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Post by Timmypotter on Sept 13, 2019 7:57:55 GMT
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Post by Gary Hackett on Sept 13, 2019 8:54:36 GMT
Whatever deal Boris comes back with will be voted down just to bring him down and further down the line whatever deal that gets agreed will go to a public vote with the only other option being remain.
If Boris loses at the supreme Court next week he'll have to resign as it'll be perceived he lied to the queen and his position will be totally untenable.
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Post by followyoudown on Sept 13, 2019 9:02:51 GMT
Just read this on Faceache and its something I have never seen before, The Lisbon Treaty. Is this for real or just a load of old Facebook nonsense ? 1: The UK along with all existing members of the EU lose their abstention veto in 2020 as laid down in the Lisbon Treaty when the system changes to that of majority acceptance with no abstentions or veto’s being allowed. 2: All member nations will become states of the new federal nation of the EU by 2022 as clearly laid out in the Lisbon treaty with no exceptions or veto’s. 3: All member states must adopt the Euro by 2022 and any new member state must do so within 2 years of joining the EU as laid down in the Lisbon treaty. 4: The London stock exchange will move to Frankfurt in 2020 and be integrated into the EU stock exchange resulting in a loss of 200,000 plus jobs in the UK because of the relocation. (This has already been pre-agreed and is only on a holding pattern due to the Brexit negotiations, which if Brexit does happen, the move is fully cancelled - but if not and the UK remains a member it’s full steam ahead for the move.) 5: The EU Parliament and ECJ become supreme over all legislative bodies of the UK. 6: The UK will adopt 100% of whatever the EU Parliament and ECJ lays down without any means of abstention or veto, negating the need for the UK to have the Lords or even the Commons as we know it today. 7: The UK will NOT be able to make its own trade deals. 8: The UK will NOT be able to set its own trade tariffs. 9 The UK will NOT be able to set its own trade quotas. 10: The UK loses control of its fishing rights 11: The UK loses control of its oil and gas rights 12: The UK loses control of its borders and enters the Schengen region by 2022 - as clearly laid down in the Lisbon treaty 13: The UK loses control of its planning legislation 14: The UK loses control of its armed forces including its nuclear deterrent 15: The UK loses full control of its taxation policy 16: The UK loses the ability to create its own laws and to implement them 17: The UK loses its standing in the Commonwealths 18: The UK loses control of any provinces or affiliated nations e.g.: Falklands, Cayman Islands, Gibraltar etc 19: The UK loses control of its judicial system 20: The UK loses control of its international policy 21: The UK loses full control of its national policy 22: The UK loses its right to call itself a nation in its own right. 23: The UK loses control of its space exploration program 24: The UK loses control of its Aviation and Sea lane jurisdiction 25: The UK loses its rebate in 2020 as laid down in the Lisbon treaty 26: The UK’s contribution to the EU is set to increase by an average of 1.2bn pa and by 2.3bn pa by 2020 This is the future that the youths of today think we stole from them? They should be on their knees thanking us for saving them from being turned into Orwellian automatons! Forget Deals no deals its time for remainers and brexiteers to unite and see whats coming before its to late. This is the whole reason they are dragging brexit out. So we can get to 2020 then we have no choices anynore. Is that a serious question? No wonder leavers get the thicko reputation if they believe this kind of shit. From a guy who has spent many pages opining on the yellowhammer document thats a hiliarious lack of self awareness
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Post by Davef on Sept 13, 2019 9:04:20 GMT
Whatever deal Boris comes back with will be voted down just to bring him down and further down the line whatever deal that gets agreed will go to a public vote with the only other option being remain. If Boris loses at the supreme Court next week he'll have to resign as it'll be perceived he lied to the queen and his position will be totally untenable. I wouldn't be so quick to assume that. Ruth Smeeth was in the The Sentinel yesterday apologising for voting down the Withdrawal Agreement. That's either a case of attempting to save her seat in Parliament or an example of the penny finally dropping with MPs that if they vote anything else down we crash out with no deal, regardless of whether they think they've taken it off the table.
