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Post by Deleted on Sept 25, 2020 19:50:03 GMT
Happy to meet still John, although not allowed at the moment technically due to lockdown measures........
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Post by Rednwhitenblue on Sept 26, 2020 17:05:25 GMT
Looks like a deal is edging closer after the government signals willingness to backdown on Internal Market Bill, according to the DT. Downing St now plans to delay the IM Bill until December, and amend it if Tory rebels agree to back down and a deal is agreed by Oct 15. "It seems like the tide is turning" said an EU official, "there is a sense of optimism". There is speculation that the softening of the tone in London comes after Boris Johnson was shocked by a London School of Economics report suggesting that no-deal would cost up to three times more than Covid. I bet he was! Meanwhile, new checking facilities for goods arriving in Northern Ireland from Great Britain will not be ready for the end of the Brexit transition period, a senior official confirmed - what a surprise. It remains to be seen what compromises both sides will make. Waga won't be a happy man...!
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Post by elystokie on Sept 27, 2020 10:39:34 GMT
Looks like a deal is edging closer after the government signals willingness to backdown on Internal Market Bill, according to the DT. Downing St now plans to delay the IM Bill until December, and amend it if Tory rebels agree to back down and a deal is agreed by Oct 15. "It seems like the tide is turning" said an EU official, "there is a sense of optimism". There is speculation that the softening of the tone in London comes after Boris Johnson was shocked by a London School of Economics report suggesting that no-deal would cost up to three times more than Covid. I bet he was! Meanwhile, new checking facilities for goods arriving in Northern Ireland from Great Britain will not be ready for the end of the Brexit transition period, a senior official confirmed - what a surprise. It remains to be seen what compromises both sides will make. Waga won't be a happy man...! I don't think Waga will be happy until the whole country is operated like a national version of that old TV show "The Good Life".
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Post by wagsastokie on Sept 27, 2020 11:28:59 GMT
Looks like a deal is edging closer after the government signals willingness to backdown on Internal Market Bill, according to the DT. Downing St now plans to delay the IM Bill until December, and amend it if Tory rebels agree to back down and a deal is agreed by Oct 15. "It seems like the tide is turning" said an EU official, "there is a sense of optimism". There is speculation that the softening of the tone in London comes after Boris Johnson was shocked by a London School of Economics report suggesting that no-deal would cost up to three times more than Covid. I bet he was! Meanwhile, new checking facilities for goods arriving in Northern Ireland from Great Britain will not be ready for the end of the Brexit transition period, a senior official confirmed - what a surprise. It remains to be seen what compromises both sides will make. Waga won't be a happy man...! To right I won't and several million likewise
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Post by wagsastokie on Sept 27, 2020 11:32:11 GMT
Looks like a deal is edging closer after the government signals willingness to backdown on Internal Market Bill, according to the DT. Downing St now plans to delay the IM Bill until December, and amend it if Tory rebels agree to back down and a deal is agreed by Oct 15. "It seems like the tide is turning" said an EU official, "there is a sense of optimism". There is speculation that the softening of the tone in London comes after Boris Johnson was shocked by a London School of Economics report suggesting that no-deal would cost up to three times more than Covid. I bet he was! Meanwhile, new checking facilities for goods arriving in Northern Ireland from Great Britain will not be ready for the end of the Brexit transition period, a senior official confirmed - what a surprise. It remains to be seen what compromises both sides will make. Waga won't be a happy man...! I don't think Waga will be happy until the whole country is operated like a national version of that old TV show "The Good Life". I won't be happy untill this country is free of European Union interference and we have complete control over are territorial waters and who and how much they are allowed to fish
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Post by wagsastokie on Sept 27, 2020 13:05:44 GMT
Well if those quisling arsewipes cave in to the EU
then I suppose I shall have to wait for the third coming of the messiah farage to sort it out
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Post by Rednwhitenblue on Sept 27, 2020 14:00:28 GMT
Looks like a deal is edging closer after the government signals willingness to backdown on Internal Market Bill, according to the DT. Downing St now plans to delay the IM Bill until December, and amend it if Tory rebels agree to back down and a deal is agreed by Oct 15. "It seems like the tide is turning" said an EU official, "there is a sense of optimism". There is speculation that the softening of the tone in London comes after Boris Johnson was shocked by a London School of Economics report suggesting that no-deal would cost up to three times more than Covid. I bet he was! Meanwhile, new checking facilities for goods arriving in Northern Ireland from Great Britain will not be ready for the end of the Brexit transition period, a senior official confirmed - what a surprise. It remains to be seen what compromises both sides will make. Waga won't be a happy man...! To right I won't and several million likewise You know what, waga, I don't think many people will actually give much of a shit! Only two things matter really to the vast majority, one is that we leave and it's done, the second is Brexit once again disappears from the news and they can get on with their lives. No doubt those of us directly interested in it will continue to follow the fallout, but if some kind of a deal is done, only those folk directly affected will give a shit, most others, even Brexiteers will just be glad it's over. There is a huge wave of Brexit fatigue over the country, especially now Covid is dominating the headlines. Brexit may briefly hit the news as both sides squabble to claim they got the best deal, but after that even Farage will struggle to get people to care about the nitty gritty of any sell out. People just want it all to fuck off!
