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Post by elystokie on Jul 18, 2023 16:20:03 GMT
"Why do drug users use drugs in the first place?" On the Swe radio a few years back. I still remember the question, but not the exact name of the radio show. It could have been Radio Krishna. And on swebb-tv they asked the same question a couple of years ago. And in at least some political local debate before the national election every time, I'd say. So what do you think is the reason? Just curious. Why do people put salt on food? |
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Post by musik on Jul 18, 2023 19:55:37 GMT
"Why do drug users use drugs in the first place?" On the Swe radio a few years back. I still remember the question, but not the exact name of the radio show. It could have been Radio Krishna. And on swebb-tv they asked the same question a couple of years ago. And in at least some political local debate before the national election every time, I'd say. So what do you think is the reason? Just curious. Why do people put salt on food? Me personally, I have no idea. But I do get what you mean. However, noone who wants a change should ask that question to our politicians here, they would say it's like putting the ball on the penalty spot for them and simply remove the keeper ... |
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Post by thehartshillbadger on Jul 18, 2023 20:03:30 GMT
"Why do drug users use drugs in the first place?" On the Swe radio a few years back. I still remember the question, but not the exact name of the radio show. It could have been Radio Krishna. And on swebb-tv they asked the same question a couple of years ago. And in at least some political local debate before the national election every time, I'd say. So what do you think is the reason? Just curious. Why do people put salt on food? To get high of course! Not me though, I have blood pressure issues, no more than 1.5g per hundred for me until I get a bit tiddly and nail a kebab or curry😉 |
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Post by elystokie on Jul 18, 2023 20:28:56 GMT
Why do people put salt on food? To get high of course! Not me though, I have blood pressure issues, no more than 1.5g per hundred for me until I get a bit tiddly and nail a kebab or curry😉 Alcohol - the gateway drug 😊 |
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Post by thehartshillbadger on Jul 18, 2023 20:33:53 GMT
To get high of course! Not me though, I have blood pressure issues, no more than 1.5g per hundred for me until I get a bit tiddly and nail a kebab or curry😉 Alcohol - the gateway drug 😊 Do you not drink Ely? |
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Post by elystokie on Jul 18, 2023 20:35:37 GMT
Why do people put salt on food? Me personally, I have no idea. But I do get what you mean. However, noone who wants a change should ask that question to our politicians here, they would say it's like putting the ball on the penalty spot for them and simply remove the keeper ... The game was lost a long time ago, trying to prevent more goals is pretty much futile, some drug cartels have a huge GDP figure and far reaching influence, prohibition just pushes up their profit margin. |
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Post by elystokie on Jul 18, 2023 20:39:39 GMT
Alcohol - the gateway drug 😊 Do you not drink Ely? In the past at times I pretty much made a career of it, it was more or less compulsory in the RN when I was in 🙂 Nowadays the odd pint or two of Guinness once or twice a month and maybe a can of it now and then, I can take it or leave it most of the time. I do have the odd bottle or three of lager when on holiday to be fair. Why d'you ask? |
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Post by thehartshillbadger on Jul 18, 2023 20:45:36 GMT
In the past at times I pretty much made a career of it, it was more or less compulsory in the RN when I was in 🙂 Nowadays the odd pint or two of Guinness once or twice a month and maybe a can of it now and then, I can take it or leave it most of the time. I do have the odd bottle or three of lager when on holiday to be fair. Why d'you ask? Sorry to pry I was just trying to work out your promotion of cannibis and your anti alcohol stance. It all fair enough, just wanted to see how your clever little mind works😉 |
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Post by iancransonsknees on Jul 18, 2023 20:54:10 GMT