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Post by Gary Hackett on Sept 13, 2019 9:12:20 GMT
Whatever deal Boris comes back with will be voted down just to bring him down and further down the line whatever deal that gets agreed will go to a public vote with the only other option being remain. If Boris loses at the supreme Court next week he'll have to resign as it'll be perceived he lied to the queen and his position will be totally untenable. I wouldn't be so quick to assume that. Ruth Smeeth was in the The Sentinel yesterday apologising for voting down the Withdrawal Agreement. That's either a case of attempting to save her seat in Parliament or an example of the penny finally dropping with MPs that if they vote anything else down we crash out with no deal, regardless of whether they think they've taken it off the table. There's only about 16 Labour MP's like Smeeth, Flint, Laura Smith, Snell, Nandy etc from strong leave constituencies that are remotely interested in agreeing any Boris deal purely to save their seats at the next election only weeks away.
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Post by foster on Sept 13, 2019 9:25:29 GMT
Is that a serious question? No wonder leavers get the thicko reputation if they believe this kind of shit. From a guy who has spent many pages opining on the yellowhammer document thats a hiliarious lack of self awareness The two aren't even comparable. Yellowhammer is real and this one obviously isn't. Anyone with 2 braincells can tell this list is a load of bollocks. It doesn't even need dissecting or disproving. ..and I never called anyone 'thick'. I said that anyone who believes that utter nonsense is thick. If anyone takes offence to that then they've likely believed this guff. Edit: Funny how you never replied to either Serpico or Partick who are of a similar opinion.
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Post by foster on Sept 13, 2019 9:29:41 GMT
Yes, let's just add in some token jews, muslims, hindus, black people, homeosexuals and transgender people, just to prove we're not prejudice. Maybe add a couple of chinese in there just to be sure.
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Post by foster on Sept 13, 2019 9:47:11 GMT
Fancy a game of spot the black man?
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Post by partickpotter on Sept 13, 2019 9:48:09 GMT
Good gender balance though to be fair. That said - why on these type of photos are women always front and centre while the men are either back or to the side.
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Post by partickpotter on Sept 13, 2019 9:53:00 GMT
From a guy who has spent many pages opining on the yellowhammer document thats a hiliarious lack of self awareness The two aren't even comparable. Yellowhammer is real and this one obviously isn't. Anyone with 2 braincells can tell this list is a load of bollocks. It doesn't even need dissecting or disproving. ..and I never called anyone 'thick'. I said that anyone who believes that utter nonsense is thick. If anyone takes offence to that then they've likely believed this guff. Edit: Funny how you never replied to either Serpico or Partick who are of a similar opinion. Yellowhammer is a serious (and necessary) document and deserves to be taken seriously. Unfortunately it is being weaponised by Remainers as evidence of how disastrous a No Deal Brexit will be which is disingenuous.
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Post by foster on Sept 13, 2019 9:53:06 GMT
Good gender balance though to be fair. That said - why on these type of photos are women always front and centre while the men are either back or to the side. Mate, it's because men are generally taller. Have you never been in a group photo?
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Post by foster on Sept 13, 2019 9:55:38 GMT
The two aren't even comparable. Yellowhammer is real and this one obviously isn't. Anyone with 2 braincells can tell this list is a load of bollocks. It doesn't even need dissecting or disproving. ..and I never called anyone 'thick'. I said that anyone who believes that utter nonsense is thick. If anyone takes offence to that then they've likely believed this guff. Edit: Funny how you never replied to either Serpico or Partick who are of a similar opinion. Yellowhammer is a serious (and necessary) document and deserves to be taken seriously. Unfortunately it is being weaponised by Remainers as evidence of how disastrous a No Deal Brexit will be which is disingenuous. As you've mentioned plenty of times before mate, there are no rules anymore. The gloves are off on all sides. Just look at that Lisbon treaty list above to see how disingenuous some leavers are to peddle that crap out.
