Gambling on credit Cards.

[somersetstokie]

I myself do not gamble except perhaps on odd occasions such as the Derby, even though I am very aware and interested in the Horse Racing calendar as I seem to live and work in areas of the West Country and Cotswolds where training stables are numerous.

I am perhaps a bit naive here as, if wishing to make a bet, I would expect to pay cash, without being especially hopeful of any return. I would understand that betting companies might operate credit accounts for appropriate clients and this is how debts on credit build up. However, perhaps I've never given it any thought, but I am extremely surprised that gambling is permitted on credit cards, and wasn't even aware that this happened until it was announced today that the Government wants to end the practice. I was stunned to be honest that this practice of using credit cards or plastic to bet hasn't been curtailed before. I know this is important stuff to a huge proportion of the population, but without wishing to cause offence to the majority, really, why was this previously allowed. We all know that gambling can cause huge problems, so why make it so easy to run up a sizeable debt, as I am sure that by using a credit card, there is less awareness or realisation of just how much you might be spending.

I haven't seen much follow up on the news but surely this is going to be a huge issue going forward, and the big International gambling operations such as BET365 seem to be coming under sustained fire at present and facing a bumpy time in the markets.

[salopstick]

It seems to me that gambling is being dealt out like crack cocaine

I’m more surprised the FA allow current managers to appear in gambling adverts

[Frogger Theft Auto]

I think there's always been a big fee from the credit card company to use them at the bookies. Deposit £10 on one and be charged something like £3 on top.

Guess it was to stop people getting around the cash advance fees by putting whatever cash they needed on something that was certain to come in and withdrawing it fee free.

Never really worth doing.

[chigstoke]

I believe Paddy Power offer their own credit card you can take to any standard cash machine and withdraw.

It's absolutely dangerous and good they're cracking down on it. I couldn't imagine using a credit card to gamble, straight up lethal.

I like a bet, but I set up a very strict deposit limit which severely limits me to what I can bet with.

[sheikhmomo]

Only around 6-8% of all on-line gambling is done via credit card but you are twice as likely to be a problem gambler if you use credit cards than those that don't. The charges levied on credit card transactions are prohibitive for most but it's worth noting that 80% of credit card gamblers are not classed as problem gamblers and use that method for convenience and clarity of their affairs. As usual it's a bit of a sledgehammer to crack a nut and not really attacking the problem from the right angle.

[crouchpotato1]

I didn’t realise how hooked youngsters(16--25 year olds I’d say) are nowadays on gambling.At work phones are out gambling on anything and everything and on New Years Eve me and the mrs went to Uttoxeter races for a good day out but I couldn’t believe how many youngsters were in attendance😮I think the gate was around the 10,000 mark and I’d hazard a guess that half were in the age bracket I quoted earlier.All the lads suited and booted and the girls😮looking like they’re on a night out.Don’t get me wrong they were all having a great time but I couldn’t believe how much money was changing hands from these youngsters.
I would imagine that online gambling has a lot to do with this age group becoming big gamblers

[salopstick]

Gambling adverts and sponsorship will be next

I understand momo saying it’s a small notional step but the whole regulation of gambling will be done slowly Piece by piece

[Pretty Little Boother]

Torn on this. I've never really been a big gambler (primarily because I'm wank at it) and as such, not really seen the attraction in it, particularly when you see how destructive it can be. However, we all have our own vices and some of these can be just as bad.

Yet, people need to be free to make these choices for themselves. We cannot, as a society, take on the mantle of being babysitter and banning things like this. Not only will it not work but it will lead to other problems. The clearest way around it will be to withdraw cash at an ATM with a credit card and immediately deposit it into a debit account. It won't work so it is a waste of public resources to try. Not only this, but if you make it more difficult for regulated bookies to accept bets, then you will increase a lucrative market for illicit gambling, the same as every instance of prohibition in recorded history.

The answer, as always, lies in education. But, this is a long-term solution that will only work over a generation. As always, people crave the quick-fix sticking plaster solution that makes you feel good for doing something immediately, and makes you look good in front of idiots who just want to see a reaction, but won't actually do any good to anyone. It'll just inconvenience the moderate better.

[somersetstokie]

I heard a women being interviewed at length on BBC Radio 5 live tonight and she was ostensibly the head of some National Gaming and Betting watchdog Authority that monitors and controls the gambling industry. She insisted that the big gambling concerns are responsible operators and are aware of the issues. For example she claimed that gamblers who are clearly into things way above their heads will be identified and their accounts and activities will be restricted. Now where have I heard that before. She was making the case for effective self regulation of the industry and the gambling companies are the best placed people to introduce change where it might be needed. Better the Devil you know than the Devil you don't, as after all, "we don't want to drive people onto unregulated sites abroad."