Me personally, I have no idea. But I do get what you mean. However, noone who wants a change should ask that question to our politicians here, they would say it's like putting the ball on the penalty spot for them and simply remove the keeper ... The game was lost a long time ago, trying to prevent more goals is pretty much futile, some drug cartels have a huge GDP figure and far reaching influence, prohibition just pushes up their profit margin. One man's cartel is another man's pharmaceutical company. |
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Post by elystokie on Jul 18, 2023 20:55:09 GMT
In the past at times I pretty much made a career of it, it was more or less compulsory in the RN when I was in 🙂 Nowadays the odd pint or two of Guinness once or twice a month and maybe a can of it now and then, I can take it or leave it most of the time. I do have the odd bottle or three of lager when on holiday to be fair. Why d'you ask? Sorry to pry I was just trying to work out your promotion of cannibis and your anti alcohol stance. It all fair enough, just wanted to see how your clever little mind works😉 I'm not anti alcohol really it's just the hypocrisy surrounding something so dangerous as opposed to the relatively benign but illegal cannabis. I do think the dangers of heavy alcohol consumption should be far more widely publicised tho. Any streetfights I've had, nights in cells, adult hospital visits and countless 'situations' have pretty much all been under the influence of alcohol 🙂 |
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Post by thehartshillbadger on Jul 18, 2023 20:57:55 GMT
Sorry to pry I was just trying to work out your promotion of cannibis and your anti alcohol stance. It all fair enough, just wanted to see how your clever little mind works😉 I'm not anti alcohol really it's just the hypocrisy surrounding something so dangerous as opposed to the relatively benign but illegal cannabis. I do think the dangers of heavy alcohol consumption should be far more widely publicised tho. Any streetfights I've had, nights in cells, adult hospital visits and countless 'situations' have pretty much all been under the influence of alcohol 🙂 You sound like a right bastard on a night out!🤣 |
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Post by elystokie on Jul 18, 2023 21:10:02 GMT
I'm not anti alcohol really it's just the hypocrisy surrounding something so dangerous as opposed to the relatively benign but illegal cannabis. I do think the dangers of heavy alcohol consumption should be far more widely publicised tho. Any streetfights I've had, nights in cells, adult hospital visits and countless 'situations' have pretty much all been under the influence of alcohol 🙂 You sound like a right bastard on a night out!🤣 I blame the company I kept... 😂 |
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Post by cvillestokie on Jul 18, 2023 22:13:22 GMT
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Post by thevoid on Jul 19, 2023 14:06:59 GMT
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Post by musik on Jul 19, 2023 19:20:25 GMT
A person up north in Sweden was shot during a drug deal, and he saw himself as a victim so he wrote to the Victim Authority to get some money from them.
The answer came today, he won't get anything since he was involved in a drug deal.
And it doesn't matter in what way, since drugs are illegal.
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Post by elystokie on Jul 20, 2023 11:26:40 GMT
A person up north in Sweden was shot during a drug deal, and he saw himself as a victim so he wrote to the Victim Authority to get some money from them. The answer came today, he won't get anything since he was involved in a drug deal. And it doesn't matter in what way, since drugs are illegal. I'm surprised he bothered trying, the outcome was pretty obvious. Seems your government, like ours, simply refuses to heed the advice of the people they pay to give them that very advice 😕 sverigesradio.se/artikel/7566468"Earlier this year, the Public Health Agency published a report with a list of suggested measures to address drug use in Sweden, several of them proving controversial. Like the proposal to introduce so-called injection rooms, where people can inject drugs under the supervision of health-care personnel. The Agency also wants to review Sweden's drug laws, including the prohibition on personal use of narcotics." |
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Post by musik on Jul 20, 2023 13:06:48 GMT
