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Post by marylandstoke on Feb 2, 2020 18:48:32 GMT
This has got to stop.
Today was just ridiculous with the low point being in the Cheese Room by The North Circular.
Old days, two linesmen (sorry Sian, I’m old) and a ref. Decision gets made, wrong or right, sometimes even fun to argue over in the pub afterwards, game goes on, jobs a gudun.
Now, play stops, goals can’t be celebrated, decisions are still, often, nothing but the opinion of a man in a shed in Hayes breathing Airo fuel under the flight path. No value for it live, no value for it on TV.
If anyone can point out the improvements and where this is wrong I would love to be edjumacated. Are there a significant amount of fans who love VAR?
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Post by CampbxllEra on Feb 2, 2020 18:49:31 GMT
This has got to stop.Today was just ridiculous with the low point being in the Cheese Room by The North Circular. Old days, two linesmen (sorry Sian, I’m old) and a ref. Decision gets made, wrong or right, sometimes even fun to argue over in the pub afterwards, game goes on, jobs a gudun. Now, play stops, goals can’t be celebrated, decisions are still, often, nothing but the opinion of a man in a shed in Hayes breathing Airo fuel under the flight path. No value for it live, no value for it on TV. If anyone can point out the improvements and where this is wrong I would love to be edjumacated. Are there a significant amount of fans who love VAR? It was fine today?
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Post by Deleted on Feb 2, 2020 18:51:50 GMT
I think Gary Lineker has a compelling argument r.e. VAR.
It should only exist to be used when the REF has had a howler, if there's something you can see immediately on first replay then reverse the decision but it's this meticulous jobsworth every millimetre bullshit is so frustrating.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 2, 2020 18:54:24 GMT
They got it right yesterday. Ref gave a red for a tackle,var intervened,ref watched the screen and changed his mind himself to a yellow,the correct decision
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Post by GoBoks on Feb 2, 2020 18:57:38 GMT
I think Gary Lineker has a compelling argument r.e. VAR. It should only exist to be used when the REF has had a howler, if there's something you can see immediately on first replay then reverse the decision but it's this meticulous jobsworth every millimetre bullshit is so frustrating. Or each team gets 1 request to review per half. Only for significant decisions (Goals and penalties given/not given) and only where there is obvious question. That way it keeps teams honest and is not the interruption everyone seems so set against. Personally, I'd rather wait a minute and get the right decision than simply have to hold on for a few moments to celebrate. Think ice cream vendor in a certain FA cup Semi-final.
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Post by rawli on Feb 2, 2020 19:21:10 GMT
This has got to stop.Today was just ridiculous with the low point being in the Cheese Room by The North Circular. Old days, two linesmen (sorry Sian, I’m old) and a ref. Decision gets made, wrong or right, sometimes even fun to argue over in the pub afterwards, game goes on, jobs a gudun. Now, play stops, goals can’t be celebrated, decisions are still, often, nothing but the opinion of a man in a shed in Hayes breathing Airo fuel under the flight path. No value for it live, no value for it on TV. If anyone can point out the improvements and where this is wrong I would love to be edjumacated. Are there a significant amount of fans who love VAR? Couldn't give a fuck what premier league teams do. In the olden days it wasn't a tv sport. Now it is. Get over it.
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Post by marylandstoke on Feb 2, 2020 19:21:56 GMT
Did wonder whimsically at one point.....
What if you tried the American Throwball system for challenges. Three substitutes (obvey, as per now) Manager has a red flag. You get a challenge a half and if your wrong you lose a sub.
not practical, not a good idea, never going to be a consideration, but it does make me smile
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Post by Deleted on Feb 2, 2020 20:20:23 GMT
I think Gary Lineker has a compelling argument r.e. VAR. It should only exist to be used when the REF has had a howler, if there's something you can see immediately on first replay then reverse the decision but it's this meticulous jobsworth every millimetre bullshit is so frustrating. Or each team gets 1 request to review per half. Only for significant decisions (Goals and penalties given/not given) and only where there is obvious question. That way it keeps teams honest and is not the interruption everyone seems so set against. Personally, I'd rather wait a minute and get the right decision than simply have to hold on for a few moments to celebrate. Think ice cream vendor in a certain FA cup Semi-final. Killing the goal problem again though, they're going to use that everytime a goal is scored.
