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Post by Pugsley on May 1, 2023 7:59:54 GMT
When Wilmot is the player of the year, deep down you know you're fucked.
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Post by bayernoatcake on May 1, 2023 8:02:11 GMT
When Wilmot is the player of the year, deep down you know you're fucked. I still can’t get over that people think he has played well tbh. In my mind we don’t have a centre half, central midfielder or striker good enough on the books. Yet people are defending Wilmot and Laurent like it’s Shawcross and Nzonzi. It’s mad.
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Post by questionable on May 1, 2023 8:12:05 GMT
When Wilmot is the player of the year, deep down you know you're fucked. I still can’t get over that people think he has played well tbh. In my mind we don’t have a centre half, central midfielder or striker good enough on the books. Yet people are defending Wilmot and Laurent like it’s Shawcross and Nzonzi. It’s mad. Certainly hasn’t played well at all, he was one major clanger in his game every game without doubt. Just shows what levels we’ve dropped to as you say.
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Post by wakeypotter on May 1, 2023 9:25:30 GMT
I think the 97/98 squad just beats it, but not by much Best team were something like, that said Kav, Thorne and Griffin would walk into this team Muggleton Griffin Sigurdsson Tweed Pickering Wallace Forsyth Kavanagh Keen Stewart Thorne And muggleton, Sigurdson and keen
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Post by newsteadst3 on May 1, 2023 10:13:57 GMT
I think the 97/98 squad just beats it, but not by much Best team were something like, that said Kav, Thorne and Griffin would walk into this team Muggleton Griffin Sigurdsson Tweed Pickering Wallace Forsyth Kavanagh Keen Stewart Thorne And muggleton, Sigurdson and keen Forsyth I bet got more goals than Laurent,Thompson and Smallbone.
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Post by spiderpuss on May 1, 2023 10:36:38 GMT
When Wilmot is the player of the year, deep down you know you're fucked. I still can’t get over that people think he has played well tbh. In my mind we don’t have a centre half, central midfielder or striker good enough on the books. Yet people are defending Wilmot and Laurent like it’s Shawcross and Nzonzi. It’s mad. I voted in sympathy with respect to injury and the hilarious buffoon of a referee who didn't even give a free kick. A bigger knut of ref you will not see. As for performances, he did nothing majorly wrong or right, which probably gets you into the top 3 this season!
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Post by davejohnno1 on May 1, 2023 11:22:59 GMT
When Wilmot is the player of the year, deep down you know you're fucked. I still can’t get over that people think he has played well tbh. In my mind we don’t have a centre half, central midfielder or striker good enough on the books. Yet people are defending Wilmot and Laurent like it’s Shawcross and Nzonzi. It’s mad. Wilmot looks good at times, poor at others. He’s definitely the best we’ve got and alongside a more complimentary partner could make a decent pairing. Laurent has the makings of a really good player. He’s ridiculously inconsistent though.
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Post by crowey on May 1, 2023 11:34:56 GMT
I think the 97/98 squad just beats it, but not by much Best team were something like, that said Kav, Thorne and Griffin would walk into this team Muggleton Griffin Sigurdsson Tweed Pickering Wallace Forsyth Kavanagh Keen Stewart Thorne And muggleton, Sigurdson and keen …. that squad definitely looks better to me (apart from Tweed of course)
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Post by bayernoatcake on May 1, 2023 11:40:41 GMT
I still can’t get over that people think he has played well tbh. In my mind we don’t have a centre half, central midfielder or striker good enough on the books. Yet people are defending Wilmot and Laurent like it’s Shawcross and Nzonzi. It’s mad. Wilmot looks good at times, poor at others. He’s definitely the best we’ve got and alongside a more complimentary partner could make a decent pairing. Laurent has the makings of a really good player. He’s ridiculously inconsistent though. I’m happy with both on the bench and rotation options. Laurent could be excellent but just doesn’t want it. He has all the tools to be a middle of the road PL midfielder but his will is that of a nobody.
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Post by Trouserdog on May 1, 2023 11:42:06 GMT
And muggleton, Sigurdson and keen …. that squad definitely looks better to me (apart from Tweed of course) That side should never have been relegated. There was a lack of depth though as once you get past that reasonably decent first XI, there was a collection of random shit loanees and youth team players making up the numbers (sound familiar?) Muggleton, Tweed, Pickering and Stewart were all very wank, but we've got no-one in this current line-up anywhere near the quality of Thorne, Kav, Siggurs or early career-Griffin.
