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Post by boskampsflaps on Dec 30, 2020 18:01:08 GMT
“Not doing enough” is the managers comment when asked Thats just a cop out imo, not doing enough what, given how bad the ones getting a game have been he really shouldn't have to do much to get a chance, being able to lace his own boots should be enough.
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Verlinden
Dec 30, 2020 18:05:28 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Dec 30, 2020 18:05:28 GMT
Considering vokes can not bother being fit and get a game
Hard to imagine verlinden is doing even less than that
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Post by potterpaul on Dec 30, 2020 22:59:19 GMT
I kinda understand the non selection of Verlinden due to the LB situation but given our diabolical form up front I think the risk of trying Clucas or Thompson or Chester or Smith or even Bauer at LB to stick with a flat back 4 and giving him an opportunity would be well worth it.
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Verlinden
Dec 31, 2020 7:45:34 GMT
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Post by chuckrocky on Dec 31, 2020 7:45:34 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Dec 31, 2020 8:24:24 GMT
I kinda understand the non selection of Verlinden due to the LB situation but given our diabolical form up front I think the risk of trying Clucas or Thompson or Chester or Smith or even Bauer at LB to stick with a flat back 4 and giving him an opportunity would be well worth it. Then play him on the right - which is his proper posdition - what would the excuse be then? He's not playing not for football reasons.
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Verlinden
Dec 31, 2020 8:26:06 GMT
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Post by lordb on Dec 31, 2020 8:26:06 GMT
I kinda understand the non selection of Verlinden due to the LB situation but given our diabolical form up front I think the risk of trying Clucas or Thompson or Chester or Smith or even Bauer at LB to stick with a flat back 4 and giving him an opportunity would be well worth it. Then play him on the right - which is his proper posdition - what would the excuse be then? He's not playing not for football reasons. I think he's better on the right too He's not playing because his attitude is wrong in training. Very frustrating.
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Post by crouchpotato1 on Dec 31, 2020 8:37:36 GMT
Having read that I’d suggest he’s off on loan again
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Post by Deleted on Dec 31, 2020 8:44:41 GMT
O'Neill says Verlinden isn't showing enough in training...what training, they are resting up in-between games,so that's bollocks for a start.as said above its probably more about him complaining he isn't getting a game,and O'Neill is just putting him in his place,to the detriment of the team I might add. No one can tell me that Ince,TOB and Vokes are showing more in training,and if they are they are not showing it on match day,and that's where it matters most,it is just an excuse O'Neill is using as there is no reason for not giving him a go when we have no one,and I do mean no one who can put in a decent cross with either foot,we have to play a flat back four with Verlinden playing as an out and out winger in place of McLean,what the hell have we got to lose the way we are playing at the moment !!! Probably the training with the academy.
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Verlinden
Dec 31, 2020 10:09:05 GMT
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Post by potterpaul on Dec 31, 2020 10:09:05 GMT
I kinda understand the non selection of Verlinden due to the LB situation but given our diabolical form up front I think the risk of trying Clucas or Thompson or Chester or Smith or even Bauer at LB to stick with a flat back 4 and giving him an opportunity would be well worth it. Then play him on the right - which is his proper posdition - what would the excuse be then? He's not playing not for football reasons. Doesn't matter whether it's Left or right a manager is still going to find it hard to place him in a wingback system. Even in 343, which is basically played 3412.
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Post by hyaduck on Dec 31, 2020 10:15:47 GMT
Considering our lack of a decent winger at the moment (McClean has been shocking lately) Verlinden needs to start or O’Neill should come out and explain why, with none of this bollocks about not doing it in training.
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Verlinden
Dec 31, 2020 10:18:50 GMT
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Post by themistocles on Dec 31, 2020 10:18:50 GMT
It'll be a loan back to Belgium - Anderlecht / Club Brugge type
He'll then sign on a free next summer and we won't here of him again.
