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Post by BristolMick on Jan 4, 2019 9:12:03 GMT
I would add also that Coates is completely stuck in his ways too, and will never appoint a manager who doesn’t fit his basic and limited criteria. He would never do for example what Wolves and other clubs have done by appointing a little known foreigner with fancy ideas.
This is just another example of Coates being cautious to extremes. He clearly finds it difficult to make and act on big decisions quickly enough and to change direction or embrace new ideas.
BM
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Post by chell_rosey on Jan 4, 2019 9:25:15 GMT
Considered, detached, too trusting, accepting of incompetence.
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Post by lifelong on Jan 4, 2019 9:30:38 GMT
"little known manager" wasnt he manager of Porto?
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Post by davejohnno1 on Jan 4, 2019 9:36:20 GMT
I would add also that Coates is completely stuck in his ways too, and will never appoint a manager who doesn’t fit his basic and limited criteria. He would never do for example what Wolves and other clubs have done by appointing a little known foreigner with fancy ideas. This is just another example of Coates being cautious to extremes. He clearly finds it difficult to make and act on big decisions quickly enough and to change direction or embrace new ideas. BM Which probably why it was denise that took the risky but decisive decision to close/sell provincial racing branches and use the funds to set up bet365
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Post by RAF on Jan 4, 2019 9:36:49 GMT
"little known manager" wasnt he manager of Porto? Yep and Valencia. H
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Post by march4 on Jan 4, 2019 9:37:08 GMT
I think the plan is to have a new manager ready to take over straight after the sacking of Rowett.
And I don’t know who will make the decision either; Peter or Jon.
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Post by redstriper on Jan 4, 2019 10:08:45 GMT
It's easy to sit on here and moan with the benefit of hindsight, and no responsibility for decisions which go wrong.
Stoke City is a business with responsibilities, decisions about employees will not and should not be made lightly.
I wouldn't fire any of my employees just because a few customers (and a few bystanders) who knew fuck all about the bigger picture suggested I should. I'd listen, but i'd make my own decisions in my own time, taking into account all the other factors, such as how effective the individuals were as part of the overall team, what their issues and constraints were etc.
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Post by Veritas on Jan 4, 2019 10:19:30 GMT
It's easy to sit on here and moan with the benefit of hindsight, and no responsibility for decisions which go wrong. Stoke City is a business with responsibilities, decisions about employees will not and should not be made lightly. I wouldn't fire any of my employees just because a few customers (and a few bystanders) who knew fuck all about the bigger picture suggested I should. I'd listen, but i'd make my own decisions in my own time, taking into account all the other factors, such as how effective the individuals were as part of the overall team, what their issues and constraints were etc. Every business should have an emergency short-term succession plan to deal with unforeseen situations such as serious illness, death or resignation, we should now activate that plan.
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Post by questionable on Jan 4, 2019 10:24:45 GMT
For the life of me I can’t understand why we’re in this position both on and off the pitch, for all of their wealth the Coates family seem as thick as pig shit when it comes to SCFC.
Stupid does as stupid says fits perfectly.
I get the impression that Jnr is simply left to carry on tinkering behind the scenes as he doesn’t seem to be mentioned much within the business frame side of things. In a nut shell whatever decision was implemented 4/5?? seasons ago has been an absolute disgrace yet the decision makers are still in place, well they can do it without my money as enough is finally enough
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Post by redstriper on Jan 4, 2019 10:25:14 GMT
It's easy to sit on here and moan with the benefit of hindsight, and no responsibility for decisions which go wrong. Stoke City is a business with responsibilities, decisions about employees will not and should not be made lightly. I wouldn't fire any of my employees just because a few customers (and a few bystanders) who knew fuck all about the bigger picture suggested I should. I'd listen, but i'd make my own decisions in my own time, taking into account all the other factors, such as how effective the individuals were as part of the overall team, what their issues and constraints were etc. Every business should have an emergency short-term succession plan to deal with unforeseen situations such as serious illness, death or resignation, we should now activate that plan. Why ? none of those scenarios apply to the current situation
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Post by Veritas on Jan 4, 2019 10:29:22 GMT
For the life of me I can’t understand why we’re in this position both on and off the pitch, for all of their wealth the Coates family seem as thick as pig shit when it comes to SCFC. Stupid does as stupid says fits perfectly. I get the impression that Jnr is simply left to carry on tinkering behind the scenes as he doesn’t seem to be mentioned much within the business frame side of things. In a nut shell whatever decision was implemented 4/5?? seasons ago has been an absolute disgrace yet the decision makers are still in place, well they can do it without my money as enough is finally enough They are on a run of bad decisions, Hughes kept too long, Lambert and Rowett appointments and some poor player signings. However never forget they delivered ten seasons of top flight football when we all thought that had gone forever, a first ever FA Cup Final, European football and three successive top 10 finishes for the only time in the clubs long history.
