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Post by bayernoatcake on Sept 22, 2023 22:26:09 GMT
You love to see it.
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Post by mtrstudent on Sept 22, 2023 23:59:59 GMT
This proposal is effectively to abandon all the plant I used to manage including Coke ovens, sinter plant, and all the material handling, up to the blast furnaces, plus the blast furnaces and steelmaking plant and I expect the power station. Effectively half or more of the works. I expect the port will continue at reduced activity. Secondly to install electric arc processing. It effectively means stopping steelmaking in the true sense from iron ore and replacing it with steel recycling by turning scrap steel into new products. Cheers mate, fascinating stuff. You make it sound like it needs less work. So there could be just as much steel coming out of the other end, but with fewer workers? Also sounds like the whole thing is risky, like relying on affordable electricity.
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Post by mtrstudent on Sept 23, 2023 2:42:31 GMT
Cheers mate, fascinating stuff. You make it sound like it needs less work. So there could be just as much steel coming out of the other end, but with fewer workers?Also sounds like the whole thing is risky, like relying on affordable electricity. This is precisely what it means and why it is questionable to invest £500M of Taxpayers Money to support an Industry that will produce Steel from recycling scrap steel with a fraction of the previous workforce. In terms of Technology it doesn't move things forward it just prolongs the inevitable death. Of course it is risky for the reasons you outlined and it certainly won't produce the same amount of Steel, perhaps 50% A relatively minor investment in hydrogen alongside would have been more prudent. Any option seems risky? Mrcoke seems to think hydrogen is still some way off and there's a lot of competition. £500m of taxpayer money seems a big bet either way.
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Post by Davef on Sept 23, 2023 10:00:04 GMT
Bravo to the King, flying to Paris, then flying to Bordeaux before flying home.
And inbetween making speeches about global warming and the necessity to reduce carbon emissions.
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Post by thehartshillbadger on Sept 23, 2023 10:20:07 GMT
Bravo to the King, flying to Paris, then flying to Bordeaux before flying home. And inbetween making speeches about global warming and the necessity to reduce carbon emissions. Maybe a horse drawn carriage would be more appropriate?
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Post by iancransonsknees on Sept 23, 2023 10:44:40 GMT
This is precisely what it means and why it is questionable to invest £500M of Taxpayers Money to support an Industry that will produce Steel from recycling scrap steel with a fraction of the previous workforce. In terms of Technology it doesn't move things forward it just prolongs the inevitable death. Of course it is risky for the reasons you outlined and it certainly won't produce the same amount of Steel, perhaps 50% A relatively minor investment in hydrogen alongside would have been more prudent. Any option seems risky? Mrcoke seems to think hydrogen is still some way off and there's a lot of competition. £500m of taxpayer money seems a big bet either way. It's peanuts when you compare it to what we got for the oft quoted £37bn, plus HS2.
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Post by mtrstudent on Sept 23, 2023 21:38:23 GMT
Work took me to a climate data archive, thought some might appreciate this. It's the pressure and temperature readouts from the HMS Prince of Wales. They worked a bit like those earthquake seismometer readings, with a pen that goes up and down with the weather. The big squiggle in blue and spike in the red line at the same time on Saturday are where she was firing her 14" guns at the Bismarck and the shaking made the pens move around. A real piece of history from the battle where the Hood was sunk.
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Post by JoeinOz on Sept 24, 2023 1:37:07 GMT
Bravo to the King, flying to Paris, then flying to Bordeaux before flying home. And inbetween making speeches about global warming and the necessity to reduce carbon emissions. Particularly impressive when he could've set an example by doing both those trips by train. Ferfuxache 🙄
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Post by superjw on Sept 24, 2023 13:02:38 GMT
Bravo to the King, flying to Paris, then flying to Bordeaux before flying home. And inbetween making speeches about global warming and the necessity to reduce carbon emissions. Particularly impressive when he could've set an example by doing both those trips by train. Ferfuxache 🙄 Defo could have taken the Eurostar and then the perfectly good French train network…
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Post by aureliuspotter on Sept 24, 2023 17:53:35 GMT
Bravo to the King, flying to Paris, then flying to Bordeaux before flying home. And inbetween making speeches about global warming and the necessity to reduce carbon emissions. Not my king.
