will itchy trigger finger solve our problems.

[ted1965]

As the pressure mounts on Nathan Jones should we really be preparing for another bout of itchy trigger finger syndrome, no I am not defending Jones or his record thus far. I am asking however how many more managers we can go through before the questions about the structure of the club comes under more fire.
Jones must be given more time not unending time but he must be given until the end of November before we start discussing whether he should be fired, he inherited a mess I doubt many would argue with that. The club had fallen asleep at the wheel and relegation was the only outcome from such negligence and short sightedness.

Mark Hughes had become jaded and seemed caught between fear and a desire to continue the progress we had made under him. He lost his bottle and became tentative in his approach which destroyed the joy he and the team had created. When the board allowed him to continue the hits kept coming and supporters lost faith and he became even more introverted which killed us on the field. The board should have had a competent replacement lined up before pulling the trigger on Hughes that season, sadly having fired him they had merely plans and ideas which resulted in Lambert and the slide was complete.

They promised a root and branch clear out but in reality Lambert was released and they thought the problems could be solved by merely bringing in a decent Championship manager in Rowett, sadly we all know how that ended so obviously he was the problem and nothing changed move onto the next saviour a young up and coming manager who had produced some wonderful times for Luton after years of disasters problem solved. So is Jones a terrible manager based on his results here you would say yes but can every manager be the problem.

If we don’t give the man some time we will be looking for another saviour and on and on it goes, the revolving managerial door through the 80’s and early 90’s proved so successful, yes there were some green shoots of recovery but none lasted more than a few months before they were snuffed out. We can’t return to those days, well we can but I sincerely hope we don’t.

We were spoiled by 10 years of modest success in the Premier League but for now those days are gone and unless we can bring some real stability to the club they will not return again for many years to come. We will become just another club who people will only talk about when we play one of the big boys in a cup competition. The pain of watching some of those lumbering stars will return the Bamber’s, such greats as Keith Scott will once more be the norm getting excited by seeing the modern day versions of such stars as faded talents like Paul Stewart lumbering around in a red and white shirt fills my heart with glee.

Tony Waddington, was given a lot of criticism for years many wanted him out because the football was dull and going nowhere fast yet look what time and stability did for us then. I am not comparing Jones to the great Waddo but he needs more time before we consign him to the one more failed manager at Stoke City., a list that is longer than a Ted post.

I understand the frustrations but sometimes time is a great healer.
Its not easy watching the same wide open spaces being exploited by opponent’s week in week out, scoring goals against Stoke at the moment isn’t a difficult task. It’s similar to a batsman in cricket getting out to a long hop every time and making no adjustments while the media tell you how great a player he is. The midfield combinations are totally wrong for our system, what does Joe Allen do, he nether wins the ball or protects the defence nor does he create very much going forward he needs to be dropped if that hurts his ego maybe it will make him look into his soul and understand football is played on the field not in the minds of his friends in the media.

I am not praising Jones at the moment either but it’s make or break for him over the next 10 games for me, show us that you understand the squad at your disposal and use them properly, players need to be playing because they are bringing something to a formation and not because they once played at a higher level. If a youngster is good enough and improves the side they need to play results are what we need now not idealistic stubbornness if he can’t move past his belief in his system then he will be gone whoever likes him or loathes him. For me I like him and want his to succeed but its down to him and this wonderful group to show he’s got what it takes to do so. I honestly believe we may have to suffer a little more pain but it could just be worth the painful patience needed.

[sheikhmomo]

Aug 24, 2019 8:22:38 GMT ted1965 said:

As the pressure mounts on Nathan Jones should we really be preparing for another bout of itchy trigger finger syndrome, no I am not defending Jones or his record thus far. I am asking however how many more managers we can go through before the questions about the structure of the club comes under more fire.
Jones must be given more time not unending time but he must be given until the end of November before we start discussing whether he should be fired, he inherited a mess I doubt many would argue with that. The club had fallen asleep at the wheel and relegation was the only outcome from such negligence and short sightedness.

Mark Hughes had become jaded and seemed caught between fear and a desire to continue the progress we had made under him. He lost his bottle and became tentative in his approach which destroyed the joy he and the team had created. When the board allowed him to continue the hits kept coming and supporters lost faith and he became even more introverted which killed us on the field. The board should have had a competent replacement lined up before pulling the trigger on Hughes that season, sadly having fired him they had merely plans and ideas which resulted in Lambert and the slide was complete.

