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Post by chuffedstokie on Nov 28, 2019 0:50:21 GMT
Divine Comedy.
Absent Friends.
Great bit of orchestration, nice and loud.
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Post by musik on Nov 28, 2019 4:11:01 GMT
"Rifle range" - Blondie
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Post by felonious on Nov 28, 2019 20:55:22 GMT
First and only time she's performed this live, I'm steadily coming round to the belief that it's quite possibly the best album of the last 20 years ... I've had 3 listens now after this heavy recommend and it's a thoroughly decent album. Fantastic start with the first three tracks but to be fair there's a high standard throughout. Like a lot of people out there I've got Born to die but outside of the top three tracks I wasn't too enamoured but this album is on another level. Have the albums in between been improving Paul?
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Post by felonious on Nov 29, 2019 19:58:02 GMT
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Post by felonious on Nov 29, 2019 20:06:24 GMT
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Post by felonious on Nov 29, 2019 20:14:35 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Nov 29, 2019 20:19:20 GMT
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Post by felonious on Nov 29, 2019 20:23:50 GMT
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Post by felonious on Nov 29, 2019 20:30:43 GMT
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Post by Gunslinger on Nov 29, 2019 20:33:32 GMT
Jaz Coleman: Magna Invocatio
This is Jaz' symphonic interpretation of Killing Joke songs.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 29, 2019 21:43:26 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Nov 30, 2019 6:53:10 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Nov 30, 2019 12:29:32 GMT
Always had a massive soft spot. Takes me right back to High school!
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Post by innocentbystander on Nov 30, 2019 21:21:43 GMT
Thoroughly absorbing story of the Stones chaotic and ultimately horrific Altamont gig, told by just about everyone involved in the attempt. www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/m000btwh
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Post by Paul Spencer on Dec 1, 2019 13:44:34 GMT
First and only time she's performed this live, I'm steadily coming round to the belief that it's quite possibly the best album of the last 20 years ... I've had 3 listens now after this heavy recommend and it's a thoroughly decent album. Fantastic start with the first three tracks but to be fair there's a high standard throughout. Like a lot of people out there I've got Born to die but outside of the top three tracks I wasn't too enamoured but this album is on another level. Have the albums in between been improving Paul? I'm afraid that that's a far from straightforward answer felonious and unfortunately I don't think I can answer that question without giving you a very long answer - I apologise in advance! I think, I, like most people first became aware of Lana del Rey on hearing 'Video Games' for the first time, it stood out on the radio, head and shoulders above anything else on the airwaves at the time and I and millions of others couldn't wait for the album to come out. Thing is, I found it to be a real let down - it was horrendously produced! There's horrible snare sounds throughout, cheesy drum loops, dreadful little vocal samples, harsh reverb's, the whole thing is an over produced, look at me wank fest from the producer (Emile Haynie). The incredible songs are buried under an avalanche of completely unnecessary production techniques but somehow, miraculously, they still managed to shine through, I guess it's a testament to how good the songs actually were in the first place. The best produced track on the album is 'Video Games' by a country mile but that was recorded way before Interscope (and then Haynie) got involved. They had the fuckin' blueprint for the album right in front of them and then they royally fucked it up! If (say) Portishead had been given the production duties, then I suspect it would have turned out to be a completely different animal. There was a few years (principally after Ultraviolence and Honeymoon had come out) when I could no longer listen to it, it was a tough ask once I had found 'true' Lana! I would love to hear 'Born To Die' remixed by Jack Antonoff (the producer of NFR), I'm sure it would blow peoples minds but I accept the chance of this happening is slim to none. I'd give the album 7/10 at best. However I also accept that it has now been in the Billboard charts for over 300 weeks, the only two other albums by females artists to achieve that feat in the whole history of music, are Tapestry and 21, so probably best to consider my previous comments as complete bollocks! On the back of the success of 'Born To Die', it's producer, Emile Haynie was given his own album, below is the lead track from it, you can see how it very much sounds like something on 'Born To Die' the problem being, that it doesn't have Lana's great songwriting as the core element and it really is a truly awful recording! 