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Post by bloodtypered on Aug 10, 2019 17:15:24 GMT
He did have some good spells but some that nearly let them through²
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Post by bayernoatcake on Aug 10, 2019 17:15:38 GMT
Campbell came on in a front two before we switched to a one. He was appalling. Okay- and if I get it right we were a front two for 4 minutes, but you’re right clearly it was Campbell’s fault- not butterhands Butland, not Dil the Dog Allen or tactical genius Jones. Bravo sir! Fully embraced the cult of the diamond.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 10, 2019 17:33:32 GMT
What do you love? And please be specific His positive approach , his honesty , his humour , the fact at least he has a definitive plan and isn’t afraid to make the big decisions . Our principal blend are deep rooted and were their long before Nathan jones arrived . Ok then. Pulis didn’t talk and give it loads of promises. He just got on with it and delivered. But yeah, nothing like a positive approach and losing every week.
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Post by ursemboys on Aug 10, 2019 17:36:28 GMT
Which bit of two forwards were doing it versus one forward left on his own are you struggling to grasp?Hence there is a spare defender to move the ball to- I guess a Time Lord can be in two places at one time, not many others. Campbell came on in a front two before we switched to a one. He was appalling. Said from day one last season Campbell is not good enough,wasnt good enough at Shrewsbury isn't good enough for us.
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Post by franklin66 on Aug 10, 2019 17:38:28 GMT
From the first game in Duisburg he was sharp and on form. He was miles better than Cousins and today he proved it. He has to play that role as I cant see who's better.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 10, 2019 17:51:48 GMT
Joe Allen is contractually obliged to play every game wherever able. This much is clear. Regardless of his ability to affect any fucking game he plays in. He needs a new contract asap, with a written obligation to leave next window.
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Post by dirtygary69 on Aug 10, 2019 18:25:34 GMT
I know it’s poor form to say but the best thing for us right now would be a Joe Allen injury. It’s beyond a joke now. It’s clear it’s in his contract that he starts every game and cannot be subbed.
Does nobody in Europe fancy him?
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Post by berahinosgoals on Aug 10, 2019 18:35:15 GMT
Played fantastic today, like a different player
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Post by cousindupree on Aug 10, 2019 18:57:19 GMT
Jones is an inexperienced manager and clearly struggling at this level. We saw last season many of his substitutions were just blatantly wrong. Today we saw another error of judgement. I don't blame him for bringing on Duffy, Charlton were clearly rocking and we were on the front foot. You could only see one winner, it was a positive move to be applauded. But why in place of Woods who had looked decent at the base of the diamond and sling Joe Allen in there who hasn't actually played that role? If Woods was carrying a knock or running out of steam then substitute like for like with Cousins, but not sure he was. The right call would have been Duffy for Ince. It was a naive substitution again from Jones. For all our sakes lets hope he learns fast!!!
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Post by Deleted on Aug 10, 2019 19:00:35 GMT
Campbell came on in a front two before we switched to a one. He was appalling. Said from day one last season Campbell is not good enough,wasnt good enough at Shrewsbury isn't good enough for us. I'm hopeful he'll still come good but there just has to be more workrate. We can't overlook a lack of workrate in a young player because the cult of English football has dictated to us that hard work automatically means long ball football, as perpetuated by the likes of Tony Pulis. The lower leagues is full of talented players that refuse to or can't work hard. The very top players have workrate in abundance to go with their talent. It's the workrate that makes the difference. Campbell is one of the most naturally gifted finishers i've ever seen at any level. It means nothing if he isn't prepared to work and graft. It's got to be the minimum.
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Post by wilcopotter on Aug 11, 2019 0:35:59 GMT
Beggars belief why we took him off. Fell apart when he left the pitch. I thought he was solid today. He looks after th the ball, wins it, gives it to the “creators “, guess what? They bottled out and give it him back.
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Post by jezzascfc on Aug 11, 2019 0:43:49 GMT
Woods must start, with Etebo, Duffy and Powell in the long term in front of him, if we continue with the diamond.
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Post by Gary Hackett on Aug 11, 2019 0:43:50 GMT
In the absence of a proper DM Woods has to play.
