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Nov 16, 2019 20:29:54 GMT
Post by Deleted on Nov 16, 2019 20:29:54 GMT
But DC in ultimate control. 3 different companies. She’s not even a director of the company that own the stadium. The betting company is hers, the club is her dads who was majority stakeholder holder with John, Denise, Richard, Scholes all minor. Whether the stakeholdings have been increased for John with him taking more control I don’t know, but I do know Denise doesn’t control the club. Her husband has more say than her Mmm
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FFP
Nov 16, 2019 21:05:47 GMT
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Post by bayernoatcake on Nov 16, 2019 21:05:47 GMT
But DC in ultimate control. 3 different companies. She’s not even a director of the company that own the stadium. The betting company is hers, the club is her dads who was majority stakeholder holder with John, Denise, Richard, Scholes all minor. Whether the stakeholdings have been increased for John with him taking more control I don’t know, but I do know Denise doesn’t control the club. Her husband has more say than her The official site (as ever) disagrees.
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FFP
Nov 16, 2019 21:37:07 GMT
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Post by skiptomylou on Nov 16, 2019 21:37:07 GMT
So can the club just not be "sold" from one family member to the next to loop hole FFP?
It's not ethical but is it possible?
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FFP
Nov 16, 2019 21:55:53 GMT
Post by benjaminbiscuit on Nov 16, 2019 21:55:53 GMT
Load of old tosh being said on here .
According to companies house , ultimately the club is owned by the Bet 365 group , the directors of which are the family and secretary and one other .definitively not Scholes .
That co can do a it pleases with any wholly owned subsidiary and its directors hire and fire in terms of its commercial running , clearly they have to abide by FFP or the law in which any of their subsidiaries operate but they can hire fire , sell close , invest as they please in line with the articles of the owning co and the laws which apply to their subsidiaries .
Whether or not they are in line with FFP remains to be seen but clearly they will want to help that subsidiary by minimising cost and maximising revenue wherever possible and one would expect them to be very aware of that
As far as Scholes is concerned like anyone else employed or subsidiary director if they are one , they can send them to oblivion whenever they choose as long as they act in line with any service agreement , subsidiary share agreements incentives etc most likely and usually by way of a. Compromise agreement .They could have binned anyone at Stoke city at Anytime , if they haven’t it’s because they choose not to , not because they can’t .
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Post by thebet365 on Nov 16, 2019 22:42:44 GMT
So can the club just not be "sold" from one family member to the next to loop hole FFP? It's not ethical but is it possible? That would have nothing to do with FFP, if sat Peter sold it to John for an inflated fee it would just be Peter making a profit. It would have to be the club selling something that it owns to realise a profit, and with the stadium being in Stoke holdings not Stoke City football club then it's only players we have to sell.
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Post by thebet365 on Nov 16, 2019 22:59:16 GMT
But DC in ultimate control. 3 different companies. She’s not even a director of the company that own the stadium. The betting company is hers, the club is her dads who was majority stakeholder holder with John, Denise, Richard, Scholes all minor. Whether the stakeholdings have been increased for John with him taking more control I don’t know, but I do know Denise doesn’t control the club. Her husband has more say than her I have no doubt she has nothing to do with the running of the club, but to clear up the ownership issues. Stoke City football club is owned by many shareholders, Peter Coates being the individual with the most at just over 600,000 however Stoke holdings have over 5 million shares making them the majority shareholder. Stoke holdings whilst having Peter and John as directors is solely owned by Bet365 as the shareholder. Bet365 is 50% owned by Denise, John has 25% I think and the rest is split with Peter, Richard, the kids and someone else. The ground is owned by Stoke City property, which has Richard, Peter, Scholes and John as directors however its shareholding is solely Stoke City holdings. So basically Bet365 wholly own the ground and have the majority in the club.
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FFP
Nov 17, 2019 12:31:39 GMT
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Post by benjaminbiscuit on Nov 17, 2019 12:31:39 GMT
3 different companies. She’s not even a director of the company that own the stadium. The betting company is hers, the club is her dads who was majority stakeholder holder with John, Denise, Richard, Scholes all minor. Whether the stakeholdings have been increased for John with him taking more control I don’t know, but I do know Denise doesn’t control the club. Her husband has more say than her I have no doubt she has nothing to do with the running of the club, but to clear up the ownership issues. Stoke City football club is owned by many shareholders, Peter Coates being the individual with the most at just over 600,000 however Stoke holdings have over 5 million shares making them the majority shareholder. Stoke holdings whilst having Peter and John as directors is solely owned by Bet365 as the shareholder. Bet365 is 50% owned by Denise, John has 25% I think and the rest is split with Peter, Richard, the kids and someone else. The ground is owned by Stoke City property, which has Richard, Peter, Scholes and John as directors however its shareholding is solely Stoke City holdings. So basically Bet365 wholly own the ground and have the majority in the club. As I said they can do what they want with who they want when they want as long. As it’s within the law and completion rules . Question will be how much help can the parent co give and I what way in addition to the actions within the club itself
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Nov 17, 2019 15:12:11 GMT
Post by Deleted on Nov 17, 2019 15:12:11 GMT
I've never read the ins and outs of FFP, but it seems that to keep clubs solvent, expenditure is geared to income. I really do not understand this, as the solvency (or otherwise) will surely be measured from the Balance Sheet, and not P&L Account.
