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87M Loss
May 27, 2021 16:21:59 GMT
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Post by thehoof on May 27, 2021 16:21:59 GMT
No , depreciation and amortisation would not be included as part of the loss because the players ( whom the depreciation is against) are not treated as INTANGIBLE)- my concern is how much of the additional write down charge ( I think it’s around £47m) will be accepted as being the direct result of COVID having knocked resale and transfer values for 6. We can hardly point to exceeding or even recovering NBV’s ( other than Arnie) of other players we’ve sold. So long as the additional impairment is not regarded as excessive, then TS may well have played a blinder. If it is considered “over the top” by the Authorities, then we would have some more explaining to do. They are included as part of the loss. If they were excluded, transfer dealings would not be part of FFP which would be nonsense. At the moment we are massively in breach of the rules pre-Covid even if the £38 million for Covid exceptional write offs is allowed. As others have said we would have to make a £25 million profit in 2020/21 to meet the requirement. As our turnover allowing for Covid would be around £45 million and we had at least a £10 million player depreciation charge this looks impossible. To be honest, it is hard to see how we could have avoided breaching FFP with the amount of transfer spending we had to write off. The hope is that there are other Covid allowances agreed with the EFL. If not we must be gambling a number of clubs are in the same position, though our numbers are extreme, and we can limp through next season. The only good news is that we will start 2022/23 with a clean slate - all the expensive contracts ended and all of our transfer spending written off. Chiswick , under the COVID rules they are most definitely excluded from the FFP loss; the fine detail is going to be the additional amount of Amortisation and impairment write off- that is what Stoke are trying to argue; COVID has caused the exceptional write offs- if there had never been COVID amortisation would have been included as part of the loss, but where the additional impairment is a DIRECT result of COVID, they will be allowable. Depending on how the EFL assess our additional impairment, TS ( and I am in no way a fan) may very well have played a blinder.
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Post by drfishy on May 27, 2021 17:06:31 GMT
They are included as part of the loss. If they were excluded, transfer dealings would not be part of FFP which would be nonsense. At the moment we are massively in breach of the rules pre-Covid even if the £38 million for Covid exceptional write offs is allowed. As others have said we would have to make a £25 million profit in 2020/21 to meet the requirement. As our turnover allowing for Covid would be around £45 million and we had at least a £10 million player depreciation charge this looks impossible. To be honest, it is hard to see how we could have avoided breaching FFP with the amount of transfer spending we had to write off. The hope is that there are other Covid allowances agreed with the EFL. If not we must be gambling a number of clubs are in the same position, though our numbers are extreme, and we can limp through next season. The only good news is that we will start 2022/23 with a clean slate - all the expensive contracts ended and all of our transfer spending written off. Chiswick , under the COVID rules they are most definitely excluded from the FFP loss; the fine detail is going to be the additional amount of Amortisation and impairment write off- that is what Stoke are trying to argue; COVID has caused the exceptional write offs- if there had never been COVID amortisation would have been included as part of the loss, but where the additional impairment is a DIRECT result of COVID, they will be allowable. Depending on how the EFL assess our additional impairment, TS ( and I am in no way a fan) may very well have played a blinder. So without Covid we would have been completely buggered!! Every cloud.........
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87M Loss
May 27, 2021 17:33:35 GMT
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Post by thehoof on May 27, 2021 17:33:35 GMT
Chiswick , under the COVID rules they are most definitely excluded from the FFP loss; the fine detail is going to be the additional amount of Amortisation and impairment write off- that is what Stoke are trying to argue; COVID has caused the exceptional write offs- if there had never been COVID amortisation would have been included as part of the loss, but where the additional impairment is a DIRECT result of COVID, they will be allowable. Depending on how the EFL assess our additional impairment, TS ( and I am in no way a fan) may very well have played a blinder. So without Covid we would have been completely buggered!! Every cloud......... Yes, I think so. Chiswick is right in that under normal circumstances depreciation of player’s contract over the life of the contract would have been included as part of our FFP loss. However for 2019/ 2020 and 2020/2021, those items of expenditure which are as a direct result of COVID are excluded from the calculation of the FFP loss. On the little bit of information that I have seen, it appears that we are saying that COVID rendered a previously buoyant transfer market now bankrupt and amounts that we may have hoped to recover are therefore no longer valid. If this approach has been discussed, approved and authorised with the relevant authorities then good on TS. If not we could be in for a difficult time. It will all come out fairly soon I would have thought.