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Post by Rednwhitenblue on Sept 27, 2020 15:56:23 GMT
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Post by RedandWhite90 on Sept 27, 2020 16:32:26 GMT
I don't think Waga will be happy until the whole country is operated like a national version of that old TV show "The Good Life". I won't be happy untill this country is free of European Union interference and we have complete control over are territorial waters and who and how much they are allowed to fish Oh my Cod!
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Post by wagsastokie on Sept 27, 2020 17:00:56 GMT
I won't be happy untill this country is free of European Union interference and we have complete control over are territorial waters and who and how much they are allowed to fish Oh my Cod! So you find it perfectly fine for European factory ships to rape the sea of fish and other marine creatures often returning unwanted dead species to the sea You find it perfectly fine for the Dutch to use electric Probe fishing and indiscriminatly stunning everything Total control of British waters by this country could lead to a world beating conservation policy With sustainable fishing whilst protecting the seabed and other marine creatures Meanwhile what's your opinion on live animal export another favorite of the EU
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Post by nicholasjalcock on Sept 27, 2020 17:04:32 GMT
Nope. The EU celebrated its 60th birthday recently. You can join in the celebrations here: www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2017/mar/23/eu-60-generation-europe-berlin-barcelona. Just semantics really to argue that the bloc doesn't go back to 1957 and has evolved and enlarged along the way, as it will probably continue to do, minus our presence. So I suspect it'll do better than the Soviet Union but, you never know, six years is a long time... We are free to rule ourselves and yet we've begged for handouts before on numerous occasions - reliance on America post WW2, the IMF debacle in the 70s for two examples. Unless that was the fault of the Europeans too? Perhaps in that short period of EEC membership at that point those pesky foreigners did for us again? We also suffered most severely from the financial crisis despite having all the safeguards of not being in the ERM and not using the Euro. Again, not quite the sunny uplands you'd like to portray... But you're right. We will continue to be able to vote in and vote out our elected representatives. And live with the consequences, as we're doing now and probably will do for decades, as you've said previously. Western Europe relied on the US to bail them out, not just the UK. A timely reminder to where our allies really are But the bit you’ve forgotten to mention is that the Americans created the post war global economic order to benefit themselves! Gone were our guaranteed imperial markets as the new U.N. was opposed to colonialism! Also, our pre war Imperial tariff protections were dismantled! For their assistance in WW2 the Americans dismantled the British Empire in a way the Austrian corporal and Togo of Japan could only dream of?
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Post by RedandWhite90 on Sept 27, 2020 17:38:51 GMT
So you find it perfectly fine for European factory ships to rape the sea of fish and other marine creatures often returning unwanted dead species to the sea You find it perfectly fine for the Dutch to use electric Probe fishing and indiscriminatly stunning everything Total control of British waters by this country could lead to a world beating conservation policy With sustainable fishing whilst protecting the seabed and other marine creatures Meanwhile what's your opinion on live animal export another favorite of the EU I remember watching a programme with Anthony Worrall-Thompon, Ben Cohen and another celebrity who went on a fishing trawler in Scotland and being pretty mortified by the rules and regulations surrounding fishing. Dead cod being tossed back into the sea due to quotas, net sizes and if you want to add stunning fish into the mix (and I dont profess to know the pro's and con's) it made for all in all pretty sad viewing. However, not at one point in time did I then or even now think that the best thing we can do is sacrifice freedom of movement, access to the single market/Customs Union, begin erecting borders, risk our own Union and removing ourself from the biggest trading bloc in the world which includes our nearest and dearest. I didn't think it was worth it for an industry that contributes 0.12% of our GDP. Does the policy need reform? I would argue on the face of it it does, but without ever working a day in the industry and living in a city which is just about as far from the sea as you can get, I just can't summon enough animosity to think it is worth what is starting to happen and will continue to get worse. In terms of live animal transportation, again I would be asking what the most humane and safe to eat way is of transporting meat and to ensure that we do it to the highest standard we possibly can. But is it an issue the way we do it now? If the alternative is hormone injected beef of chlorinated chicken then I would say we're probably on the better path. If we're failing on the 2 above points we should have been pushing for change and reform within the EU, and voting for eurosceptic xenophobic nationalists as MEP's wasn't really going to fix it. But the fishing point remains... 'giving up what we do, for 0.12' ...mental in my eyes.
