoming manager rather than the same names on the manager merry go round. I looked at his Luton team and thought we’d got it right. His first interview impressed me immensely. It took about 4/6 weeks to realise he hadn’t a clue. A man out of his depth completely. For me he is the worst manager ever to sit in our dugout and he could well have consigned us to league one. He certainly would have if we’d have stuck. At least now we have a fighting chance. A lot I can agree with. I think I was blinded by the whole "lets write off this season, judge me after 10 games next season when I've bought in my own players". I was willing to put aside a lot of the issues last season and give him that time and chance as I felt that was better than changing manager again after another half a season so I still stand by that. I also gave him his 10 games, and still felt he'd been incredibly unfortunate with the sitters being missed, Butland developing butter fingers and doing our best to screw up. But - his time was up. We've all moved on and there is such a clear improvement since MON's appointment. To be fair giving him the summer to bring in "his type of player" was absolutely the right thing to do. But our recruitment was terrible, he pinned all his hopes on a diamond formation then went into the season with McClean/Ward as his left backs, and Cousins as his DCM. The two pivotal positions to make the formation work, that alone is a sacking offence. He then dropped the formation he's been banging on about for 6 months at the first sign of problems, when he should have stuck to it and sank or swam by it. In the end we had a manager brought in to play a certain way, sloshing around in a pool of piss changing his formation and personnel by the week......
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Post by Deleted on Jan 2, 2020 10:00:33 GMT
He admitted about halfway through his tenure that he wasn't used to losing the games he did and wasn't sure how to handle it. I think that sums him and his suitability for the job down to a tee. He wasn't ready for it, especially with such a quirky system and less than a tenth of the money his predecessor had to spend to turn a failing club around. I don't think it does him any harm and he should learn from it in the long run. To say he's a fraud is just plain wrong. You can't be a fraud if you turn a team of misfits at League Two or One level into the second highest scoring behind Man City if you don't know what you're doing. It didn't work out for him here and I personally wish him all the best for the future. Less than a tenth? Rowett spent about 60m? Jones spent about 12/13? Plus some massive signing on fees for Gregory and Powell etc. I question whether Vokes and Batth were really his signings or were they Lambert style NDiaye signings that Rowett wanted and the club were so far down the line with them that they were either obliged to complete or didn't want to back track on them, with Jones happy to sign off on them to keep the peace.
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Post by lostinafrenchbar on Jan 2, 2020 10:02:32 GMT
I thought he was a weird but interesting appointment....and then he made all those bloody silly signings, like a kid who'd been starving in Luton, and suddenly the Coates family give him the keys to a branch of Thorntons. From then on we were in trouble, and it's going to take a while to recover from the financial mess him and Hughes are largely responsible for.
It wasn't a great idea from Stoke's point of view, but I'll never understand why he left Luton. Seemed an odd thing to do, and maybe that's the answer. God moves in mysterious ways so he does too.
I think MON is also a weird but interesting appointment. Fingers and legs crossed for the moment.
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Post by bayernoatcake on Jan 2, 2020 10:09:50 GMT
Less than a tenth? Rowett spent about 60m? Jones spent about 12/13? Plus some massive signing on fees for Gregory and Powell etc. I question whether Vokes and Batth were really his signings or were they Lambert style NDiaye signings that Rowett wanted and the club were so far down the line with them that they were either obliged to complete or didn't want to back track on them, with Jones happy to sign off on them to keep the peace. I forgot about Batth. So it’s more like 15/16. I don’t think so tbh. We carried on with players like them in the summer minus the fees.
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Post by GeneralFaye on Jan 2, 2020 10:12:06 GMT
Gave him the benefit of the doubt last season but this summer was catastrophic and I didn't particularly like him as a person if I'm honest, far too intense and seemingly little idea on how to get results under pressure.
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Post by ColonelMustard on Jan 2, 2020 10:47:36 GMT
I just posted this on another thread but its probably more relevant here. One of the things I was most critical of Jones were his signings. Which not only looked poor but that he didnt play. O'Neil is picking far more of them and getting them to look like footballers. Thankfully, Jones's recruitment might not be as bad as first suspected. In hindsight it was his management skills and naivety that were the bigger problems. He seemed to suffer from a confusing combination of over confidence with a lack of courage.