'Paradise' was really just an extension of 'Born To Die', released later the same year and it suffered the same problems with the production, however the songs weren't as strong. The exception being 'Ride', the only track on the album produced by Rick Rubin. I don't know in what order the tracks were produced but if 'Ride' was one of the first ones to be completed, I don't know why they didn't give Rubin the entire album, the track sounded completely different to anything else on the album or it's predecessor. 6/10 overall. Thankfully Del Rey switched producers for next record 'Ultraviolence', as Dan Auerbach from the Black Keys was given the controls. Gone were all the nasty production techniques that had marred the first album. I immediately loved it, it was almost a total relief, that finally, the songs were being given the space to breath in, that faux trip hop sound had almost disappeared completely, this was more of a desert rock gig and Auberbach seemed to have far more empathy with what Del Rey was all about. I'm not sure that the album as a whole has her strongest songs on it but it does have some sublime moments. 'West Coast' is like that track that Billie Eilish might get to make as the pinnacle of her career at some point in the future and 'Pretty When You Cry' was real Lana, you can really feel her pain! For me the best producers are the ones you don't notice and that is exactly what happens on 'Ultraviolence', it was the complete opposite of 'Born To Die', with Auerbach operating discretely in the background, simply providing Del Rey the platform to do her stuff on. A solid 8/10. Next came 'Honeymoon'. Long time song writing partner Rick Nowels was given the production duties for this record and blimey it's incredible! 'Honeymoon' is like the grown up version of 'Born To Die,' the songs are better, the production is a return in style to that baroque pop of the first album but without all the garish production techniques that had ruined her major label debut. It was becoming increasingly clear that with Lana Del Rey, less (production) clearly equals more. Once you heard the opening bars to the album's first track you knew that, wow! Lana Del Rey had finally arrived, this is it, this is the point that all the roads had been leading to her entire career, for the first time we were hearing what she was truly all about. Every single track on the album is magnificent. I remember hearing 'Terrence Loves You' for the first time and thinking it was as good as anything Kate Bush had ever done, we were witnessing a true genius at work. Could you imagine Emile Haynie (the producer of Born To Die) being given this song, he would have totally destroyed it with a barrage of unnecessary production techniques! For me it was one of the best albums of the decade, a unique, cinematic sound and some unbelievably brilliant songs. Prior to 'NFR' it would have been a clear 10/10 but that album has knocked even this masterpiece down a mark. 9/10So we'd had two great albums following 'Born To Die/Paradise', fantastically produced, surely Lana's a&r and her management knew now what was required and they were on a roll, what could possibly go wrong? 'Lust For Life' the next album, was what could go wrong, it was absolutely awful! Absolutely outstanding songs, completely ruined by overproduction, as well as the addition of completely inappropriate guest stars! Emile Haynie (that horrible producer from 'Born To Die' was back on production duties for the lead track 'Love' and unsurprisingly, completely ruined it. 'Lust For Life' is a duet with the Weeknd (who I love in his own right) but this is just wishy washy, dreary pop shite. '13 Beaches' is one of the best songs on the album but is again horribly over produced. 'Summer Bummer' and 'White Mustang' are amazing songs but are destroyed by horrendous production, one after the next, sublime songs completely ruined by terrible production! And don't get me started on the guest stars! Jeez ... I'm not sure that Del Rey needs to be doing duets with anybody but if she is going to share vocal duties, then at least please get Matt Berninger or somebody similar in the vocal booth. The ASAP Rocky appearances just sound so ridiculously out of place, I love Stevie Nicks but 'Beautiful People, Beautiful Problems' is just cheestastic bollocks and the Sean Ono Lennon collaboration is vomit inducing. It doesn't really feel like a Lana album but rather just a mish mash of misguided, egotistical a&r/management led bollocks - such a disappointment. That's not to say that it does not have some special moments in Heroin and Change but still overall just a 6/10. So as I said at the start, it wasn't ever going to be a straight forward answer to your question, apologies for the length of the answer I came up with.
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Post by mickmillslovechild on Dec 1, 2019 14:13:00 GMT
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Post by heyzeus on Dec 1, 2019 15:41:03 GMT
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Post by Paul Spencer on Dec 2, 2019 10:39:39 GMT
Jaz Coleman: Magna Invocatio This is Jaz' symphonic interpretation of Killing Joke songs. I wasn't aware of this before, absolutely brilliant ... thanks for the heads up! 👍
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Post by Gary Hackett on Dec 2, 2019 13:32:52 GMT
Try this :
Better than the original Frightened Rabbit version.