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Post by Northy on Sept 13, 2019 9:58:03 GMT
Just read this on Faceache and its something I have never seen before, The Lisbon Treaty. Is this for real or just a load of old Facebook nonsense ? 1: The UK along with all existing members of the EU lose their abstention veto in 2020 as laid down in the Lisbon Treaty when the system changes to that of majority acceptance with no abstentions or veto’s being allowed. 2: All member nations will become states of the new federal nation of the EU by 2022 as clearly laid out in the Lisbon treaty with no exceptions or veto’s. 3: All member states must adopt the Euro by 2022 and any new member state must do so within 2 years of joining the EU as laid down in the Lisbon treaty. 4: The London stock exchange will move to Frankfurt in 2020 and be integrated into the EU stock exchange resulting in a loss of 200,000 plus jobs in the UK because of the relocation. (This has already been pre-agreed and is only on a holding pattern due to the Brexit negotiations, which if Brexit does happen, the move is fully cancelled - but if not and the UK remains a member it’s full steam ahead for the move.) 5: The EU Parliament and ECJ become supreme over all legislative bodies of the UK. 6: The UK will adopt 100% of whatever the EU Parliament and ECJ lays down without any means of abstention or veto, negating the need for the UK to have the Lords or even the Commons as we know it today. 7: The UK will NOT be able to make its own trade deals. 8: The UK will NOT be able to set its own trade tariffs. 9 The UK will NOT be able to set its own trade quotas. 10: The UK loses control of its fishing rights 11: The UK loses control of its oil and gas rights 12: The UK loses control of its borders and enters the Schengen region by 2022 - as clearly laid down in the Lisbon treaty 13: The UK loses control of its planning legislation 14: The UK loses control of its armed forces including its nuclear deterrent 15: The UK loses full control of its taxation policy 16: The UK loses the ability to create its own laws and to implement them 17: The UK loses its standing in the Commonwealths 18: The UK loses control of any provinces or affiliated nations e.g.: Falklands, Cayman Islands, Gibraltar etc 19: The UK loses control of its judicial system 20: The UK loses control of its international policy 21: The UK loses full control of its national policy 22: The UK loses its right to call itself a nation in its own right. 23: The UK loses control of its space exploration program 24: The UK loses control of its Aviation and Sea lane jurisdiction 25: The UK loses its rebate in 2020 as laid down in the Lisbon treaty 26: The UK’s contribution to the EU is set to increase by an average of 1.2bn pa and by 2.3bn pa by 2020 This is the future that the youths of today think we stole from them? They should be on their knees thanking us for saving them from being turned into Orwellian automatons! Forget Deals no deals its time for remainers and brexiteers to unite and see whats coming before its to late. This is the whole reason they are dragging brexit out. So we can get to 2020 then we have no choices anynore. I’m massively in favour of Brexit and there are plenty of factual reasons to leave. Though none of the above is true. number 1 is true for a start, I was watching a video of guy verhofstadt only this morning explaining it, and how they will push issues onto countries that don't want them like immigration. It will be interesting if they vote to stop the massive costly and environmentally bad monthly move to Strasborg if France objects.
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Post by foster on Sept 13, 2019 10:04:00 GMT
I’m massively in favour of Brexit and there are plenty of factual reasons to leave. Though none of the above is true. number 1 is true for a start, I was watching a video of guy verhofstadt only this morning explaining it, and how they will push issues onto countries that don't want them like immigration. It will be interesting if they vote to stop the massive costly and environmentally bad monthly move to Strasborg if France objects. That list is nothing but a infinitely more obscene version of what leavers call 'project fear'. The worst part of it is that I can imagine a fair few people who don't read up much on these things will believe it. I can imagine the BP handing out flyers with this stuff on at their little gatherings or distributing them through letter boxes.
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Post by Northy on Sept 13, 2019 10:11:00 GMT
number 1 is true for a start, I was watching a video of guy verhofstadt only this morning explaining it, and how they will push issues onto countries that don't want them like immigration. It will be interesting if they vote to stop the massive costly and environmentally bad monthly move to Strasborg if France objects. That list is nothing but a infinitely more obscene version of what leavers call 'project fear'. The worst part of it is that I can imagine a fair few people who don't read up much on these things will believe it. I can imagine the BP handing out flyers with this stuff on at their little gatherings or distributing them through letter boxes. This ones for you the shift from unanimous to majority voting, also a shift from 72% to 55% voting in other areas with country weighting, I other words, shitting on the little guys. www.independent.ie/irish-news/the-lisbon-treaty-for-dummies-26447679.html
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Post by foster on Sept 13, 2019 10:14:43 GMT
That list is nothing but a infinitely more obscene version of what leavers call 'project fear'. The worst part of it is that I can imagine a fair few people who don't read up much on these things will believe it. I can imagine the BP handing out flyers with this stuff on at their little gatherings or distributing them through letter boxes. This ones for you the shift from unanimous to majority voting, also a shift from 72% to 55% voting in other areas with country weighting, I other words, shitting on the little guys. www.independent.ie/irish-news/the-lisbon-treaty-for-dummies-26447679.htmlJust out of principle I'm not going read that! Don't ask me what principle it is, but it's there! But anyway, my points were related to the ridiculous statements in that fictional list. I'm not going to give it anymore time than it deserves.
