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Post by stokebill on Mar 31, 2008 14:16:40 GMT
"This must also be contrasted with the fact that not only did Stoke "know about the law" and change their matchday-squad to comply with it; but also by the fact that - during the game - we subbed Pearson for Bothroyd (a loanee for a loanee) to stay within the regulations." That's a good point AndyHar, and one that hasn't really been mentioned. A team is only allowed 4 on the field of play at any one time. Sheffield Wednesday of course deliberately adhered to this law also, so we must congratulate them on this at least. ![;)](//storage.proboards.com/800541/images/0m0lbCuTEBzaRn6f8QaM.gif)
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Post by Deleted on Mar 31, 2008 14:18:08 GMT
...excuse me for being dense, but wtf does this mean? If you have five you can play them all, can't you? That's OK ![;)](//storage.proboards.com/800541/images/0m0lbCuTEBzaRn6f8QaM.gif) No ... apparently not. Only four "on the pitch" at any one time (this might involve short-term loanees only, BTW). Good "on the field management" by our backroom staff ( WELL DONE KEMPY!) ah
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Post by FullerMagic on Mar 31, 2008 14:20:45 GMT
Yeah, that's one that Wednesday (probably accidentally) didn't breach. Let's all do a Tevez ![::)](//storage.proboards.com/800541/images/cj7bsBj2jOTuEAUVaPt5.gif) Daily Mail Sources close to the club were yesterday hinting that they would immediately seek legal advice if Wednesday were to escape with a fine.
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Post by winger on Mar 31, 2008 14:21:06 GMT
Wow, that is dangerous in the heat of battle.
But as Wedney only used 4 they are innocent as charged, aren't they? Otherwise we could have used five and that would of* more-or-less broke the rules.
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Post by FullerMagic on Mar 31, 2008 14:28:10 GMT
It's clear they didn't break the secondary rule, but they're up to their necks in it over the primary breach.
Wednesday to admit rules breach
Alan Biggs Monday March 31, 2008 The Guardian
Sheffield Wednesday will today admit to breaking Football League rules in Saturday's home game with Stoke City by including six loan players in their squad, one more than the permitted quota. However the Championship strugglers will plead to keep the point they gained against the second-placed club.
Stoke are expected to lodge a complaint after the 1-1 draw which cost them top spot. Wednesday, whose equaliser was scored by Portsmouth's Franck Songo'o, one of their loanees, will own up to breaching the rules in talks with the league today.
However they will also enter a strong plea of mitigation if Stoke seek to be awarded the three points. Wednesday can expect a fine at least, which was the punishment accepted by Leeds when they were charged with a similar offence last season and incurred a £1,000 penalty with a further £1,000 suspended.
But Leeds' offence was arguably more serious in that they broke a secondary rule that allows only four loan players to be on the field.
The Elland Road club had five on the pitch whereas Wednesday used only four. They will therefore argue that the result was not affected and that they are merely guilty of a technicality.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 31, 2008 14:28:15 GMT
That's me point, winger. We worked hard to make sure we complied with all rules. The Wendies didn't. Game null and void; three points to us. ta ![;)](//storage.proboards.com/800541/images/0m0lbCuTEBzaRn6f8QaM.gif) ah
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Post by Stick It On Cort's Head on Mar 31, 2008 14:44:46 GMT
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Post by winger on Mar 31, 2008 14:55:41 GMT
I'm with you now ah. I'll lead the Campaign.
'Justice for the City 16, including full the legal consignment of five loanees, of which only four were on the pitch at any one time, as per sub section b article c.'
Snappy, dontchathuink?
We could have t-shirts too:
Justice for City: They had muppets on the bench while Cresser missed all the sitters.
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Post by FullerMagic on Mar 31, 2008 15:12:04 GMT
Doesn't look like much will come of it.
31/03/2008 - 4pm Update:
Stoke's hopes fading
STOKE’s chances of gaining any recompense for Sheffield Wednesday’s breach of the loan rules on Saturday appeared to be fading this afternoon after a closer precedent came to light.