It all seemed very distasteful, especially from the head of a Watchdog body, who seemed to be stating, either through ignorance or denial, that the concerns about the growth of UK gambling are unfounded and there is not really a problem.

[bigvern]

I think it's a step in the right direction. I was massively addicted back in the mid 90s to mid 00s and I did myself spunk my 3000 limit in the bookies drawing 300 a time from the cash point. If I had a credit card with £1,000,000 on it I would've spunked the lot. If betting gets its claws into you it cam be devastating. I hope all of the fuckers go under including Bet365 ( little hope I know). I must have given the bookies at least £100,000 and probably a lot more and for a working class lad from stoke that's a fortune.

[Deleted]

If you're betting on credit cards then you've got a problem.

Yes, that's a sweeping statement, but I cant see how anyone would go down that route.

Its insane and devoid of any rhyme or reason.

[Deleted]

Jan 14, 2020 19:08:01 GMT @redapples said:

If you're betting on credit cards then you've got a problem.

Yes, that's a sweeping statement, but I cant see how anyone would go down that route.

Its insane and devoid of any rhyme or reason.

I use my CC to make bets, but i pay it off every month, but then again it's not big bets , just the odd £50 every week for the Footy

[telfordstoke]

I only realised there was a fee levied by the card company til last year. Like some on thread I’m a Derby/Grand National gambler only, but when the Champions League final was on Paddy Powe (and others) did an offer for new customers that gave you your money back if your bet lost. So I signed up and duly lost and cashed out. I then decided to cancel account which took several emails and two phone calls ( “ yes I am really sure I dont want it and yes I know you can put a hold on my account to stop me ga,bling if I leave it open” - “ but are you sure, really sure you don’t just want to leave it open?!” ) . Quite an eye opener considering the when the fun stops, stop line.

Then when the cc statement arrived, sure enough there’s a £3 fee levied. In future I’ll simply use cash at the high st bookies cos the opening account route did not work at all for me.

[henry]

Jan 14, 2020 13:46:11 GMT salopstick said:

It seems to me that gambling is being dealt out like crack cocaine

I’m more surprised the FA allow current managers to appear in gambling adverts

It's an uncomfortable position, but not as uncomfortable as big racing stables being sponsored by major bookmaking firms.

[redstriper]

I gamble a lot, but only with money i can afford to lose, however I'm sure that sports betting is not the problem here, its the online casinos, they are seriously addictive and its far too easy to lose large sums in a very short space of time.

[santy]

What is an appropriate use of a credit card though and who gets the right to decide? Surely its just as much an issue in some regards if you're using your credit card to place a bet as it is if you're using it to buy a takeaway, buy expensive clothes, get a season ticket etc.

I don't gamble at all, having realised long ago that I'm far too likely a person to get addicted and its the same with drink so I give that a large swerve most of the time as well. Also extends to drugs so I've never gone down the route of smoking weed or anything stronger. For me that isn't something to be lauded, its just the case that I noticed these things were possible issues so avoided them.

There's still plenty of other shit in life though where I waste money much the same way as someone who gambles does.

Outside of poker does anyone really consider gambling to be where they'd make their living? I'm sure the fantasy applies to winning big but realistically the logic to me seems to follow that you're essentially putting money in for the enhanced experience you get as a byproduct of that. Gambling spending isn't a necessity in life. But then neither is a lot of what most of us do. Some people are predisposed to going for a car on credit that is maybe out of their bracket or stretches their finances. Others get holidays they can ill-afford. Some deck out their wardrobes with credit. For an awful lot of people getting a credit card in the first place is going to be the problem as they can use it frivolously on whatever they desire.

It seems strange to me that there's so much interest in having the government trying to legislate our behaviour. For me, if gambling has to be so heavily restricted or phased out then I believe the only logical end destination is for so much more to go with it. Essentially, if we all want the government to play a role in deciding what is best for us and what's appropriate we should just be restricted to our one government issued garb that we can purchase for a low price and our 3 government issued daily meals at a set price meeting all nutritional requirement and then there should be no deviation. No need to go out on the weekends unless you want recreational drinking of water with friends. A system can be introduced where all electronic devices such as TV's, laptops etc are shut down X amount of hours before our next shift to ensure we only sleep a healthy amount and of course the content on there can be modified accordingly. Football would have to be fucked off too, how much money do people waste following football.