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Post by SamB_SCFC on Feb 2, 2020 20:56:37 GMT
I think Gary Lineker has a compelling argument r.e. VAR. It should only exist to be used when the REF has had a howler, if there's something you can see immediately on first replay then reverse the decision but it's this meticulous jobsworth every millimetre bullshit is so frustrating. The problem is how do you define a howler? In the opinion of the team who's just conceded a goal to a fractional offside, that's a howler. I'm a believer in a review system similar to cricket and tennis. 1 review per half per team and they have to decide as and when they use it and how certain they are before they request the review. If you succeed, then you keep your review. If the original decision stands, you lose it. Also the review needs to be for a specific offence. For example, if the defending team alleges a handball or dive in the build up to a goal/penalty and the replay shows that the alleged offence didn't happen but there was a fractional offside elsewhere in the move, the goal will still stand because the decision that had been questioned was correct and the other unqueried offence is deemed irrelevant. It'll focus the reviews to a specific offence and stop time being wasted analysing the entire build up to a goal for any fractional offence. It'll speed things up and stop this ridiculous reviewing of pretty much every goal and goals being disallowed or penalties given for fractional offences that couldn't possibly be seen by the naked eye. If you pointlessly fritter away your review hoping to get a goal disallowed for fractional offside and then become the victim of a real howler later, that's your fault.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 2, 2020 21:23:20 GMT
I think Gary Lineker has a compelling argument r.e. VAR. It should only exist to be used when the REF has had a howler, if there's something you can see immediately on first replay then reverse the decision but it's this meticulous jobsworth every millimetre bullshit is so frustrating. The problem is how do you define a howler? In the opinion of the team who's just conceded a goal to a fractional offside, that's a howler. I'm a believer in a review system similar to cricket and tennis. 1 review per half per team and they have to decide as and when they use it and how certain they are before they request the review. If you succeed, then you keep your review. If the original decision stands, you lose it. Also the review needs to be for a specific offence. For example, if the defending team alleges a handball or dive in the build up to a goal/penalty and the replay shows that the alleged offence didn't happen but there was a fractional offside elsewhere in the move, the goal will still stand because the decision that had been questioned was correct and the other unqueried offence is deemed irrelevant. It'll focus the reviews to a specific offence and stop time being wasted analysing the entire build up to a goal for any fractional offence. It'll speed things up and stop this ridiculous reviewing of pretty much every goal and goals being disallowed or penalties given for fractional offences that couldn't possibly be seen by the naked eye. If you pointlessly fritter away your review hoping to get a goal disallowed for fractional offside and then become the victim of a real howler later, that's your fault. If it's a mistake immediately noticeable watching a replay in normal time on pretty much first viewing.
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Post by bayernoatcake on Feb 2, 2020 21:42:25 GMT
They got it right yesterday. Ref gave a red for a tackle,var intervened,ref watched the screen and changed his mind himself to a yellow,the correct decision Didn’t get it right with the Bournemouth keeper punching the Villa player in the face.
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Post by thfc67 on Feb 2, 2020 21:57:31 GMT
This has got to stop.Today was just ridiculous with the low point being in the Cheese Room by The North Circular. Old days, two linesmen (sorry Sian, I’m old) and a ref. Decision gets made, wrong or right, sometimes even fun to argue over in the pub afterwards, game goes on, jobs a gudun. Now, play stops, goals can’t be celebrated, decisions are still, often, nothing but the opinion of a man in a shed in Hayes breathing Airo fuel under the flight path. No value for it live, no value for it on TV. If anyone can point out the improvements and where this is wrong I would love to be edjumacated. Are there a significant amount of fans who love VAR? Cheese Room?