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Post by Veritas on Jan 4, 2019 10:32:03 GMT
Every business should have an emergency short-term succession plan to deal with unforeseen situations such as serious illness, death or resignation, we should now activate that plan. Why ? none of those scenarios apply to the current situation Those scenarios are examples of why you need an emergency succession plan, our current situation is one where a key individual is seriously damaging the reputation and performance of the business and has to be removed.
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Post by Staffsoatcake on Jan 4, 2019 10:38:11 GMT
I think we are where P Coates wants us to be.
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Post by BristolMick on Jan 4, 2019 11:06:47 GMT
"little known manager" wasnt he manager of Porto? Yep and Valencia. H Like I say, to Peter Coates he would have been a little known foreigner with fancy ideas. BM
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Post by RAF on Jan 4, 2019 11:09:20 GMT
Like I say, to Peter Coates he would have been a little known foreigner with fancy ideas. BM Porto and Valencia. Ironic because together it's almost Port Vale which is more Peters idea of manager selection! ;) H
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Post by Veritas on Jan 4, 2019 11:09:31 GMT
I think we are where P Coates wants us to be. What bottom half of the second tier turning out rubbish football??
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Post by lloydcolesguitar on Jan 4, 2019 11:11:52 GMT
It's easy to sit on here and moan with the benefit of hindsight, and no responsibility for decisions which go wrong. Stoke City is a business with responsibilities, decisions about employees will not and should not be made lightly. I wouldn't fire any of my employees just because a few customers (and a few bystanders) who knew fuck all about the bigger picture suggested I should. I'd listen, but i'd make my own decisions in my own time, taking into account all the other factors, such as how effective the individuals were as part of the overall team, what their issues and constraints were etc. With respect no hindsight from me, i wanted Charisma out after 2015/16, and no it gives me no pleasure the way things have turned out it sickens me, sickens me.
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Post by davejohnno1 on Jan 4, 2019 12:04:32 GMT
For the life of me I can’t understand why we’re in this position both on and off the pitch, for all of their wealth the Coates family seem as thick as pig shit when it comes to SCFC. Stupid does as stupid says fits perfectly. I get the impression that Jnr is simply left to carry on tinkering behind the scenes as he doesn’t seem to be mentioned much within the business frame side of things. In a nut shell whatever decision was implemented 4/5?? seasons ago has been an absolute disgrace yet the decision makers are still in place, well they can do it without my money as enough is finally enough The decision was most likely the one to release rudge and allocate his responsibilities to the remit of Scholes. At that point, relationships soured and slowly but surely things turned to shit. Its often stated that a bad employee decision doesn't bear full consequence for around 3 years because you can tread water off the back of previous successes. That is especially pertinent to the timelines of the stoke city decline.
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Post by estrangedsonoffaye on Jan 4, 2019 12:17:31 GMT
It's easy to sit on here and moan with the benefit of hindsight, and no responsibility for decisions which go wrong. Stoke City is a business with responsibilities, decisions about employees will not and should not be made lightly. I wouldn't fire any of my employees just because a few customers (and a few bystanders) who knew fuck all about the bigger picture suggested I should. I'd listen, but i'd make my own decisions in my own time, taking into account all the other factors, such as how effective the individuals were as part of the overall team, what their issues and constraints were etc. In fairness, a lot of people wanted a big change in 16/17 becauae they could see a huge shift in the side’s effort, quality and general organisation. Hughes would have been hard pressed to keep his job at a majority of football clubs after that season. I agree with not taking decisions lightly, but when you’ve been poor for over a year as we had at that point, surely the time was right for a thorough assessment of what had gone wrong. How had we gone from beating both Manchester clubs to then beating pretty much only the bottom 6 in 16/17? The warning signs were all there, swept under the rug by most fans by dismissing the comments of Arnautovic and even Marc Wilson as bitter.