The other option is Cousins and I'd rather have my balls waxed than that.
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Post by Gary Hackett on Aug 11, 2019 0:47:30 GMT
Woods must start, with Etebo, Duffy and Powell in the long term in front of him, if we continue with the diamond. That's possibly the most creative midfield but doesn't answer who will put the ball in the net.
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Post by jezzascfc on Aug 11, 2019 0:56:08 GMT
Woods must start, with Etebo, Duffy and Powell in the long term in front of him, if we continue with the diamond. That's possibly the most creative midfield but doesn't answer who will put the ball in the net. Hogan and Gregory could form a good partnership, mobile and pacy and pressing from the front, and will get better with match sharpness and playing together.
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Post by Gary Hackett on Aug 11, 2019 1:08:05 GMT
That's possibly the most creative midfield but doesn't answer who will put the ball in the net. Hogan and Gregory could form a good partnership, mobile and pacy and pressing from the front, and will get better with match sharpness and playing together. They can press as much as they like and offer all those things but there's not more than 20 to 25 goals between them which is nowhere near enough.
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Post by Paul Spencer on Aug 11, 2019 1:09:24 GMT
It was a truly staggering decision.
He'd been our best player on the day, solid at the base of the diamond, protecting the back four, his distribution was good.
Fair enough, Jones at 1-1 wanted to go for it but why on earth take Woods off and move Allen into his position to do so?
We said it in the ground, literally as it happened ... just take Joe off.
Really worrying from Nathan ...
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Post by jezzascfc on Aug 11, 2019 1:18:11 GMT
Hogan and Gregory could form a good partnership, mobile and pacy and pressing from the front, and will get better with match sharpness and playing together. They can press as much as they like and offer all those things but there's not more than 20 to 25 goals between them which is nowhere near enough. When fit and firing both have proved they can score 15-20 goals in a season. Add some from Vokes and Campbell and a few from midfield and who knows?
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Post by Deleted on Aug 11, 2019 5:57:07 GMT
It was a truly staggering decision. He'd been our best player on the day, solid at the base of the diamond, protecting the back four, his distribution was good. Fair enough, Jones at 1-1 wanted to go for it but why on earth take Woods off and move Allen into his position to do so? We said it in the ground, literally as it happened ... just take Joe off. Really worrying from Nathan … Jones didn't move Allen into Woods' position. He continued alongside Clucas he'd done before, as ineffectually, demanding the ball from younger teammates, doing nothing with it. He failed to do any pressing unlike most others. Jones dispensed with Woods' position as he changed from the diamond to go 4-2-3-1. If it'd worked it would have been seen as a stroke of genius and we'd have praised him for having a masterful plan b. It didn't work and so he's the villain. I think he should be praised for the courage to try and change things around as he had already done with his six changes. As for Allen, he shouldn't be taken off; he shouldn't have been in the team in the first place. Hopefully the return of Etebo and Badou will make Jones see other options, if he can get around that contractual obligation...
