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Post by Paul Spencer on Aug 11, 2019 16:59:28 GMT
It was a truly staggering decision. He'd been our best player on the day, solid at the base of the diamond, protecting the back four, his distribution was good. Fair enough, Jones at 1-1 wanted to go for it but why on earth take Woods off and move Allen into his position to do so? We said it in the ground, literally as it happened ... just take Joe off. Really worrying from Nathan … Jones didn't move Allen into Woods' position. He continued alongside Clucas he'd done before, as ineffectually, demanding the ball from younger teammates, doing nothing with it. He failed to do any pressing unlike most others. Jones dispensed with Woods' position as he changed from the diamond to go 4-2-3-1. If it'd worked it would have been seen as a stroke of genius and we'd have praised him for having a masterful plan b. It didn't work and so he's the villain. I think he should be praised for the courage to try and change things around as he had already done with his six changes. As for Allen, he shouldn't be taken off; he shouldn't have been in the team in the first place. Hopefully the return of Etebo and Badou will make Jones see other options, if he can get around that contractual obligation... He absolutely did do. Jones didn't switch from the diamond to 4231 until AFTER we conceded the second goal.
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Post by Paul Spencer on Aug 11, 2019 17:03:08 GMT
Woods must start, with Etebo, Duffy and Powell in the long term in front of him, if we continue with the diamond. Who would be at the tip of the diamond and who would play next to Etebo? I think it would be very hard to fit both Duffy and Powell into a diamond.
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Post by neddy on Aug 11, 2019 17:06:43 GMT
Woods must start, with Etebo, Duffy and Powell in the long term in front of him, if we continue with the diamond. Who would be at the tip of the diamond and who would play next to Etebo? I think it would be very hard to fit both Duffy and Powell into a diamond. Powell moves further forward alongside the striker 4 1 3 1 1 lol
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Post by neddy on Aug 11, 2019 17:07:57 GMT
Clucas to left back and Duffy the top....
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Post by jezzascfc on Aug 11, 2019 17:48:34 GMT
Woods must start, with Etebo, Duffy and Powell in the long term in front of him, if we continue with the diamond. Who would be at the tip of the diamond and who would play next to Etebo? I think it would be very hard to fit both Duffy and Powell into a diamond. My big concern over the past few years has been a lack of creativity to produce chances for the strikers. I'd love us to get as much creativity as we can into the team, with Duffy on the right side of the diamond (as an ex-right winger he can drift wide as well) and Powell at no.10, and Ince to cover both. This may leave us a little lightweight in there, but in games we dominate at home, it could prove useful to break down defences. I'd like to always find room for 2 of Powell, Ince and Duffy in any team we put out, as it is hard to see enough quality in the final third without them. Realistically, Allen will play on the right of the diamond most weeks and Duffy is competition for Powell and Ince at no.10.
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Post by Ron on Aug 11, 2019 17:55:09 GMT
Woods inclusion helped , sort of, keep the diamond in shape. How he ever thought Cousins was a better option is staggering. Has to be given a run in the side now. Hopefully at the expense of Allen who needs dropping short term to give him the kick up the arse he needs after months of routinely average displays.
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Post by biglad180 on Aug 12, 2019 7:14:15 GMT
woods needs a run in the team now. i thought he played well while he was on the mistake was made taking him an ince off we were in control of the game up to then.
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Post by neilb987 on Aug 12, 2019 9:15:03 GMT
My main doubt about Woods last season was his apparent lack of physicality. However, he seems to have come back both physically and mentally stronger; and as he is a much better passer of the ball than Cousins he would be a first choice for me at CDM. My concerns are for the two 'flank' players in the Diamond. Allen is currently woeful, and although Clucas is much better on the left than on the right, I think he'd certainly be better at left-back than either of the current incumbents of that position. Etebo should certainly be one of those midfielders. If Badou really does want to play for us again he would certainly be a solid option, but a really bold decision would be to play Duffy of the right of the pair and Etebo on the left, with Powell or Ince for the No.10 role.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 12, 2019 9:28:28 GMT
The biggest issue was bringing on Tyrese Campbell, who was appalling. I know it's a taboo to criticise the kids on here but our high press slowed right down instantly when he came on, and became non existent when Gregory went off. This is my biggest bugbear with our fans that slay the manager for not playing the kids. When they don't perform or make mistakes they are glossed over in the hunt for the managers head. Collins last week and Campbell this week. He needs to up his workrate off the ball. Compared to Lee Gregory and an unfit Hogan he was chalk and cheese. Sadly I have to agree. Ty looked like he was trying to impersonate Diouf at his worst. But don't generalise over one bad thing. Collins looked amazing when he came on last season, Sorensen laid on a goal on his debut the year before. Edwards took some time before finding his feet, but at the end of last season was our best performer.