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Post by iglugluk on Jan 4, 2019 12:23:27 GMT
It's easy to sit on here and moan with the benefit of hindsight, and no responsibility for decisions which go wrong. Stoke City is a business with responsibilities, decisions about employees will not and should not be made lightly. I wouldn't fire any of my employees just because a few customers (and a few bystanders) who knew fuck all about the bigger picture suggested I should. I'd listen, but i'd make my own decisions in my own time, taking into account all the other factors, such as how effective the individuals were as part of the overall team, what their issues and constraints were etc. Some good points there, RS......especially coming from a business owner, as I know you to be. I would say that the owners of the club have, however, failed to make the correct changes that were required since the wheels fell off the Hughes bus. These failures were well documented and Peter Coates' quote "I don't know what all the fuss is about" followed by the shambles they orchestrated in appointing Lambert followed by the obvious toxicity that Rowett is overseeing currently with no apparent action from the hierarchy must indicate either serious indecision, lack of due diligence or poisonous cronyism permeating the club.........personally I think it's a combination of all three. Obviously they should and will make their own decisions in their own time but football is a results business that can decline over a few short weeks and when the crowd lose faith the club sinks very quickly. In that way football is very different to your average business hence it's 'rich enthusiast owner' profile. Ultimately the business is a club and a club is its fans and the fans opinions are often well informed and very astute. The Coates family simply must change their approach to halt the dramatic decline that is apparent to almost everyone who cares about SCFC. Keeping a manager who seems intent on further damaging the club's relationship with its fans is foolhardy and keeping your mates in highly paid jobs is extremely detrimental over time. Good quality hard decisions need to be made right now.
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Post by Staffsoatcake on Jan 4, 2019 12:44:32 GMT
I think we are where P Coates wants us to be. What bottom half of the second tier turning out rubbish football?? Not having to pay hugh transfer fees and hugh amounts in wages,just to tread water in the bottom half of the Premiership.
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Post by cheshirepotter on Jan 4, 2019 12:47:20 GMT
Insane.
Because "Insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results."
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Post by Veritas on Jan 4, 2019 13:58:07 GMT
What bottom half of the second tier turning out rubbish football?? Not having to pay hugh transfer fees and hugh amounts in wages,just to tread water in the bottom half of the Premiership. I just don't see that, I am sure PC and the board's objective is to be back in the top 10 of the PL they are just making a bit of a hash of it at present.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 5, 2019 14:25:53 GMT
With GR at the helm , SCFC stands for apathy and a lack of professionalism
I have just read an entertaining book ..Journeyman ...Ben smith
At 16 Ben was playing with Dennis Bergkamp et al for arsenal in pre season His story charts 17 years of dropping down the leagues .. reading , southend , Hereford , crawley town It's a funny and by his own admission laughably ' wise in hindsight '
According to Ben regardless of the level you are at , you need 3 things or forget it
1) confidence ...your players have to believe they are as good as the other lot and can get the job done 2)fitness ... pre season is not a holiday , you have to get the lads proper fit or forget it 3)intensity ...you have got to get the ball forward quickly and incisively , not hoof it , but don't waste the ball going sideways and backwards unless you have to . Players have to be brave on the ball
Liverpool , Man city etc do so much more than these 3 things ...they are organised attacking and defending set pieces , they move up and down the pitch in unison , create two on ones , overloads
GR's stoke don't do the basics , the bare minimum
In particular the idea the stoke players rocked up on day one , with the same fitness as the leeds players is laughable , miles of beam
Biesla has professional standards
Rowett doesn't
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Post by johnnypotter on Jan 5, 2019 21:03:47 GMT
Indecisive, laid back and unambitious.
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