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Post by Gary Hackett on Dec 2, 2019 13:55:11 GMT
I've had 3 listens now after this heavy recommend and it's a thoroughly decent album. Fantastic start with the first three tracks but to be fair there's a high standard throughout. Like a lot of people out there I've got Born to die but outside of the top three tracks I wasn't too enamoured but this album is on another level. Have the albums in between been improving Paul? I'm afraid that that's a far from straightforward answer felonious and unfortunately I don't think I can answer that question without giving you a very long answer - I apologise in advance! I think, I, like most people first became aware of Lana del Rey on hearing 'Video Games' for the first time, it stood out on the radio, head and shoulders above anything else on the airwaves at the time and I and millions of others couldn't wait for the album to come out. Thing is, I found it to be a real let down - it was horrendously produced! There's horrible snare sounds throughout, cheesy drum loops, dreadful little vocal samples, harsh reverb's, the whole thing is an over produced, look at me wank fest from the producer (Emile Haynie). The incredible songs are buried under an avalanche of completely unnecessary production techniques but somehow, miraculously, they still managed to shine through, I guess it's a testament to how good the songs actually were in the first place. The best produced track on the album is 'Video Games' by a country mile but that was recorded way before Interscope (and then Haynie) got involved. They had the fuckin' blueprint for the album right in front of them and then they royally fucked it up! If (say) Portishead had been given the production duties, then I suspect it would have turned out to be a completely different animal. There was a few years (principally after Ultraviolence and Honeymoon had come out) when I could no longer listen to it, it was a tough ask once I had found 'true' Lana! I would love to hear 'Born To Die' remixed by Jack Antonoff (the producer of NFR), I'm sure it would blow peoples minds but I accept the chance of this happening is slim to none. I'd give the album 7/10 at best. However I also accept that it has now been in the Billboard charts for over 300 weeks, the only two other albums by females artists to achieve that feat in the whole history of music, are Tapestry and 21, so probably best to consider my previous comments as complete bollocks! On the back of the success of 'Born To Die', it's producer, Emile Haynie was given his own album, below is the lead track from it, you can see how it very much sounds like something on 'Born To Die' the problem being, that it doesn't have Lana's great songwriting as the core element and it really is a truly awful recording! 'Paradise' was really just an extension of 'Born To Die', released later the same year and it suffered the same problems with the production, however the songs weren't as strong. The exception being 'Ride', the only track on the album produced by Rick Rubin. I don't know in what order the tracks were produced but if 'Ride' was one of the first ones to be completed, I don't know why they didn't give Rubin the entire album, the track sounded completely different to anything else on the album or it's predecessor. 6/10 overall. Thankfully Del Rey switched producers for next record 'Ultraviolence', as Dan Auerbach from the Black Keys was given the controls. Gone were all the nasty production techniques that had marred the first album. I immediately loved it, it was almost a total relief, that finally, the songs were being given the space to breath in, that faux trip hop sound had almost disappeared completely, this was more of a desert rock gig and Auberbach seemed to have far more empathy with what Del Rey was all about. I'm not sure that the album as a whole has her strongest songs on it but it does have some sublime moments. 'West Coast' is like that track that Billie Eilish might get to make as the pinnacle of her career at some point in the future and 'Pretty When You Cry' was real Lana, you can really feel her pain! For me the best producers are the ones you don't notice and that is exactly what happens on 'Ultraviolence', it was the complete opposite of 'Born To Die', with Auerbach operating discretely in the background, simply providing Del Rey the platform to do her stuff on. A solid 8/10. Next came 'Honeymoon'. Long time song writing partner Rick Nowels was given the production duties for this record and blimey it's incredible! 'Honeymoon' is like the grown up version of 'Born To Die,' the songs are better, the production is a return in style to that baroque pop of the first album but without all the garish production techniques that had ruined her major label debut. It was becoming increasingly clear that with Lana Del Rey, less (production) clearly equals more. Once you heard the opening bars to the album's first track you knew that, wow! Lana Del Rey had finally arrived, this is it, this is the point that all the roads had been leading to her entire career, for the first time we were hearing what she was truly all about. Every single track on the album is magnificent. I remember hearing 'Terrence Loves You' for the first time and thinking it was as good as anything Kate Bush had ever done, we were witnessing a true genius at work. Could you imagine Emile Haynie (the producer of Born To Die) being given this song, he would have totally destroyed it with a barrage of unnecessary production techniques! For me it was one of the best albums of the decade, a unique, cinematic sound and some unbelievably brilliant songs. Prior to 'NFR' it would have been a clear 10/10 but that album has knocked even this masterpiece down a mark. 9/10So we'd had two great albums following 'Born To Die/Paradise', fantastically produced, surely Lana's a&r and her management knew now what was required and they were on a roll, what could possible go wrong? 