|
Post by scfcrmagic on Oct 27, 2009 9:07:13 GMT
Hillsborough Disaster on the History channel.....very sad day for football shows how things have changed though.....
|
|
|
Post by gloucesterstokie on Oct 27, 2009 9:18:25 GMT
changed building regulations thats for sure
|
|
|
Post by mark71 on Oct 27, 2009 9:20:37 GMT
Hillsborough Disaster on the History channel.....very sad day for football shows how things have changed though..... They haven't changed enough though, were still treated like shit by the Police.
|
|
|
Post by JoeinOz on Oct 27, 2009 10:24:10 GMT
It did change things forever. And in many respects rightly so. I agree Mark, the worst aspect is that there are still intances of police mistreating supporters....in a way that just wouldn't happen in any other aspect of society.
|
|
|
Post by scfcrmagic on Oct 27, 2009 10:37:00 GMT
Police clearly to blame...but no apologies to the families......
The players were tremendous....as were all the fans from both sides who helped get people on the pitch.....the press were like a pack of wolves ...nothing changes..
|
|
|
Post by JoeinOz on Oct 27, 2009 10:38:46 GMT
The lowest point in football history?
|
|
|
Post by mark71 on Oct 27, 2009 10:51:30 GMT
There was a documentary on Chanel 4 Thursday night, it was about Police training for crowd control situations. It was very frightening viewing. Police officers spend 2 days a year on a refresher course. Where they train for worse case scenario IE full on riot, Toxteth Brixton, Broard water farm, Poll tax etc. Can you notice a common theme about the examples given? they all happened 20 or 30 years ago. There hasn't been an example of a crowd disturbance where a petrol bomb being thrown at Met police officers since broad water farm but the majority of police crowd control training is spent dealing with petrol bombs! There is an obvious need to train police officers in such eventuality's but the training should be Representative of the situations they face throughout the year. And surprise surprise the police training to clear a street of protesters is the same no matter who they are or what threat they pose. It seems as police tactics and training are going back wards and are being used indiscriminately no matter what the threat. It's not the whole program but here's a link to it. www.channel4.com/programmes/dispatches
|
|
|
Post by JoeinOz on Oct 27, 2009 10:59:56 GMT
That's interesting/worrying Mark. The same techniques are used across the board is just daft. And shows no sympathy to the respective sensitivities it throws up.
|
|
|
Post by RAF on Oct 27, 2009 11:01:30 GMT
Possibly, although the Bradford fire was fucking attrocious aswell. Even more so because of the tv footage seeing people burning to death, it was fucking horrific.
H
|
|
|
Post by JoeinOz on Oct 27, 2009 11:06:09 GMT
Mmmm. 1985 was horrendous.
|
|
|
Post by mark71 on Oct 27, 2009 11:06:36 GMT
Possibly, although the Bradford fire was fucking atrocious Oswell. Even more so because of the TV footage seeing people burning to death, it was fucking horrific. H Got to agree with RAF there was footage on You Tube a few months ago of the Bradford fire disaster, it was truly, truly horrific. The bit where a policeman comes out of the stand on fire will remain with me for ever.
|
|
|
Post by JoeinOz on Oct 27, 2009 11:08:24 GMT
The Bradford fire was so fast. It took about three minutes for the whole stand to go up. Terrifying. Things had to change didn't they.
|
|
|
Post by mark71 on Oct 27, 2009 11:10:52 GMT
Just found something, it's not the origional one. It's awfull but it must be watched just to remember what happened. Hopefully football will never enter those dark days again.
|
|
|
Post by RAF on Oct 27, 2009 11:14:12 GMT
As Mark says, the images of those blokes staggering out of the stand on fire and collapsing will fucking haunt me forever.
H
|
|
|
Post by JoeinOz on Oct 27, 2009 11:15:21 GMT
Me too RAF. And that could have been any set of supporters.
|
|
|
Post by RAF on Oct 27, 2009 11:19:28 GMT
But for the grace of god , hey Joe?
H
|
|
|
Post by JoeinOz on Oct 27, 2009 11:25:17 GMT
Thats exactly what I thought after Hillsborough RAF. It's not that it could have been us....two months before it WAS us.
|
|
|
Post by RAF on Oct 27, 2009 11:27:25 GMT
Certainly makes you think mate.
