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Post by partickpotter on Oct 15, 2020 7:34:37 GMT
Extending your car analogy a little, most of the time he was here he seemed content to play in third gear but could move effortlessly up the gears when he chose to. I think that is his nature and maybe explains why he never reached the level in the game his ability could have taken him to. I thought most of the time he was here, from the day he walked through the door until the day he left, he was comfortably head and shoulders above anything else we'd had in central midfield for about 25 years. He had that brief spell out of the side when he was sent off and Hughes didn't immediately bring him back but even as part of a Pulis midfield where he was clearly miserable and regularly bypassed, he had more about him than any other option in the squad. Nzonzi in third gear was head and shoulders above anything we’d had in midfield for years! The thing is he still had gears to move up into. That’s why there was a thought he could move onto playing a big role in one of the big boys. Which never happened.
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Post by The Toxic Avenger on Oct 15, 2020 7:41:29 GMT
I thought most of the time he was here, from the day he walked through the door until the day he left, he was comfortably head and shoulders above anything else we'd had in central midfield for about 25 years. He had that brief spell out of the side when he was sent off and Hughes didn't immediately bring him back but even as part of a Pulis midfield where he was clearly miserable and regularly bypassed, he had more about him than any other option in the squad. Nzonzi in third gear was head and shoulders above anything we’d had in midfield for years! The thing is he still had gears to move up into. That’s why there was a thought he could move onto playing a big role in one of the big boys. Which never happened. I think it depends on what you class as 'the big boys'. If he thought he could play at a significantly higher level for a bigger club then that very much did happen, no? He was arguably a game changer in a World Cup final to boot, doesn't really get much bigger than that. If we're saying he never played for a Barca or a Real Madrid or one of the very top clubs here, I'd agree he was perhaps maybe a rung below that. As far as the 'gears' things goes, he glided serenely around, rarely giving the ball away, occasionally bludgeoning somebody, and could step it up when he needed to. That was exactly what he was there to do. He could do rampaging but not every game calls for that.
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Post by partickpotter on Oct 15, 2020 8:00:56 GMT
Nzonzi in third gear was head and shoulders above anything we’d had in midfield for years! The thing is he still had gears to move up into. That’s why there was a thought he could move onto playing a big role in one of the big boys. Which never happened. I think it depends on what you class as 'the big boys'. If he thought he could play at a significantly higher level for a bigger club then that very much did happen, no? He was arguably a game changer in a World Cup final to boot, doesn't really get much bigger than that. If we're saying he never played for a Barca or a Real Madrid or one of the very top clubs here, I'd agree he was perhaps maybe a rung below that. As far as the 'gears' things goes, he glided serenely around, rarely giving the ball away, occasionally bludgeoning somebody, and could step it up when he needed to. That was exactly what he was there to do. He could do rampaging but not every game calls for that. I think we agree about what a good player he was at Stoke. I reckon though, he could have ended up at the likes of Barca, Madrid, Bayern, Man U/C. He had the talent imo.
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Post by The Toxic Avenger on Oct 15, 2020 8:03:34 GMT
I think it depends on what you class as 'the big boys'. If he thought he could play at a significantly higher level for a bigger club then that very much did happen, no? He was arguably a game changer in a World Cup final to boot, doesn't really get much bigger than that. If we're saying he never played for a Barca or a Real Madrid or one of the very top clubs here, I'd agree he was perhaps maybe a rung below that. As far as the 'gears' things goes, he glided serenely around, rarely giving the ball away, occasionally bludgeoning somebody, and could step it up when he needed to. That was exactly what he was there to do. He could do rampaging but not every game calls for that. I think we agree about what a good player he was at Stoke. I reckon though, he could have ended up at the likes of Barca, Madrid, Bayern, Man U/C. He had the talent imo. He'd certainly have improved Man U's midfield. Not sure he'd have got into any of the others. Huge fan of his though, one of my top five all-time favourite Stoke players and probably the best player I've seen play for us.
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Post by JoeinOz on Oct 15, 2020 8:07:57 GMT
Quality player...a Rolls Royce on his day. Extending your car analogy a little, most of the time he was here he seemed content to play in third gear but could move effortlessly up the gears when he chose to. I think that is his nature and maybe explains why he never reached the level in the game his ability could have taken him to. When he was strutting through Moscow with the world cup in his hands he was reflecting on how he'd underachieved.
