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Post by thevoid on Dec 22, 2019 14:48:03 GMT
This is nonsense, he inherited a disparate bunch of players and we would have gone down if he had not come in. As I said, he has never been relegated and look at the phenomenal job he has done at clubs like Plymouth. What he did at Boro now looks good in the light of what they have become this season. Pulis has never been relegated you say I am surprised he has not mentioned this before off the top of my head the only other Stoke managers who could make a similar claim are Michael O Neill, Nathan Jones, Gary Rowett, Mark Hughes (plus if I could be bothered to look some of Bates, Jordan, Macari, Mills). Not being relegated is not actually that big a claim. And what middlesboro have become is down to a massive reduction in the budget not pulis who actually took a middlesboro side to a play off semi final they needed to win and his team didnt manage a single shot on target from memory. They didn't have a shot in the first leg at home to Villa. Obviously they had a go in the away leg with being a goal down, but the question remains as to why they didn't adopt this approach from the get go. In summary, he's spineless. He was more concerned with the might of Norwich at home than Valencia away |
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Post by royalewithcheese on Dec 22, 2019 14:52:44 GMT
Yes. And the history and record books. False. |
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Post by royalewithcheese on Dec 22, 2019 14:53:20 GMT
Trophies. League position. He's not even close. He absolutely is. |
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Post by Pugsley on Dec 22, 2019 15:05:19 GMT
Are you referring to the context of 'Tone' only spending less than Chelsea and Man City over a 5 year period, that context? It's a good point actually. Prior to the 07/08 season commencing you wouldn't have found a single Stoke fan who had any genuine expectations of promotion. Nobody from the outside was predicting we would be in the hunt either. It was an unbelievable achievement to get us up. And when we got there every man and his dog wrote us off before a ball was kicked. The squad we had shouldn't have had a hope. After the first game at Bolton it looked like the writing was on the wall. He somehow managed to keep that squad up, and that is incidentally the kind of miracle we need right now. We then went from strength to strength and consolidated our place in the top flight. He took us to the FA Cup final and allowed us to dare to dream, with a brilliant day out at Wembley (not forgetting the semi final trip too, which will live with me for a lifetime). We then went on the European adventure and made even more unbelievable memories, the kind of which I never thought I'd see in my lifetime. Still, slag him off if you like. He was fucking shit. "..allowed us to dare to dream" PMSL - if he worked as hard on developing his football team as he did on damping down expectations Toxic would have won us everything. Your heads gone mate. |
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Post by royalewithcheese on Dec 22, 2019 15:09:50 GMT
Prior to the 07/08 season commencing you wouldn't have found a single Stoke fan who had any genuine expectations of promotion. Nobody from the outside was predicting we would be in the hunt either. It was an unbelievable achievement to get us up. And when we got there every man and his dog wrote us off before a ball was kicked. The squad we had shouldn't have had a hope. After the first game at Bolton it looked like the writing was on the wall. He somehow managed to keep that squad up, and that is incidentally the kind of miracle we need right now. We then went from strength to strength and consolidated our place in the top flight. He took us to the FA Cup final and allowed us to dare to dream, with a brilliant day out at Wembley (not forgetting the semi final trip too, which will live with me for a lifetime). We then went on the European adventure and made even more unbelievable memories, the kind of which I never thought I'd see in my lifetime. Still, slag him off if you like. He was fucking shit. "..allowed us to dare to dream" PMSL - if he worked as hard on developing his football team as he did on damping down expectations Toxic would have won us everything. Your heads gone mate. My heads fine mate. Its clearly you who has clouded judgement. You dont like the guy, that's fine. But you cant argue with what he achieved at the club. I'd bet every last cent I have that I won't see another manager remotely as successful as Pulis in my life time. We've gone from seriously over achieving in his days, to a succession of managers that have seriously under achieved, despite healthy financial backing. We should have taken him back when we had the chance. He would have made a fist of keeping this bunch of jokers up. |
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Post by RAF on Dec 22, 2019 15:20:29 GMT
Are you referring to the context of 'Tone' only spending less than Chelsea and Man City over a 5 year period, that context? It's a good point actually. Prior to the 07/08 season commencing you wouldn't have found a single Stoke fan who had any genuine expectations of promotion. Nobody from the outside was predicting we would be in the hunt either. It was an unbelievable achievement to get us up. And when we got there every man and his dog wrote us off before a ball was kicked. The squad we had shouldn't have had a hope. After the first game at Bolton it looked like the writing was on the wall. He somehow managed to keep that squad up, and that is incidentally the kind of miracle we need right now. We then went from strength to strength and consolidated our place in the top flight. He took us to the FA Cup final and allowed us to dare to dream, with a brilliant day out at Wembley (not forgetting the semi final trip too, which will live with me for a lifetime). We then went on the European adventure and made even more unbelievable memories, the kind of which I never thought I'd see in my lifetime. Still, slag him off if you like. He was fucking shit. No one has actually said that though have they drama queen? H |
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Post by Clem on Dec 22, 2019 15:20:31 GMT
You've provided an opinion on why you think Tony Pulis is Stoke City's most successful manager. He's not though. In your opinion. Context |
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Post by LL Cool Dave on Dec 22, 2019 15:24:51 GMT
Should have gone for Pearson.