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Post by mrcoke on Sept 28, 2023 18:28:26 GMT
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Post by aureliuspotter on Sept 28, 2023 19:30:05 GMT
Attachment DeletedLatest Ulez camera map The black ones are the ones that have been taken out by a group calling themselves 'the blade runners'
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Post by Northy on Sept 28, 2023 20:00:57 GMT
Bravo to the King, flying to Paris, then flying to Bordeaux before flying home. And inbetween making speeches about global warming and the necessity to reduce carbon emissions. He's always been two faced on these issues
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Post by cvillestokie on Sept 29, 2023 0:20:15 GMT
Particularly impressive when he could've set an example by doing both those trips by train. Ferfuxache 🙄 Defo could have taken the Eurostar and then the perfectly good French train network… Not shocking that he’s a massive hypocrite, is it?
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Post by elystokie on Oct 11, 2023 10:53:22 GMT
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Post by Northy on Oct 11, 2023 11:40:33 GMT
Probably blocked by the oil industry giving favours to officials. They also blocked the water powered car.
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Post by elystokie on Oct 11, 2023 12:20:45 GMT
Probably blocked by the oil industry giving favours to officials. They also blocked the water powered car. That was certainly a part of it, most of the early 'Reefer Madness' stuff came from the newspaper magnate Randolph Hearst who also had a lot of lumber interests, hemp production would have threatened the value of his investment. Harry Anslinger was the main protagonist in making cannabis/hemp illegal, he was married to the niece of Richard Mellon who certainly did have oil interests, Mellon was instrumental in landing Anslinger his job at the (then, later DEA) Bureau of Narcotics in 1931. I keep saying it but it really is Emperor's New Clothes stuff and has been for 85 years. www.420magazine.com/community/threads/anslinger-and-mellon-connection.79470/
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Post by mtrstudent on Oct 11, 2023 14:11:34 GMT
To avert climate disaster, what if one rogue nation dimmed the Sun?Interesting article: should we do desperate things like pump pollution into the upper air to reflect sunlight? It could cool us down, but there's a chance it would collapse monsoons and starve hundreds of millions. And if you don't cut CO2 then you're setting up other disasters anyway. Still, it might be better than letting global warming rampage. Some experts said "don't do it, don't even test it", they're mostly politics people. Then a letter saying "research it" signed by a lot of climate scientists.
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Post by elystokie on Oct 14, 2023 8:47:01 GMT
Jack Herer first released 'The Emperor Wears no Clothes' in 1985, he'd been campaigning for cannabis legalisation since the early 70s. How he amassed the information he did in a pre internet age will always amaze me. He wanted the book to be available to everyone, for free, forever. Here's a link to possibly the most important book ever written - commons.m.wikimedia.org/w/index.php?title=File:Jack_Herer_-_The_Emperor_Wears_No_Clothes.pdf&page=1If he'd been listened to 40-50 years ago instead of being ridiculed the world and the planet would be in a far better place 🤦 RIP Jack and thank you, you were right all along.
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Post by cvillestokie on Oct 14, 2023 11:03:57 GMT
To avert climate disaster, what if one rogue nation dimmed the Sun?Interesting article: should we do desperate things like pump pollution into the upper air to reflect sunlight? It could cool us down, but there's a chance it would collapse monsoons and starve hundreds of millions. And if you don't cut CO2 then you're setting up other disasters anyway. Still, it might be better than letting global warming rampage. Some experts said "don't do it, don't even test it", they're mostly politics people. Then a letter saying "research it" signed by a lot of climate scientists. Or, we could just plant more trees, stop building in flood zones, reduce the ridiculously overcrowded World population and the emissions that goes with it.