A person up north in Sweden was shot during a drug deal, and he saw himself as a victim so he wrote to the Victim Authority to get some money from them. The answer came today, he won't get anything since he was involved in a drug deal. And it doesn't matter in what way, since drugs are illegal. I'm surprised he bothered trying, the outcome was pretty obvious. Seems your government, like ours, simply refuses to heed the advice of the people they pay to give them that very advice 😕 sverigesradio.se/artikel/7566468"Earlier this year, the Public Health Agency published a report with a list of suggested measures to address drug use in Sweden, several of them proving controversial. Like the proposal to introduce so-called injection rooms, where people can inject drugs under the supervision of health-care personnel. The Agency also wants to review Sweden's drug laws, including the prohibition on personal use of narcotics." Public Health Agency? The Tegnell gang. 🙃 I think it's a battle between different reports. One here is about the costs associated with people using drugs, compared to if they hadn't - and that one has always priority. |
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Post by elystokie on Jul 20, 2023 13:18:20 GMT
I'm surprised he bothered trying, the outcome was pretty obvious. Seems your government, like ours, simply refuses to heed the advice of the people they pay to give them that very advice 😕 sverigesradio.se/artikel/7566468"Earlier this year, the Public Health Agency published a report with a list of suggested measures to address drug use in Sweden, several of them proving controversial. Like the proposal to introduce so-called injection rooms, where people can inject drugs under the supervision of health-care personnel. The Agency also wants to review Sweden's drug laws, including the prohibition on personal use of narcotics." Public Health Agency? The Tegnell gang. 🙃 I think it's a battle between different reports. One here is about the costs associated with people using drugs, compared to if they hadn't - and that one has always priority. The costs associated are largely self inflicted by imposing prohibition. I don't suppose they've considered taxing it and putting the money towards helping people that have problems with drugs and educating the public on the relative dangers of all drugs? |
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Post by musik on Jul 20, 2023 13:35:03 GMT
Public Health Agency? The Tegnell gang. 🙃 I think it's a battle between different reports. One here is about the costs associated with people using drugs, compared to if they hadn't - and that one has always priority. The costs associated are largely self inflicted by imposing prohibition. I don't suppose they've considered taxing it and putting the money towards helping people that have problems with drugs and educating the public on the relative dangers of all drugs? They really already do the last part intensely! Conclusion: don't do drugs, they say. And if you want to put a pill in your body anyway, trust the professionals, the pharmaceutical industry. The people who knows what they talk about. And they don't see prohibition as the problem since they see it as the solution, since their goal is a drug free society. That's the other side of the coin. And the thing you wrote before about "salt on food", as an answer to why some people use drugs would they see as the biggest advantage with prohibition of them all. People shouldn't need "salt" or anything else to spice them up. Then it's something wrong with their lives. Swedish politicians work first of all to prevent people from drugs and if they use it they see it as a result of an underlying problem; an underlying problem that could be solved hopefully. And to continue with drugs is never a part of that solution. This is the general picture. However, we have an alternative, the Peasant's party, nowadays also called C, center liberals, who think a little bit differently. A bit. They will have a problem reaching 4% next time. |
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Post by musik on Jul 20, 2023 13:45:03 GMT
Something else I've noticed lately is the info appearing at different places within the health sector here now about risk factors for getting ALS.
It says if you are really overweight and fat and drink coffee and drink alcohol regularly you will have a much lower risk of getting ALS.
Isn't that .... well, weird? 🤔
But it might be true.
I was thinking about that since they perhaps don't chase alcohol and coffee drinkers and perhaps fat people as much as I first thought?!?