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Post by royalewithcheese on Dec 22, 2019 15:36:42 GMT
Prior to the 07/08 season commencing you wouldn't have found a single Stoke fan who had any genuine expectations of promotion. Nobody from the outside was predicting we would be in the hunt either. It was an unbelievable achievement to get us up. And when we got there every man and his dog wrote us off before a ball was kicked. The squad we had shouldn't have had a hope. After the first game at Bolton it looked like the writing was on the wall. He somehow managed to keep that squad up, and that is incidentally the kind of miracle we need right now. We then went from strength to strength and consolidated our place in the top flight. He took us to the FA Cup final and allowed us to dare to dream, with a brilliant day out at Wembley (not forgetting the semi final trip too, which will live with me for a lifetime). We then went on the European adventure and made even more unbelievable memories, the kind of which I never thought I'd see in my lifetime. Still, slag him off if you like. He was fucking shit. No one has actually said that though have they drama queen? H Have you got anything of substance to add to the debate for once kid, or just contributing your usual arsegravy nuggets of wisdom? |
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Post by thevoid on Dec 22, 2019 15:44:03 GMT
Trophies. League position. He's not even close. He absolutely is. Garbage. Trophies won? Bettered by Waddington. League position? Bettered by Waddington and Hughes European qualification? Achieved twice by Waddington via league placings rather than by default for losing a cup final whereby the opposition had already qualified. |
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Post by royalewithcheese on Dec 22, 2019 15:49:29 GMT
Garbage. Trophies won? Bettered by Waddington. League position? Bettered by Waddington and Hughes European qualification? Achieved twice by Waddington via league placings rather than by default for losing a cup final whereby the opposition had already qualified. Context. Different eras. Pulis was in a an era where the game was completely different. Money changed it significantly and made it more difficult for the lesser teams to compete. The divide between the top and the rest became much bigger. There wasnt that much disparity 40 or 50 years ago. Much more level playing field. Context. |
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Post by thevoid on Dec 22, 2019 15:54:34 GMT
Garbage. Trophies won? Bettered by Waddington. League position? Bettered by Waddington and Hughes European qualification? Achieved twice by Waddington via league placings rather than by default for losing a cup final whereby the opposition had already qualified. Context. Different eras. Pulis was in a an era where the game was completely different. Money changed it significantly and made it more difficult for the lesser teams to compete. The divide between the top and the rest became much bigger. There wasnt that much disparity 40 or 50 years ago. Much more level playing field. Context. Makes it even more astonishing that Hughes achieved higher league placings than Pulis managed then, especially as these were achieved over a 38 game programme against some of these top teams you referenced. That's more commendable than a favourable cup draw against Wolves reserves, Cardiff and a Bolton side in decline, surely? Context. |
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Post by royalewithcheese on Dec 22, 2019 16:08:59 GMT
Context. Different eras. Pulis was in a an era where the game was completely different. Money changed it significantly and made it more difficult for the lesser teams to compete. The divide between the top and the rest became much bigger. There wasnt that much disparity 40 or 50 years ago. Much more level playing field. Context. Makes it even more astonishing that Hughes achieved higher league placings than Pulis managed then, especially as these were achieved over a 38 game programme against some of these top teams you referenced. That's more commendable than a favourable cup draw against Wolves reserves, Cardiff and a Bolton side in decline, surely? Context. Hughes inherited a great backbone of a side, and built on the foundations. He did brilliant for 3 years, but hes not in the same league as Pulis when it comes to great Stoke managers. |
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Post by dannymadeley30 on Dec 22, 2019 16:13:04 GMT
This is nonsense, he inherited a disparate bunch of players and we would have gone down if he had not come in. As I said, he has never been relegated and look at the phenomenal job he has done at clubs like Plymouth. What he did at Boro now looks good in the light of what they have become this season. Pulis has never been relegated you say I am surprised he has not mentioned this before off the top of my head the only other Stoke managers who could make a similar claim are Michael O Neill, Nathan Jones, Gary Rowett, Mark Hughes (plus if I could be bothered to look some of Bates, Jordan, Macari, Mills). Not being relegated is not actually that big a claim. And what middlesboro have become is down to a massive reduction in the budget not pulis who actually took a middlesboro side to a play off semi final they needed to win and his team didnt manage a single shot on target from memory. TP has been around a lot longer than those managers and been given some tough gigs. We have taken a chance on a manager with very little relevant league experience when we could have brought back our best manager since Waddo. |