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Post by crowey on May 1, 2023 11:44:04 GMT
…. just looked at some of the bit part players we had at the time. That makes scary reading. Apart from my young namesake who scored a few goals? Whatever happened to him? Do I remember him going to Walsall?
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Post by Trouserdog on May 1, 2023 11:44:18 GMT
Wilmot looks good at times, poor at others. He’s definitely the best we’ve got and alongside a more complimentary partner could make a decent pairing. Laurent has the makings of a really good player. He’s ridiculously inconsistent though. I’m happy with both on the bench and rotation options. Laurent could be excellent but just doesn’t want it. He has all the tools to be a middle of the road PL midfielder but his will is that of a nobody. That's pretty much what Wilmot was for Watford during their promotion season. He's an OK option for 10 or 15 games a season and someone you're alright with coming off the bench now and again. If that's our player of the season it shows how fucked we are.
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Post by lordb on May 1, 2023 11:46:47 GMT
When Wilmot is the player of the year, deep down you know you're fucked. I still can’t get over that people think he has played well tbh. In my mind we don’t have a centre half, central midfielder or striker good enough on the books. Yet people are defending Wilmot and Laurent like it’s Shawcross and Nzonzi. It’s mad. Don’t be silly absolutely no one is comparing either to those two Wilmot probably hasn't been man of the match in a single match all season but deserves his player of the season accolades as he has been consistently pretty good, 7 out 10 pretty much every game He's also cut down radically on the poor passing from last season Appreciate you are incapable of ever accepting a player can improve, once you've decided they are no good that's it, but thousands of fans can see he's been quite good this season In a good season he'd be nowhere near player of the season
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Post by lordb on May 1, 2023 11:53:33 GMT
…. that squad definitely looks better to me (apart from Tweed of course) That side should never have been relegated. There was a lack of depth though as once you get past that reasonably decent first XI, there was a collection of random shit loanees and youth team players making up the numbers (sound familiar?) Muggleton, Tweed, Pickering and Stewart were all very wank, but we've got no-one in this current line-up anywhere near the quality of Thorne, Kav, Siggurs or early career-Griffin. The central issue at the time was having someone, Moxey, interfering very very badly in transfers That and appointing a good number two but complete soft touch as manager Stoke should have simply let Chic hold the fort till Lou was back from his court dealings Not an ideal scenario but no chance we would have gone down They should also have spent the £300k that Chelsea wanted for Stein and not spent that money on Stewarts signing on fee even with the lack of any depth Thorne Stein combo would have masked a lot of problems This isn't hindsight either all this was openly discussed at the time
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Post by bayernoatcake on May 1, 2023 12:32:59 GMT
I still can’t get over that people think he has played well tbh. In my mind we don’t have a centre half, central midfielder or striker good enough on the books. Yet people are defending Wilmot and Laurent like it’s Shawcross and Nzonzi. It’s mad. Don’t be silly absolutely no one is comparing either to those two Wilmot probably hasn't been man of the match in a single match all season but deserves his player of the season accolades as he has been consistently pretty good, 7 out 10 pretty much every game He's also cut down radically on the poor passing from last season Appreciate you are incapable of ever accepting a player can improve, once you've decided they are no good that's it, but thousands of fans can see he's been quite good this season In a good season he'd be nowhere near player of the season His passing has still been really poor and he’s always got a mistake in him. He’s a good rotation option but nothing more.