Personally I'm just of the mind to say legalise the lot, but put taxes on the things you don't want to encourage.

[Pretty Little Boother]

Jan 14, 2020 21:21:06 GMT santy said:

What is an appropriate use of a credit card though and who gets the right to decide? Surely its just as much an issue in some regards if you're using your credit card to place a bet as it is if you're using it to buy a takeaway, buy expensive clothes, get a season ticket etc.

I don't gamble at all, having realised long ago that I'm far too likely a person to get addicted and its the same with drink so I give that a large swerve most of the time as well. Also extends to drugs so I've never gone down the route of smoking weed or anything stronger. For me that isn't something to be lauded, its just the case that I noticed these things were possible issues so avoided them.

There's still plenty of other shit in life though where I waste money much the same way as someone who gambles does.

Outside of poker does anyone really consider gambling to be where they'd make their living? I'm sure the fantasy applies to winning big but realistically the logic to me seems to follow that you're essentially putting money in for the enhanced experience you get as a byproduct of that. Gambling spending isn't a necessity in life. But then neither is a lot of what most of us do. Some people are predisposed to going for a car on credit that is maybe out of their bracket or stretches their finances. Others get holidays they can ill-afford. Some deck out their wardrobes with credit. For an awful lot of people getting a credit card in the first place is going to be the problem as they can use it frivolously on whatever they desire.

It seems strange to me that there's so much interest in having the government trying to legislate our behaviour. For me, if gambling has to be so heavily restricted or phased out then I believe the only logical end destination is for so much more to go with it. Essentially, if we all want the government to play a role in deciding what is best for us and what's appropriate we should just be restricted to our one government issued garb that we can purchase for a low price and our 3 government issued daily meals at a set price meeting all nutritional requirement and then there should be no deviation. No need to go out on the weekends unless you want recreational drinking of water with friends. A system can be introduced where all electronic devices such as TV's, laptops etc are shut down X amount of hours before our next shift to ensure we only sleep a healthy amount and of course the content on there can be modified accordingly. Football would have to be fucked off too, how much money do people waste following football.

Personally I'm just of the mind to say legalise the lot, but put taxes on the things you don't want to encourage.

Pretty much a perfect post until that last clause.

[Widget123]

Jan 14, 2020 20:18:27 GMT redstriper said:

I gamble a lot, but only with money i can afford to lose, however I'm sure that sports betting is not the problem here, its the online casinos, they are seriously addictive and its far too easy to lose large sums in a very short space of time.

Completely agree. I've lost track of the number of times in recent years I've been away on business and sat in the bar reading the news, watching bored sales professionals at chairs next to me rinsing hundreds and hundreds of pounds in online casinos. It truly scary how quickly these guys and gals lose what must be very substantial sums of money.

[santy]

Jan 14, 2020 21:50:17 GMT Pretty Little Boother said:

Pretty much a perfect post until that last clause.

To be honest, the chances of any kind of common sense being utilised means I've given very little thought to the tax aspect. It just seems one of the ways in which taxation could perhaps be shifted away from individuals and more onto things that have an argument whereby they increase the costs for society.

[salopstick]

Jan 15, 2020 10:00:55 GMT santy said:

Jan 14, 2020 21:50:17 GMT Pretty Little Boother said:

Pretty much a perfect post until that last clause.

To be honest, the chances of any kind of common sense being utilised means I've given very little thought to the tax aspect. It just seems one of the ways in which taxation could perhaps be shifted away from individuals and more onto things that have an argument whereby they increase the costs for society.

That’s the problem with perceived bad things such as drink, drugs, fags and gambling.

It’s the destructive impact they can have on families and wider society

[3putts]

Jan 15, 2020 10:14:57 GMT salopstick said:

Jan 15, 2020 10:00:55 GMT santy said:

To be honest, the chances of any kind of common sense being utilised means I've given very little thought to the tax aspect. It just seems one of the ways in which taxation could perhaps be shifted away from individuals and more onto things that have an argument whereby they increase the costs for society.

That’s the problem with perceived bad things such as drink, drugs, fags and gambling.

It’s the destructive impact they can have on families and wider society

OK so let's ban everything like prohibition on alcohol in the states that worked didn't it? Or maybe we can treat people like adults and let them decide how much they want to risk?
It's funny ain't it we have a new tory government and the first thing they do is go after one of labour's donors?? Not like there's nowt else that needs attention is there?