They promised a root and branch clear out but in reality Lambert was released and they thought the problems could be solved by merely bringing in a decent Championship manager in Rowett, sadly we all know how that ended so obviously he was the problem and nothing changed move onto the next saviour a young up and coming manager who had produced some wonderful times for Luton after years of disasters problem solved. So is Jones a terrible manager based on his results here you would say yes but can every manager be the problem.

If we don’t give the man some time we will be looking for another saviour and on and on it goes, the revolving managerial door through the 80’s and early 90’s proved so successful, yes there were some green shoots of recovery but none lasted more than a few months before they were snuffed out. We can’t return to those days, well we can but I sincerely hope we don’t.

We were spoiled by 10 years of modest success in the Premier League but for now those days are gone and unless we can bring some real stability to the club they will not return again for many years to come. We will become just another club who people will only talk about when we play one of the big boys in a cup competition. The pain of watching some of those lumbering stars will return the Bamber’s, such greats as Keith Scott will once more be the norm getting excited by seeing the modern day versions of such stars as faded talents like Paul Stewart lumbering around in a red and white shirt fills my heart with glee.

Tony Waddington, was given a lot of criticism for years many wanted him out because the football was dull and going nowhere fast yet look what time and stability did for us then. I am not comparing Jones to the great Waddo but he needs more time before we consign him to the one more failed manager at Stoke City., a list that is longer than a Ted post.

I understand the frustrations but sometimes time is a great healer.
Its not easy watching the same wide open spaces being exploited by opponent’s week in week out, scoring goals against Stoke at the moment isn’t a difficult task. It’s similar to a batsman in cricket getting out to a long hop every time and making no adjustments while the media tell you how great a player he is. The midfield combinations are totally wrong for our system, what does Joe Allen do, he nether wins the ball or protects the defence nor does he create very much going forward he needs to be dropped if that hurts his ego maybe it will make him look into his soul and understand football is played on the field not in the minds of his friends in the media.

I am not praising Jones at the moment either but it’s make or break for him over the next 10 games for me, show us that you understand the squad at your disposal and use them properly, players need to be playing because they are bringing something to a formation and not because they once played at a higher level. If a youngster is good enough and improves the side they need to play results are what we need now not idealistic stubbornness if he can’t move past his belief in his system then he will be gone whoever likes him or loathes him. For me I like him and want his to succeed but its down to him and this wonderful group to show he’s got what it takes to do so. I honestly believe we may have to suffer a little more pain but it could just be worth the painful patience needed.

End of November will be 20 games in Ted. Way too long to keep him with out significant improvement. The one way he can keep his job is win some games, its that simple. Any notion of achieving anything this season has already been laid to rest, expectations are low, he doesn't have to go an a run or win 10 on the bounce or anything daft like that but he needs to win three of the next six or seven to restore some sanity and stability to the situation. With the resources he's got and the overall quality of the division that should be well within his capabilities. If he doesn't, he'll be toast and rightfully so.

[thestatusquo]

He’s already had 8 months Ted and there’s no real sign of improvement

[Goonie]

I dont think sacking Jones will help unless we're relegated

Staying up is the main aim now

[Deleted]

I think you have to look at why the last three managers haven't had an instant reaction from the squad and ask why?  I know you don't always get them but to have three in a row is pretty special

Lambert and Rowett were quite pragmatic.  Rowett had limited success at the top end of the Championship, without ever achieving anything and Lambert had experience (again limited) of fudging a team to safety and promotion from the Championship and League One.

Jones had created a machine at Luton, on a totally different planet to the previous two managers.

So why have three different managers spanning two very different styles of football 'failed' to hit the ground running - one manager having over 50M to spend?


My question is how many more managers have we got to go through before we hit the root of the problem?

[sheikhmomo]

Aug 24, 2019 9:34:07 GMT theonlooker said:

I think you have to look at why the last three managers haven't had an instant reaction from the squad and ask why?  I know you don't always get them but to have three in a row is pretty special

Lambert and Rowett were quite pragmatic.  Rowett had limited success at the top end of the Championship, without ever achieving anything and Lambert had experience (again limited) of fudging a team to safety and promotion from the Championship and League One.

Jones had created a machine at Luton, on a totally different planet to the previous two managers.

So why have three different managers spanning two very different styles of football 'failed' to hit the ground running - one manager having over 50M to spend?