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Post by wagsastokie on Sept 27, 2020 17:54:02 GMT
So you find it perfectly fine for European factory ships to rape the sea of fish and other marine creatures often returning unwanted dead species to the sea You find it perfectly fine for the Dutch to use electric Probe fishing and indiscriminatly stunning everything Total control of British waters by this country could lead to a world beating conservation policy With sustainable fishing whilst protecting the seabed and other marine creatures Meanwhile what's your opinion on live animal export another favorite of the EU I remember watching a programme with Anthony Worrall-Thompon, Ben Cohen and another celebrity who went on a fishing trawler in Scotland and being pretty mortified by the rules and regulations surrounding fishing. Dead cod being tossed back into the sea sea to quotas, net sizes and if you want to add stunning fish into the mix (and I dont profess to know the pro's and con's) it made for all in all pretty sad viewing. However, not at one point in time did I then or even now think that the best thing we can do is sacrifice freedom of movement, access to the single market/Customs Union, begin erecting borders, risk our own Union and removing ourself from the biggest trading bloc in the world which includes our nearest and dearest. I didn't think it was worth it for an industry that contributes 0.12% of our GDP. Does the policy need reform? I would argue on the face of it it does, but without ever working a day in the industry and living in a city which is just about as far from the sea as you can get, I just can't summon enough animosity to think it is worth what is starting to happen and will continue to get worse. In terms of live animal transportation, again I would be asking what the most humane and safe to eat way is of transporting meat and to ensure that we do it to the highest standard we possibly can. But is it an issue the way we do it now? If the alternative is hormone injected beef of chlorinated chicken then I would say we're probably on the better path. If we're failing on the 2 above points we should have been pushing for change and reform within the EU, and voting for urosceptic xenophobic nationalists as MEP's wasn't really going to fix it. But the fishing point remains... 'giving up what we do, for 0.12' ...mental in my eyes. Fair enough reply everyone to there views I just belive that protecting the seas around the country from being damaged by unsustainable fishing practices And the abhorrent practice of transporting live animals for slaughter overseas Is worth a lot more in reality than the cost on paper
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Post by mrcoke on Sept 28, 2020 20:19:28 GMT
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Post by followyoudown on Sept 30, 2020 8:37:14 GMT
From the donkeys mouth what it really means is why do member states have to approve everything we do.
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Post by wagsastokie on Sept 30, 2020 8:56:24 GMT
From the donkeys mouth what it really means is why do member states have to approve everything we do. They don't want to upset putin to much just in case he switches there gas off this winter
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Post by Timmypotter on Sept 30, 2020 9:29:37 GMT
From the donkeys mouth what it really means is why do member states have to approve everything we do. I've said it on this thread before, but I end up feeling a bit sorry for Guy. He sees further centralisation of power as the solution to every problem, to the extent that it blinds him to much easier and more obvious answers. He's the proverbial man with a hammer.
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Post by mrcoke on Sept 30, 2020 19:38:49 GMT
Are the cracks appearing? Apparently UK are offering a 3 year transition period on fishing for the EU to wind down their fishing fleet. www.theguardian.com/politics/2020/sep/30/britain-offers-eu-fishing-concession-brexit-sweetenerI'm afraid the EU will see this as a sign of weakening. There is also news that the EU intend to put tariffs on parts in British cars that are supplied from outside the EU, even if we agree free trade. Many such parts are supplied from Japan who the EU are supposed to have a free trade agreement with the EU. I feel it is extremely important to make a free trade agreemsnt with the EU including an element of compromise. But I am increasingly of the view that we are going to have to leave without an agreement on 31st December, then sit down on 2nd January and have truly productive negotiations, while goods pile up at ports. It will concentrate minds towards a rapid conclusion.