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Nov 18, 2019 14:12:12 GMT
Post by cheekymatt71 on Nov 18, 2019 14:12:12 GMT
Looking at scenario planning we are either in Championship or League One next year and the last year of smaller parachute payments. Plus the 3 years in the lower divisions as per the FFP calculation.
We are looking at a BIG hole in the accounts - much more than the 39M loss we are allowed.
That being the case - how much will we need to raise from player sales?
Realistic sales would be:
Butland - 5-8M now Ndiaye - 10M Etebo - 8M Joe Allen - 3M Woods - 4M Campbell - 2M
The rest are either too old, too shit or on crazy contracts meaning they will never leave. That lot would just about raise 25M which I reckon wouldnt be enough if we drop to League One - meaning points deduction.
Relegation would really be a double whammy under FFP for us
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FFP
Nov 18, 2019 15:11:42 GMT
Post by chiswickpotter on Nov 18, 2019 15:11:42 GMT
Looking at scenario planning we are either in Championship or League One next year and the last year of smaller parachute payments. Plus the 3 years in the lower divisions as per the FFP calculation. We are looking at a BIG hole in the accounts - much more than the 39M loss we are allowed. That being the case - how much will we need to raise from player sales? Realistic sales would be: Butland - 5-8M now Ndiaye - 10M Etebo - 8M Joe Allen - 3M Woods - 4M Campbell - 2M The rest are either too old, too shit or on crazy contracts meaning they will never leave. That lot would just about raise 25M which I reckon wouldnt be enough if we drop to League One - meaning points deduction. Relegation would really be a double whammy under FFP for us We just dont know what the accounts for last season will show, until we do its hard to form any view. Even so, next season we could support a budget of around £60 million, £25m parachute, £20m tickets and commercial and £13m allowable loss. I imagine our wage bill must be coming down as contracts run down and no-one is picking up bonuses which can be worth a third of a typical total wage bill It would be easier in League 1 the restrictions are lighter I believe, just a wage cap which owners can contribute to
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Nov 18, 2019 22:40:58 GMT
Post by followyoudown on Nov 18, 2019 22:40:58 GMT
Looking at scenario planning we are either in Championship or League One next year and the last year of smaller parachute payments. Plus the 3 years in the lower divisions as per the FFP calculation. We are looking at a BIG hole in the accounts - much more than the 39M loss we are allowed. That being the case - how much will we need to raise from player sales? Realistic sales would be: Butland - 5-8M now Ndiaye - 10M Etebo - 8M Joe Allen - 3M Woods - 4M Campbell - 2M The rest are either too old, too shit or on crazy contracts meaning they will never leave. That lot would just about raise 25M which I reckon wouldnt be enough if we drop to League One - meaning points deduction. Relegation would really be a double whammy under FFP for us We just dont know what the accounts for last season will show, until we do its hard to form any view. Even so, next season we could support a budget of around £60 million, £25m parachute, £20m tickets and commercial and £13m allowable loss. I imagine our wage bill must be coming down as contracts run down and no-one is picking up bonuses which can be worth a third of a typical total wage bill It would be easier in League 1 the restrictions are lighter I believe, just a wage cap which owners can contribute to £20m tickets thats about £35 a time on a average of 25k crowd so I would say you can probably nearly halve that amount
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Nov 19, 2019 1:11:27 GMT
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Post by benjaminbiscuit on Nov 19, 2019 1:11:27 GMT
£20m tickets thats about £35 a time on a average of 25k crowd so I would say you can probably nearly halve that amount Id say 7.5m
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Nov 19, 2019 2:57:01 GMT
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Post by enuntio on Nov 19, 2019 2:57:01 GMT
FTFFP
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FFP
Nov 19, 2019 9:22:52 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Nov 19, 2019 9:22:52 GMT
A 400 point deduction should suffice, if only for Gary Monk. That would be great actually... Charge Monk with the deduction to follow him around no matter where he goes!
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FFP
Nov 19, 2019 9:39:05 GMT
Post by Squeekster on Nov 19, 2019 9:39:05 GMT
Isn't it Stoke city Holdings limited? They own the football club stadium and training facility not certain but I thought I'd read that these are 3 separate entities?
It was previously called KIDSGROVE ROAD LIMITED.
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Nov 19, 2019 9:53:04 GMT
Post by thebet365 on Nov 19, 2019 9:53:04 GMT
Isn't it Stoke city Holdings limited? They own the football club stadium and training facility not certain but I thought I'd read that these are 3 separate entities? It was previously called KIDSGROVE ROAD LIMITED. Correct, there's no such company as Bet365 holdings.