My question is how many more managers have we got to go through before we hit the root of the problem?

Yeah and there's nothing to suggest that any new manager would get any more out of the job but at the same time it's not a never ending free pass either. If he doesn't get a couple of wins very, very soon his job will become untenable.

[teenagefanclub]

Is no one allowed to tell Ted "there are already loads of threads regarding this, why start a new one"

[Deleted]

Aug 24, 2019 9:47:04 GMT sheikhmomo said:

Aug 24, 2019 9:34:07 GMT theonlooker said:

I think you have to look at why the last three managers haven't had an instant reaction from the squad and ask why?  I know you don't always get them but to have three in a row is pretty special

Lambert and Rowett were quite pragmatic.  Rowett had limited success at the top end of the Championship, without ever achieving anything and Lambert had experience (again limited) of fudging a team to safety and promotion from the Championship and League One.

Jones had created a machine at Luton, on a totally different planet to the previous two managers.

So why have three different managers spanning two very different styles of football 'failed' to hit the ground running - one manager having over 50M to spend?


My question is how many more managers have we got to go through before we hit the root of the problem?

Yeah and there's nothing to suggest that any new manager would get any more out of the job but at the same time it's not a never ending free pass either. If he doesn't get a couple of wins very, very soon his job will become untenable.

Like you say, that's the law of the jungle.    I've asked it many times and will continue to do so - where do the club go next in the event of an untenable situation?  What kind of manager do they go for since pretty much all bases have been now covered - experienced manager, pragmatic manager, young up and coming manager, attacking football manager.

We'll have half a squad of unmotivated bomb squadders, half a squad of Jones players littered with players in between that have either been signed previously and come down through the leagues with us or signed by Rowett wondering just what the hell is going on.

If there are more scenes like Bristol City last season then the next man in has a hell of a job to lift players that have gone through that twice in some cases.


We just need a dirty win or three from somewhere in the next month or so to calm the whole situation down.


In the medium term the club need to get rid of the CEO and bring in two football people in two crucial positions - CEO and Technical/Sporting Director.  They then need to dip into their contact book and find a real bona fide sports/stats analysis expert to come in and create a rock solid recruitment model.  The longer we carry on with the idiots running the club at the top then the longer we will be outside of the top division.  Their money though, their choice.

[marrer]

Aug 24, 2019 8:22:38 GMT ted1965 said:

As the pressure mounts on Nathan Jones should we really be preparing for another bout of itchy trigger finger syndrome, no I am not defending Jones or his record thus far. I am asking however how many more managers we can go through before the questions about the structure of the club comes under more fire.
Jones must be given more time not unending time but he must be given until the end of November before we start discussing whether he should be fired, he inherited a mess I doubt many would argue with that. The club had fallen asleep at the wheel and relegation was the only outcome from such negligence and short sightedness.

Mark Hughes had become jaded and seemed caught between fear and a desire to continue the progress we had made under him. He lost his bottle and became tentative in his approach which destroyed the joy he and the team had created. When the board allowed him to continue the hits kept coming and supporters lost faith and he became even more introverted which killed us on the field. The board should have had a competent replacement lined up before pulling the trigger on Hughes that season, sadly having fired him they had merely plans and ideas which resulted in Lambert and the slide was complete.

They promised a root and branch clear out but in reality Lambert was released and they thought the problems could be solved by merely bringing in a decent Championship manager in Rowett, sadly we all know how that ended so obviously he was the problem and nothing changed move onto the next saviour a young up and coming manager who had produced some wonderful times for Luton after years of disasters problem solved. So is Jones a terrible manager based on his results here you would say yes but can every manager be the problem.

If we don’t give the man some time we will be looking for another saviour and on and on it goes, the revolving managerial door through the 80’s and early 90’s proved so successful, yes there were some green shoots of recovery but none lasted more than a few months before they were snuffed out. We can’t return to those days, well we can but I sincerely hope we don’t.

We were spoiled by 10 years of modest success in the Premier League but for now those days are gone and unless we can bring some real stability to the club they will not return again for many years to come. We will become just another club who people will only talk about when we play one of the big boys in a cup competition. The pain of watching some of those lumbering stars will return the Bamber’s, such greats as Keith Scott will once more be the norm getting excited by seeing the modern day versions of such stars as faded talents like Paul Stewart lumbering around in a red and white shirt fills my heart with glee.

