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Post by partickpotter on Jan 27, 2021 18:25:47 GMT
I note some bleating in this thread about us looking to do more business with India on account, seemingly, of their employment practices.
Yet...
No concerns are being expressed about our cricketers who are about to start a test series there.
Double standards?
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Post by partickpotter on Jan 27, 2021 18:28:18 GMT
So what do you propose the UK does? Do we break off relations with Saudi? Do we then have sanctions against those countries that do deal with Saudi? Such as USA. It's just 100 years since the British massacred Indians and today India is one of the biggest investors in the UK. Times change and Saudi will change as the rest of the world becomes more democratic and liberal. The rest of the world (including US and Britain) is becoming less democratic and less liberal though I thought the US had just rediscovered democracy with the ascension of Joe Biden?
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Post by oggyoggy on Jan 27, 2021 18:29:14 GMT
The rest of the world (including US and Britain) is becoming less democratic and less liberal though I thought the US had just rediscovered democracy with the ascension of Joe Biden? Maybe, we’ll see
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Post by prestwichpotter on Jan 27, 2021 18:32:24 GMT
I note some bleating in this thread about us looking to do more business with India on account, seemingly, of their employment practices. Yet... No concerns are being expressed about our cricketers who are about to start a test series there. Double standards? Fast and loose with the word "bleating" again. Buy this man a dictionary someone please.......
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Post by Linx on Jan 27, 2021 19:45:08 GMT
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Post by foster on Jan 27, 2021 20:52:04 GMT
I note some bleating in this thread about us looking to do more business with India on account, seemingly, of their employment practices. Yet... No concerns are being expressed about our cricketers who are about to start a test series there. Double standards? Fast and loose with the word "bleating" again. Buy this man a dictionary someone please....... Totally missed the point as well. It was double standards by brexiteers.
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Post by mrcoke on Jan 27, 2021 21:06:42 GMT
The rest of the world (including US and Britain) is becoming less democratic and less liberal though I thought the US had just rediscovered democracy with the ascension of Joe Biden? To me democracy is the right of the people to chose their government. If enough people vote for a Trump or a Johnson, we might think that is "unfortunate" but it is democracy and at some point in time they can be voted out of power. India and Israel's governments were elected whether you like them or not, but Russia's, China's, Saudi's, and the EU Commission who run the EU are not elected and cannot be removed.
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Post by partickpotter on Jan 27, 2021 21:14:40 GMT
Fast and loose with the word "bleating" again. Buy this man a dictionary someone please....... Totally missed the point as well. It was double standards by brexiteers. What are you talking about. Genuine question.
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Post by vokeswagen on Jan 27, 2021 21:25:34 GMT
Totally missed the point as well. It was double standards by brexiteers. What are you talking about. Genuine question. If it’s a genuine question, put a genuine question mark on it you plum When did you get so right wing anyway fella?! Have you got family in the Venezuelan upper classes or summit?
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Post by followyoudown on Jan 27, 2021 22:28:45 GMT
My last post has been criticised at my welcoming the UK working towards a trade deal with India. I was not a Brexiteer who attacked the EU proposing an investment agreement with China, all I said was it was driven by (German) corporate interests and rushed through while Germany still chaired the EU Council. We've yet to see whether the European parliament approve the deal, but they usually nod through everything the Commission and Council want. No one said you were. But there are other Brexiteers on here that have criticised or used the deal as a stick to beat the EU with..namely Craps, FYD and scfcbiancorrossi. And how is a trade deal with India even remotely the same as an investment deal with China, I am fully aware the PM of India is a bit of a cunt but any trade deal would be for british and indian companies. Indian companies are not state controlled, the EU investment deal takes money straight from the chinese communist party.
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Post by followyoudown on Jan 27, 2021 22:32:04 GMT
Totally missed the point as well. It was double standards by brexiteers. What are you talking about. Genuine question. He is trying to claim taking investment from the chinese government into EU companies is as morally wrong as arranging a free trade deal to sell cheshire cheese or whatever to Indian consumers / buy stuff from indian suppliers because Modi is a knob.
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Post by foster on Jan 27, 2021 23:34:06 GMT
What are you talking about. Genuine question. He is trying to claim taking investment from the chinese government into EU companies is as morally wrong as arranging a free trade deal to sell cheshire cheese or whatever to Indian consumers / buy stuff from indian suppliers because Modi is a knob. Just claiming that there are some hypocrites on here that pick and choose what's morally acceptable to them to suit their agendas. Thanks for confirming.
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Post by partickpotter on Jan 27, 2021 23:46:22 GMT
He is trying to claim taking investment from the chinese government into EU companies is as morally wrong as arranging a free trade deal to sell cheshire cheese or whatever to Indian consumers / buy stuff from indian suppliers because Modi is a knob. Just claiming that there are some hypocrites on here that pick and choose what's morally acceptable to them to suit their agendas. Thanks for confirming. True. Plenty of hypocrisy on show.