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Post by questionable on May 1, 2023 13:14:42 GMT
Don’t be silly absolutely no one is comparing either to those two Wilmot probably hasn't been man of the match in a single match all season but deserves his player of the season accolades as he has been consistently pretty good, 7 out 10 pretty much every game He's also cut down radically on the poor passing from last season Appreciate you are incapable of ever accepting a player can improve, once you've decided they are no good that's it, but thousands of fans can see he's been quite good this season In a good season he'd be nowhere near player of the season His passing has still been really poor and he’s always got a mistake in him. He’s a good rotation option but nothing more. Bonkers as Stoke fans on Twitter telling Wilmot it’s much deserved, blah, blah, blah. No it’s not deserved whatsoever, average player at the very best, game changing mistakes in him, rightly dropped. How many stand out games has he had “None”. Honestly I can’t think of one positive thing to say about him. Worst league position for years, worst home form for years, not being funny here but there was nobody else to give a plate to really was there. Joke of a club
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Post by CBUFAWKIPWH on May 1, 2023 13:31:34 GMT
I still can’t get over that people think he has played well tbh. In my mind we don’t have a centre half, central midfielder or striker good enough on the books. Yet people are defending Wilmot and Laurent like it’s Shawcross and Nzonzi. It’s mad. I voted in sympathy with respect to injury and the hilarious buffoon of a referee who didn't even give a free kick. A bigger knut of ref you will not see. As for performances, he did nothing majorly wrong or right, which probably gets you into the top 3 this season! I saw the exact opposite. Up until about January he was playing ok but was dropping a clanger virtually every game he played - he was a liability. Since then he's played well. I think the only reason he got player of the season was because people forgot about his earlier performances and as a vote of sympathy for his recent injury. That and there really wasn't anyone who has stood out for the whole season.
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Post by bayernoatcake on May 1, 2023 13:37:24 GMT
His passing has still been really poor and he’s always got a mistake in him. He’s a good rotation option but nothing more. Bonkers as Stoke fans on Twitter telling Wilmot it’s much deserved, blah, blah, blah. No it’s not deserved whatsoever, average player at the very best, game changing mistakes in him, rightly dropped. How many stand out games has he had “None”. Honestly I can’t think of one positive thing to say about him. Worst league position for years, worst home form for years, not being funny here but there was nobody else to give a plate to really was there. Joke of a club Yeah the standards are so low. It’s really tiresome.
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Post by onionman on May 1, 2023 14:07:44 GMT
…. that squad definitely looks better to me (apart from Tweed of course) That side should never have been relegated. There was a lack of depth though as once you get past that reasonably decent first XI, there was a collection of random shit loanees and youth team players making up the numbers (sound familiar?) Muggleton, Tweed, Pickering and Stewart were all very wank, but we've got no-one in this current line-up anywhere near the quality of Thorne, Kav, Siggurs or early career-Griffin. I remember going to each game full of optimism only for mad things to happen, like Neville Southall charging out of his box like a fireman racing to the scene of a fire on a tractor, or Kofi Nyamah falling over the ball in slow motion despite nobody being within 20 yards of him, or a triallist up front who half the crowd thought was Kyle Lightbourne but it was actually a white bloke from Canada who had just failed a trial at the Vale. This season hasn't been as much fun to be honest.
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Post by Trouserdog on May 1, 2023 16:18:34 GMT
That side should never have been relegated. There was a lack of depth though as once you get past that reasonably decent first XI, there was a collection of random shit loanees and youth team players making up the numbers (sound familiar?) Muggleton, Tweed, Pickering and Stewart were all very wank, but we've got no-one in this current line-up anywhere near the quality of Thorne, Kav, Siggurs or early career-Griffin. The central issue at the time was having someone, Moxey, interfering very very badly in transfers That and appointing a good number two but complete soft touch as manager Stoke should have simply let Chic hold the fort till Lou was back from his court dealings Not an ideal scenario but no chance we would have gone down They should also have spent the £300k that Chelsea wanted for Stein and not spent that money on Stewarts signing on fee even with the lack of any depth Thorne Stein combo would have masked a lot of problems This isn't hindsight either all this was openly discussed at the time Moxey was pretty much the reason that Lou left the club- the Celtic court case was ongoing at the time, but I don't think it was the real reason Lou wanted out. I honestly think he'd have turned that offer down, even though it seemed to make sense at the time. Stewart was almost certainly Moxey's signing as we didn't have a manager appointed at the time he joined. Clearly scouting wasn't Moxey's forte as it was obvious that Stewart's legs had gone from very early on in his Stoke career (he was the Dwight Gayle of his day). I do wonder whether we'd have gone down had we kept Chic in charge. Bizarrely we sacked him after we'd beaten Bradford 2-1! I can't remember how many points we were adrift of safety by the end of the season, but I can't imagine Chic would have done as badly as Kamara did once he took over. The dressing room was a mess though at that time. I'm pretty sure we'd transfer listed half the squad without telling them beforehand or something stupid- hence them downing tools in that 0-7 horror show against Birmingham. Chic was popular with the players though, and I think he'd have got them on track again, rather than taking a flamethrower to the squad like Kamara did.