Tony Waddington, was given a lot of criticism for years many wanted him out because the football was dull and going nowhere fast yet look what time and stability did for us then. I am not comparing Jones to the great Waddo but he needs more time before we consign him to the one more failed manager at Stoke City., a list that is longer than a Ted post.

I understand the frustrations but sometimes time is a great healer.
Its not easy watching the same wide open spaces being exploited by opponent’s week in week out, scoring goals against Stoke at the moment isn’t a difficult task. It’s similar to a batsman in cricket getting out to a long hop every time and making no adjustments while the media tell you how great a player he is. The midfield combinations are totally wrong for our system, what does Joe Allen do, he nether wins the ball or protects the defence nor does he create very much going forward he needs to be dropped if that hurts his ego maybe it will make him look into his soul and understand football is played on the field not in the minds of his friends in the media.

I am not praising Jones at the moment either but it’s make or break for him over the next 10 games for me, show us that you understand the squad at your disposal and use them properly, players need to be playing because they are bringing something to a formation and not because they once played at a higher level. If a youngster is good enough and improves the side they need to play results are what we need now not idealistic stubbornness if he can’t move past his belief in his system then he will be gone whoever likes him or loathes him. For me I like him and want his to succeed but its down to him and this wonderful group to show he’s got what it takes to do so. I honestly believe we may have to suffer a little more pain but it could just be worth the painful patience needed.

Spot on

[sheds1862]

Aug 24, 2019 9:47:43 GMT teenagefanclub said:

Is no one allowed to tell Ted "there are already loads of threads regarding this, why start a new one"

We may as well have one humungous thread really because most threads go over the same stuff time and time again.
They just have a different title

[banx10]

We need a committed man, someone prepared to literally use his head to restore order & passion. You can tell they are half hearted.
Ince is such a baby he'd get mugged by a school girl lol!

[Deleted]

Aug 24, 2019 9:47:43 GMT teenagefanclub said:

Is no one allowed to tell Ted "there are already loads of threads regarding this, why start a new one"

Just don't read it then. What Ted manages to achieve when he posts, is a sensible, thought-out approach to whatever we're discussing, so I think it probably deserves it's own thread.

If you want to discuss throwing Nathan into The Cut, making him do National Service, etc, then there are other threads to discuss it.

[serpico]

Aug 24, 2019 9:51:32 GMT theonlooker said:

Aug 24, 2019 9:47:04 GMT sheikhmomo said:

Yeah and there's nothing to suggest that any new manager would get any more out of the job but at the same time it's not a never ending free pass either. If he doesn't get a couple of wins very, very soon his job will become untenable.

Like you say, that's the law of the jungle.    I've asked it many times and will continue to do so - where do the club go next in the event of an untenable situation?  What kind of manager do they go for since pretty much all bases have been now covered - experienced manager, pragmatic manager, young up and coming manager, attacking football manager.

We'll have half a squad of unmotivated bomb squadders, half a squad of Jones players littered with players in between that have either been signed previously and come down through the leagues with us or signed by Rowett wondering just what the hell is going on.

If there are more scenes like Bristol City last season then the next man in has a hell of a job to lift players that have gone through that twice in some cases.


We just need a dirty win or three from somewhere in the next month or so to calm the whole situation down.


In the medium term the club need to get rid of the CEO and bring in two football people in two crucial positions - CEO and Technical/Sporting Director.  They then need to dip into their contact book and find a real bona fide sports/stats analysis expert to come in and create a rock solid recruitment model.  The longer we carry on with the idiots running the club at the top then the longer we will be outside of the top division.  Their money though, their choice.

Exotic foreign manager ?

[Deleted]

Aug 24, 2019 11:02:22 GMT serpico said:

Aug 24, 2019 9:51:32 GMT theonlooker said:

Like you say, that's the law of the jungle.    I've asked it many times and will continue to do so - where do the club go next in the event of an untenable situation?  What kind of manager do they go for since pretty much all bases have been now covered - experienced manager, pragmatic manager, young up and coming manager, attacking football manager.

We'll have half a squad of unmotivated bomb squadders, half a squad of Jones players littered with players in between that have either been signed previously and come down through the leagues with us or signed by Rowett wondering just what the hell is going on.

If there are more scenes like Bristol City last season then the next man in has a hell of a job to lift players that have gone through that twice in some cases.


We just need a dirty win or three from somewhere in the next month or so to calm the whole situation down.