'Lust For Life' the next album, was what could go wrong, it was absolutely awful! Absolutely outstanding songs, completely ruined by overproduction, as well as the addition of completely inappropriate guest stars! Emile Haynie (that horrible producer from 'Born To Die' was back on production duties for the lead track 'Love' and unsurprisingly, completely ruined it. 'Lust For Life' is a duet with the Weeknd (who I love in his own right) but this is just wishy washy, dreary pop shite. '13 Beaches' is one of the best songs on the album but is again horribly over produced. 'Summer Bummer' and 'White Mustang' are amazing songs but are destroyed by horrendous production, one after the next, sublime songs completely ruined by terrible production! And don't get me started on the guest stars! Jeez ... I'm not sure that Del Rey needs to be doing duets with anybody but if she is going to share vocal duties, then at least please get Matt Berninger or somebody similar in the vocal booth. The ASAP Rocky appearances just sound so ridiculously out of place, I love Stevie Nicks but 'Beautiful People, Beautiful Problems' is just cheestastic bollocks and the Sean Ono Lennon collaboration is vomit inducing. It doesn't really feel like a Lana album but rather just a mish mash of misguided, egotistical a&r/management led bollocks - such a disappointment. That's not to say that it does have some special moments in Heroin and Change but still overall just a 6/10. So as I said at the start, it wasn't ever going to be a straight forward answer to your question, apologies for the length of the answer I came up with. I think you're being very harsh regarding the production on the 1st album. I think the reason the album is so good is because of the production techniques. National anthem and Radio are two of my favourite songs from the past 10 years, I really like the over production on them. I'd also argue that without the difference the production made on that album she wouldn't have made the massive breakthrough at that time. If she's have gone straight to Honeymoon style on born to die I doubt the interest would have been there and she'd have struggled in the over crowded singer songwriter market. As to Honeymoon it's no surprise its a good album thanks to Rick Nowels input. He's produced / written some of the best songs from two of my favourite female solo artists - Belinda Carlisle and Dido so it was always going to be a perfect match. I haven't seen her live yet but I'm going on February, looking forward to it.
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Post by Clayton Wood on Dec 2, 2019 13:57:16 GMT
Harry Potter plays it pretty for them
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Post by Gunslinger on Dec 2, 2019 14:09:32 GMT
Jaz Coleman: Magna Invocatio This is Jaz' symphonic interpretation of Killing Joke songs. I wasn't aware of this before, absolutely brilliant ... thanks for the heads up! 👍 It was released just a couple of days ago - a fantastic album. It's incredible that Jaz can switch from being a complete madman on stage one day to a classic composer the next day. If you're a Killing Joke fan then it's also worth noting the photographic book which was released earlier this year (in case you haven't seen this): Twilight Of The Mortals
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Post by jimmygscfc on Dec 2, 2019 16:26:02 GMT
I've had 3 listens now after this heavy recommend and it's a thoroughly decent album. Fantastic start with the first three tracks but to be fair there's a high standard throughout. Like a lot of people out there I've got Born to die but outside of the top three tracks I wasn't too enamoured but this album is on another level. Have the albums in between been improving Paul? I'm afraid that that's a far from straightforward answer felonious and unfortunately I don't think I can answer that question without giving you a very long answer - I apologise in advance! I think, I, like most people first became aware of Lana del Rey on hearing 'Video Games' for the first time, it stood out on the radio, head and shoulders above anything else on the airwaves at the time and I and millions of others couldn't wait for the album to come out. Thing is, I found it to be a real let down - it was horrendously produced! There's horrible snare sounds throughout, cheesy drum loops, dreadful little vocal samples, harsh reverb's, the whole thing is an over produced, look at me wank fest from the producer (Emile Haynie). The incredible songs are buried under an avalanche of completely unnecessary production techniques but somehow, miraculously, they still managed to shine through, I guess it's a testament to how good the songs actually were in the first place. The best produced track on the album is 'Video Games' by a country mile but that was recorded way before Interscope (and then Haynie) got involved. They had the fuckin' blueprint for the album right in front of them and then they royally fucked it up! If (say) Portishead had been given the production duties, then I suspect it would have turned out to be a completely different animal. There was a few years (principally after Ultraviolence and Honeymoon had come out) when I could no longer listen to it, it was a tough ask once I had found 'true' Lana! I would love to hear 'Born To Die' remixed by Jack Antonoff (the producer of NFR), I'm sure it would blow peoples minds but I accept the chance of this happening is slim to none. I'd give the album 7/10 at best. However I also accept that it has now been in the Billboard charts for over 300 weeks, the only two other albums by females artists to achieve that feat in the whole history of music, are Tapestry and 21, so probably best to consider my previous comments as complete bollocks! On the back of the success of 'Born To Die', it's producer, Emile Haynie was given his own album, below is the lead track from it, you can see how it very much sounds like something on 'Born To Die' the problem being, that it doesn't have Lana's great songwriting as the core element and it really is a truly awful recording! 