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Post by essexstokey on Jun 16, 2017 11:29:55 GMT
For those of you complaining about deleted posts, if you quote a post with an abusive message then that will also be removed. Admin please remind us what you class as abusive
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Post by manmarking on Jun 16, 2017 11:31:28 GMT
This is the end of the age of austerity, mate. The mood everywhere is turning. Even bigger I reckon. I think they made a huge mistake in 2010 making the poor pay the price because it's made a target of the whole project which still largely progressed under New Labour. This fire encapsulates so many of the negatives of the state shrinking policies of the last 30 years, no wonder they want to kick it into the long grass. Fortunately, they can barely control the narrative any more and patience is very thin. Yes it's weird how political change is so often embodied by particular events that people become especially struck by. Eg. piles of rubbish in the 70s, the poll tax riots, Black Wednesday, Northern Rock etc. I strongly suspect this is such an event. It's a tragedy that illustrates the rampant inequalities of our society and the brutal realities of decades of neoliberalism. Profits above people. It's illustrated this in a way that's so stark and so horrific that it's now impossible for most people to ignore.
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Post by followyoudown on Jun 16, 2017 11:40:25 GMT
He did. The Anthony Mayer Report. Commissioned along with the Harris Report so another review Sadiq Khant has ignored. "Since taking office, the Mayor of London has commissioned two reviews which have relevance to the London Fire Brigade."
"This [Anthony Mayer Report] review is 14 pages long and contains 6 recommendations. These are: Recommendation 1. There is currently no persuasive case to increase LFB's budget by diverting resources from elsewhere in the GLA Group or increasing the precept."How long has Khan been in the job how many years of boris cuts if unsure watch this linkMissing the point as usual, the report Sadiq Khan commissioned says London Fire Brigade have sufficient resources, the FBU are now saying they don't so either report was wrong, the FBU is wrong or the new mayor has further cut budgets.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 16, 2017 11:45:51 GMT
Oh goody. I'm here to spectate the day it's decided this gaff does need moderating after all. As you were
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Post by harryburrows on Jun 16, 2017 11:46:29 GMT
For those of you complaining about deleted posts, if you quote a post with an abusive message then that will also be removed. Admin please remind us what you class as abusive As a grown up you should not need to be told
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Post by essexstokey on Jun 16, 2017 11:54:18 GMT
Admin please remind us what you class as abusive As a grown up you should not need to be told well it seems you tory boys get away with personal attacks etc so I was asking for clarification
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Post by rogerjonesisgod on Jun 16, 2017 12:13:34 GMT
For those of you complaining about deleted posts, if you quote a post with an abusive message then that will also be removed. Admin please remind us what you class as abusive Well whatever crap you were spouting earlier because my replies to you have gone. Just stop your vile false politicking until the report is published.
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Post by manmarking on Jun 16, 2017 12:39:31 GMT
Admin please remind us what you class as abusive Well whatever crap you were spouting earlier because my replies to you have gone. Just stop your vile false politicking until the report is published. You're in no position to criticise mate. You endlessly politicise tragedies when it suits your agenda. Besides, this is an inherently political issue and people in similar housing need some action taking now to avert similar tragedies. Now as in now. Not after a few years once a report is published. The previous Labour government has awkward questions to answer too, if that's of any consolation to you.
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Post by serpico on Jun 16, 2017 12:53:21 GMT
it's possible they chose this cladding not purely because it was cheaper, but because it was greener, there's lots of pressure these days to hit certain energy efficiency targets.
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Post by salopstick on Jun 16, 2017 12:56:36 GMT
I think the PM has been done here. She visits the fire people. Announces a review then gets slated because she didn't visit victims.
It's not for politicians to just turn up amongst grieving people for a show.
Now she's been sort of forced to visit hospitals
If she had gone to victims first the same people would have said she was doing it for political gain.