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Post by followyoudown on Jan 28, 2021 0:11:15 GMT
He is trying to claim taking investment from the chinese government into EU companies is as morally wrong as arranging a free trade deal to sell cheshire cheese or whatever to Indian consumers / buy stuff from indian suppliers because Modi is a knob. Just claiming that there are some hypocrites on here that pick and choose what's morally acceptable to them to suit their agendas. Thanks for confirming. I think you are wibbling again, the chinese government are currently running concentration camps, that same government is investing in the eu directly or indirectly through the companies that they control, a trade deal between India and Britain involves eliminating tariffs on goods / services between the two countries for private owned companies. UK companies also have an obligation to ensure none of their subsidiaries or anyone in their supply chain is involved in modern slavery so there should not be any taking advantage of working practices in india. I see nothing hypocritical there.
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Post by foster on Jan 28, 2021 5:42:50 GMT
Just claiming that there are some hypocrites on here that pick and choose what's morally acceptable to them to suit their agendas. Thanks for confirming. I think you are wibbling again, the chinese government are currently running concentration camps, that same government is investing in the eu directly or indirectly through the companies that they control, a trade deal between India and Britain involves eliminating tariffs on goods / services between the two countries for private owned companies. UK companies also have an obligation to ensure none of their subsidiaries or anyone in their supply chain is involved in modern slavery so there should not be any taking advantage of working practices in india. I see nothing hypocritical there. I know you don't. That's the point. Seems you're picking and choosing what you think is relevant and ignoring all the issues with working practices and human rights and conditions in India - sweatshops, equal rights, working conditions, etc. Personally, I don't mind having a deal with either country, but I'm not going to make myself look daft by criticising one whilst greeting the other with open arms.
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Post by yeswilko on Jan 28, 2021 8:11:34 GMT
On this thread you're saying the UK will prosper outside the EU because we're not tearing ourselves apart over Covid . On the Covid thread you're talking of triggers for civil unrest in the UK this summer because of Covid. I'd love to know what you really think is a measure of success. Oh don't get me wrong. I think we're heading for a huge recession and probably quite a bit of unrest. History tells us large scale job losses lead to mass unrest. But the EU is heading for far worse. Just watch it happen. No need to go on the defensive. Just sit back and watch it happen 😊 And you voted for large scale job losses.
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Post by scfcbiancorossi on Jan 28, 2021 8:45:51 GMT
Oh don't get me wrong. I think we're heading for a huge recession and probably quite a bit of unrest. History tells us large scale job losses lead to mass unrest. But the EU is heading for far worse. Just watch it happen. No need to go on the defensive. Just sit back and watch it happen 😊 And you voted for large scale job losses. All these Brexit induced job losses are terrible aren't they? The Nissan situation was just awful, thousands!!! The same Nissan that have actually had zero redundancies and indeed have cited a new competitive advantage off the back of brexit. Pretty much the only criticism bitter, anti democracy remoaners can moan about right now is a few teething, inevitable red tape challenges and the odd logistical delay here and there. They'll last all of about 6 months. Brexit is proving a monumental success and you know it. The first big win being that we are providing the most stunning logistical roll out in history, meanwhile the EU is floundering in a sea of misery, anger and confusion.
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Post by prestwichpotter on Jan 28, 2021 8:49:03 GMT
Just claiming that there are some hypocrites on here that pick and choose what's morally acceptable to them to suit their agendas. Thanks for confirming. I think you are wibbling again, the chinese government are currently running concentration camps, that same government is investing in the eu directly or indirectly through the companies that they control, a trade deal between India and Britain involves eliminating tariffs on goods / services between the two countries for private owned companies. UK companies also have an obligation to ensure none of their subsidiaries or anyone in their supply chain is involved in modern slavery so there should not be any taking advantage of working practices in india. I see nothing hypocritical there. The Indian regime is accused of detaining and killing thousands of Kashmiri’s over the years by the same human rights organisations that accuse China. There is clear evidence of mass graves that have been found in villages across the region. There is now pretty much a total news blackout and no journalists are allowed in or out so who knows what’s currently going on? I know China is everyone’s primary focus right now despite us actively courting their business over the years, but both regimes have plenty of blood on their hands.......