[mrcoke]

Jan 15, 2020 10:14:57 GMT salopstick said:

Jan 15, 2020 10:00:55 GMT santy said:

To be honest, the chances of any kind of common sense being utilised means I've given very little thought to the tax aspect. It just seems one of the ways in which taxation could perhaps be shifted away from individuals and more onto things that have an argument whereby they increase the costs for society.

That’s the problem with perceived bad things such as drink, drugs, fags and gambling.

It’s the destructive impact they can have on families and wider society

I think there has to be a balance between regulation in the general interest of society and a free society where everyone can do as they please.
We probably all have a different opinion on where the fulcrum should lie.
In the 1950s there were those who criticized the government issuing premium bonds and saw it as encouraging gambling. At that time there was no legal off course gambling until bookmaker shops were legalised and the main form of gambling was the football pools.
We have subsequently seen a massive growth in gambling. There were leaps in growth along the way. Firstly the National Lottery, which made it socially acceptable to bet as part of the profits went to "good works". The second major boost has been the internet. 
When the National Lottery started I could see that it was a step that society would come to regret. I think it was Marx who said that religeon was the "opium of the people" (I stand to be corrected on that), but nowadays gambling has become a national addiction, which only a very few members of society draw any benefit from.

[somersetstokie]

As i said in my original post if I gamble it is only on the big showpiece horse races. As the last poster indicated the start of legal off course betting with High St Bookies was the real beginning of the National gambling malaise.

When I was young one sage friend pointed out to me that if you go into a Big City Betting Shop you are likely to see 6 or 7 cashier windows for "paying in" or laying bets, but probably on 2 are needed for paying out. Says it all really.

[chigstoke]

Jan 15, 2020 15:48:51 GMT mrcoke said:

Jan 15, 2020 10:14:57 GMT salopstick said:

That’s the problem with perceived bad things such as drink, drugs, fags and gambling.

It’s the destructive impact they can have on families and wider society

I think there has to be a balance between regulation in the general interest of society and a free society where everyone can do as they please.
We probably all have a different opinion on where the fulcrum should lie.
In the 1950s there were those who criticized the government issuing premium bonds and saw it as encouraging gambling. At that time there was no legal off course gambling until bookmaker shops were legalised and the main form of gambling was the football pools.
We have subsequently seen a massive growth in gambling. There were leaps in growth along the way. Firstly the National Lottery, which made it socially acceptable to bet as part of the profits went to "good works". The second major boost has been the internet. 
When the National Lottery started I could see that it was a step that society would come to regret. I think it was Marx who said that religeon was the "opium of the people" (I stand to be corrected on that), but nowadays gambling has become a national addiction, which only a very few members of society draw any benefit from.

I've given up completely now on the national lottery now. I could spend a tenner a week on it for the Euro or Lotto and I'd be going nowhere very fast.

I just put £40 a month aside now instead of spending on the lottery, which comes to a nice £480 at the end of the year, so that can be used on Christmas, put towards an holiday, rainy day fund etc... It's just like winning my own money!

[3putts]

Jan 14, 2020 17:48:58 GMT bigvern said:

I think it's a step in the right direction. I was massively addicted back in the mid 90s to mid 00s and I did myself spunk my 3000 limit in the bookies drawing 300 a time from the cash point. If I had a credit card with £1,000,000 on it I would've spunked the lot. If betting gets its claws into you it cam be devastating. I hope all of the fuckers go under including Bet365 ( little hope I know). I must have given the bookies at least £100,000 and probably a lot more and for a working class lad from stoke that's a fortune.

That's shocking you want to see a local company go to the wall costing 1,000s of jobs because of your own weakness? Nobody forced you to gamble. I had a massive hangover the other day should I be campaigning for the government to close all breweries?

[georgieboy52]

Jan 16, 2020 2:43:19 GMT 3putts said:

Jan 14, 2020 17:48:58 GMT bigvern said:

I think it's a step in the right direction. I was massively addicted back in the mid 90s to mid 00s and I did myself spunk my 3000 limit in the bookies drawing 300 a time from the cash point. If I had a credit card with £1,000,000 on it I would've spunked the lot. If betting gets its claws into you it cam be devastating. I hope all of the fuckers go under including Bet365 ( little hope I know). I must have given the bookies at least £100,000 and probably a lot more and for a working class lad from stoke that's a fortune.