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Post by partickpotter on Sept 13, 2019 10:27:59 GMT
Yellowhammer is a serious (and necessary) document and deserves to be taken seriously. Unfortunately it is being weaponised by Remainers as evidence of how disastrous a No Deal Brexit will be which is disingenuous. As you've mentioned plenty of times before mate, there are no rules anymore. The gloves are off on all sides. Just look at that Lisbon treaty list above to see how disingenuous some leavers are to peddle that crap out. True. But I think there is a difference between some numpty on Facebook spouting pish who has next to zero influence and politicians who use MSM to spout their pish
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Post by Northy on Sept 13, 2019 10:37:12 GMT
Just out of principle I'm not going read that! Don't ask me what principle it is, but it's there! But anyway, my points were related to the ridiculous statements in that fictional list. I'm not going to give it anymore time than it deserves. bit of a void amongst your list of principles then ?
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Post by foster on Sept 13, 2019 10:57:39 GMT
As you've mentioned plenty of times before mate, there are no rules anymore. The gloves are off on all sides. Just look at that Lisbon treaty list above to see how disingenuous some leavers are to peddle that crap out. True. But I think there is a difference between some numpty on Facebook spouting pish who has next to zero influence and politicians who use MSM to spout their pish Just like there's a difference between people using facts and people using nonsense to state their cases. The arguments to leave the EU (contribution fee, freedom of movement, common market, etc) have been used repeatedly over the past 3 years, as have the arguments to remain. There is no difference really. You can't really argue that any side has been totally honest with how they've portrayed potential consequences or benefits of either. If you're going to make a case then at least it should relate to some kind of factual information. My point here was that the list above is mostly made up of untruths which have no foundation.
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Post by foster on Sept 13, 2019 10:58:38 GMT
Just out of principle I'm not going read that! Don't ask me what principle it is, but it's there! But anyway, my points were related to the ridiculous statements in that fictional list. I'm not going to give it anymore time than it deserves. bit of a void amongst your list of principles then ? You've lost me mate. I think you're doing what someone stated yesterday was a strawman argument. Nothing related to the original point of discussion.
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Post by serpico on Sept 13, 2019 11:30:18 GMT
It’s a load of shite. If you’re interested, the excellent Full Fact dissected it: link🙂
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Post by foster on Sept 13, 2019 11:33:18 GMT
Seems to be a slow day in the world of Brexit.
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Post by serpico on Sept 13, 2019 11:44:54 GMT
Whatever deal Boris comes back with will be voted down just to bring him down and further down the line whatever deal that gets agreed will go to a public vote with the only other option being remain. If Boris loses at the supreme Court next week he'll have to resign as it'll be perceived he lied to the queen and his position will be totally untenable. I wouldn't be so quick to assume that. Ruth Smeeth was in the The Sentinel yesterday apologising for voting down the Withdrawal Agreement. That's either a case of attempting to save her seat in Parliament or an example of the penny finally dropping with MPs that if they vote anything else down we crash out with no deal, regardless of whether they think they've taken it off the table. Yeh, it might squeak through if there’s a vote before an election. What was it short last time, about 26 ? but I wonder how many are emboldened enough to vote it down in the hope brexit can still be reversed ?
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Post by claytonscrubs on Sept 13, 2019 12:51:29 GMT
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Post by rogerjonesisgod on Sept 13, 2019 13:19:16 GMT
Met drop criminal investigation into overspending by Leave.EU
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Post by henry on Sept 13, 2019 13:32:07 GMT
Seems to be a slow day in the world of Brexit. Busy behind the scenes The EU have to give GB interested in doing a deal Hopefully deal by the end of the week Friday announcement possible We may or may not leave the EU Regards Davesviews
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Post by Davef on Sept 13, 2019 13:35:30 GMT
Seems to be a slow day in the world of Brexit. Busy behind the scenes The EU have to give GB interested in doing a deal Hopefully deal by the end of the week Friday announcement possible We may or may not leave the EU Regards Davesviews Daviddaviesviews
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Post by Northy on Sept 13, 2019 14:30:35 GMT
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Post by serpico on Sept 13, 2019 14:32:36 GMT
Met drop criminal investigation into overspending by Leave.EU The attempts to stop brexit or cast illegitimacy on it post referendum are very similar to the attempts to bring trump down post 2016 election, from various courts cases to claims about Russian involvement, these people have thrown everything at stopping brexit.
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Post by Northy on Sept 13, 2019 14:35:06 GMT
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