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Post by biglad180 on Dec 31, 2020 10:24:33 GMT
we have given a lot of young lads there chance and they have done well time to give verlindon a go at 21 he should be well up for it let him prove himself, or we should let him move on, why pay players that you have no intention of playing, my choice would be to give him a fair go at it,
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Verlinden
Dec 31, 2020 10:26:10 GMT
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Post by gingerninja on Dec 31, 2020 10:26:10 GMT
Verlinden is on a long deal I believe?. He's not out of contract in the summer is he?.
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Verlinden
Dec 31, 2020 10:28:26 GMT
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Post by potterpaul on Dec 31, 2020 10:28:26 GMT
Verlinden is on a long deal I believe?. He's not out of contract in the summer is he?. That doesn't matter with the way we do things
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Post by mickstupp on Dec 31, 2020 10:34:36 GMT
Verlinden is on a long deal I believe?. He's not out of contract in the summer is he?. Out of contract in June 2022. He’s becoming some kind of strange obsession. I’m not quite sure why though because he’s totally unproven. It’s perfectly clear that the manager simply doesn’t rate him.
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Verlinden
Dec 31, 2020 10:38:41 GMT
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Post by superalexneil on Dec 31, 2020 10:38:41 GMT
Verlinden is on a long deal I believe?. He's not out of contract in the summer is he?. Out of contract in June 2022. He’s becoming some kind of strange obsession. I’m not quite sure why though because he’s totally unproven. It’s perfectly clear that the manager simply doesn’t rate him. We want to see he is actually worse than mclean/ince/brown
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Post by mickstupp on Dec 31, 2020 10:47:58 GMT
Out of contract in June 2022. He’s becoming some kind of strange obsession. I’m not quite sure why though because he’s totally unproven. It’s perfectly clear that the manager simply doesn’t rate him. We want to see he is actually worse than mclean/ince/brown The bloke who matters thinks he is worse. Either that, or there are still some concerns about his fitness. I’ve watched him in the u23’s and he’s got some nice skills but he strikes me as a bit frail, and his career so far shows he’s injury prone.
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Post by LGH87 on Dec 31, 2020 10:50:16 GMT
He is the best crosser of the ball at the club with his right foot and his left foot.
He simply needs to be playing.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 31, 2020 11:59:33 GMT
Then play him on the right - which is his proper posdition - what would the excuse be then? He's not playing not for football reasons. Doesn't matter whether it's Left or right a manager is still going to find it hard to place him in a wingback system. Even in 343, which is basically played 3412. You were yourself suggesting a flat back four. Then why not play him on the right with Smith behind him?
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Verlinden
Dec 31, 2020 12:09:14 GMT
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Post by potterpaul on Dec 31, 2020 12:09:14 GMT
Doesn't matter whether it's Left or right a manager is still going to find it hard to place him in a wingback system. Even in 343, which is basically played 3412. You were yourself suggesting a flat back four. Then why not play him on the right with Smith behind him? You need to read it again.