In the medium term the club need to get rid of the CEO and bring in two football people in two crucial positions - CEO and Technical/Sporting Director.  They then need to dip into their contact book and find a real bona fide sports/stats analysis expert to come in and create a rock solid recruitment model.  The longer we carry on with the idiots running the club at the top then the longer we will be outside of the top division.  Their money though, their choice.

Exotic foreign manager ?

Aitor Karanka incoming...

[sheikhmomo]

You'd think Hughton would tick every box. Old school without being a relic. Good championship experience. British. An all round decent fella. Catholic upbringing.

Seems like a Coates senior wet dream!

[liathroid]

Aug 24, 2019 11:07:45 GMT sheikhmomo said:

You'd think Hughton would tick every box. Old school without being a relic. Good championship experience. IRISH. An all round decent fella. Catholic upbringing.

Seems like a Coates senior wet dream!

[boskampsflaps]

Aug 24, 2019 9:17:48 GMT Goonie said:

I dont think sacking Jones will help unless we're relegated

Staying up is the main aim now

Is it, seems waaaay to soon to be saying that.

[thevoid]

Aug 24, 2019 9:17:48 GMT Goonie said:

I dont think sacking Jones will help unless we're relegated

Staying up is the main aim now

That's too late!

[tony1234]

Get the sentiments, Jones needs to be getting a point a game by 10 games for me. And that's probably my cut off. 

But the second part of the "do we get rid of him?" question depends very very very much on who we would replace him with.

Replace him with a void, a questionmark - which a month later becomes a desparate compromise (an equally ill equipped backroom staff member, other lower league manager or has-been), then no. Might as well stay as we are. We saw that with Lambert.

If that replacement option is someone though with a good record of doing well in this league, then I'd probably take it. The candidates who would tip me, if they'd come, would be Bruce (assuming a continuation of the NU situation), Hughton. Borderline would be Gary Monk, given his good record at several clubs - he wouldn't get us up, but does know more than Jones about getting a team to punch its weight and above in this league. Similarly, Pearson, though he'd be more of a dice throw.

This really isn't a time though for Cowley brothers, John Terry (on his own anyway) or Rory Delap etc.

[serpico]

If we keep conceding goals at the rate we are then he won’t get 10 games.

[sheikhmomo]

Aug 24, 2019 11:12:49 GMT liathroid said:

Aug 24, 2019 11:07:45 GMT sheikhmomo said:

You'd think Hughton would tick every box. Old school without being a relic. Good championship experience. IRISH. An all round decent fella. Catholic upbringing.

Seems like a Coates senior wet dream!

Well his mum is

[Deleted]

Aug 24, 2019 11:17:55 GMT tony1234 said:

Get the sentiments, Jones needs to be getting a point a game by 10 games for me. And that's probably my cut off. 

But the second part of the "do we get rid of him?" question depends very very very much on who we would replace him with.

Replace him with a void, a questionmark - which a month later becomes a desparate compromise (an equally ill equipped backroom staff member, other lower league manager or has-been), then no. Might as well stay as we are. We saw that with Lambert.

If that replacement option is someone though with a good record of doing well in this league, then I'd probably take it. The candidates who would tip me, if they'd come, would be Bruce (assuming a continuation of the NU situation), Hughton. Borderline would be Gary Monk, given his good record at several clubs - he wouldn't get us up, but does know more than Jones about getting a team to punch its weight and above in this league. Similarly, Pearson, though he'd be more of a dice throw.

This really isn't a time though for Cowley brothers, John Terry (on his own anyway) or Rory Delap etc.

Nigel Pearson would be exceptionally dodgy.  A complete nut job (I like and would probably be needed by that point) but he has on more than one occasion had a record of around 3 wins in 14 at two different clubs.  If he brought that one to the party here we'd be up the creek without a paddle, with a manager that would be pretty much pinning Nigel Johnson up against the wall every week labelling him all kinds of weird and exotic birds.

It's a minefield.

For gods sake Jones, just win a few and get rid of some of these names!

[songthrush01]

ted if you keeping him until november,
what if has not won a game by then.
you cannot predict a time to get rid or keep.

[Goonie]

Aug 24, 2019 11:13:46 GMT boskampsflaps said:

Aug 24, 2019 9:17:48 GMT Goonie said:

I dont think sacking Jones will help unless we're relegated

Staying up is the main aim now

Is it, seems waaaay to soon to be saying that.

Probably most knickers time on my part 😁