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Post by slicko on Jan 2, 2020 10:49:20 GMT
10/10 for enthusiasm 9/10 for honesty 8/10 for loyalty to the owners 3/10 for effective tactics 2/10 for commanding a dresssing room 1/10 for sticking to his principals ie red flags, 20 man squad. Lovely guy but was a kid in candyland at our club. 9/10 for honesty young, hungry, pacey footballers a team to be proud of Ahem, good point and well made. Perhaps I should have said “convincingly honest until proven otherwise “.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 2, 2020 10:54:00 GMT
A lot I can agree with. I think I was blinded by the whole "lets write off this season, judge me after 10 games next season when I've bought in my own players". I was willing to put aside a lot of the issues last season and give him that time and chance as I felt that was better than changing manager again after another half a season so I still stand by that. I also gave him his 10 games, and still felt he'd been incredibly unfortunate with the sitters being missed, Butland developing butter fingers and doing our best to screw up. But - his time was up. We've all moved on and there is such a clear improvement since MON's appointment. To be fair giving him the summer to bring in "his type of player" was absolutely the right thing to do. But our recruitment was terrible, he pinned all his hopes on a diamond formation then went into the season with McClean/Ward as his left backs, and Cousins as his DCM. The two pivotal positions to make the formation work, that alone is a sacking offence. He then dropped the formation he's been banging on about for 6 months at the first sign of problems, when he should have stuck to it and sank or swam by it. In the end we had a manager brought in to play a certain way, sloshing around in a pool of piss changing his formation and personnel by the week...... 100% agree with that
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Post by stokiejoe on Jan 2, 2020 10:59:22 GMT
I liked him as a person for his enthusiasm and passion, but his results were poor. It's interesting to see the contrast between MON and Jones: MON is calm and laid back on the touchline whereas Jones was a bag of nerves. It is noticeable that this appears to tranmit to the team.
We went behind and MON stood there with hands in pockets, we came back and he was still the same. Ok celebrated after but his approach does appear to be working.
Still early days of course.
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Post by mamasgloves on Jan 2, 2020 11:04:27 GMT
I question whether Vokes and Batth were really his signings or were they Lambert style NDiaye signings that Rowett wanted and the club were so far down the line with them that they were either obliged to complete or didn't want to back track on them, with Jones happy to sign off on them to keep the peace. I forgot about Batth. So it’s more like 15/16. I don’t think so tbh. We carried on with players like them in the summer minus the fees. All told it was around £20m that he spent Vokes was £9m (plus more in clauses) Batth over £3m? Smith £4m Lindsay just under £3m? Plus multi million sign ons for both Powell and Davies
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Post by bayernoatcake on Jan 2, 2020 11:08:48 GMT
I forgot about Batth. So it’s more like 15/16. I don’t think so tbh. We carried on with players like them in the summer minus the fees. All told it was around £20m that he spent Vokes was £9m (plus more in clauses) Batth over £3m? Smith £4m Lindsay just under £3m? Plus multi million sign ons for both Powell and Davies I’ve seen 7 for Vokes so was going off that. But he was definitely backed and backed bloody well relative to most managers in this league. There’s one of his signings I wouldn’t sell immediately. And that’s Powell who I would never have signed in the first place because of his injuries. The rest are toss.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 2, 2020 11:17:42 GMT
I was among the first Jones doubters back in February, called his bluff many times, but give some credit where it's due. A Jones signing was our game changer yesterday. Possibly our season changer.
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Post by leicspotter on Jan 2, 2020 11:26:27 GMT
Based on all of this it looks like Scholes is off the hook...?
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Post by wakefieldstokie on Jan 2, 2020 11:29:39 GMT
Nathan Jones was the most catastrophic and devastating thing to hit on this club since the gales of January 1976. You forgot Tony Scholes! And Paul Williams ample arse hitting the changing room door frame.
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