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Post by chad on Feb 2, 2020 22:08:46 GMT
It’s Shite Fuck it off
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Post by thfc67 on Feb 2, 2020 22:23:56 GMT
It took VAR 2 minutes to decide that a penalty should be awarded. Meanwhile, the game carried on. Spurs or Man City could have scored 2 goals in that time (which would have been disallowed). How long is VAR allowed to deliberate over a decision? Two minutes? 10? 20? Where is the clarity?
How on earth can you run a sport like this. The Premier League is one the most watched leagues around the world, generating billions in revenue. Yet, clowns and fools are allowed to be involved. The problem is not the technology (VAR), it's the implementation of it in the PL.
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Post by marylandstoke on Feb 2, 2020 22:38:11 GMT
This has got to stop.Today was just ridiculous with the low point being in the Cheese Room by The North Circular. Old days, two linesmen (sorry Sian, I’m old) and a ref. Decision gets made, wrong or right, sometimes even fun to argue over in the pub afterwards, game goes on, jobs a gudun. Now, play stops, goals can’t be celebrated, decisions are still, often, nothing but the opinion of a man in a shed in Hayes breathing Airo fuel under the flight path. No value for it live, no value for it on TV. If anyone can point out the improvements and where this is wrong I would love to be edjumacated. Are there a significant amount of fans who love VAR? Cheese Room? Yes The new White Tart Lane, as well as having the one way glass tunnel so you can see your heroes picking their noses (not each other’s, that might be worth seeing) or furious rearranging their “man furniture” (see above) has a speciality gourmet cheese room in its design. It is now on my bucket list to go, with any book by Walpole just so I can say....... I curtailed my Walpoling activities, sallied forth and infiltrated you place of purveyance in the hope of purchasing some cheeeeese
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Post by thfc67 on Feb 2, 2020 22:46:41 GMT
Yes The new White Tart Lane, as well as having the one way glass tunnel so you can see your heroes picking their noses (not each other’s, that might be worth seeing) or furious rearranging their “man furniture” (see above) has a speciality gourmet cheese room in its design. It is now on my bucket list to go, with any book by Walpole just so I can say....... I curtailed my Walpoling activities, sallied forth and infiltrated you place of purveyance in the hope of purchasing some cheeeeese There is no "cheese room" at the Tottenham Hotspur Stadium. You're talking bollocks.
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Post by marylandstoke on Feb 2, 2020 22:57:15 GMT
Yes The new White Tart Lane, as well as having the one way glass tunnel so you can see your heroes picking their noses (not each other’s, that might be worth seeing) or furious rearranging their “man furniture” (see above) has a speciality gourmet cheese room in its design. It is now on my bucket list to go, with any book by Walpole just so I can say....... I curtailed my Walpoling activities, sallied forth and infiltrated you place of purveyance in the hope of purchasing some cheeeeese There is no "cheese room" at the Tottenham Hotspur Stadium. You're talking bollocks. Sir Yes Sir All apologies
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Post by marylandstoke on Feb 2, 2020 22:59:59 GMT
Yes The new White Tart Lane, as well as having the one way glass tunnel so you can see your heroes picking their noses (not each other’s, that might be worth seeing) or furious rearranging their “man furniture” (see above) has a speciality gourmet cheese room in its design. It is now on my bucket list to go, with any book by Walpole just so I can say....... I curtailed my Walpoling activities, sallied forth and infiltrated you place of purveyance in the hope of purchasing some cheeeeese There is no "cheese room" at the Tottenham Hotspur Stadium. You're talking bollocks. Oh, by the way, don’t know if you read much? It doesn’t say there is a cheese room, it says there was one in the design. Which there was in the original
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Post by marylandstoke on Feb 2, 2020 23:03:16 GMT
Yes The new White Tart Lane, as well as having the one way glass tunnel so you can see your heroes picking their noses (not each other’s, that might be worth seeing) or furious rearranging their “man furniture” (see above) has a speciality gourmet cheese room in its design. It is now on my bucket list to go, with any book by Walpole just so I can say....... I curtailed my Walpoling activities, sallied forth and infiltrated you place of purveyance in the hope of purchasing some cheeeeese There is no "cheese room" at the Tottenham Hotspur Stadium. You're talking bollocks. OK....Un-brie-lievable: VIP cheese room at new Spurs stadium melts away. Guardian last Feb, less than a year old. I take it your fact checker is off today.