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Post by mrcoke on Oct 14, 2023 13:53:54 GMT
This proposal is effectively to abandon all the plant I used to manage including Coke ovens, sinter plant, and all the material handling, up to the blast furnaces, plus the blast furnaces and steelmaking plant and I expect the power station. Effectively half or more of the works. I expect the port will continue at reduced activity. Secondly to install electric arc processing. It effectively means stopping steelmaking in the true sense from iron ore and replacing it with steel recycling by turning scrap steel into new products. Cheers mate, fascinating stuff. You make it sound like it needs less work. So there could be just as much steel coming out of the other end, but with fewer workers? Also sounds like the whole thing is risky, like relying on affordable electricity. Scunthorpe steelworks have jumped the gun and shutdown its last Coke ovens which not only produces Coke for the blast furnaces but also Coke ovens gas (2 thirds hydrogen) for heating the furnaces in the rolling mills. So: www.argusmedia.com/en/news/2490618-british-steel-production-glitch-sparks-delivery-delays
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Post by elystokie on Oct 16, 2023 6:38:43 GMT
This is a documentary on the life of Jack Herer, the author of 'The Emperor Wears no Clothes'.
Imagine a plant that can provide food, fuel, medicine, clothing, building materials and pretty much anything currently made by metal, a plant that grows to up to 20ft in one season, a plant that requires very little by way of water/fertilizer/weedkiller and re-conditions radiated soil, a plant that can sequester far more CO2 than trees.
Imagine making that plant illegal 🤦
That's what this man spent his life fighting against, hopefully one day we'll all be grateful.
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Post by mtrstudent on Oct 16, 2023 16:05:07 GMT
To avert climate disaster, what if one rogue nation dimmed the Sun?Interesting article: should we do desperate things like pump pollution into the upper air to reflect sunlight? It could cool us down, but there's a chance it would collapse monsoons and starve hundreds of millions. And if you don't cut CO2 then you're setting up other disasters anyway. Still, it might be better than letting global warming rampage. Some experts said "don't do it, don't even test it", they're mostly politics people. Then a letter saying "research it" signed by a lot of climate scientists. Or, we could just plant more trees, stop building in flood zones, reduce the ridiculously overcrowded World population and the emissions that goes with it. What more do you do to stop population growth? Unless fossils fuel burning goes down then we're gonna see extreme global warming and "flood zones" will include lots of major cities, so it might be easier said than done!
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Post by mrcoke on Oct 17, 2023 9:49:52 GMT
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Post by Seymour Beaver on Oct 17, 2023 10:06:24 GMT
I was prepared to take it seriously until it said of the UK " scored 100 for water and sanitation, including drinking water and sanitation". Given the state of our rivers what exactly have you got to do to get 99? - pump pure effluent into people's kitchens?
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Post by mrcoke on Oct 17, 2023 13:19:48 GMT
I was prepared to take it seriously until it said of the UK " scored 100 for water and sanitation, including drinking water and sanitation". Given the state of our rivers what exactly have you got to do to get 99? - pump pure effluent into people's kitchens? Effluent treatment is environment protection and a different category to health, which water and sanitation come under. The water the UK drink is generally one of the highest in the world and there is generally 100% provision of waste disposal. In terms of sewage in rivers the issue is overstated. Sewage disposal is relatively modern phenomenon and started in Victorian times due to the stench in rapidly growing cities. As recently as the 50s it was common place for virtually all coastal communities to discharge raw sewage to the sea. Many countries still have little sewage treatment such as 80% of India's sewage (largest population in the world soon) is untreated. I have spent a week in bed after a trip to India! It has always been the case that excess liquid waste is discharged to rivers when it rains a lot, and general practice throughout the world. It has increased because of weather extremes and development has not kept pace with population growth and the move away from terraced housing and high-rise to housing estates with acres of concrete and tarmac. It should also be remembered that the main source of river pollution throughout Europe is chemicals from intensive farming. voxeurop.eu/en/investigating-europe-water-pollution-crisis-blame-industrial-farming/
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Post by Seymour Beaver on Oct 17, 2023 13:24:57 GMT
I was prepared to take it seriously until it said of the UK " scored 100 for water and sanitation, including drinking water and sanitation". Given the state of our rivers what exactly have you got to do to get 99? - pump pure effluent into people's kitchens? Effluent treatment is environment protection and a different category to health, which water and sanitation come under. The water the UK drink is generally one of the highest in the world and there is generally 100% provision of waste disposal. In terms of sewage in rivers the issue is overstated. Sewage disposal is relatively modern phenomenon and started in Victorian times due to the stench in rapidly growing cities. As recently as the 50s it was common place for virtually all coastal communities to discharge raw sewage to the sea. Many countries still have little sewage treatment such as 80% of India's sewage (largest population in the world soon) is untreated. I have spent a week in bed after a trip to India! It has always been the case that excess liquid waste is discharged to rivers when it rains a lot, and general practice throughout the world. It has increased because of weather extremes and development has not kept pace with population growth and the move away from terraced housing and high-rise to housing estates with acres of concrete and tarmac. It should also be remembered that the main source of river pollution throughout Europe is chemicals from intensive farming. Yeah well - doesn't look like 100 to me www.the-ies.org/analysis/state-uk-rivers-confronting#:~:text=Only%2036%25%20of%20UK%20surface,has%20attained%20good%20chemical%20status.