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Post by cousindupree on Aug 12, 2019 9:39:22 GMT
The assist stats from last season for the main creators in midfield and wider men like McClean and Ince were absolutely awful and it's no surprise we drew so many blanks. I think Ince was the main provider with 7 and Etebo a simply dreadful 1 assist!! Hopefully we will see more than double figures from the tip of the diamond and Allen and Etebo simply have to do better. I am hoping if he continues with Woods at the base he has the passing ability to create. If Cousins is back in that position there is no chance. The last time he had an assist was......over 100 games ago. Ok OK I know he is a CDM but 100 games since an assist, holy shit!
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Post by Deleted on Aug 12, 2019 9:50:51 GMT
The biggest issue was bringing on Tyrese Campbell, who was appalling. I know it's a taboo to criticise the kids on here but our high press slowed right down instantly when he came on, and became non existent when Gregory went off. This is my biggest bugbear with our fans that slay the manager for not playing the kids. When they don't perform or make mistakes they are glossed over in the hunt for the managers head. Collins last week and Campbell this week. He needs to up his workrate off the ball. Compared to Lee Gregory and an unfit Hogan he was chalk and cheese. Sadly I have to agree. Ty looked like he was trying to impersonate Diouf at his worst. But don't generalise over one bad thing. Collins looked amazing when he came on last season, Sorensen laid on a goal on his debut the year before. Edwards took some time before finding his feet, but at the end of last season was our best performer. Totally get that and I've championed our kids, Edwards particularly, for many years. I'm just trying to say it as I see it and treat players equal and fair.
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Post by westgatelakes on Aug 12, 2019 11:01:14 GMT
Woods is a footballer If he doesn't come good at Stoke He will come good somewhere What Nj has got against him, I have no idea He didn't show much sign of being a footballer many times last season !
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Post by Deleted on Aug 12, 2019 11:18:25 GMT
Woods is a footballer If he doesn't come good at Stoke He will come good somewhere What Nj has got against him, I have no idea He didn't show much sign of being a footballer many times last season ! Like many of Rowett's signings, possibly all of them, Woods' confidence crashed completely, when the man who signed him was sacked. Expect the same to happen to most or all the 10 new signings, if Jones were let go. Not that I think he will be, but remember a number of them has stated that they signed on, because Jones was so enthusiastic about his project and their part in it. Not because of their undying love for Stoke, although they didn't put it quite like that...
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Post by FullerMagic on Aug 12, 2019 12:45:59 GMT
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Post by SCFC92 on Aug 12, 2019 12:47:05 GMT
And fair play for admitting it!
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Post by sd22 on Aug 12, 2019 12:52:37 GMT
Are we serious? a manager that owns up and realises they have made a mistake. Maybe even learning from it!
Fucking shit Stoke.
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Post by estrangedsonoffaye on Aug 12, 2019 12:55:09 GMT
First step admitting it, second step acting on it. If he does the latter then he'll be fine.
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Post by StoKeith on Aug 12, 2019 12:59:05 GMT
It’s reassuring to hear him acknowledging the mistake. It’s infuriating when managers sound like they watched a different game to the rest of us, so fair play to NJ.
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Post by trickydicky73 on Aug 12, 2019 13:02:55 GMT
Is Woods ace again, now? I thought he'd been deemed shit on here? 😜
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Post by FullerMagic on Aug 12, 2019 13:07:50 GMT
Is Woods ace again, now? I thought he'd been deemed shit on here? 😜 To be fair, it wasn't so much that he was shit - more that he'd only got on the pitch in 4 or 5 games under NJ, despite him being fit - and he looked all set for the high jump. Now he's suddenly out of the deep freeze despite him hand-picking Cousins for that role. So it's all a bit..er...fluid by the looks of it!