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Post by foster on Jan 28, 2021 9:52:46 GMT
I think you are wibbling again, the chinese government are currently running concentration camps, that same government is investing in the eu directly or indirectly through the companies that they control, a trade deal between India and Britain involves eliminating tariffs on goods / services between the two countries for private owned companies. UK companies also have an obligation to ensure none of their subsidiaries or anyone in their supply chain is involved in modern slavery so there should not be any taking advantage of working practices in india. I see nothing hypocritical there. The Indian regime is accused of detaining and killing thousands of Kashmiri’s over the years by the same human rights organisations that accuse China. There is clear evidence of mass graves that have been found in villages across the region. There is now pretty much a total mess blackout and no journalists are allowed in or out so who knows what’s currently going on? I know China is everyone’s primary focus right now despite us actively courting their business over the years, but both regimes have plenty of blood on their hands....... Come on mate, you know FYD has a hard-on for everything the government does and won't have a bad word said about them. He defended them on how COVID's been handled, he's defended them on any and all deals they make, he's defended them on how they haven't applied enough digital tax on the tech giants dominating the UK market, he defended them on how they've managed school meals/vouchers for kids in poverty, etc. Whatever the government does, you can be sure that FYD is consistent in his unwavering devotion to Boris n co.
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Post by prestwichpotter on Jan 28, 2021 10:12:32 GMT
The Indian regime is accused of detaining and killing thousands of Kashmiri’s over the years by the same human rights organisations that accuse China. There is clear evidence of mass graves that have been found in villages across the region. There is now pretty much a total mess blackout and no journalists are allowed in or out so who knows what’s currently going on? I know China is everyone’s primary focus right now despite us actively courting their business over the years, but both regimes have plenty of blood on their hands....... Come on mate, you know FYD has a hard-on for everything the government does and won't have a bad word said about them. He defended them on how COVID's been handled, he's defended them on any and all deals they make, he's defended them on how they haven't applied enough digital tax on the tech giants dominating the UK market, he defended them on how they've managed school meals/vouchers for kids in poverty, etc. Whatever the government does, you can be sure that FYD is consistent in his unwavering devotion to Boris n co. The thing is it's not really about the minutiae of each individual country, it's about having a set of common values in our foreign policy whether it be socially, economically, militarily. Until we get to that point we'll continue to cherry pick our outrage depending on which way the wind blows.......
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Post by Rednwhitenblue on Jan 28, 2021 12:37:05 GMT
I wonder if this vaccine spat between ourselves and the EU is a sign of things to come in our relationship generally...I hope not, it doesn't bode well for either party.
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Post by partickpotter on Jan 28, 2021 13:52:55 GMT
I wonder if this vaccine spat between ourselves and the EU is a sign of things to come in our relationship generally...I hope not, it doesn't bode well for either party. Who knows. The EU has fucked up big time on this so is desperately trying to both resolve the problem while dousing down criticism. In some regards the problem is temporary and short term as regards supply of the vaccine, but it is also permanent and for ever in that more people will die because they didn’t get the vaccine. It might damage future relationships between the EU and the UK, it might damage the EU itself. I suspect though in a years time it will be water under the bridge.
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Post by mrcoke on Jan 28, 2021 14:34:07 GMT
We seem to have loads of vaccine judging by numerous reports.
I read somewhere that there are over 150 vaccines under development and trial around the world and another one is expected to be approved next week which the UK has an order for 30 million doses.
Perhaps it would be a magnanimous jesture to offer some to the EU, to smooth relations.
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Post by foster on Jan 28, 2021 16:22:27 GMT
We seem to have loads of vaccine judging by numerous reports. I read somewhere that there are over 150 vaccines under development and trial around the world and another one is expected to be approved next week which the UK has an order for 30 million doses. Perhaps it would be a magnanimous jesture to offer some to the EU, to smooth relations. Maybe they don’t actually don’t want it - the German’s don’t. Leastways for over 65s. So do they or don't they want it? Genuine question
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Post by partickpotter on Jan 28, 2021 16:41:51 GMT
Maybe they don’t actually don’t want it - the German’s don’t. Leastways for over 65s. So do they or don't they want it? Genuine question Not for over 65s. And seeing as that covers 90 odd per cent of the most at risk population it seems, for the most part, they don't.
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Post by muggleton on Jan 28, 2021 17:09:05 GMT
We seem to have loads of vaccine judging by numerous reports. I read somewhere that there are over 150 vaccines under development and trial around the world and another one is expected to be approved next week which the UK has an order for 30 million doses. Perhaps it would be a magnanimous jesture to offer some to the EU, to smooth relations. There's a shortage of vaccine in this country, hence the strict rationing which means healthy adults won't get theirs for months and GPs are being drip fed tiny quantities at a time. Vaccine supply is the single biggest barrier to reopening the economy.
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Post by crapslinger on Jan 28, 2021 17:23:22 GMT
We seem to have loads of vaccine judging by numerous reports. I read somewhere that there are over 150 vaccines under development and trial around the world and another one is expected to be approved next week which the UK has an order for 30 million doses. Perhaps it would be a magnanimous jesture to offer some to the EU, to smooth relations. For a highly inflated price, they fcuked up with ordering we didn't our turn to hold them to ransom perhaps.