'Paradise' was really just an extension of 'Born To Die', released later the same year and it suffered the same problems with the production, however the songs weren't as strong. The exception being 'Ride', the only track on the album produced by Rick Rubin. I don't know in what order the tracks were produced but if 'Ride' was one of the first ones to be completed, I don't know why they didn't give Rubin the entire album, the track sounded completely different to anything else on the album or it's predecessor. 6/10 overall. Thankfully Del Rey switched producers for next record 'Ultraviolence', as Dan Auerbach from the Black Keys was given the controls. Gone were all the nasty production techniques that had marred the first album. I immediately loved it, it was almost a total relief, that finally, the songs were being given the space to breath in, that faux trip hop sound had almost disappeared completely, this was more of a desert rock gig and Auberbach seemed to have far more empathy with what Del Rey was all about. I'm not sure that the album as a whole has her strongest songs on it but it does have some sublime moments. 'West Coast' is like that track that Billie Eilish might get to make as the pinnacle of her career at some point in the future and 'Pretty When You Cry' was real Lana, you can really feel her pain! For me the best producers are the ones you don't notice and that is exactly what happens on 'Ultraviolence', it was the complete opposite of 'Born To Die', with Auerbach operating discretely in the background, simply providing Del Rey the platform to do her stuff on. A solid 8/10. Next came 'Honeymoon'. Long time song writing partner Rick Nowels was given the production duties for this record and blimey it's incredible! 'Honeymoon' is like the grown up version of 'Born To Die,' the songs are better, the production is a return in style to that baroque pop of the first album but without all the garish production techniques that had ruined her major label debut. It was becoming increasingly clear that with Lana Del Rey, less (production) clearly equals more. Once you heard the opening bars to the album's first track you knew that, wow! Lana Del Rey had finally arrived, this is it, this is the point that all the roads had been leading to her entire career, for the first time we were hearing what she was truly all about. Every single track on the album is magnificent. I remember hearing 'Terrence Loves You' for the first time and thinking it was as good as anything Kate Bush had ever done, we were witnessing a true genius at work. Could you imagine Emile Haynie (the producer of Born To Die) being given this song, he would have totally destroyed it with a barrage of unnecessary production techniques! For me it was one of the best albums of the decade, a unique, cinematic sound and some unbelievably brilliant songs. Prior to 'NFR' it would have been a clear 10/10 but that album has knocked even this masterpiece down a mark. 9/10So we'd had two great albums following 'Born To Die/Paradise', fantastically produced, surely Lana's a&r and her management knew now what was required and they were on a roll, what could possible go wrong? 'Lust For Life' the next album, was what could go wrong, it was absolutely awful! Absolutely outstanding songs, completely ruined by overproduction, as well as the addition of completely inappropriate guest stars! Emile Haynie (that horrible producer from 'Born To Die' was back on production duties for the lead track 'Love' and unsurprisingly, completely ruined it. 'Lust For Life' is a duet with the Weeknd (who I love in his own right) but this is just wishy washy, dreary pop shite. '13 Beaches' is one of the best songs on the album but is again horribly over produced. 'Summer Bummer' and 'White Mustang' are amazing songs but are destroyed by horrendous production, one after the next, sublime songs completely ruined by terrible production! And don't get me started on the guest stars! Jeez ... I'm not sure that Del Rey needs to be doing duets with anybody but if she is going to share vocal duties, then at least please get Matt Berninger or somebody similar in the vocal booth. The ASAP Rocky appearances just sound so ridiculously out of place, I love Stevie Nicks but 'Beautiful People, Beautiful Problems' is just cheestastic bollocks and the Sean Ono Lennon collaboration is vomit inducing. It doesn't really feel like a Lana album but rather just a mish mash of misguided, egotistical a&r/management led bollocks - such a disappointment. That's not to say that it does have some special moments in Heroin and Change but still overall just a 6/10. So as I said at the start, it wasn't ever going to be a straight forward answer to your question, apologies for the length of the answer I came up with. I think we need to stop asking Paul, Lana-related questions as I'm concerned about his fragile state of mind
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Post by Paul Spencer on Dec 2, 2019 17:33:33 GMT
Got tickets this morning for their Hyde Park show next summer, so we've got Ten on!