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Post by Deleted on Aug 12, 2019 13:09:03 GMT
Big mistake admitting your mistakes. First rule in management. Never admit your mistakes and always look for something or someone to blame.
"Lack of investment at Charlton means their stadium is in a bit of a state. The red faded seats were turning orange and clashing with Woodsy's hair. From a distance he looked bald. I had to bring him off. He's a semi tone darker than Clucas and a full tone darker than Duffy."
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Post by onionman on Aug 12, 2019 13:10:22 GMT
Jones has gone up in my estimation. The best managers are often the ones who have learnt from their mistakes.
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Post by trickydicky73 on Aug 12, 2019 13:20:32 GMT
Is Woods ace again, now? I thought he'd been deemed shit on here? 😜 To be fair, it wasn't so much that he was shit - more that he'd only got on the pitch in 4 or 5 games under NJ, despite him being fit - and he looked all set for the high jump. Now he's suddenly out of the deep freeze despite him hand-picking Cousins for that role. So it's all a bit..er...fluid by the looks of it! Ha ha, yeah! It's like a Jackson Pollock painting at the moment. I quite like the admission that he fucked up with the sub, though, and hope the fluidity works out.
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Post by Gary Hackett on Aug 12, 2019 13:47:57 GMT
Doesn't sound like he'll make that mistake again.
Also pleased he's quickly realised Cousins isn't any fucking use whatsoever.
So that's 3 of his own signings he's already realised aren't any use - Cousins, Davies and Vokes.
I wonder how many more they'll be.
My guess is Ward and Smith will be the next 2 for the chop.
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Post by Paul Spencer on Aug 12, 2019 13:55:29 GMT
Really encouraging to hear Jones admit that he made a big mistake, not the sort of thing you ordinarily here a manager admit to.
Fair play to him.
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Post by Rick Grimes on Aug 12, 2019 14:48:27 GMT
Doesn't sound like he'll make that mistake again. Also pleased he's quickly realised Cousins isn't any fucking use whatsoever. So that's 3 of his own signings he's already realised aren't any use - Cousins, Davies and Vokes. I wonder how many more they'll be. My guess is Ward and Smith will be the next 2 for the chop. Saying he’s realised that some of his own signings aren’t of any use is an incredibly narrow (and I would suggest incorrect) way of looking at it. It’s a squad name and just because he’s dropped a few or hasn’t played them doesn’t necessarily mean they’re useless. It’s a squad game and it’s up to them to perform and keep their place, they’ll get chances to prove themselves again.
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Post by chigstoke on Aug 12, 2019 14:51:46 GMT
Somewhat refreshing to see a manager admit he made an error. He now has to learn from it and put his lesson into action for the next match.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 12, 2019 14:56:32 GMT
Is Woods ace again, now? I thought he'd been deemed shit on here? 😜 There's obviously a footballer there, we saw that when he first arrived. He then lost his mojo, and was utter horsewank after that. If Jones can get him going again, great.
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Post by neilb987 on Aug 12, 2019 15:17:13 GMT
Hopefully now Jones will give Woods a good run in the CDM role. Against QPR, Cousins ran around a bit, never seemed to be in the right position, occasionally hoofed the ball aimlessly upfield, and gave away lots of niggly fouls. Woods against Charlton was a different matter, attempting to play his proper game of deep-lying playmaker and looking to find team-mates with accurate passes. I always wonder if Rowett thought he was buying a 'destroyer' type of CDM and insisted that he play that way, which is maybe why his form soon collapsed?
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Post by crapslinger on Aug 12, 2019 15:42:52 GMT
Hopefully now Jones will give Woods a good run in the CDM role. Against QPR, Cousins ran around a bit, never seemed to be in the right position, occasionally hoofed the ball aimlessly upfield, and gave away lots of niggly fouls. Woods against Charlton was a different matter, attempting to play his proper game of deep-lying playmaker and looking to find team-mates with accurate passes. I always wonder if Rowett thought he was buying a 'destroyer' type of CDM and insisted that he play that way, which is maybe why his form soon collapsed? His form collapsed when Jones came in.
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