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Post by mrcoke on Jan 28, 2021 17:51:33 GMT
The Germans During my working life I had many dealings with Germans. I found them to be very dedicated to their work, extremely loyal to their employers, very disciplined, and extremely well organised. But there is a flaw in their character (you appreciate I am generalising). The best way of explaining this is a very long story of an experience I had in the 1980s. One summer I had an exchange German chemical engineering student attached to me for 3 months, for him to get industrial experience. His first day was the same day I arrived back at work off holiday, so I needed to catch up with business and could not give him my immediate attention.To get him started I gave him a copy of the plant description to read and I gave him a job to do. The job was to file all the operators and foremen shift reports from the weekend. I suggested he read them, about 2 dozen, and filed them in a specific filing cabinet. I then went to the morning meeting. When I returned he was reading the plant description. I looked for the shift reports, which I couldn't see and asked him where they were. He told me he had filed them. I was impressed. But then I noticed two of the report sheets on top of the filing cabinet. I picked them up and said "You didn't file these?" "No" he said and pointing to the top one said "I could not see where to file that one." Sure enough he was right, that report was the fire prevention report and it went in a different filing cabinet to the operational reports. I then asked him why he hadn't filed the other sheet, which was an operators report. "Because it has not been signed" he replied. Now I'm really impressed! I checked my diary and post and found I had a meeting that afternoon at a different works. Unfortunately the diary and letter said the meeting was at different times. I rang someone to find out what time the meeting actually was as I didn't to waste time waiting, or arrive late; I got no reply. I apologised to the student that I could not tell him what time we could have a discussion that afternoon. As the morning went on I made repeated calls but could not contact anyone. The student sat listening. Eventually just before lunchtime I managed to contact someone who said "Oh yes, that meeting is cancelled due to people off work". I was a bit annoyed as I could have travelled miles on a wasted journey for a cancelled meeting. Later that day I related all the above to the secretary. I concluded by saying " We (British) are very disorganised, the Germans must wonder how they lost the war". She replied "I know why they lost the war". "Because they were too busy doing their filing". I have no doubt the German's have an excellent, thorough, and exhaustive process for approving the use of a vaccine, but I wonder how many over 65s will suffer because of it?
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Post by mrcoke on Jan 28, 2021 18:33:40 GMT
Except, the EU isn't "literally going up in flames". You don't half over-react, bianco You might as well say "the UK is literally dying" - because a lot of folk have died of Covid...! There may well be sporadic Covid protests in various countries - perhaps you missed it but we've had several over here too! Mate come on we both know the EU is in an incredibly bad state right now. I was just chatting to our guys in Romania and they are absolutely fuming at the delays. You've got Spain, Greece and Italy that are already on the brink (EU flags being burnt in town squares in Italy). You've got the riots in the Netherlands and I can assure you there were quite a few flames last night! I think its becoming pretty obvious the EU is creaking like mad. This EU vaccine crisis could genuinely finish it off. The funny thing is and what it makes it better is the fact that these delays are such a classic example of EU bureaucracy gone wrong. I think the rest of the EU will also be fuming about Romania and where their money is going: www.eureporter.co/world/romania/2021/01/28/romania-one-of-the-most-corrupt-countries/and Hungary looking to go its own way with vaccine: newseu.cgtn.com/news/2021-01-29/Hungary-defies-EU-to-seal-vaccine-deals-amid-AstraZeneca-row-Xqvc2iHnws/index.html
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Post by followyoudown on Jan 28, 2021 19:34:59 GMT
I think you are wibbling again, the chinese government are currently running concentration camps, that same government is investing in the eu directly or indirectly through the companies that they control, a trade deal between India and Britain involves eliminating tariffs on goods / services between the two countries for private owned companies. UK companies also have an obligation to ensure none of their subsidiaries or anyone in their supply chain is involved in modern slavery so there should not be any taking advantage of working practices in india. I see nothing hypocritical there. I know you don't. That's the point. Seems you're picking and choosing what you think is relevant and ignoring all the issues with working practices and human rights and conditions in India - sweatshops, equal rights, working conditions, etc. Personally, I don't mind having a deal with either country, but I'm not going to make myself look daft by criticising one whilst greeting the other with open arms. Nope aren't you the supersmart lawyer I suggest you look up the reqirements of the modern slavery act in the uk. And if it was just a trade deal between countries that would be fine as apart from switzeland or sweden you can probably find something objectionable that every country is doing. A deal with china directly benefits the chinese communist party who are engaged in a genecide as well as the suppression of democracy in hong kong.
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