For what's it worth it seems loads of things that politicians of both colour could have done to stop this disaster being as bad as what it was. Only the inquiry will get the answers and politicians should stay out of it until then. The media is not helping either
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Post by essexstokey on Jun 16, 2017 13:10:20 GMT
I think the PM has been done here. She visits the fire people. Announces a review then gets slated because she didn't visit victims. It's not for politicians to just turn up amongst grieving people for a show. Now she's been sort of forced to visit hospitals If she had gone to victims first the same people would have said she was doing it for political gain. For what's it worth it seems loads of things that politicians of both colour could have done to stop this disaster being as bad as what it was. Only the inquiry will get the answers and politicians should stay out of it until then. The media is not helping either Well you have to have a heart to feel compassion, you cannot defend her or the council leader on this as they say actions speak louder than words and she has been found wanting yet again
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Post by rogerjonesisgod on Jun 16, 2017 13:56:02 GMT
Well whatever crap you were spouting earlier because my replies to you have gone. Just stop your vile false politicking until the report is published. You're in no position to criticise mate. You endlessly politicise tragedies when it suits your agenda. Besides, this is an inherently political issue and people in similar housing need some action taking now to avert similar tragedies. Now as in now. Not after a few years once a report is published. The previous Labour government has awkward questions to answer too, if that's of any consolation to you. "Endlessly politicise tragedies" Cobblers. Name them. I don't need your consolation. Just you and Essex et al to stop posting absolute bullshit just because it fits your nasty Leftist agenda. Last London Tower block fire 2009 under Labour. Report published 2013! Khan commissioned a report last year from Anthony Mayer which doesn't call for more funding for the fire service. . Caroline Flint made Mayer an ombudsman back in 2009 for social housing. Labour started Oftenant to assist in social housing matters. How'd that worked out? The new Labour MP for Kensington was a local councillor sitting on the KCTMO and local Fire Advisory Committee. She blames the contractors. The council, housing association, contractors, sub contractors, building plans and regs, material manufacturers, Architects etc etc will all have to submit documents to the coroner and the judge lead inquiry. For anyone to be saying it's May or Boris' fault at this point is just plain daft.
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Post by boothenboy75 on Jun 16, 2017 15:14:47 GMT
I think the PM has been done here. She visits the fire people. Announces a review then gets slated because she didn't visit victims. It's not for politicians to just turn up amongst grieving people for a show. Now she's been sort of forced to visit hospitals If she had gone to victims first the same people would have said she was doing it for political gain. For what's it worth it seems loads of things that politicians of both colour could have done to stop this disaster being as bad as what it was. Only the inquiry will get the answers and politicians should stay out of it until then. The media is not helping either I can agree with some of that and perhaps if she hadn't spent the election avoiding, almost entirely, contact with joe public she'd "get away with it". Her big problem is she's now portrayed as cold and heartless, and with her lack of social skills and seeming lack of being able to show empathy, this is yet another step towards a further election this year. I've got to say the response from both local and central government is looking spectacularly poor in the media. There was a bloke searching for a family member on the news yesterday who had to visit each hospital in turn to find if any of the bodies recovered were his uncle. Surely they can do better than that?
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Post by trickydicky73 on Jun 16, 2017 15:17:51 GMT
link councillor blames residents What a load of bullshit that headline is, where exactly does he blame residents ? He says residents did not want the extra delay and disruption fitting sprinklers would cause and that is why they weren't put in during the refit, that's either a fact or a lie but why is that blaming the residents ? Something quite distasteful about using dead bodies to try and get elected. He's wanted power for 40 years and will do just about anything to get it. I knew Labour would jump on this; they can't resist it.
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Post by boothenboy75 on Jun 16, 2017 15:21:15 GMT
Protestors currently occupying the local council offices. Could turn nasty later.
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Post by Gods on Jun 16, 2017 15:31:33 GMT
Protestors currently occupying the local council offices. Could turn nasty later. This was only ever going to end up in one place wasn't it? Genuinely heart broken people directly involved losing their loved ones and rightly becoming increasingly incandescent with rage at the circumstances in which it happened but perhaps much more worryingly rent-a-mob waiting in the wings ready to seriously up the ante and make political capital. And summer has always been riot season in our big cities, no one likes to chuck stuff around in the cold, its almost a great British tradition, like Henley and Ascot for the less well off. I hate to call the situation a tinder box but that is what it is, needs some calm heads right now.