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Post by Paul Spencer on Dec 2, 2019 17:50:30 GMT
I'm afraid that that's a far from straightforward answer felonious and unfortunately I don't think I can answer that question without giving you a very long answer - I apologise in advance! I think, I, like most people first became aware of Lana del Rey on hearing 'Video Games' for the first time, it stood out on the radio, head and shoulders above anything else on the airwaves at the time and I and millions of others couldn't wait for the album to come out. Thing is, I found it to be a real let down - it was horrendously produced! There's horrible snare sounds throughout, cheesy drum loops, dreadful little vocal samples, harsh reverb's, the whole thing is an over produced, look at me wank fest from the producer (Emile Haynie). The incredible songs are buried under an avalanche of completely unnecessary production techniques but somehow, miraculously, they still managed to shine through, I guess it's a testament to how good the songs actually were in the first place. The best produced track on the album is 'Video Games' by a country mile but that was recorded way before Interscope (and then Haynie) got involved. They had the fuckin' blueprint for the album right in front of them and then they royally fucked it up! If (say) Portishead had been given the production duties, then I suspect it would have turned out to be a completely different animal. There was a few years (principally after Ultraviolence and Honeymoon had come out) when I could no longer listen to it, it was a tough ask once I had found 'true' Lana! I would love to hear 'Born To Die' remixed by Jack Antonoff (the producer of NFR), I'm sure it would blow peoples minds but I accept the chance of this happening is slim to none. I'd give the album 7/10 at best. However I also accept that it has now been in the Billboard charts for over 300 weeks, the only two other albums by females artists to achieve that feat in the whole history of music, are Tapestry and 21, so probably best to consider my previous comments as complete bollocks! On the back of the success of 'Born To Die', it's producer, Emile Haynie was given his own album, below is the lead track from it, you can see how it very much sounds like something on 'Born To Die' the problem being, that it doesn't have Lana's great songwriting as the core element and it really is a truly awful recording! 'Paradise' was really just an extension of 'Born To Die', released later the same year and it suffered the same problems with the production, however the songs weren't as strong. The exception being 'Ride', the only track on the album produced by Rick Rubin. I don't know in what order the tracks were produced but if 'Ride' was one of the first ones to be completed, I don't know why they didn't give Rubin the entire album, the track sounded completely different to anything else on the album or it's predecessor. 6/10 overall. Thankfully Del Rey switched producers for next record 'Ultraviolence', as Dan Auerbach from the Black Keys was given the controls. Gone were all the nasty production techniques that had marred the first album. I immediately loved it, it was almost a total relief, that finally, the songs were being given the space to breath in, that faux trip hop sound had almost disappeared completely, this was more of a desert rock gig and Auberbach seemed to have far more empathy with what Del Rey was all about. I'm not sure that the album as a whole has her strongest songs on it but it does have some sublime moments. 'West Coast' is like that track that Billie Eilish might get to make as the pinnacle of her career at some point in the future and 'Pretty When You Cry' was real Lana, you can really feel her pain! For me the best producers are the ones you don't notice and that is exactly what happens on 'Ultraviolence', it was the complete opposite of 'Born To Die', with Auerbach operating discretely in the background, simply providing Del Rey the platform to do her stuff on. A solid 8/10. Next came 'Honeymoon'. Long time song writing partner Rick Nowels was given the production duties for this record and blimey it's incredible! 'Honeymoon' is like the grown up version of 'Born To Die,' the songs are better, the production is a return in style to that baroque pop of the first album but without all the garish production techniques that had ruined her major label debut. It was becoming increasingly clear that with Lana Del Rey, less (production) clearly equals more. Once you heard the opening bars to the album's first track you knew that, wow! Lana Del Rey had finally arrived, this is it, this is the point that all the roads had been leading to her entire career, for the first time we were hearing what she was truly all about. Every single track on the album is magnificent. I remember hearing 'Terrence Loves You' for the first time and thinking it was as good as anything Kate Bush had ever done, we were witnessing a true genius at work. Could you imagine Emile Haynie (the producer of Born To Die) being given this song, he would have totally destroyed it with a barrage of unnecessary production techniques! For me it was one of the best albums of the decade, a unique, cinematic sound and some unbelievably brilliant songs. Prior to 'NFR' it would have been a clear 10/10 but that album has knocked even this masterpiece down a mark. 9/10So we'd had two great albums following 'Born To Die/Paradise', fantastically produced, surely Lana's a&r and her management knew now what was required and they were on a roll, what could possible go wrong? 'Lust For Life' the next album, was what could go wrong, it was absolutely awful! Absolutely outstanding songs, completely ruined by overproduction, as well as the addition of completely inappropriate guest stars! Emile Haynie (that horrible producer from 'Born To Die' was back on production duties for the lead track 'Love' and unsurprisingly, completely ruined it. 