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Post by onefatcopper on Dec 31, 2020 12:45:38 GMT
Verlinden is on a long deal I believe?. He's not out of contract in the summer is he?. Out of contract in June 2022. He’s becoming some kind of strange obsession. I’m not quite sure why though because he’s totally unproven. It’s perfectly clear that the manager simply doesn’t rate him. It’s the Bojan factor, we are crying out for the days when the little maestro was terrorising premier league defenders with his god given talents and even after his career changing injury, page after page was written on this site criticising various managers for their failures to include him in their teams. So roll on the years and here we are again, a little foreign magician who again has the undoubted skills to mesmerise the fans who have been starved of natural talent and unpredictability. But Verlinden is no Bojan, he’s a young talent that’s been treading water after been rewarded with a long term contract as a safety blanket, even at U23 level he’s hardly been tearing up trees ! He’s consistently inconsistent, hasn’t put the work in at the gym to increase his body strength and now he’s witnessing his peers jump ahead of him and taking their chance to establish themselves in the first team. I’d love to be proven wrong but until he knuckles down and proves to the manager he’s the real deal, he could end up as a enigma that drifts into obscurity, just like his compatriots.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 31, 2020 12:57:39 GMT
Out of contract in June 2022. He’s becoming some kind of strange obsession. I’m not quite sure why though because he’s totally unproven. It’s perfectly clear that the manager simply doesn’t rate him. It’s the Bojan factor, we are crying out for the days when the little maestro was terrorising premier league defenders with his god given talents and even after his career changing injury, page after page was written on this site criticising various managers for their failures to include him in their teams. So roll on the years and here we are again, a little foreign magician who again has the undoubted skills to mesmerise the fans who have been starved of natural talent and unpredictability. But Verlinden is no Bojan, he’s a young talent that’s been treading water after been rewarded with a long term contract as a safety blanket, even at U23 level he’s hardly been tearing up trees ! He’s consistently inconsistent, hasn’t put the work in at the gym to increase his body strength and now he’s witnessing his peers jump ahead of him and taking their chance to establish themselves in the first team. I’d love to be proven wrong but until he knuckles down and proves to the manager he’s the real deal, he could end up as a enigma that drifts into obscurity, just like his compatriots. It's an interesting perspective. You have to ask though: were Messi, Bojan, Laudrup, Cruyff, and so many others ever asked to work out in the gym, track back for their useless fullbacks and prove themselves to a manager's pet folly? Actually they were, but they didn't do it anyway, believing in their own ability to set their world alight. So where does Thino fit in? He doesn't, he will never fit into the Auld English standards of coaching manuals that MON studies in his spare time. Never and so he cannot be allowed to come into the team and upset the high standards that MON has set, and that Rowett and Jones set before him. It's more important that these standards are upheld than some little winger comes on and saves the team from dreary draws. HNY!
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Post by lordb on Dec 31, 2020 12:58:50 GMT
O'Neill says Verlinden isn't showing enough in training...what training, they are resting up in-between games,so that's bollocks for a start.as said above its probably more about him complaining he isn't getting a game,and O'Neill is just putting him in his place,to the detriment of the team I might add. No one can tell me that Ince,TOB and Vokes are showing more in training,and if they are they are not showing it on match day,and that's where it matters most,it is just an excuse O'Neill is using as there is no reason for not giving him a go when we have no one,and I do mean no one who can put in a decent cross with either foot,we have to play a flat back four with Verlinden playing as an out and out winger in place of McLean,what the hell have we got to lose the way we are playing at the moment !!! Probably the training with the academy. can verify this is the case
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Post by lordb on Dec 31, 2020 13:00:22 GMT
It’s the Bojan factor, we are crying out for the days when the little maestro was terrorising premier league defenders with his god given talents and even after his career changing injury, page after page was written on this site criticising various managers for their failures to include him in their teams. So roll on the years and here we are again, a little foreign magician who again has the undoubted skills to mesmerise the fans who have been starved of natural talent and unpredictability. But Verlinden is no Bojan, he’s a young talent that’s been treading water after been rewarded with a long term contract as a safety blanket, even at U23 level he’s hardly been tearing up trees ! He’s consistently inconsistent, hasn’t put the work in at the gym to increase his body strength and now he’s witnessing his peers jump ahead of him and taking their chance to establish themselves in the first team. I’d love to be proven wrong but until he knuckles down and proves to the manager he’s the real deal, he could end up as a enigma that drifts into obscurity, just like his compatriots. It's an interesting perspective. You have to ask though: were Messi, Bojan, Laudrup, Cruyff, and so many others ever asked to work out in the gym, track back for their useless fullbacks and prove themselves to a manager's pet folly? Actually they were, but they didn't do it anyway, believing in their own ability to set their world alight. So where does Thino fit in? He doesn't, he will never fit into the Auld English standards of coaching manuals that MON studies in his spare time. Never and so he cannot be allowed to come into the team and upset the high standards that MON has set, and that Rowett and Jones set before him. It's more important that these standards are upheld than some little winger comes on and saves the team from dreary draws. HNY! Bojan was a great trainer, won over the old school types such as Walters,Adam e.t.c very quickly with his application in training
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Verlinden
Dec 31, 2020 13:05:31 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Dec 31, 2020 13:05:31 GMT
The simple fact that MON has already given several Academy products/young players their chance, and kept them in there, would suggest to me that if he thought Verlinden would improve us, he'd be in there, and starting by now.