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Post by bathstoke on Jun 16, 2017 15:33:20 GMT
What a load of bullshit that headline is, where exactly does he blame residents ? He says residents did not want the extra delay and disruption fitting sprinklers would cause and that is why they weren't put in during the refit, that's either a fact or a lie but why is that blaming the residents ? Something quite distasteful about using dead bodies to try and get elected. He's wanted power for 40 years and will do just about anything to get it. I knew Labour would jump on this; they can't resist it. It's not that they can't resist it, they can't ignore it
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Post by manmarking on Jun 16, 2017 15:35:03 GMT
You're in no position to criticise mate. You endlessly politicise tragedies when it suits your agenda. Besides, this is an inherently political issue and people in similar housing need some action taking now to avert similar tragedies. Now as in now. Not after a few years once a report is published. The previous Labour government has awkward questions to answer too, if that's of any consolation to you. "Endlessly politicise tragedies" Cobblers. Name them. I don't need your consolation. Just you and Essex et al to stop posting absolute bullshit just because it fits your nasty Leftist agenda. Last London Tower block fire 2009 under Labour. Report published 2013! Khan commissioned a report last year from Anthony Mayer which doesn't call for more funding for the fire service. . Caroline Flint made Mayer an ombudsman back in 2009 for social housing. Labour started Oftenant to assist in social housing matters. How'd that worked out? The new Labour MP for Kensington was a local councillor sitting on the KCTMO and local Fire Advisory Committee. She blames the contractors. The council, housing association, contractors, sub contractors, building plans and regs, material manufacturers, Architects etc etc will all have to submit documents to the coroner and the judge lead inquiry. For anyone to be saying it's May or Boris' fault at this point is just plain daft. So far today, you’ve laid into firefighters and sworn at me for finding it annoying that so many poor folk lived in a death trap and have just died or been displaced needlessly. Now you’re calling me a ‘nasty leftist’ because I’ve said I’d like poor people to be able to live in safe, dignified accommodation. By extension, you’re saying the many tower block residents around the UK who are voicing that view are ‘nasty leftists’ too. That includes people who survived Grenfell Tower - people who you’ve barely mentioned, incidentally. I can only assume because you think that trying to shout down any awkward questions whatsoever to a Tory government is a more pressing concern. I’ve even agreed that previous Labour administrations have difficult questions to answer too, but evidently that’s not enough. Personally I think you should take a step back and show a modicum of concern for the victims but that’s up to you. Carry on making yourself look a callous, deranged little attack dog if you prefer. I’ll wear your insults with great pride because frankly I’d be disappointed if I agreed with you on this issue In terms of politicising tragedies, let’s see. Off the top of my head … There’s using IRA bombings to try to provide political advantage to Theresa May. For two years. There’s your post above (ironically), where you’re scurrying about desperately trying to protect your Great Leader and her only electable potential replacement by deflecting blame towards various Labour figures. There’s your frequent criticism of immigration and security policies in the direct aftermath of terror attacks. I could go on but, well, I can’t really be arsed. It’s a nice day and we’re not going to agree, are we
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Post by followyoudown on Jun 16, 2017 16:05:22 GMT
What a load of bullshit that headline is, where exactly does he blame residents ? He says residents did not want the extra delay and disruption fitting sprinklers would cause and that is why they weren't put in during the refit, that's either a fact or a lie but why is that blaming the residents ? Something quite distasteful about using dead bodies to try and get elected. He's wanted power for 40 years and will do just about anything to get it. I knew Labour would jump on this; they can't resist it. Some big supporters and websites with close links have been spreading fake news re D-Notices on the number of deaths, each time you think they've hit rock bottom they crash on through and keep going lower.
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Post by Northy on Jun 16, 2017 16:54:21 GMT
You're in no position to criticise mate. You endlessly politicise tragedies when it suits your agenda. Besides, this is an inherently political issue and people in similar housing need some action taking now to avert similar tragedies. Now as in now. Not after a few years once a report is published. The previous Labour government has awkward questions to answer too, if that's of any consolation to you. For anyone to be saying it's May or Boris' fault at this point is just plain daft. Nail and head
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Post by essexstokey on Jun 16, 2017 17:08:16 GMT
For anyone to be saying it's May or Boris' fault at this point is just plain daft. Nail and head Boris Johnson’s ‘Get Stuffed’ Response To Question About London Firefighter Cuts Is Coming Back To Haunt Him link please watch this
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Post by manmarking on Jun 16, 2017 17:14:42 GMT
For anyone to be saying it's May or Boris' fault at this point is just plain daft. Nail and head More deflection. No one has blamed either of those people for the fire. Did any policy decisions increase the number of casualties? Or allow inappropriate construction materials to be used? Does the previous Labour administration carry any blame? There are loads of searching questions that need answering in the full light of day. What is scandalous is that the building - for whatever reason - was unfit for human habitation. Profits appear to have been put before lives. Victims deserve some initial answers very quickly. And people living in similar buildings need whatever is required to bring their homes up to standard even more quickly.