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Post by elystokie on Jul 20, 2023 14:06:56 GMT
Something else I've noticed lately is the info appearing at different places within the health sector here now about risk factors for getting ALS. It says if you are really overweight and fat and drink coffee and drink alcohol regularly you will have a much lower risk of getting ALS. Isn't that .... well, weird? 🤔 But it might be true. I was thinking about that since they perhaps don't chase alcohol and coffee drinkers and perhaps fat people as much as I first thought?!? Whether it's true or not, given all the other health risks associated with those 3, I'm not sure it's worth the higher overall risk just for a lower risk of ALS 🙂 It's always a bit strange for me that they're very selective of the ways in which they want to 'protect' us, if they're going to do it by banning stuff, why not base it on science? |
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Post by elystokie on Jul 20, 2023 14:18:36 GMT
The costs associated are largely self inflicted by imposing prohibition. I don't suppose they've considered taxing it and putting the money towards helping people that have problems with drugs and educating the public on the relative dangers of all drugs? They really already do the last part intensely! Conclusion: don't do drugs, they say. And if you want to put a pill in your body anyway, trust the professionals, the pharmaceutical industry. The people who knows what they talk about. And they don't see prohibition as the problem since they see it as the solution, since their goal is a drug free society. That's the other side of the coin. And the thing you wrote before about "salt on food", as an answer to why some people use drugs would they see as the biggest advantage with prohibition of them all. People shouldn't need "salt" or anything else to spice them up. Then it's something wrong with their lives. Swedish politicians work first of all to prevent people from drugs and if they use it they see it as a result of an underlying problem; an underlying problem that could be solved hopefully. And to continue with drugs is never a part of that solution. This is the general picture. However, we have an alternative, the Peasant's party, nowadays also called C, center liberals, who think a little bit differently. A bit. They will have a problem reaching 4% next time. If the 'education' is anything like the TV adverts we saw in the UK in the 80s it's known as scaremongering. My salt comment was somewhat flippant but people add all sorts of things to food to make it more palatable to them, same with life. www.emcdda.europa.eu/publications/data-fact-sheets/european-web-survey-drugs-2021-top-level-findings-eu-21-switzerland_en"The motivations to use particular drugs often reflect the effects users expect when they use them. The survey responses suggest herbal cannabis is taken for its calming and euphoric effects, specifically to reduce stress or to relax, to get high or for fun and to improve sleep. For MDMA, euphoric and socialising effects are reported as motivations." From what I've read for people who've suffered childhood trauma and/or struggling with homelessness and mental health issues the drug use is of stronger substances, more often. Do you think alcohol prohibition in the USA in the 1920s was a success or a failure overall? |
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Post by musik on Jul 21, 2023 10:29:14 GMT
Something else I've noticed lately is the info appearing at different places within the health sector here now about risk factors for getting ALS. It says if you are really overweight and fat and drink coffee and drink alcohol regularly you will have a much lower risk of getting ALS. Isn't that .... well, weird? 🤔 But it might be true. I was thinking about that since they perhaps don't chase alcohol and coffee drinkers and perhaps fat people as much as I first thought?!? Whether it's true or not, given all the other health risks associated with those 3, I'm not sure it's worth the higher overall risk just for a lower risk of ALS 🙂 It's always a bit strange for me that they're very selective of the ways in which they want to 'protect' us, if they're going to do it by banning stuff, why not base it on science? In Sweden they say everything is very well based on science, but they never show any books, reports or give links or titles. How is it in England, do either side ever show any references? |
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Post by musik on Jul 21, 2023 10:39:20 GMT
Do you think alcohol prohibition in the USA in the 1920s was a success or a failure overall? A success I suppose if you look at the decreased drinking. A failure if you look at decreased tax income. On the other hand, you would have to take into account decreased alcohol related health sector costs. |
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Post by elystokie on Jul 21, 2023 11:04:06 GMT
Whether it's true or not, given all the other health risks associated with those 3, I'm not sure it's worth the higher overall risk just for a lower risk of ALS 🙂 It's always a bit strange for me that they're very selective of the ways in which they want to 'protect' us, if they're going to do it by banning stuff, why not base it on science? In Sweden they say everything is very well based on science, but they never show any books, reports or give links or titles. How is it in England, do either side ever show any references? In the UK the media concentrate on stories that shock, it sells better, probably the same all over to be fair. There was some truthful coverage years ago when the government commissioned a study to discover the relative harms of all drugs, legal and illegal. They appointed their Chief Scientific Advisor, Professor Nutt, to oversee the study and didn't like what he found, a classic case of the evidence not fitting the policies. He made a couple of factual statements to the press that showed the drug laws for the farce they are and they sacked him. He set up the charity linked below with a view to educating people about drugs and hopefully have some effect on drug law reform. According to the man himself even the Daily Mail are showing signs of 'softening' their approach as far as drugs go, long way to go on that front tho. I've seen a definite increase in numbers in the talks/lectures/discussions I've attended recently so hopefully the message is getting through, albeit far more slowly than it could be. www.drugscience.org.uk/There's also a lot of work being done by the Anyone's Child organization, a group of parents that want drug law reform to try and stop other people's kids from dying. The Undercover Cop videos on there are particularly revealing. anyoneschild.org/meet-the-professionals/ |