As some have said, and I agree, he cannot possibly be any worse than Ince, Brown or the current McClean right now. It's impossible.
We're desperately lacking a player with a 'spark' at the moment. I include Powell in that, who I like a lot, but I think needs a rest.
Playing how we are, with the options he's competing with, Verlinden will probably never get a better chance to make an impression. He himself, needs to make it happen though, MON doesn't seem the type to just give a player a leg-up.
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Verlinden
Dec 31, 2020 13:13:55 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Dec 31, 2020 13:13:55 GMT
Time to sink or swim for verlinden
With a Neil Warnock / fixture congestion inspired, injury crisis , it seems fair he is given his chance
He may or may not make it , likewise Jacob brown , but now is the time for them to show what they can, or cannot, do .
You can get promoted too early
Bursik , souttar ,Collins , Campbell have all done great but it's not quite enough
We need more from some young attackers like brown or verlinden , or frankly we are not ready to go up .
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Post by onefatcopper on Dec 31, 2020 13:28:51 GMT
It’s the Bojan factor, we are crying out for the days when the little maestro was terrorising premier league defenders with his god given talents and even after his career changing injury, page after page was written on this site criticising various managers for their failures to include him in their teams. So roll on the years and here we are again, a little foreign magician who again has the undoubted skills to mesmerise the fans who have been starved of natural talent and unpredictability. But Verlinden is no Bojan, he’s a young talent that’s been treading water after been rewarded with a long term contract as a safety blanket, even at U23 level he’s hardly been tearing up trees ! He’s consistently inconsistent, hasn’t put the work in at the gym to increase his body strength and now he’s witnessing his peers jump ahead of him and taking their chance to establish themselves in the first team. I’d love to be proven wrong but until he knuckles down and proves to the manager he’s the real deal, he could end up as a enigma that drifts into obscurity, just like his compatriots. It's an interesting perspective. You have to ask though: were Messi, Bojan, Laudrup, Cruyff, and so many others ever asked to work out in the gym, track back for their useless fullbacks and prove themselves to a manager's pet folly? Actually they were, but they didn't do it anyway, believing in their own ability to set their world alight. So where does Thino fit in? He doesn't, he will never fit into the Auld English standards of coaching manuals that MON studies in his spare time. Never and so he cannot be allowed to come into the team and upset the high standards that MON has set, and that Rowett and Jones set before him. It's more important that these standards are upheld than some little winger comes on and saves the team from dreary draws. HNY! Don’t you think that even now Messi doesn’t work on his game and fitness ? Unfortunately in English football we require robotic clones who can run the required miles put in the required number of tackles etc, the game is just all about stats, stats and stats. Now natural talent will eventually be coached out of you unless you are exceptionally talented. I can remember when nearly every team had a entertainer, Hudson, Currie, Bowles, Worthington, Dobson, Marsh the list was endless. My point is that even with his undoubted talent Verlinden has got to go out, prove he’s the best by going that extra mile and put the groundwork in. Don’t you think that if you could ask Messi,Bojan,Laudrup etc if they ever came across a better player when they came through the ranks their answer would be No, Because they would be lying ! They made it by being prepared to do anything to make it, and are still working to maintain their position as the best.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 31, 2020 14:34:24 GMT