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87M Loss
May 27, 2021 17:36:59 GMT
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Post by chuckrocky on May 27, 2021 17:36:59 GMT
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Post by Gods on May 27, 2021 17:39:17 GMT
Knowing our luck we won't find anyone to match the £12m we paid for the stadium and we'll end up sending it to Turkey on a season loan
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87M Loss
May 27, 2021 17:41:06 GMT
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Post by neddy on May 27, 2021 17:41:06 GMT
Can’t read it but is it suggesting bet 365 buy it?
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87M Loss
May 27, 2021 17:45:15 GMT
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Post by nonameface on May 27, 2021 17:45:15 GMT
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Post by FullerMagic on May 27, 2021 17:47:06 GMT
www.telegraph.co.uk/football/2021/05/27/stoke-city-could-forced-sell-stadium-avoid-breaching-financial/Stoke City could be forced to sell stadium to avoid breaching financial rules after £88m loss Exclusive: Stoke are braced to be the latest Championship side to lose ownership of their stadium due to financial problemsStoke City could become the next Championship club to be forced into selling their stadium to avoid breaching financial rules, after recording huge pre-tax losses of £88million.
The club are facing possible sanctions for breaking the Football League’s Profitability & Sustainability regulations next year and are under pressure to consider their options to reduce further losses.
One of those options may be to sell or lease their ground, the bet365 Stadium, following rival Championship clubs Derby, Sheffield Wednesday, Reading and Birmingham, in a bid to fall in line with the rules.
Relegated from the Premier League in 2018, Stoke are owned by the Coates family, who have backed their managers significantly to try and regain promotion back to the top division.
The impact of Covid-19 and absence of supporters since March last year has further impacted on finances, with Championship clubs allowed to record losses of £39million over a three-year period.
Accounts released on Thursday reveal pre-tax losses of £88million, with turnover falling to £49.8million and operating expenses increasing to £141.4million.
It is understood that around £70million of the £88million has been written off the balance sheet on the historic value of players.
Stoke have been vigorously opposed to the EFL’s strict P & S rules in the past, arguing that the limits punish owners with ambition.
Widely regarded as one of the best local owners in English football, the Coates family supported employees during the pandemic last year by continuing to pay wages.
John Coates, the club’s chairman, recently admitted his frustration over the EFL’s rules at a fans’ forum.
He said: “We'll always support our manager to the extent that the rules allow us to support him. Clearly the rules within the Championship and the profit and sustainability rules don't allow us to support him as much as we would like to."
Stoke are managed by Michael O’Neill and finished 14th in the Championship this season.
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Post by chigstoke on May 27, 2021 17:52:06 GMT
Another twist in the Stoke City rollercoaster
Why do I feel like we're living in the reality where it's going to go really tits up for us?
I mean, more tits up than it has done for the past 5 years.
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Post by toppercorner on May 27, 2021 17:55:42 GMT
Can we sell it, and then rebuild the vic!
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Post by followyoudown on May 27, 2021 17:58:51 GMT
Yeah its nonsense no way they would sell to a third party one of the family will buy the ground through a non bet 365 company or something.
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87M Loss
May 27, 2021 18:02:16 GMT
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Post by gingerninja on May 27, 2021 18:02:16 GMT
Which if happens will make a mockery of FFP
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87M Loss
May 27, 2021 18:02:51 GMT
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Post by terrorofturfmoor on May 27, 2021 18:02:51 GMT
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Post by spitthedog on May 27, 2021 18:10:40 GMT
Is it really good for the game that so many clubs are forced to sell their stadiums?
What are these regulations hoping to achieve?
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Post by leesandfordstoupe on May 27, 2021 18:11:11 GMT
The football club doesn’t own the ground so I’m confused as how this could help.
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Post by terrorofturfmoor on May 27, 2021 18:11:43 GMT
Over to you Scholes??? The club need to make a statement about this now, to either refute any reports, or put us in the picture of just how much shit we're really in!!!