'Lust For Life' is a duet with the Weeknd (who I love in his own right) but this is just wishy washy, dreary pop shite. '13 Beaches' is one of the best songs on the album but is again horribly over produced. 'Summer Bummer' and 'White Mustang' are amazing songs but are destroyed by horrendous production, one after the next, sublime songs completely ruined by terrible production! And don't get me started on the guest stars! Jeez ... I'm not sure that Del Rey needs to be doing duets with anybody but if she is going to share vocal duties, then at least please get Matt Berninger or somebody similar in the vocal booth. The ASAP Rocky appearances just sound so ridiculously out of place, I love Stevie Nicks but 'Beautiful People, Beautiful Problems' is just cheestastic bollocks and the Sean Ono Lennon collaboration is vomit inducing. It doesn't really feel like a Lana album but rather just a mish mash of misguided, egotistical a&r/management led bollocks - such a disappointment. That's not to say that it does have some special moments in Heroin and Change but still overall just a 6/10. So as I said at the start, it wasn't ever going to be a straight forward answer to your question, apologies for the length of the answer I came up with. I think you're being very harsh regarding the production on the 1st album. I think the reason the album is so good is because of the production techniques. National anthem and Radio are two of my favourite songs from the past 10 years, I really like the over production on them. I'd also argue that without the difference the production made on that album she wouldn't have made the massive breakthrough at that time. If she's have gone straight to Honeymoon style on born to die I doubt the interest would have been there and she'd have struggled in the over crowded singer songwriter market. As to Honeymoon it's no surprise its a good album thanks to Rick Nowels input. He's produced / written some of the best songs from two of my favourite female solo artists - Belinda Carlisle and Dido so it was always going to be a perfect match. I haven't seen her live yet but I'm going on February, looking forward to it. While I respect your opinion Mark, you of course like what you like. My opinion about the production is of course totally imho and I did say, that it should probably be treated as a load of bollocks, in light of the album's success. However I don't think your argument about her not making a breakthrough without that type of production really stands up, as it was 'Video Games' that gave her her massive worldwide breakthrough and that's the only track on the album that ISN'T over produced, indeed it was recorded and mixed before Interscope even got involved.
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Post by felonious on Dec 2, 2019 18:58:12 GMT
I'm afraid that that's a far from straightforward answer felonious and unfortunately I don't think I can answer that question without giving you a very long answer - I apologise in advance! I think, I, like most people first became aware of Lana del Rey on hearing 'Video Games' for the first time, it stood out on the radio, head and shoulders above anything else on the airwaves at the time and I and millions of others couldn't wait for the album to come out. Thing is, I found it to be a real let down - it was horrendously produced! There's horrible snare sounds throughout, cheesy drum loops, dreadful little vocal samples, harsh reverb's, the whole thing is an over produced, look at me wank fest from the producer (Emile Haynie). The incredible songs are buried under an avalanche of completely unnecessary production techniques but somehow, miraculously, they still managed to shine through, I guess it's a testament to how good the songs actually were in the first place. The best produced track on the album is 'Video Games' by a country mile but that was recorded way before Interscope (and then Haynie) got involved. They had the fuckin' blueprint for the album right in front of them and then they royally fucked it up! If (say) Portishead had been given the production duties, then I suspect it would have turned out to be a completely different animal. There was a few years (principally after Ultraviolence and Honeymoon had come out) when I could no longer listen to it, it was a tough ask once I had found 'true' Lana! I would love to hear 'Born To Die' remixed by Jack Antonoff (the producer of NFR), I'm sure it would blow peoples minds but I accept the chance of this happening is slim to none. I'd give the album 7/10 at best. However I also accept that it has now been in the Billboard charts for over 300 weeks, the only two other albums by females artists to achieve that feat in the whole history of music, are Tapestry and 21, so probably best to consider my previous comments as complete bollocks! On the back of the success of 'Born To Die', it's producer, Emile Haynie was given his own album, below is the lead track from it, you can see how it very much sounds like something on 'Born To Die' the problem being, that it doesn't have Lana's great songwriting as the core element and it really is a truly awful recording! 'Paradise' was really just an extension of 'Born To Die', released later the same year and it suffered the same problems with the production, however the songs weren't as strong. The exception being 'Ride', the only track on the album produced by Rick Rubin. I don't know in what order the tracks were produced but if 'Ride' was one of the first ones to be completed, I don't know why they didn't give Rubin the entire album, the track sounded completely different to anything else on the album or it's predecessor. 