Wednesday are under investigation by the Football League after naming six loan players in their 16 for Saturday’s 1-1 draw with City. The only previously highlighted precedent was Leeds being fined last season for naming six loanees in a game they lost anyway. But now another example has come to light involving Swansea City in 2003 when they were caught naming six in their 16 for a game they, like Stoke, subsequently drew. Crucially, perhaps, the League let them off with a reprimand after recognising the fact that only five of the six actually played in the game. And only four of Wednesday’s six hired hands actually got onto the field on Saturday. Stoke are likely to argue that one of those four just happened to score Wednesday’s late equaliser, while Stoke themselves were at a disadvantage from the kick-off because loan duo Paul Gallagher and Gabriel Zakuani were omitted in order to comply with League rules. For now, however, Stoke are keeping their cards close to their chest regarding any reaction if the League’s only action is to punish Sheffield.
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baddo
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Post by baddo on Mar 31, 2008 15:12:23 GMT
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Post by Stick It On Cort's Head on Mar 31, 2008 15:14:05 GMT
OH FOR FUCK SAKE!
A FINE?!?!
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Post by tazi on Mar 31, 2008 15:15:52 GMT
If Stoke do not gain from this after illegally being disadvantaged then to stop it from happening again then Sheffield Wednesday should be relegated.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 31, 2008 15:17:35 GMT
I'm with you now ah. I'll lead the Campaign. 'Justice for the City 16, including full the legal consignment of five loanees, of which only four were on the pitch at any one time, as per sub section b article c.' Snappy, dontchathuink? We could have t-shirts too: Justice for City: They had muppets on the bench while Cresser missed all the sitters. You're not taking this at all well, are you winger! ![;)](//storage.proboards.com/800541/images/0m0lbCuTEBzaRn6f8QaM.gif) Swansea " Crucially, perhaps, the League let them off with a reprimand after recognising the fact that only five of the six actually played in the game" We don't have this one in the research!!! (what the bl00dy hell is going on ... Burger - Where were ya?!) However: "only five of the six actually played in the game." I assume one of them was a longterm loanee then - Or it should have only been four. We'll see (soon, probably); and I think I'd still chase it if I were Stoke and we got nowt from the original judgement (just to keep the support quiet for the next 40-years after the furore over "flag waving man" at the 1971/72 semi-final) ![;)](//storage.proboards.com/800541/images/0m0lbCuTEBzaRn6f8QaM.gif) ah
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Post by Mr Jon on Mar 31, 2008 15:17:45 GMT
OK, it's worth £10K in fines over the next 5 games to have a full deck of loanees to choose from.
Let's do it!!!!
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Post by adri2008 on Mar 31, 2008 15:19:04 GMT
The so called fines are generally fucking useless. How much deterrant is a £1k-2k fine these days - they may as well just do nothing at all.
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Post by FullerMagic on Mar 31, 2008 15:19:15 GMT
May as well erase the rule from the books if , EVERY TIME it happens, a slap on the wrists is all teams are going to get by clearly benefiting and disadvantaging their rivals by an outright breach of one of the most widely-known football league regulations.
Not worth the paper it's written on.
Deterrent my arse!
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Post by nathan on Mar 31, 2008 15:19:27 GMT
If they let them off with a fine lets all name our 6 loanees and show a complete disregard for the rules as clearly the FL haven't got the balls to take firm action when a law they bring in is breached.
They need the point deducting, even if we do not receive recompense.
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baddo
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Post by baddo on Mar 31, 2008 15:19:44 GMT
What's the point of sticking to rules if only measly fines are handed out?
Are The Football League basically saying that it is quite alright to break rules if you pay us (the league) a small fee?
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Post by nathan on Mar 31, 2008 15:20:59 GMT
Seems to be the case Baddo.
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Post by Stick It On Cort's Head on Mar 31, 2008 15:21:38 GMT
Fair enough,Fine Swansea, leeds i'm not so sure .