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Post by rawli on Feb 2, 2020 23:07:13 GMT
They got it right yesterday. Ref gave a red for a tackle,var intervened,ref watched the screen and changed his mind himself to a yellow,the correct decision Didn’t get it right with the Bournemouth keeper punching the Villa player in the face. It is amazing what keepers can do to opponents but as soon as they are so much as looked at they get a foul given.
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Post by boskampsflaps on Feb 2, 2020 23:28:10 GMT
Its all over the place, it needs scrapping until its sorted or forgotten about completely.
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Post by thfc67 on Feb 2, 2020 23:54:24 GMT
There is no "cheese room" at the Tottenham Hotspur Stadium. You're talking bollocks. OK....Un-brie-lievable: VIP cheese room at new Spurs stadium melts away. Guardian last Feb, less than a year old. I take it your fact checker is off today. Fact checker? FACT No.1 - There is no cheese room at the Spurs new ground. FACT No.2 - There never was a cheese room planned at Spurs ground. Wind your neck in. I can take it or leave it if you want to take the piss out of Spurs, I have have plenty of Arsenal and Chelsea mates who do that; but none of them go on about a 'cheese room' because it never existed.
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Post by bayernoatcake on Feb 3, 2020 0:02:56 GMT
Didn’t get it right with the Bournemouth keeper punching the Villa player in the face. It is amazing what keepers can do to opponents but as soon as they are so much as looked at they get a foul given. We saw the other week with De Gea. That was never a foul for me. VAR reversed it. Yet they allow the keeper to punch a player. How they managed to screw that up I don’t know.
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Post by GoBoks on Feb 3, 2020 1:00:12 GMT
Or each team gets 1 request to review per half. Only for significant decisions (Goals and penalties given/not given) and only where there is obvious question. That way it keeps teams honest and is not the interruption everyone seems so set against. Personally, I'd rather wait a minute and get the right decision than simply have to hold on for a few moments to celebrate. Think ice cream vendor in a certain FA cup Semi-final. Killing the goal problem again though, they're going to use that everytime a goal is scored. They only get 1 per half.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 3, 2020 1:32:20 GMT
Killing the goal problem again though, they're going to use that everytime a goal is scored. They only get 1 per half. Enough for a game with 4 goals though... I stand by what I said! 1 a game I would be much more open to.
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Post by blackpoolred on Feb 3, 2020 9:38:17 GMT
This has got to stop.Today was just ridiculous with the low point being in the Cheese Room by The North Circular. Old days, two linesmen (sorry Sian, I’m old) and a ref. Decision gets made, wrong or right, sometimes even fun to argue over in the pub afterwards, game goes on, jobs a gudun. Now, play stops, goals can’t be celebrated, decisions are still, often, nothing but the opinion of a man in a shed in Hayes breathing Airo fuel under the flight path. No value for it live, no value for it on TV. If anyone can point out the improvements and where this is wrong I would love to be edjumacated. Are there a significant amount of fans who love VAR? Overall I think it has been proved to get more of the decisions right, but I have to say with the penalty decisions and the owd handball bollox it is still getting a fair few dreadfully wrong. I like the goal line technology and surely in this day and age we could have instant off-side decisions - again with the aid of technology - why on earth are we having to hold the game up to check for off-side is beyond me - we were flying men to the feckin moon in the 60's surely we can design some technology that gives an instant decision After that, I agree, let's do away with VAR. For me, as stated, so many decisions are plain wrong(Liverpool - Southampton) and so many decisions are just open for debate and depending on the bias of the man sitting in that little room - what is the point - just hand that bias back to the twat in black and let's get back to celebrating goals again
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Post by estrangedsonoffaye on Feb 3, 2020 10:18:44 GMT
If we had VAR in the 70s, how would we have ever come up with our Ice Cream Man Sob story from the FA Cup Semi Final?