6/10 overall. Thankfully Del Rey switched producers for next record 'Ultraviolence', as Dan Auerbach from the Black Keys was given the controls. Gone were all the nasty production techniques that had marred the first album. I immediately loved it, it was almost a total relief, that finally, the songs were being given the space to breath in, that faux trip hop sound had almost disappeared completely, this was more of a desert rock gig and Auberbach seemed to have far more empathy with what Del Rey was all about. I'm not sure that the album as a whole has her strongest songs on it but it does have some sublime moments. 'West Coast' is like that track that Billie Eilish might get to make as the pinnacle of her career at some point in the future and 'Pretty When You Cry' was real Lana, you can really feel her pain! For me the best producers are the ones you don't notice and that is exactly what happens on 'Ultraviolence', it was the complete opposite of 'Born To Die', with Auerbach operating discretely in the background, simply providing Del Rey the platform to do her stuff on. A solid 8/10. Next came 'Honeymoon'. Long time song writing partner Rick Nowels was given the production duties for this record and blimey it's incredible! 'Honeymoon' is like the grown up version of 'Born To Die,' the songs are better, the production is a return in style to that baroque pop of the first album but without all the garish production techniques that had ruined her major label debut. It was becoming increasingly clear that with Lana Del Rey, less (production) clearly equals more. Once you heard the opening bars to the album's first track you knew that, wow! Lana Del Rey had finally arrived, this is it, this is the point that all the roads had been leading to her entire career, for the first time we were hearing what she was truly all about. Every single track on the album is magnificent. I remember hearing 'Terrence Loves You' for the first time and thinking it was as good as anything Kate Bush had ever done, we were witnessing a true genius at work. Could you imagine Emile Haynie (the producer of Born To Die) being given this song, he would have totally destroyed it with a barrage of unnecessary production techniques! For me it was one of the best albums of the decade, a unique, cinematic sound and some unbelievably brilliant songs. Prior to 'NFR' it would have been a clear 10/10 but that album has knocked even this masterpiece down a mark. 9/10So we'd had two great albums following 'Born To Die/Paradise', fantastically produced, surely Lana's a&r and her management knew now what was required and they were on a roll, what could possible go wrong? 'Lust For Life' the next album, was what could go wrong, it was absolutely awful! Absolutely outstanding songs, completely ruined by overproduction, as well as the addition of completely inappropriate guest stars! Emile Haynie (that horrible producer from 'Born To Die' was back on production duties for the lead track 'Love' and unsurprisingly, completely ruined it. 'Lust For Life' is a duet with the Weeknd (who I love in his own right) but this is just wishy washy, dreary pop shite. '13 Beaches' is one of the best songs on the album but is again horribly over produced. 'Summer Bummer' and 'White Mustang' are amazing songs but are destroyed by horrendous production, one after the next, sublime songs completely ruined by terrible production! And don't get me started on the guest stars! Jeez ... I'm not sure that Del Rey needs to be doing duets with anybody but if she is going to share vocal duties, then at least please get Matt Berninger or somebody similar in the vocal booth. The ASAP Rocky appearances just sound so ridiculously out of place, I love Stevie Nicks but 'Beautiful People, Beautiful Problems' is just cheestastic bollocks and the Sean Ono Lennon collaboration is vomit inducing. It doesn't really feel like a Lana album but rather just a mish mash of misguided, egotistical a&r/management led bollocks - such a disappointment. That's not to say that it does have some special moments in Heroin and Change but still overall just a 6/10. So as I said at the start, it wasn't ever going to be a straight forward answer to your question, apologies for the length of the answer I came up with. I think we need to stop asking Paul, Lana-related questions as I'm concerned about his fragile state of mind To be fair to him Jimmy it is an outrageously good album with not a duff track on there..... it's even got the 9 minute track that you don't want to end, from 3 to 9 minutes it's pretty perfect music to listen to. I love it when someone waxes lyrical about their favourite artist even one as hot as Lana These serious female artists always push us to the limit I'm thinking Kate Bush's elfin face faze and who can concentrate when faced with Aimee Mann's delightful pins On a slightly more serious note if Carole King and Joni Mitchell were just starting out I would imagine that this is what it would sound like.
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Post by georgieboy52 on Dec 2, 2019 19:14:34 GMT
Moby Dick JHB.
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Post by Gary Hackett on Dec 3, 2019 1:55:43 GMT
One of her best, about her dad passing away...
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Post by Paul Spencer on Dec 3, 2019 3:16:15 GMT
Was in a pub in Nantwich yesterday and this came on the juke box, I thought, what the fuck is this? So I shazamned it ... The bloomin' Four fuckin' Tops! How on earth have I gone through my whole life and not heard it before?
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Post by jimmygscfc on Dec 3, 2019 10:30:39 GMT
Paul, there seems a lot you've missed out on!!!!!!!! I love that Four Tops track but this is another off the radar fave of mine:
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