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Post by lommack on Jun 16, 2017 17:14:53 GMT
He's wanted power for 40 years and will do just about anything to get it. I knew Labour would jump on this; they can't resist it. Some big supporters and websites with close links have been spreading fake news re D-Notices on the number of deaths, each time you think they've hit rock bottom they crash on through and keep going lower. One of your right wing pin ups, Isabell Oakshott, has just been on Radio 5 absolutely slating the Tories (mentioned a housing minister running away from a Sky news crew) and (surprisingly) defended Corbyn and the Labour party saying they are doing what an opposition party should do.....asking awkward/difficult questions. I'm fairly sure you lot were showing faux concern for democracy by not having a vocal and difficult opposition before the election You have got one now
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Post by manmarking on Jun 16, 2017 17:31:01 GMT
He's wanted power for 40 years and will do just about anything to get it. I knew Labour would jump on this; they can't resist it. Some big supporters and websites with close links have been spreading fake news re D-Notices on the number of deaths, each time you think they've hit rock bottom they crash on through and keep going lower. Let's take a wild guess where you've had that story from www.order-order.com/2017/06/16/corbynistas-peddle-grenfell-d-notice-fake-news/amp/Not websites with close links to Labour. Any more than any media outlet that gets tip offs from people in the Labour party. Including dear old Guido. Why are you more bothered with attacking Corbyn than you are with discussing the victims and those living in similar housing, fyd? It's almost as if you're politicising the issue.
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Post by essexstokey on Jun 16, 2017 17:32:01 GMT
You're in no position to criticise mate. You endlessly politicise tragedies when it suits your agenda. Besides, this is an inherently political issue and people in similar housing need some action taking now to avert similar tragedies. Now as in now. Not after a few years once a report is published. The previous Labour government has awkward questions to answer too, if that's of any consolation to you. "Endlessly politicise tragedies" Cobblers. Name them. I don't need your consolation. Just you and Essex et al to stop posting absolute bullshit just because it fits your nasty Leftist agenda. Last London Tower block fire 2009 under Labour. Report published 2013! And who was in power when the report came out!the bullshit as you put it is what the press are saying that's including the tory press Khan commissioned a report last year from Anthony Mayer which doesn't call for more funding for the fire service. Cant coment as I have not seen the report and I bet you haven't too . Caroline Flint made Mayer an ombudsman back in 2009 for social housing. Labour started Oftenant to assist in social housing matters. How'd that worked out? The new Labour MP for Kensington was a local councillor sitting on the KCTMO and local Fire Advisory Committee. She blames the contractors. Please remind us how many Tory councillors are there to other partiesThe council, housing association, contractors, sub contractors, building plans and regs, material manufacturers, Architects etc etc will all have to submit documents to the coroner and the judge lead inquiry. But why is it an inquiry and not an inquest what is there to nideFor anyone to be saying it's May or Boris' fault at this point is just plain daft. He was mayor she was home secretary and pm when these reports came out who else is there to blame for the cuts and ignoring of reports, may visited emergency services yesterday don't you think its odd she didn't have the compassion to meet the people effected until guilted into it? even our 93 year old queen visited them and yes even though it was difficult and he faced anger so did khan and corbin showing compassion all government ministers have done is tried to defend may and Ledbury was taken to task on sky news by a teen. People are very angry down here the victims are in B&Bs and also halls (church as social centre was sold off and is now for the posher people in the area(there words not mine)) they are living from day to day no one from the council has been to see them, some didn't even know where they were sleeping last night as the council had not confirmed to them that they were paying. Today at lunch time the deputy council leader said it would be 2 years before they found accommodation for all of them, the locals on the ground have said that the council have been useless and its the volunteers and churches that have done all the work and organising and the residents say the council is in disarray.
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Post by essexstokey on Jun 16, 2017 17:37:30 GMT
Wow matless is laying into may on the news channel she is being ripped to shredds
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Post by essexstokey on Jun 16, 2017 17:43:59 GMT
'I can't comment I'm afraid'
Posted at 17:36
Earlier today, former housing minister Gavin Barwell refused to comment on Grenfell Tower
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Post by The Drunken Communist on Jun 16, 2017 17:49:52 GMT
'I can't comment I'm afraid' Posted at 17:36 Earlier today, former housing minister Gavin Barwell refused to comment on Grenfell Tower What was he asked before he replied "I CAN'T comment I'm afraid"? I don't know, I haven't seen/read/heard whatever it is that that has come from, but there is a whole world of difference between "I can't", whether that be due to simply not knowing, or not being allowed to discuss such details, as there is to 'refusing' to comment like you're making out.
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Post by essexstokey on Jun 16, 2017 17:52:15 GMT
'I can't comment I'm afraid' Posted at 17:36 Earlier today, former housing minister Gavin Barwell refused to comment on Grenfell Tower What was he asked before he replied "I CAN'T comment I'm afraid"? I don't know, I haven't seen/read/heard whatever it is that that has come from, but there is a whole world of difference between "I can't", whether that be due to simply not knowing, or not being allowed to discuss such details, as there is to 'refusing' to comment like you're making out. This was copied of bbc news stream
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Post by The Drunken Communist on Jun 16, 2017 17:54:21 GMT
This was copied of bbc news stream So copy the question he was replying to then...
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