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Post by lordb on May 1, 2023 16:22:40 GMT
The central issue at the time was having someone, Moxey, interfering very very badly in transfers That and appointing a good number two but complete soft touch as manager Stoke should have simply let Chic hold the fort till Lou was back from his court dealings Not an ideal scenario but no chance we would have gone down They should also have spent the £300k that Chelsea wanted for Stein and not spent that money on Stewarts signing on fee even with the lack of any depth Thorne Stein combo would have masked a lot of problems This isn't hindsight either all this was openly discussed at the time Moxey was pretty much the reason that Lou left the club- the Celtic court case was ongoing at the time, but I don't think it was the real reason Lou wanted out. I honestly think he'd have turned that offer down, even though it seemed to make sense at the time. Stewart was almost certainly Moxey's signing as we didn't have a manager appointed at the time he joined. Clearly scouting wasn't Moxey's forte as it was obvious that Stewart's legs had gone from very early on in his Stoke career (he was the Dwight Gayle of his day). I do wonder whether we'd have gone down had we kept Chic in charge. Bizarrely we sacked him after we'd beaten Bradford 2-1! I can't remember how many points we were adrift of safety by the end of the season, but I can't imagine Chic would have done as badly as Kamara did once he took over. The dressing room was a mess though at that time. I'm pretty sure we'd transfer listed half the squad without telling them beforehand or something stupid- hence them downing tools in that 0-7 horror show against Birmingham. Chic was popular with the players though, and I think he'd have got them on track again, rather than taking a flamethrower to the squad like Kamara did. Dirk Schreuder, Light Bourne - Moxey signings We could have had Emerson Thom for a very low fee too, no said Jez Imho the person with the final say has to be the manager Can have whatever structure you want but last word has to be the man who carries the can Man City do it best, absolutely no one is signed without Peps say so
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Post by SamB_SCFC on May 1, 2023 16:37:38 GMT
That side should never have been relegated. There was a lack of depth though as once you get past that reasonably decent first XI, there was a collection of random shit loanees and youth team players making up the numbers (sound familiar?) Muggleton, Tweed, Pickering and Stewart were all very wank, but we've got no-one in this current line-up anywhere near the quality of Thorne, Kav, Siggurs or early career-Griffin. The central issue at the time was having someone, Moxey, interfering very very badly in transfers That and appointing a good number two but complete soft touch as manager Stoke should have simply let Chic hold the fort till Lou was back from his court dealings Not an ideal scenario but no chance we would have gone down They should also have spent the £300k that Chelsea wanted for Stein and not spent that money on Stewarts signing on fee even with the lack of any depth Thorne Stein combo would have masked a lot of problems This isn't hindsight either all this was openly discussed at the time Why on earth you'd choose an ageing, obviously past it Paul Stewart over Stein just boggles the mind. I know at that point Stein had suffered a bad injury at Chelsea and lost some pace, and was the wrong side of 30 himself. But he'd shown in the previous season when he had an excellent partnership with Sheron for a few months that he was still good enough and I think a Thorne and Stein partnership would have done well. We wouldn't have had that confidence sapping crash in form from mid November onwards and then the chaotic mess that happened after that which caused some of our better players like Thorne to start hiding. That squad should have been comfortably mid table, lower top half at least. But a combination of poor management, dreadful running of the club from the owners and Moxey, the toxic relationship between the fans and the ownership and some dreadful loans and short term signings in the second half of the season sealed our fate. It shouldn't have happened but all those toxic factors combined together and made it happen. This season's squad on ability alone is far worse and I believe we were very lucky to stay up.
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Post by SamB_SCFC on May 1, 2023 16:39:28 GMT
That side should never have been relegated. There was a lack of depth though as once you get past that reasonably decent first XI, there was a collection of random shit loanees and youth team players making up the numbers (sound familiar?) Muggleton, Tweed, Pickering and Stewart were all very wank, but we've got no-one in this current line-up anywhere near the quality of Thorne, Kav, Siggurs or early career-Griffin. I remember going to each game full of optimism only for mad things to happen, like Neville Southall charging out of his box like a fireman racing to the scene of a fire on a tractor, or Kofi Nyamah falling over the ball in slow motion despite nobody being within 20 yards of him, or a triallist up front who half the crowd thought was Kyle Lightbourne but it was actually a white bloke from Canada who had just failed a trial at the Vale. This season hasn't been as much fun to be honest. Kofi Nyamah my god. I don't think I've ever seen a worse player in a Stoke shirt.