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Post by elystokie on Jul 21, 2023 11:09:15 GMT
Do you think alcohol prohibition in the USA in the 1920s was a success or a failure overall? A success I suppose if you look at the decreased drinking. A failure if you look at decreased tax income. On the other hand, you would have to take into account decreased alcohol related health sector costs. Have you thought about the increase in health costs due to people drinking all sorts of unlicensed, unregulated hooch? Or the increase in costs due to the policing of alcohol, subsequent prison time for offenders and the gangland violence and widespread murders that the era is famed for? |
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Post by musik on Jul 21, 2023 12:19:04 GMT
A success I suppose if you look at the decreased drinking. A failure if you look at decreased tax income. On the other hand, you would have to take into account decreased alcohol related health sector costs. Have you thought about the increase in health costs due to people drinking all sorts of unlicensed, unregulated hooch? Or the increase in costs due to the policing of alcohol, subsequent prison time for offenders and the gangland violence and widespread murders that the era is famed for? I would absolutely take all things under consideration, glad you mentioned those above. But my personal balanced view doesn't count. To explain, I would say the vast majority of people here would say the things you mentioned occur just because people break the law - and we can't build a society where breaking the law rule things. That's the general opinion. |
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Post by elystokie on Jul 21, 2023 12:29:43 GMT
Have you thought about the increase in health costs due to people drinking all sorts of unlicensed, unregulated hooch? Or the increase in costs due to the policing of alcohol, subsequent prison time for offenders and the gangland violence and widespread murders that the era is famed for? I would absolutely take all things under consideration, glad you mentioned those above. But my personal balanced view doesn't count. To explain, I would say the vast majority of people here would say the things you mentioned occur just because people break the law - and we can't build a society where breaking the law rule things. That's the general opinion. "But my personal balanced view doesn't count." It should, and the more people that are prepared to take a balanced view the more there is chance of change for the better. |
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Post by elystokie on Aug 14, 2023 12:26:08 GMT
Neil Woods has been on Radio Stoke news on the hour, commenting on how the £200k spent by the local police on drug informants was a waste of money.
His view as an ex-undercover cop posing as a drug dealer for 14 years is that a lot of the time it's gangs and their members taking payments for effectively putting their rivals out of business.
Hardly surprising really.
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Post by salopstick on Aug 14, 2023 12:49:14 GMT
What we need is a form of soft legalisation as I've called it. It would utterly destroy an entire range of underground criminal enterprises. You start by completely legalizing consumption. The sooner that happens, the sooner you stop criminalizing the users rather than suppliers, which appears to be the current modus operandi. In addition, you introduce laws that bring drugs especially those already easy to find and heavily available (weed, coke, etc) inline with alcohol, such as drink driving, drunken disorderly etc. The whole point is not to criminalise the consumption but the consequence of negligent behaviour which is exactly what the drink driving laws intend to do. You make it okay to consume drugs in a healthy way such as in your home or in a designated cafes, you get them away from the streets. The streets are where they and other forms of drug related crime such as burglary, prostitution and laundering fester. I've said before that cocaine, for example, is a bit of a fighting drug so you punish those who are caught fighting after consumption accordingly which is exactly what we do for booze right? We punish people for their actions not for their consumption. Once you've legalised consumption, you go about dismantling the dealing networks. Start by legalizing the distribution of 'soft' drugs such as weed, pills, mushrooms etc. You educate people to the dangers of specific drug consumption which is exactly what we already do for alcohol and tobacco but you bring a formerly underground market above ground. The more dangerous drugs like crack and heroin would probably need more thought. Nobody needs a bunch of wreck heads running around on shop bought smack but whatever the alternative is, it's better than what we have which is an extreme form of human suffering. I suspect it would be some form of legalized substitutes like methadone. It would need some serious thought and extremely intelligent individuals involved rather than fly-by-night career politicians, who for the most part know fuck all. That is a brilliant post you need a massive education push to go with it. Otherwise you get a good thing like vaping which helps smokers quitting smoking to it being used and targetted at kids |
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