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Post by bigjohnritchie on Sept 30, 2020 20:12:43 GMT
Are the cracks appearing? Apparently UK are offering a 3 year transition period on fishing for the EU to wind down their fishing fleet. www.theguardian.com/politics/2020/sep/30/britain-offers-eu-fishing-concession-brexit-sweetenerI'm afraid the EU will see this as a sign of weakening. There is also news that the EU intend to put tariffs on parts in British cars that are supplied from outside the EU, even if we agree free trade. Many such parts are supplied from Japan who the EU are supposed to have a free trade agreement with the EU. I feel it is extremely important to make a free trade agreemsnt with the EU including an element of compromise. But I am increasingly of the view that we are going to have to leave without an agreement on 31st December, then sit down on 2nd January and have truly productive negotiations, while goods pile up at ports. It will concentrate minds towards a rapid conclusion. As is usually the case in the Guardian the headline, the spin and the first part of the article does not tell the whole story. It may well be that the EU rejects the offer and is still not happy with state aid/ a level playing field. In terms of time scales it is a great shame that the years following the referendum were taken up by the attempts to effectively overturn/ ignore the referendum ( second confirmatory referendums/ soft Brexits) The EU still cannot come to terms with the fact that they are dealing with an independent country. Obviously it is and always was difficult to escape when there has been the movement towards closer union for 40 years. ......... The second part of the article suggests that the EU may not accept any movement away from " permanent " quotas....... “It is perfect, clear. We are not for a gradual withdrawal of quotas. We are for permanent quotas.” “Phasing out is not an option if the UK wants access to the European market in general, which is based on an absence of tariffs and quotas.” While the policy would deliver the extra catches to British fishermen promised as a Brexit bonus, it is understood the government is also making new commitments on maintaining EU sustainability standards and cooperation on the collection of data. Advertisement The offer was part of five new draft negotiating documents submitted by the government, including legal texts on fisheries, the “level playing field”, law enforcement and judicial cooperation, civil nuclear cooperation and social security coordination. A UK government spokesman said: “We aren’t commenting during the talks. We set out our position at the beginning of these negotiations and have always been clear that we will deliver the benefits that fishing communities have been asking for.” An EU official said: “We can confirm that we received additional documents from the UK. We are studying them.” According to Brussels sources, the UK’s new paper on state aid, still the most contentious of the outstanding issues, offers to lay out a series of “principles” on controlling domestic subsidies. The EU said the paper offered hope that the UK would build on provisions in the recently signed UK-Japan deal. The trade deal with Tokyo prevents either side from indefinitely guaranteeing the debts of struggling companies or providing open-ended bailouts without approved restructuring plans. But the paper failed to offer appropriate “governance” proposals that would allow Brussels to keep the UK to its pledges, EU sources said.
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Post by longdistancekiddie on Oct 1, 2020 7:59:39 GMT
It is hard to have any belief in the brexit team when bluffer johnski was pro European and a Remainer only a few years ago
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Post by bigjohnritchie on Oct 1, 2020 8:30:14 GMT
It is hard to have any belief in the brexit team when bluffer johnski was pro European and a Remainer only a few years ago That could be true. Although David Frost seems genuine. It depends upon where we end up on January 1st 2021....and then if/ what the strategy is for "Ever Further Disentanglement"....if indeed there is one. I suppose it's a bit like Corbyn in reverse....a very enthusiastic Leaver,his position was so well thought out and articulated, it was hard to argue with.....until he became Labour leader. It's a shame Farage isn't Prime Minister.....just what the country needs in these times of challenge and change
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Post by Rednwhitenblue on Oct 1, 2020 8:36:31 GMT
Yeah, just what the country needs - a man whose sole tactic these days is to appeal to the dog whistle brigade on illegal immigration over and over again.
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Post by bigjohnritchie on Oct 1, 2020 9:08:37 GMT
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Post by maxplonk on Oct 1, 2020 9:24:15 GMT
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Post by bigjohnritchie on Oct 1, 2020 9:48:41 GMT
That's an interesting one Max As I understand it, by the time that this gets through the European Court of "Justice", that Court will have no jurisdiction over us. Being a European Union Court we would have no representation and being a political Court it is bound to rule in favour of the EU. Ursula von der Leyen isn't stupid so perhaps someone could enlighten me as to what she is up to....making an international statement perhaps?
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Post by maxplonk on Oct 1, 2020 9:50:53 GMT
Can't help you there JR, but it seems the rest of the media has picked up on it now. Dunno about the Guardian tho.
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Post by maxplonk on Oct 1, 2020 9:51:10 GMT
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Post by maxplonk on Oct 1, 2020 9:53:55 GMT
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Post by maxplonk on Oct 1, 2020 9:56:39 GMT
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Post by Rednwhitenblue on Oct 1, 2020 9:59:20 GMT
I agree. But by his own words and actions Farage doesn't.
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