Let's be clear, I'm no fan of VAR but to pretend people simply got over bad decisions when entire narratives have been created about them completely glosses over the fact bad decisions, with or without technology have always been key points of contention. VAR exists because of that fact. If people didn't care, or did get over bad decisions, there would have been little to no demand for it.
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Post by stokefc on Feb 3, 2020 10:19:23 GMT
What's a cheese room, somewhere they eat/make cheese at a football ground, sounds weird
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Post by SamB_SCFC on Feb 3, 2020 10:42:25 GMT
The problem is how do you define a howler? In the opinion of the team who's just conceded a goal to a fractional offside, that's a howler. I'm a believer in a review system similar to cricket and tennis. 1 review per half per team and they have to decide as and when they use it and how certain they are before they request the review. If you succeed, then you keep your review. If the original decision stands, you lose it. Also the review needs to be for a specific offence. For example, if the defending team alleges a handball or dive in the build up to a goal/penalty and the replay shows that the alleged offence didn't happen but there was a fractional offside elsewhere in the move, the goal will still stand because the decision that had been questioned was correct and the other unqueried offence is deemed irrelevant. It'll focus the reviews to a specific offence and stop time being wasted analysing the entire build up to a goal for any fractional offence. It'll speed things up and stop this ridiculous reviewing of pretty much every goal and goals being disallowed or penalties given for fractional offences that couldn't possibly be seen by the naked eye. If you pointlessly fritter away your review hoping to get a goal disallowed for fractional offside and then become the victim of a real howler later, that's your fault. If it's a mistake immediately noticeable watching a replay in normal time on pretty much first viewing. The problem with rules is they have to be definable by specific parameters. 'Immediately noticeable' is just too vague and subjective to be written into the rule book. While anyone with common sense knows exactly what you mean, there will still be those borderline cases that are missed one week and spotted the next, causing uproar when a goal rightly gets disallowed one week then doesn't the next for the same offence despite the fact that both goals got reviewed because the official in the second week wasn't as good as the official in the previous week and didn't process the information quickly enough. Part of the problem with VAR in my opinion is because of the difficulty with defining 'clear and obvious' which leads to the officials defaulting to a letter by letter approach to interpreting the rules in an attempt to get consistency. Which is why we're getting these ridiculous finger nail offside decisons that take 5 minutes of forensically measuring millimetres to work out. For me a challenge system is the best way to get around all of these issues. Each team has to decide when and if to use their challenge and what for, and VAR then analyses in as much detail as is required for the challenged offence. Time isn't wasted analysing offences other than the issue that the team wants to challenge, and once a challenge has been used up (because it failed to overturn the on pitch decision) fans and players are safe to celebrate any further goals without any danger of intervention from VAR. I think it could introduce an interesting dynamic to the game. With only 1 challenge per half, teams would have to think twice about challenging goals just for the sake of it because a big mistake could occur later in the half that they'll not be able to challenge because they wasted it earlier in the half on an obviously good goal. And there will still be a mechanism to use VAR for the original reason it was designed for if a team manages their challenges effectively, overturning obviously bad decisions. If two howlers occur against the same team in one half, they'll still be able to challenge both because they'll retain their challenge if they successfully overturn the decision. While teams who waste time frivolously challenging goals or obvious red cards for the sake of it will be punished if they are later a victim of a bad decision and are then unable to challenge it because they wasted it earlier.
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Post by Billy the kid on Feb 3, 2020 16:47:04 GMT
OK....Un-brie-lievable: VIP cheese room at new Spurs stadium melts away. Guardian last Feb, less than a year old. I take it your fact checker is off today. Fact checker? FACT No.1 - There is no cheese room at the Spurs new ground. FACT No.2 - There never was a cheese room planned at Spurs ground. Wind your neck in. I can take it or leave it if you want to take the piss out of Spurs, I have have plenty of Arsenal and Chelsea mates who do that; but none of them go on about a 'cheese room' because it never existed. Im sorry mate, What a truly bizarre thing to argue about. I'm quite gutted now that their isn't a cheese room at your stadium.
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