That's shocking you want to see a local company go to the wall costing 1,000s of jobs because of your own weakness? Nobody forced you to gamble. I had a massive hangover the other day should I be campaigning for the government to close all breweries?

I don't think you'd see it like that if one of your own family were addicted to gambling.

It's not a weakness it's an illness and now recognised as such.

It was reported by an insider that bet365 used an algorithm to stop or limit regular winners recently. They don't have one to stop people from losing.

They do as you say employ a lot of people, I'm not sure how many are locals but they're not exactly quality jobs are they ?

How far we have dropped as a City since we had big manufacturing industries. Now it's all low paid service work.

[henry]

The “rush” of online gambling is being planted into youngsters minds from an early age through things like fifa points / player packs. Buying substandard goods online and realising it’s tat when it gets delivered all make spending money and having nothing to show for it part of every day life.
It’s a booming business.

[3putts]

Jan 16, 2020 6:51:21 GMT georgieboy52 said:

Jan 16, 2020 2:43:19 GMT 3putts said:

That's shocking you want to see a local company go to the wall costing 1,000s of jobs because of your own weakness? Nobody forced you to gamble. I had a massive hangover the other day should I be campaigning for the government to close all breweries?

I don't think you'd see it like that if one of your own family were addicted to gambling.

It's not a weakness it's an illness and now recognised as such.

It was reported by an insider that bet365 used an algorithm to stop or limit regular winners recently. They don't have one to stop people from losing.

They do as you say employ a lot of people, I'm not sure how many are locals but they're not exactly quality jobs are they ?

How far we have dropped as a City since we had big manufacturing industries. Now it's all low paid service work.

my dad loved the horses but he would only bet with what he had in his pocket.i bet more on football these days but love a day at the races I allways keep my gambling money separate than my spending money[nothing gets in the way of my beer money] sometimes I win sometimes I lose its no problem. the problem gamblers are those who are convinced they are going to win big and change their life. that aint going to happen. same as going into a casino chances are your going to come out with less money than you entered.if you cannot accept that then don't go in its simple really
re bet365 I bet they pay considerably more than many of the so called "sheds" that have sprung up in s-o-t to replace all the jobs lost in the mines and potbanks.
we are living in the snowflake generation now ban everything lets ban macdonalds too many youngsters are too lazy to cook.

[mrcoke]

Jan 16, 2020 6:51:21 GMT georgieboy52 said:

Jan 16, 2020 2:43:19 GMT 3putts said:

That's shocking you want to see a local company go to the wall costing 1,000s of jobs because of your own weakness? Nobody forced you to gamble. I had a massive hangover the other day should I be campaigning for the government to close all breweries?

I don't think you'd see it like that if one of your own family were addicted to gambling.

It's not a weakness it's an illness and now recognised as such.

It was reported by an insider that bet365 used an algorithm to stop or limit regular winners recently. They don't have one to stop people from losing.

They do as you say employ a lot of people, I'm not sure how many are locals but they're not exactly quality jobs are they ?

How far we have dropped as a City since we had big manufacturing industries. Now it's all low paid service work.

I would call it an addiction.
"Addiction is a brain disorder characterized by compulsive engagement in rewarding stimuli despite adverse consequences."
I would suggest it starts as a weakness, becomes a habit, and then a dependency.

[3putts]

Jan 16, 2020 10:02:10 GMT mrcoke said:

Jan 16, 2020 6:51:21 GMT georgieboy52 said:

I don't think you'd see it like that if one of your own family were addicted to gambling.

It's not a weakness it's an illness and now recognised as such.

It was reported by an insider that bet365 used an algorithm to stop or limit regular winners recently. They don't have one to stop people from losing.

They do as you say employ a lot of people, I'm not sure how many are locals but they're not exactly quality jobs are they ?

How far we have dropped as a City since we had big manufacturing industries. Now it's all low paid service work.

I would call it an addiction.
"Addiction is a brain disorder characterized by compulsive engagement in rewarding stimuli despite adverse consequences."
I would suggest it starts as a weakness, becomes a habit, and then a dependency.

addiction whatever its the blame game. no its not your fault you have done the housekeeping at bingo its those nasty people at the bingo halls with their lurid advertising. people need to be held responsible for their own actions and stop blaming someone else. if you have spunked your money away at the bookies or casino there is only one person to blame. likewise when I drink too much I will not send a letter to the brewery complaining about my hangover.
for the record I fully agree about banning creditcards as you should NEVER gamble on borrowed money