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Nov 19, 2019 10:13:58 GMT
Post by chigstoke on Nov 19, 2019 10:13:58 GMT
Isn't it Stoke city Holdings limited? They own the football club stadium and training facility not certain but I thought I'd read that these are 3 separate entities? It was previously called KIDSGROVE ROAD LIMITED.
Previously KIDSGROVE ROAD LIMITED for just over a year on Coates return.
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Nov 19, 2019 10:45:56 GMT
Post by bayernoatcake on Nov 19, 2019 10:45:56 GMT
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FFP
Nov 19, 2019 19:05:32 GMT
Post by leicspotter on Nov 19, 2019 19:05:32 GMT
Our owners can compete with anyone financially if they wish to. Our youth facilities are light years behind some other clubs. SCFC can afford the best and we deserve the best. We are not going to attract any decent youngsters unless we have the best facilities in the country. And we can spend, spend, spend without worrying about FFP. Missing the point, march. It wouldn't matter if we built training facilities that looked iike Buckingham Palace on steroids...the parents of any talented kids are still going to choose Man City or Man Utd over us because they're Man City and Man Utd. The way we compete is by establishing a reputation as a club that brings through youngsters and coaches them well, so parents can see a genuine route to a football career for their kids and a club that'll nurture them properly. The academy facilities we have, in terms of bricks and mortar, are absolutely fine. That's how Crewe (used to?) do it...gained quite a reputation for developing young talent. May have been tarnished a bit of late
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Nov 30, 2019 20:10:02 GMT
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Post by crouchpotato1 on Nov 30, 2019 20:10:02 GMT
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FFP
Nov 30, 2019 20:29:52 GMT
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Post by benjaminbiscuit on Nov 30, 2019 20:29:52 GMT
We believe we did it right the last three times ie we have learned absolutely nothing Just let that sink in utter denial and if it helps Tony you have got it horribly wrong again so that’s Again and Again and Again and Again Your job performance by every conceivable KPI has been abhorrent for four consecutive years and I wouldn’t bet against you making a dogs breakfast of FFP too Your not fit to wear the suit
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Nov 30, 2019 22:24:08 GMT
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Post by Gods on Nov 30, 2019 22:24:08 GMT
Anyone else catch Scholes on Radio Stoke today on FFP?
He said as a club we think it's a nonsense.
He made it pretty clear that Sir Peter is up for throwing more pound notes at this thing but FFP wont allow it.
When you think about it that's the whole point of FFP isn't it? So the guilded can't simply buy their way put of trouble by mortgaging the future.
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FFP
Nov 30, 2019 22:25:00 GMT
Post by bayernoatcake on Nov 30, 2019 22:25:00 GMT
It is a nonsense tbf.
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Post by citynickscfc on Nov 30, 2019 22:26:50 GMT
Anyone else catch it? He said as a club we think it's a nonsense. He made it pretty clear that Sir Peter is up for throwing more pound notes at this thing but FFP wont allow it. When you think about it that's the whole point of FFP isn't it? So the guilded can't simply buy their way put of trouble by mortgaging the future. That's like saying "children I want to give you more candy, honestly, but mother won't allow it, so be mad at her not me/us...." What is the point of that? What kind of sick and twisted distraction method or pushing of blame is that? Take responsibility man?????
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FFP
Nov 30, 2019 22:34:58 GMT
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Post by FullerMagic on Nov 30, 2019 22:34:58 GMT
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Nov 30, 2019 22:36:50 GMT
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Post by citynickscfc on Nov 30, 2019 22:36:50 GMT
Really makes no difference does it... Whining like a little bitch. Seriously, what does it achieve. He basically says himself "we don't like it, I'm moaning, but we have to do what they say or else" Like that's an excuse for being so shit?
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Post by swampySCFC on Nov 30, 2019 22:38:48 GMT
Spunked millions on wankers that have never impacted the club now weve got fuck all left. Running the fucking club like a Labour Government. Fuck off Scholes
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FFP
Nov 30, 2019 22:39:48 GMT
Post by Vadiation_Ribe on Nov 30, 2019 22:39:48 GMT
Really makes no difference does it... Whining like a little bitch. Seriously, what does it achieve. He basically says himself "we don't like it, I'm moaning, but we have to do what they say or else" Like that's an excuse for being so shit? He was asked what he/the club thought of FFP.
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FFP
Nov 30, 2019 22:45:24 GMT
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Post by citynickscfc on Nov 30, 2019 22:45:24 GMT
Really makes no difference does it... Whining like a little bitch. Seriously, what does it achieve. He basically says himself "we don't like it, I'm moaning, but we have to do what they say or else" Like that's an excuse for being so shit? He was asked what he/the club thought of FFP. Pointless question. A better question is "how will we avoid repercussions of ffp?
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FFP
Nov 30, 2019 23:04:46 GMT
Post by Jimm on Nov 30, 2019 23:04:46 GMT
Tony's a spineless twat and John hasn't got a fucking clue about running a football club
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