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Post by mrcoke on Oct 17, 2023 13:33:50 GMT
Effluent treatment is environment protection and a different category to health, which water and sanitation come under. The water the UK drink is generally one of the highest in the world and there is generally 100% provision of waste disposal. In terms of sewage in rivers the issue is overstated. Sewage disposal is relatively modern phenomenon and started in Victorian times due to the stench in rapidly growing cities. As recently as the 50s it was common place for virtually all coastal communities to discharge raw sewage to the sea. Many countries still have little sewage treatment such as 80% of India's sewage (largest population in the world soon) is untreated. I have spent a week in bed after a trip to India! It has always been the case that excess liquid waste is discharged to rivers when it rains a lot, and general practice throughout the world. It has increased because of weather extremes and development has not kept pace with population growth and the move away from terraced housing and high-rise to housing estates with acres of concrete and tarmac. It should also be remembered that the main source of river pollution throughout Europe is chemicals from intensive farming. Yeah well - doesn't look like 100 to me www.the-ies.org/analysis/state-uk-rivers-confronting#:~:text=Only%2036%25%20of%20UK%20surface,has%20attained%20good%20chemical%20status. As I tried to explain in my post, pollution of rivers is a different category to provision of water and sanitation. The score would drop below 100 if the water you drink fell below acceptable standard or you could not flush away from your toilet to a sewer. What happens after that is a different assessment category.
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Post by Seymour Beaver on Oct 17, 2023 13:39:39 GMT
As I tried to explain in my post, pollution of rivers is a different category to provision of water and sanitation. The score would drop below 100 if the water you drink fell below acceptable standard or you could not flush away from your toilet to a sewer. What happens after that is a different assessment category. Possibly so - but if you're looking at how 'green' a country is 'water' is a lot more than just drinking water - as rivers and lakes contribute massively to biodiversity.
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Post by mrcoke on Nov 6, 2023 16:53:56 GMT
Latest news on the steel making front is that having secured £100s millions from the government to build electric arc steelmaking at Port Talbot, Tata now propose to shutdown steelmaking in the short term and import hot rolled coil for further processing at various South Wales plants into end products for car industry, white goods, and everything down bottle tops. This proposal means shutting down all the heavy end (Coke ovens, sinter plant, blast furnaces and all associated facilities such as power plant, stockyard, blending, workshops, locomotive/logistics etc.), all steelmaking (BOS plant, concast plant, and all associated facilities), and mothballing the hot strip mill until the electric arc steelmaking is up and running in some years to come. We are talking about a lot of Tata jobs and a lot of contractors, supplies, etc. jobs. Meanwhile: www.deccanherald.com/business/india-to-remain-top-importer-of-coking-coal-rising-prices-of-raw-material-a-concern-isa-president-oommen-2758710It would be somewhat ironic if the UK starts producing coking coal in Cumbria to supply raw material to India. The world would be turning around! www.ft.com/content/5aab3be5-c175-4324-b501-9571dc1ec733
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