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Post by onionman on May 1, 2023 16:55:06 GMT
I remember going to each game full of optimism only for mad things to happen, like Neville Southall charging out of his box like a fireman racing to the scene of a fire on a tractor, or Kofi Nyamah falling over the ball in slow motion despite nobody being within 20 yards of him, or a triallist up front who half the crowd thought was Kyle Lightbourne but it was actually a white bloke from Canada who had just failed a trial at the Vale. This season hasn't been as much fun to be honest. Kofi Nyamah my god. I don't think I've ever seen a worse player in a Stoke shirt. Jason Kavanagh was worse in my opinion. Remember him getting absolutely turned inside out by a very poor Reading and Notts County, then he disappeared and resurfaced as a double-glazing salesman.
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Post by thehartshillbadger on May 1, 2023 16:57:59 GMT
Is this squad worse? Even the Brian Little squad had players like Peter Thorne, Graham Kavanagh, Larus Sigurdsson and an admittedly ageing Kevin Keen. There isn't anybody of that quality in this squad. Pearson maybe, possibly Smallbone. But neither of those are our players either. I think we've been extremely lucky to not get relegated this season. And had it not been for some good loan deals in January and the March purple patch that followed then we probably would have been. The quality of The Championship has been dreadfully poor this season and that's probably saved us. Had it been of an average standard we'd have dropped with this team. There's a serious amount of work to do this summer because surely the league can't be as bad again next season. Other than the big names though, the rank and file in the Little squad were worse than what we've got now. David Oldfield, Bryan Small, Jason Kavanagh, Ben Petty, Kyle Lightbourne etc were so shite they make the likes of Jacob Brown and Josh Tymon look like world beaters. Nothing wrong with Kyle Lightbourne, he’s certainly out our current crop to shame
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Post by SamB_SCFC on May 1, 2023 17:03:43 GMT
Other than the big names though, the rank and file in the Little squad were worse than what we've got now. David Oldfield, Bryan Small, Jason Kavanagh, Ben Petty, Kyle Lightbourne etc were so shite they make the likes of Jacob Brown and Josh Tymon look like world beaters. Nothing wrong with Kyle Lightbourne, he’s certainly out our current crop to shame Lightbourne was better than anyone we have up front now. His problem was that he was disappointing considering the £500,000 we'd paid for him which was a lot of money at the time. He never lived up to the expectation that came with his fee and he's forever associated with a very dark period for the club.
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Post by Trouserdog on May 1, 2023 18:30:53 GMT
Nothing wrong with Kyle Lightbourne, he’s certainly out our current crop to shame Lightbourne was better than anyone we have up front now. His problem was that he was disappointing considering the £500,000 we'd paid for him which was a lot of money at the time. He never lived up to the expectation that came with his fee and he's forever associated with a very dark period for the club. Nah, he was really poor at Championship level- I'd take Campbell and Brown over him, any day of the week. He was on OK foil to Thorney in the third tier, but it was obvious straight away that we'd dropped an almighty bollock signing him for £500k.
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Post by SamB_SCFC on May 1, 2023 18:41:43 GMT
Lightbourne was better than anyone we have up front now. His problem was that he was disappointing considering the £500,000 we'd paid for him which was a lot of money at the time. He never lived up to the expectation that came with his fee and he's forever associated with a very dark period for the club. Nah, he was really poor at Championship level- I'd take Campbell and Brown over him, any day of the week. He was on OK foil to Thorney in the third tier, but it was obvious straight away that we'd dropped an almighty bollock signing him for £500k. It's difficult to judge him at this level because he signed late season into a team that was suffering a chronic confidence crisis, were totally rudderless and there was all the toxic background noise swirling around with the fan anger towards the owners and the team in general. I suspect you're right though. It was certainly clear immediately that we'd dropped a bollock for that much money. Neither Brown nor Campbell are good enough though. Particularly Brown.
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