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Post by thevoid on Dec 22, 2019 16:16:34 GMT
Makes it even more astonishing that Hughes achieved higher league placings than Pulis managed then, especially as these were achieved over a 38 game programme against some of these top teams you referenced. That's more commendable than a favourable cup draw against Wolves reserves, Cardiff and a Bolton side in decline, surely? Context. Hughes inherited a great backbone of a side, and built on the foundations. He did brilliant for 3 years, but hes not in the same league as Pulis when it comes to great Stoke managers. League placings and results earned home AND away against the top sides suggest otherwise. Even his one full season below 9th saw a position that Pulis achieved. In fact you could also argue that the League Cup run in 2015/16 saw tougher opposition beaten than the FA Cup run under Pulis (Chelsea, beaten with 10 men). Context. |
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Post by Miles Offside on Dec 22, 2019 16:16:46 GMT
The fact is that we are heading for League One under a succession of poor managers with the most contemptable set of players ever to wear the shirt. Meanwhile, our most successful manager since Waddo remains available. As long as we continue to slide, he is the elephant in the room who could put a stop to it. I can't see the fans accepting Hughes back. Hughes  . Why wouldn't we turn to the man who left us sliding towards relegation, with the team spirit ruined and the club's finances wrecked? Good old Sparky. Pulis would've been perfect for the dog fight we're in now, but the owners seem to think he'd be one Tony too many in the hierarchy. |
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Post by dannymadeley30 on Dec 22, 2019 16:21:17 GMT
I can't see the fans accepting Hughes back. Hughes . Why wouldn't we turn to the man who left us sliding towards relegation, with the team spirit ruined and the club's finances wrecked? Good old Sparky. Pulis would've been perfect for the dog fight we're in now, but the owners seem to think he'd be one Tony too many in the hierarchy. Yes, we could have got TP in until the end of the season then reviewed it then. I think he would have kept us up comfortably then we would be looking at a play off bid next season with a lot of this deadwood binned off. |
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Post by royalewithcheese on Dec 22, 2019 16:24:13 GMT
Hughes inherited a great backbone of a side, and built on the foundations. He did brilliant for 3 years, but hes not in the same league as Pulis when it comes to great Stoke managers. League placings and results earned home AND away against the top sides suggest otherwise. Even his one full season below 9th saw a position that Pulis achieved. In fact you could also argue that the League Cup run in 2015/16 saw tougher opposition beaten than the FA Cup run under Pulis (Chelsea, beaten with 10 men). Context. None of what Hughes achieved would have been possible without the incredible work Pulis carried out before. Logic. |
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Post by Deleted on Dec 22, 2019 16:28:51 GMT
Groundhog day yet again
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Post by thevoid on Dec 22, 2019 16:42:33 GMT
League placings and results earned home AND away against the top sides suggest otherwise. Even his one full season below 9th saw a position that Pulis achieved. In fact you could also argue that the League Cup run in 2015/16 saw tougher opposition beaten than the FA Cup run under Pulis (Chelsea, beaten with 10 men). Context. None of what Hughes achieved would have been possible without the incredible work Pulis carried out before. Logic. So how come these finishes weren't achieved under Pulis? How come Hughes managed to get better finishes with Pulis players than Pulis managed? How come Pulis wasn't able to identify players to achieve these higher standings himself? Baffled. |
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Post by royalewithcheese on Dec 22, 2019 16:46:21 GMT
None of what Hughes achieved would have been possible without the incredible work Pulis carried out before. Logic. So how come these finishes weren't achieved under Pulis? How come Hughes managed to get better finishes with Pulis players than Pulis managed? How come Pulis wasn't able to identify players to achieve these higher standings himself? Baffled. His time ran out. He lost his way. All managers, even the very best, have a shelf life. Same thing with Hughes. Started off brilliant, then ended up completely shit. Doesn't negate the great work he did before. Which bit of any of this are you struggling with? |
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Post by thevoid on Dec 22, 2019 16:48:38 GMT