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Post by oldspeckledben on Oct 15, 2020 8:23:29 GMT
I remember well, the bloke I used to sit in front of used to slag him off all game. A fully paid up member of the "are you watching the same game?" guild. There are dozens of them...
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Post by partickpotter on Oct 15, 2020 8:39:00 GMT
Extending your car analogy a little, most of the time he was here he seemed content to play in third gear but could move effortlessly up the gears when he chose to. I think that is his nature and maybe explains why he never reached the level in the game his ability could have taken him to. When he was strutting through Moscow with the world cup in his hands he was reflecting on how he'd underachieved. Yeah - his career is not without success. But, he did not achieve all he could have done imo, noting his talent; just 18 caps for France seems very low (notwithstanding his 35 mins in the WC final).
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Post by Cast no shadow on Oct 15, 2020 8:58:39 GMT
When he was strutting through Moscow with the world cup in his hands he was reflecting on how he'd underachieved. Yeah - his career is not without success. But, he did not achieve all he could have done imo, noting his talent; just 18 caps for France seems very low (notwithstanding his 35 mins in the WC final). The roma move was possibly a mistake, the Italian league is a little different to both the English and Spanish, and especially the way he likes to play probably limited his chances of flourishing.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 15, 2020 9:13:14 GMT
Extending your car analogy a little, most of the time he was here he seemed content to play in third gear but could move effortlessly up the gears when he chose to. I think that is his nature and maybe explains why he never reached the level in the game his ability could have taken him to. When he was strutting through Moscow with the world cup in his hands he was reflecting on how he'd underachieved. The original post was to highlight my surprise that he'd ended up in Turkey so soon after a golden period in his career, I'd be surprised if anyone thought he couldn't do better at the age of 30. And now Rennes, which again seems a waste.......
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Post by The Toxic Avenger on Oct 15, 2020 9:27:45 GMT
When he was strutting through Moscow with the world cup in his hands he was reflecting on how he'd underachieved. Yeah - his career is not without success. But, he did not achieve all he could have done imo, noting his talent; just 18 caps for France seems very low (notwithstanding his 35 mins in the WC final). He's had to compete with Pogba, Kante, Matuidi etc in that time though. He's arguably done well to feature in such prominent games with that competition.
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Post by bayernoatcake on Oct 15, 2020 9:30:33 GMT
Would hope that the current regime tell TOB to watch some tapes of Fonz. I think he could be that kind of player.
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Post by lordb on Oct 15, 2020 11:09:45 GMT
When he was strutting through Moscow with the world cup in his hands he was reflecting on how he'd underachieved. Yeah - his career is not without success. But, he did not achieve all he could have done imo, noting his talent; just 18 caps for France seems very low (notwithstanding his 35 mins in the WC final). 18 caps isn't really low when you consider the wealth of options France have in midfield
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Post by Deleted on Oct 15, 2020 11:37:45 GMT
When he was strutting through Moscow with the world cup in his hands he was reflecting on how he'd underachieved. Yeah - his career is not without success. But, he did not achieve all he could have done imo, noting his talent; just 18 caps for France seems very low (notwithstanding his 35 mins in the WC final). He was in the French squad on and off for years before finally Deschasmp saw his qualities, but even then he had the misfortune to be virtual understudy to Pogba. If Pogba hadn't been around, Nzonzi might have played 40-50 more games for them.
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Post by marwood on Oct 15, 2020 12:53:25 GMT
When he was strutting through Moscow with the world cup in his hands he was reflecting on how he'd underachieved. The original post was to highlight my surprise that he'd ended up in Turkey so soon after a golden period in his career, I'd be surprised if anyone thought he couldn't do better at the age of 30. And now Rennes, which again seems a waste....... I saw him play for Galatasaray while I was in Turkey in December, he was terrible (on the day) and the fans didn't rate him at all, apparently that performance was typical of his time there. They couldn't wait to get rid. As soon as they saw I was a Stoke fan, they questioned what we saw in him. Conversely they loved N'Diaye and were desperate to get him back, until he spent time with Trabzonspor, then they hated him.
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