It's an interesting perspective. You have to ask though: were Messi, Bojan, Laudrup, Cruyff, and so many others ever asked to work out in the gym, track back for their useless fullbacks and prove themselves to a manager's pet folly? Actually they were, but they didn't do it anyway, believing in their own ability to set their world alight. So where does Thino fit in? He doesn't, he will never fit into the Auld English standards of coaching manuals that MON studies in his spare time. Never and so he cannot be allowed to come into the team and upset the high standards that MON has set, and that Rowett and Jones set before him. It's more important that these standards are upheld than some little winger comes on and saves the team from dreary draws. HNY! Don’t you think that even now Messi doesn’t work on his game and fitness ? Unfortunately in English football we require robotic clones who can run the required miles put in the required number of tackles etc, the game is just all about stats, stats and stats. Now natural talent will eventually be coached out of you unless you are exceptionally talented. I can remember when nearly every team had a entertainer, Hudson, Currie, Bowles, Worthington, Dobson, Marsh the list was endless. My point is that even with his undoubted talent Verlinden has got to go out, prove he’s the best by going that extra mile and put the groundwork in. Don’t you think that if you could ask Messi,Bojan,Laudrup etc if they ever came across a better player when they came through the ranks their answer would be No, Because they would be lying ! They made it by being prepared to do anything to make it, and are still working to maintain their position as the best. Of course they take part in physical training, but not as much as the english game demands. Messi at one point had to be told to stop chasing back in games, because the coaches wanted him to preserve his energy for scoring goals, a successfull strategy don't you think. Imagine if Stoke's coaches said so to Powell...
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Post by onefatcopper on Dec 31, 2020 14:53:04 GMT
Don’t you think that even now Messi doesn’t work on his game and fitness ? Unfortunately in English football we require robotic clones who can run the required miles put in the required number of tackles etc, the game is just all about stats, stats and stats. Now natural talent will eventually be coached out of you unless you are exceptionally talented. I can remember when nearly every team had a entertainer, Hudson, Currie, Bowles, Worthington, Dobson, Marsh the list was endless. My point is that even with his undoubted talent Verlinden has got to go out, prove he’s the best by going that extra mile and put the groundwork in. Don’t you think that if you could ask Messi,Bojan,Laudrup etc if they ever came across a better player when they came through the ranks their answer would be No, Because they would be lying ! They made it by being prepared to do anything to make it, and are still working to maintain their position as the best. Of course they take part in physical training, but not as much as the english game demands. Messi at one point had to be told to stop chasing back in games, because the coaches wanted him to preserve his energy for scoring goals, a successfull strategy don't you think. Imagine if Stoke's coaches said so to Powell... There’s a big factor which is understated with Messi, his teammates ! Throughout his Barcelona career he’s been fortunate enough to be surrounded by teammates who could be rated world class in their own particular position leaving Messi to concentrate on driving his team forwards, look at his career with Argentina where he’s had the added responsibility of carry his nation, he’s had flashes of genius but also mediocrity.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 1, 2021 7:53:13 GMT
Of course they take part in physical training, but not as much as the english game demands. Messi at one point had to be told to stop chasing back in games, because the coaches wanted him to preserve his energy for scoring goals, a successfull strategy don't you think. Imagine if Stoke's coaches said so to Powell... There’s a big factor which is understated with Messi, his teammates ! Throughout his Barcelona career he’s been fortunate enough to be surrounded by teammates who could be rated world class in their own particular position leaving Messi to concentrate on driving his team forwards, look at his career with Argentina where he’s had the added responsibility of carry his nation, he’s had flashes of genius but also mediocrity. Proportionately, we have players that can do the same for Powell. Players that think football the same way that Powell does. But we need the manager to give them freedom to express themselves. This season we've seen both Powell and, when fit, Cluces moved much deeper into our defensive lines. It's good that they can do that, but it comes at a very high price for oir play forwards. It makes them, and us, a lesser team.
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