H
|
|
|
Post by march4 on Oct 27, 2009 11:28:17 GMT
As soon as I walked into the Upper Tier of the stand at Everton I thought of the Bradford fire. I thought those wooden stands had gone or the wood had been covered to stop it catching alight.
The only relief at Bradford was the lack of fences in front on the stand. Imagine a fire in the old Butler St Stand.
What a terrible event it was and one that still haunts regular supporters of that age, because as the previous poster says; 'there for the grace of God..............'
|
|
|
Post by mark71 on Oct 27, 2009 11:30:56 GMT
The night we played Barnsley will last long in the memory. How everyone came home alive I'll never know.
I can honestly say I was petrified that night.
|
|
|
Post by JoeinOz on Oct 27, 2009 11:32:10 GMT
The only relief at Bradford was the lack of fences in front on the stand. Imagine a fire in the old Butler St Stand
You know what? All these years have passed, and these are things I've dwelled on but that thought has only just come to me. All that time everyone was just riding their luck.
|
|
|
Post by RAF on Oct 27, 2009 11:32:52 GMT
I think I genuinely let a bit of piss release in my pants I was that scared that night.
Burning to death and drowning I have to say must be the most horrific ways to die.
H
|
|
|
Post by march4 on Oct 27, 2009 11:33:07 GMT
The night we played Barnsley will last long in the memory. How everyone came home alive I'll never know. I can honestly say I was petrified that night. Agreed, there have been so many near misses over the years for supporters of all clubs.
|
|
|
Post by JoeinOz on Oct 27, 2009 11:37:10 GMT
Agree Mark. We were in an identical situation. Had there been more people on the terrace when the gate was opened it could have been us to suffer that tragedy. And to suffer the scandalous suggestions of violence which are attached to the story.
|
|
|
Post by RipRoaringPotter on Oct 27, 2009 11:39:29 GMT
The night we played Barnsley will last long in the memory. How everyone came home alive I'll never know. I can honestly say I was petrified that night. What happened at Barnsley?
|
|
|
Post by JoeinOz on Oct 27, 2009 11:48:53 GMT
At Barnsley and FA cup replay. Thousands of Stoke fans turned up late due to roadworks and heavy traffic and KO was approaching. Only one turnstile was open and a crush developed in the. The crush got worse and worse and worse. My mate realised what was happening, moved back and told a policeman someone could get hurt and he was told "Shut your mouth or I'll fucking arrest you" The police response was to send a police charging into the panicking crowd which made the situation worse as people were now being knocked from side to side and crushed and hurt against the stadium walls. Eventually the police opened to big exit gates to relieve the crush and everyone dashed in the ground and onto the terrace to watch the match which was alrerady underway.
This was exactly what happened about ten weeks later at Hillsborough. Had there been more people on the terrace at the time the gate was opened we could have suffered the same tragedy.
|
|
|
Post by mark71 on Oct 27, 2009 11:55:23 GMT
If I remember rightly didn't the police hold back the supporters coaches untill virtually kick off time ensuring everyone turned up right on kick off time?
I wasn't on the coaches so can't be sure.
|
|
|
Post by murphy on Oct 27, 2009 11:58:53 GMT
What made the situation much worse Joe, was the matchday police decided (and this was common practice in those days) to hold 30 plus Stoke coaches just off the motorway until just before KO and the discharge the fans at the ground at kick off time and there was an almighty virtually un-policed crush. There was an extensive thread earlier this year on this subject,and the memory of this near disaster for me, my son and many hundreds of other Stokies does not fade.
|
|
|
Post by JoeinOz on Oct 27, 2009 11:59:39 GMT
It was in the days when they would hold the coaches a few miles out of town then take them in for KO time. I wasn't on coahes either for that game but often was and remember S. Yorkshire police doing that.
|
|
|
Post by murphy on Oct 27, 2009 12:04:48 GMT
I was on the coaches that night, and that is exactly what happened, and have thought many times when the Hillsboro disaster is mentioned "there but for the grace of God "
|
|