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87M Loss
May 27, 2021 18:12:22 GMT
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Post by mowlee on May 27, 2021 18:12:22 GMT
Is the 88 million loss for the 3 seasons which were meant too have a loss of 39 million or less.. so we’re 49 million up the drink with ffp.. we’re going too have too sell the stadium or it’s a 12 point deduction.. an how much is the stadium even worth
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Post by leicspotter on May 27, 2021 18:13:57 GMT
Which if happens will make a mockery of FFP FFP is already a mockery I'm afraid
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Post by dg19531 on May 27, 2021 18:16:12 GMT
Yeah its nonsense no way they would sell to a third party one of the family will buy the ground through a non bet 365 company or something. Non-story. The ground is not owned by Stoke City FC. It is owned by Stoke City (Property) Ltd, a separate subsidiary of Bet365.
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87M Loss
May 27, 2021 18:17:22 GMT
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Post by leesandfordstoupe on May 27, 2021 18:17:22 GMT
Is the 88 million loss for the 3 seasons which were meant too have a loss of 39 million or less.. so we’re 49 million up the drink with ffp.. we’re going too have too sell the stadium or it’s a 12 point deduction.. an how much is the stadium even worth Naah just one year. We were already set to mis the 3 year loss allowed with anything less than a sea change in our finances.
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Post by FullerMagic on May 27, 2021 18:18:03 GMT
Must admit, I always thought the one-time stadium sale gambit thing was not an option for us as we weren't the official owners
Unlike Percy to be completely wide of the mark though
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87M Loss
May 27, 2021 18:20:34 GMT
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Post by mowlee on May 27, 2021 18:20:34 GMT
Is the 88 million loss for the 3 seasons which were meant too have a loss of 39 million or less.. so we’re 49 million up the drink with ffp.. we’re going too have too sell the stadium or it’s a 12 point deduction.. an how much is the stadium even worth Naah just one year. We were already set to mis the 3 year loss allowed with anything less than a sea change in our finances. so what’s the loss for the 3 seasons
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87M Loss
May 27, 2021 18:21:17 GMT
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Post by leesandfordstoupe on May 27, 2021 18:21:17 GMT
Yeah its nonsense no way they would sell to a third party one of the family will buy the ground through a non bet 365 company or something. Non-story. The ground is not owned by Stoke City FC. It is owned by Stoke City (Property) Ltd, a separate subsidiary of Bet365. Unbelievable that they print something that has obviously not even had any basic research put into it.
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Post by gingerninja on May 27, 2021 18:24:47 GMT
Percy is usually pretty spot on when it comes to Stoke City stories.
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Post by yyy on May 27, 2021 18:38:08 GMT
The club has somehow managed to get into this position from being a very wealthy Premier league club, within 5 years we're hearing reports of needing to sell our best young players and now possibly the stadium, you couldn't make it up.
Fancy being that rich with that much Premiership revenue and being so amateurish you find yourself in the position we do from mega riches to rags.
It's like the football version of that young bin man that won the lottery, spunked it all on pros & drugs and now he's back doing the bins.
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87M Loss
May 27, 2021 18:38:08 GMT
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Post by leesandfordstoupe on May 27, 2021 18:38:08 GMT
Naah just one year. We were already set to mis the 3 year loss allowed with anything less than a sea change in our finances. so what’s the loss for the 3 seasons Around £135M
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Post by FullerMagic on May 27, 2021 18:43:11 GMT
Former director:
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Post by Deleted on May 27, 2021 18:44:54 GMT
The club has somehow managed to get into this position from being a very wealthy Premier league club, within 5 years we're hearing reports of needing to sell our best young players and now possibly the stadium, you couldn't make it up. Fancy being that rich with that much Premiership revenue and being so amateurish you find yourself in the position we do from mega riches to rags. It's like the football version of that young bin man that won the lottery, spunked it all on pros & drugs and now he's back doing the bins. FFP is amateurish not us. It allows the big clubs to do whatever the fuck they want which includes keeping the smaller clubs right where they are.
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Post by Deleted on May 27, 2021 18:48:44 GMT
In the space of five years we've gone from knocking on the door of European foothall with our best team in nearly forty years, to this.
What a fucking shit show.
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87M Loss
May 27, 2021 18:50:28 GMT
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Post by s7oke on May 27, 2021 18:50:28 GMT
The football club doesn’t own the ground so I’m confused as how this could help. Me too Maybe we are selling Collins for 88 million to Utd As he’s better than those two stiffs that played last night
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