BUT then WEDNESDAY???
Surely the more times this happens the bigger the severity of the punishment as this has alerted teams and they should know of the rule/punishments!!!
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baddo
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Post by baddo on Mar 31, 2008 15:22:53 GMT
Well let's play the strongest squad we have regardless if we break the rules of the Football League. (Except don't ask me to pay the fines. ;D)
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Post by troj on Mar 31, 2008 15:24:46 GMT
shoot em - that'll teach em
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Post by GoBoks on Mar 31, 2008 15:25:46 GMT
Nothing official yet! Let's just keep our powder dry until they make the ruling. They are in a no win situation, all because of Wendies. If they give a fine then change the rule book to include forfeiture of game as the punishment, they really make themselves look stupid. If they don't change the rule book, then basically they are implementing a "you can pay this fee to play additional loanees" policy. Sadly, I think that if they deduct no points, Stoke and 5 or 6 teams at the bottom will be upset with their decision. If they give us the points, Wendies and 5 or 6 teams at the top will be upset. If they deduct one point, only Wendies and Stoke will be upset. Guess what decision the gutless ones will make ![:(](//storage.proboards.com/800541/images/4tzqvp1fxEemag_TAXLJ.gif)
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xess
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Post by xess on Mar 31, 2008 15:26:54 GMT
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Post by winger on Mar 31, 2008 15:26:58 GMT
You're not taking this at all well, are you winger! ![;)](//storage.proboards.com/800541/images/0m0lbCuTEBzaRn6f8QaM.gif) I'm taking it aces, I haven't had so much fun since Merkin last started a thread.
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Post by FullerMagic on Mar 31, 2008 15:34:25 GMT
According to this, there's a Swansea breach in 2005 (which is maybe the one they're on about?) and it doesn't look the same at all.
Swans warned over loan mix-up Thursday Sep 29 2005 14:29
Swansea City have escaped with a warning for initially naming six loan players in their squad for the clash with Wrexham at the beginning of March.
The Swans realised their error before the game started and although Craig Stiens was named on the final teamsheet, he did not take his place on the bench.
Following a Football League investigation, a statement read: "The management committee of the Football League have considered all the evidence, and Swansea City have been issued a severe reprimand and no further action will be taken."
Swans club secretary Jackie Rockey was relieved, adding on the club's official website: "At no time were we ever seeking to gain an unfair advantage, it was down to a genuine oversight on our behalf.
"Given these facts, along with it being only a minor breach of a brand new rule, we feel that the verdict they have come to was the only one open to them."
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Post by nathan on Mar 31, 2008 15:36:37 GMT
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Post by Olgrligm on Mar 31, 2008 15:36:44 GMT
6 months to take a decision. Whoopee.
Maybe that's why there was no punishment in that case - it was too late.
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Post by Mr Jon on Mar 31, 2008 15:37:50 GMT
Spot on FM.
In fact, Swansea would have only had an active squad of 15 during the game so they actually disadvantaged themselves. The Swansea game is NOT a precedent!
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Post by nathan on Mar 31, 2008 15:37:55 GMT
Swansea City have escaped being docked league points for picking too many loan players in their Welsh derby clash with Wrexham.
The news is a boost for the Swans, who were given a reprimand when they could have been dealt a far more severe punishment by the Football League.
Being stripped of points could have destroyed their fight against relegation from Division Three, undoing much of the good work that manager Brian Flynn has done since taking over.
A fine would also have adversely affected the cash-strapped Vetch Field outfit.
The fact the club picked up the mistake themselves before the match on 1 March and then reported it to the League authorities, counted in their favour.
The five loan players used by Swansea were Neil Cutler (Stoke), Leon Hylton (Aston Villa), Alan Tate (Man Utd), Leon Britton (West Ham) and Marc Richards (Blackburn).
Swansea await slapped wrist
Craig Stiens (Leeds Utd) was also on the bench, but played no part and was not considered by Flynn after the pre-kick-off warning.
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