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Post by Deleted on Aug 11, 2019 8:43:44 GMT
It was a truly staggering decision. He'd been our best player on the day, solid at the base of the diamond, protecting the back four, his distribution was good. Fair enough, Jones at 1-1 wanted to go for it but why on earth take Woods off and move Allen into his position to do so? We said it in the ground, literally as it happened ... just take Joe off. Really worrying from Nathan … Jones didn't move Allen into Woods' position. He continued alongside Clucas he'd done before, as ineffectually, demanding the ball from younger teammates, doing nothing with it. He failed to do any pressing unlike most others. Jones dispensed with Woods' position as he changed from the diamond to go 4-2-3-1. If it'd worked it would have been seen as a stroke of genius and we'd have praised him for having a masterful plan b. It didn't work and so he's the villain. I think he should be praised for the courage to try and change things around as he had already done with his six changes. As for Allen, he shouldn't be taken off; he shouldn't have been in the team in the first place. Hopefully the return of Etebo and Badou will make Jones see other options, if he can get around that contractual obligation... The 2 in a 4-2-3-1 are supposed to sit in front of the back 4,neither Clucas nor Allen really dropped back much at all which compounded the poor decision to take Woods off.... I really couldn't make out where Allen was playing after the sub. Duffy was a positive sub and he should start the next match
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Post by Deleted on Aug 11, 2019 9:53:38 GMT
Jones didn't move Allen into Woods' position. He continued alongside Clucas he'd done before, as ineffectually, demanding the ball from younger teammates, doing nothing with it. He failed to do any pressing unlike most others. Jones dispensed with Woods' position as he changed from the diamond to go 4-2-3-1. If it'd worked it would have been seen as a stroke of genius and we'd have praised him for having a masterful plan b. It didn't work and so he's the villain. I think he should be praised for the courage to try and change things around as he had already done with his six changes. As for Allen, he shouldn't be taken off; he shouldn't have been in the team in the first place. Hopefully the return of Etebo and Badou will make Jones see other options, if he can get around that contractual obligation... The 2 in a 4-2-3-1 are supposed to sit in front of the back 4,neither Clucas nor Allen really dropped back much at all which compounded the poor decision to take Woods off.... I really couldn't make out where Allen was playing after the sub. Duffy was a positive sub and he should start the next match I too had the feeling at one point that we were dispensing with any system, and for a while it looked promising, but then they scored, and then again, and we just adapted our losing ID.
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Post by webbyscfc on Aug 11, 2019 10:06:47 GMT
Woods is a footballer If he doesn't come good at Stoke He will come good somewhere What Nj has got against him, I have no idea What NJ has got against him? He started him. He made a mistake bringing him off which he thought was the right thing at the time, but I am 100% sure he didn’t bring him off because he has got “something against him”
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Post by wearepremierleague on Aug 11, 2019 10:26:20 GMT
Fully confirmed what I already knew. Woods is a very good player, miles better than Cousins, and can play the base of the diamond.
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Post by raythesailor on Aug 11, 2019 11:04:02 GMT
Even the Radio Stoke commentary thought it would be Allan, and were suprised when Wood came off.
We were playing well and if nobody was carrying a knock or tiring why make any changes ?
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Post by neddy on Aug 11, 2019 11:04:37 GMT
Is that it for Cousins then already!
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Post by cheadlestokie on Aug 11, 2019 11:26:05 GMT
For all I can say is that for this game, coincidence or not, once Woods was taken off the defensive midfield position disappeared and both the second and third goals seem to come because of that. I know the third was from a set piece but one they were able to work and have a player free on the edge of the box centrally and no midfield player was there to stop him scoring. I thought Woods was very tidy and effective in that position. I also thought Duffy in his short spell was also looking good on the ball and I have high hopes for him to be effective. Clucas drives me daft because he clearly has ability but I feel is rather idle in his defensive duties.
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Post by drippinggoatsnob on Aug 11, 2019 11:39:43 GMT
I think he wanted to go for it. Allen on the pitch can grab you a goal where as Woods doesn't look like he has it in his locker. It was brave and it backfired. Cest la vie. Also Woods hasn't has loads of minutes recently. Probably all things playing on Jones mind.
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Post by Lakeland Potter on Aug 11, 2019 14:29:03 GMT
Woods must start, with Etebo, Duffy and Powell in the long term in front of him, if we continue with the diamond. I think that (when all are fit) that is our best midfield 4 as well Jezza. But I can't see Allen being dropped to allow those 4 to play from the start, can you? Does this mean that we all hope for Allen to pick up an early injury so that our preferred 4 end up on the field together by accident - and then put on such an outstanding display as to then become undroppable?
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Post by ChrisKamarasPerm on Aug 11, 2019 14:31:53 GMT
Controlling the game. Making the system look good. As soon as he goes off we collapse. Poor management from Jones that - lost us the game. Getting Duffy on was by in large the correct substitution to make but should've been for Allen. Frustrating. Because Nathan and his team are tactically inept.
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Post by crapslinger on Aug 11, 2019 16:32:22 GMT
Controlling the game. Making the system look good. As soon as he goes off we collapse. Poor management from Jones that - lost us the game. Getting Duffy on was by in large the correct substitution to make but should've been for Allen. Frustrating. Because Nathan and his team are tactically inept. Incompetent management.
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