Hughes . Why wouldn't we turn to the man who left us sliding towards relegation, with the team spirit ruined and the club's finances wrecked? Good old Sparky. Pulis would've been perfect for the dog fight we're in now, but the owners seem to think he'd be one Tony too many in the hierarchy. Yes, we could have got TP in until the end of the season then reviewed it then. I think he would have kept us up comfortably then we would be looking at a play off bid next season with a lot of this deadwood binned off. Wow, do you have tomorrow's horseracing results? You're setting considerable store in wishful and fanciful thinking, and no small degree of bias, rather than anything concrete and substantial. For instance, your posts during and after MON's maiden win at Oakwell were not the kind of posts I'd expect from a Stoke fan after hearing his side not only win a much-needed game of football, but also score four goals in a game for the first time since JRR Tolkien was in short trousers. It hardly suggests you're approaching this debate with an open mind if you don't mind me saying? |
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Post by wrighter on Dec 22, 2019 16:50:52 GMT
Should have gone for Pearson. i said that after Hughes was sacked |
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Post by thevoid on Dec 22, 2019 16:55:18 GMT
So how come these finishes weren't achieved under Pulis? How come Hughes managed to get better finishes with Pulis players than Pulis managed? How come Pulis wasn't able to identify players to achieve these higher standings himself? Baffled. His time ran out. He lost his way. All managers, even the very best, have a shelf life. Same thing with Hughes. Started off brilliant, then ended up completely shit. Doesn't negate the great work he did before. Which bit of any of this are you struggling with? I'm struggling with your earlier musings where you stated that Pulis was our most successful manager ever, which, despite being presented with cold hard facts and evidence to the contrary, you continue to espouse. I'm glad you agree that his time ran out though. Couldn't agree more. Catfish. |
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Post by royalewithcheese on Dec 22, 2019 16:57:30 GMT
His time ran out. He lost his way. All managers, even the very best, have a shelf life. Same thing with Hughes. Started off brilliant, then ended up completely shit. Doesn't negate the great work he did before. Which bit of any of this are you struggling with? I'm struggling with your earlier musings where you stated that Pulis was our most successful manager ever, which, despite being presented with cold hard facts and evidence to the contrary, you continue to espouse. I'm glad you agree that his time ran out though. Couldn't agree more. Catfish. Pulis is our most successful manager ever. I think most fans would agree with that. |
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Post by benjaminbiscuit on Dec 22, 2019 16:59:45 GMT
See Pearson and Shakespeare proven at the level and beyond and available at the time as many stated got Watford going today .O’Neil appointment was like looking for someone ti fly a 747 and going for someone who’d once flown a Cessna always going to be too big a task and going to end in a horrible crash . But of course the process deemed it more important to recruit someone who’d fall for pilot error rather than someone who’d say fuck the process and the dipstick over paid weasel that runs it and actually fly the plane .
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Post by thevoid on Dec 22, 2019 17:02:39 GMT
I'm struggling with your earlier musings where you stated that Pulis was our most successful manager ever, which, despite being presented with cold hard facts and evidence to the contrary, you continue to espouse. I'm glad you agree that his time ran out though. Couldn't agree more. Catfish. Pulis is our most successful manager ever. I think most fans would agree with that. We're going round in circles now, and for that reason, I'm out. Chewbacca. |
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Post by fca47 on Dec 22, 2019 17:03:19 GMT
Comparing the side TP inherited to one of the most expensively assembled sides ever in the Championship, the last three managers started with , is ludicrous, and only goes to show that people are wilfully misrepresenting the situations.
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Post by Clem on Dec 22, 2019 17:06:09 GMT
I'm struggling with your earlier musings where you stated that Pulis was our most successful manager ever, which, despite being presented with cold hard facts and evidence to the contrary, you continue to espouse. I'm glad you agree that his time ran out though. Couldn't agree more. Catfish. Pulis is our most successful manager ever. I think most fans would agree with that. Kippers |
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Post by RAF on Dec 22, 2019 17:18:04 GMT
No one has actually said that though have they drama queen? H Have you got anything of substance to add to the debate for once kid, or just contributing your usual arsegravy nuggets of wisdom? Ironic Drama Queen. H |
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. Why wouldn't we turn to the man who left us sliding towards relegation, with the team spirit ruined and the club's finances wrecked? Good old Sparky.
